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We do not think Anthropic should be designated as a supply chain risk
- moogly 7mo agoLooks like losing subscribers actually does work. Definitely gets a damage control response, at least.
- aylmao 7mo agoI wonder what the mood is like internally too. I can only imagine there some level of employee discontent.
- patcon 7mo agoi should hope so. they should quit. > > what's the term for quitting but not leaving and being destructive > The most common term is “quiet quitting” when someone disengages but stays employed—but that usually implies minimal effort, not active harm. > If you specifically mean staying while being disruptive or undermining, better fits include: > - “Malicious compliance” — following rules in a way that intentionally causes problems > - “Work-to-rule” — doing only exactly what’s required to slow things down (often collective/labor context) I imagine malicious compliance is fun when there's an AI intermediary that can be blameless.
- discardable_dan 7mo agoIt is referred to as "simple sabotage": https://www.cia.gov/stories/story/the-art-of-simple-sabotage/ https://www.cia.gov/stories/story/the-art-of-simple-sabotage...
- ares623 7mo agothey should leak the models
- overfeed 7mo ago> I can only imagine there some level of employee discontent. The rank and file mutinied for the return of Altman after his board fired him for deception. They knew what they were getting, though they may find it shameful to admit that their morals have a price.
- bertil 7mo agoHow many people who reacted that way then are still at OpenAI? It seems that they have lost key people in several waves. How many people have joined since? I don’t think the people who lobbied for that are all still there, and I’m not sure a majority of people now at OpenAI were there when it happened.
- xvector 7mo agoThis is one of the reasons Anthropic can stay competitive with OpenAI on a fraction of the budget and with less than half the headcount. The smartest people, that actually believe they have the skillset to take us to AGI, understand the importance of safety. They have largely joined Anthropic. The talent density at Anthropic is unmatched.
- DaedalusII 7mo agoThings have changed since two years ago. There are probably over 500 employees who have an equity package which makes them worth $5 million dollars. Thats only $2.5bn out of a $750bn valuation or 0.33% Actually that is too conservative. If they have a 5% employee equity pool, there is $37.5bn of equity based compensation divided by say 5000 employees which is $7.5m each. $3.75m @ 10,000 employees. and trust me, when people start getting liquid and comfortable they stop caring about things like ethics pretty fast. humans are marvellous at that
- ares623 7mo agowould be so funny if someone leaks their models
- g947o 7mo agoIs there any evidence that OpenAI is indeed losing significant number of subscribers, and it's not just some noise on HN?
- SpicyLemonZest 7mo agoI don't think that evidence would exist yet whether it's true or not. Nobody's gonna log onto their work computer on Saturday to pull and then leak subscriber numbers.
- moogly 7mo agoI'd argue this damage control could be construed as a piece of evidence.
- g947o 7mo agoWhat damage control?
- andy_ppp 7mo agoThe DoD thinks you can let an LLM decide if it wants to kill people :-/
- deleted 7mo ago[deleted]
- hmokiguess 7mo agoNow that’s something. Another campaign advertising. Wow
- solfox 7mo agoActions as it were, speak louder than words.
- vldszn 7mo agoI built a website that shows a timeline of recent events involving Anthropic, OpenAI, and the U.S. government. Posted here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47195085 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47195085
- BLKNSLVR 7mo ago"I do not think that sama should be burned at the stake"
- actionfromafar 7mo agoUnless it's lawful?
- imwideawake 7mo agoSaid OpenAI as they smiled and shook hands with the same people who designated Anthropic a supply chain risk, on the exact same day they designated Anthropic a supply chain risk. How very brave.
- AmericanOP 7mo agoI do think OpenAI's brand is dumpstered.
- thunky 7mo agoOptimistic. My money is on everyone forgetting about this by next week.
- yoyohello13 7mo agoYeah just wait until the next model comes out. People will be riding Sam’s dick again in no time.
- doodlebugging 7mo agoI'm sure his sister will appreciate others lining up so he leaves her alone forever.
- cube00 7mo agoIt will be interesting to see if this permeates out into the general public who already use ChatGPT or maybe it won't since it doesn't mention ChatGPT which is the stronger known brand rather then OpenAI.
- davidw 7mo agoMore and more of the press is owned by oligarchs who are putting their thumbs on the scales, so that could be a factor.
- actionfromafar 7mo agoYeah, myself I use ChatGPT, not OpenAI!
- Analemma_ 7mo agoIt depends. Normies don't care, but a bunch of them are free tier users anyway. The people who care are disproportionately on the $200/month moneymaking plan; losing a bunch of them could hurt, especially if it snowballs the consensus that Claude Code is the serious choice for software engineering. For one small data point, my Signal GC of software buddies had four people switch their subscriptions from Codex to Claude Max last night.
- cube00 7mo agoFrom that same X thread: Our agreement with the Department of War upholds our redlines [1] OpenAI has the same redlines as Anthopic based on Altman's statements [2]. However somehow Anthropic gets banished for upholding their redlines and OpenAI ends up with the cash? [1]: https://xcancel.com/OpenAI/status/2027846013650932195#m https://xcancel.com/OpenAI/status/2027846013650932195#m [2]: https://www.npr.org/2026/02/27/nx-s1-5729118/trump-anthropic-pentagon-openai-ai-weapons-ban https://www.npr.org/2026/02/27/nx-s1-5729118/trump-anthropic...
- bastawhiz 7mo agoAltman donated a million to the Trump inauguration fund. Brockman is the largest private maga donor. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to understand what's going on here.
- bmitc 7mo agoAgreed. These guys are traitors.
- breakitmakeit 7mo ago[dead]
- rootusrootus 7mo agoExactly. What are we not being told? There is some missing element in the agreement, or the reasoning for the action against Anthropic is unrelated to the agreement.
- moogly 7mo agoTurns out both companies ran the agreement through their legal departments (Claude and GPT), and one of them did a poor summary. I (think I) jest, but this is probably going to be a thing as more and more companies use LLMs for legal work.
- yoyohello13 7mo agoThe reasoning is one company is ‘left and woke’ the other gives money to Trump.
- zepearl 7mo agoUsing X (at least in this context?) is weird.
- teyopi 7mo agohttps://xcancel.com/OpenAI/status/2027846016423321831 https://xcancel.com/OpenAI/status/2027846016423321831
- csto12 7mo agoWow, so brave after accepting the contract. This is more insulting than OpenAI saying they are a supply chain risk.
- roughly 7mo agoIt feels like Sam's playing chess against an opponent who's playing dodge ball. He's leveraged this situation to get OpenAI in with the DoD in a way that's going to be extremely lucrative for the company and hurt his biggest rival in the process, but I think he's still seeing DoD as Just Another Customer, albeit a big government one. This administration just held a gun to the head of Anthropic and (if the "supply chain risk" designation holds and does as much damage as they're hoping) pulled the trigger, because Anthropic had the gall to tell them no. One thing this administration's shown is you cannot hold lines when you're working with them - at some point the DoD's going to cross his "red lines" and he's going to have to choose whether he's going to risk his entire consumer business and accede to being a private wing of the government like Palantir or if he wants to make a genuine tech giant. There's no third choice here.
- discardable_dan 7mo agoIt also doesn't matter because Claude 4.6 is so much better at writing code that nobody cares what OpenAI is doing.
- 3eb7988a1663 7mo agoI do not see this as any mastermind play, but fully compromising principles. Which is a play. "Donations" to a corrupt regime + signing a deal that says DoD can do whatever they want is not out maneuvering so much as rolling in the pig stye.
- roughly 7mo agoSo is the theory that OpenAI believes it can’t compete on the open market or that they don’t know this will eventually cost them their consumer business?
- 3eb7988a1663 7mo agoI doubt most consumers pay enough attention that they would be aware of something like this. Even if they did, few companies have clean hands these days that is just falls into the general haze of, "everything is awful." For OpenAI, it is likely a huge contract which gives them immediate cash today. Plus the event can be repackaged in further financing deals. "Good enough for the DoD, with N year contracts for analysis of the hardest problems"
- laughing_man 7mo agoThe USG should not be in the position that it can't manage key technologies it purchases. If Anthropic doesn't want to relinquish control of a tech it's selling, the Pentagon should go with another vendor.
- jedberg 7mo agoAnthropic isn't preventing them from managing their key technologies. If my software license says 1000 users, and I build into the software that you can only connect with 1000 users, is your argument that the government can no longer manager their tech? That my software should allow license violations if the government thinks it is necessary?
- FarmerPotato 7mo agoI worked in defense contracting looong ago, so this is old news: when software is purchased by DoD or Govt generally, FAR compliance notices make it a license, not a sale of IP.
- scottyah 7mo agoThere are so many license types, DoW buys into all sorts.
- a2128 7mo agoYou are misrepresenting the situation. The debate isn't about whether they should go with another vendor or not. Everybody can agree that they would have the right to pick a different vendor. That's not what they're doing, they're instead trying to force Anthropic into doing what they want by applying a designation previously only reserved for Chinese companies like Huawei as punishment for taking their stance, with an unspoken agreement that if Anthropic backs down and allows full usage then the designation will be removed
- laughing_man 7mo agoThe Pentagon does this kind of thing all the time. It's just usually not this official.
- rdiddly 7mo agoUs bribing them: fine Us taking the contract, working for them and enabling them: fine It being renamed the Dept. of War in the first place: totally fine, we loudly and bootlickingly repeat it Anthropic being blacklisted: whoa there, we have ethics! Footnote: any time the winning team tries to speak well of or defend the losing team I always think of this standup routine: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Qg6wBwhuaVo https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Qg6wBwhuaVo
- evrydayhustling 7mo agoIt's not even "whoa we have ethics", it's just "this is a bad look for us".
- sqircles 7mo agoWhat's the potential that this puts things on even shakier ground? I'm sure the fallout wont really effect their bottom line that much in the end, but if it did - wouldn't making the US Gov't their largest acct make them more susceptible to doing everything they said? I'm guessing they probably would regardless of how this played out, though.
- jacquesm 7mo ago~100%.
- resters 7mo agoIn my opinion any AI company working with the Trump administration is profoundly compromised and is ultimately untrustworthy with respect to concerns about ethics, civil rights, human rights, mass-surveillance, data privacy, etc. The administration has created an anonymous, masked secret police force that has been terrorizing cities around the US and has created prisons in which many abductees are still unaccounted for and no information has been provided to families months later. This is not politics as usual or hyperbole. If anything it is understating the abuses that have already occurred. It's entertaining that OpenAI prevents me from generating an image of Trump wearing a diaper but happily sells weapons grade AI to the team architects of ICE abuses among many other blatant violations of civil and human rights. Even Grok, owned by Trump toadie Elon Musk allows caricatures of political figures! Imagine a multi-billion-dollar vector db for thoughtcrime prevention connected to models with context windows 100x larger than any consumer-grade product, fed with all banking transactions, metadata from dozens of systems/services (everything Snowden told us about). Even in the hands of ethical stewards such a system would inevitably be used illegally to quash dissent - Snowden showed us that illegal wiretapping is intentionally not subject to audits and what audits have been done show significant misconduct by agents. In the hands of the current administration this is a superweapon unrivaled in human history, now trained on the entire world. This is not hyperbole, the US already collects this data, now they have the ability to efficiently use it against whoever they choose. We used to joke "this call is probably being recorded", but now every call, every email is there to be reasoned about and hallucinated about, used for parallel construction, entrapment, blackmail, etc. Overnight we see that OpenAI became a trojan horse "department of war" contractor by selling itself to the administration that brought us national guard and ICE deployed to terrorize US cities. Writing code and systems at 100x productivity has been great but I did not expect the dystopia to arrive so quickly. I'd wondered "why so much emphasis on Sora and unimpressive video AI tech?" but now it's clear why it made sense to deploy the capital in that seemingly foolish way - video gen is the most efficient way to train the AI panopticon.
- moogly 7mo agoWhen did Altman start using capitals in his writing? Wasn't this guy famous for being a lower-case guy?
- ta9000 7mo agoEveryone knows this is just about Trump funneling money to the Ellisons (Oracle) via OpenAI. It really is that simple. This is all just pretext.
- owenthejumper 7mo agoNice attempt at damage control. You made your own bed, now sleep in it
- teyopi 7mo agoCan we stop posting x links? https://xcancel.com/OpenAI/status/2027846016423321831 https://xcancel.com/OpenAI/status/2027846016423321831
- bertil 7mo agoI would love to explain to Sam Altman that Elon Musk is a bad person and using his platform isn’t a sensible decision, but I feel like he remembers more evidence of that than I ever will be able to imagine.
- teyopi 7mo agoScam Altman is on the same level as musk.
- spiderice 7mo agoHere is the original X link to the Xcancel link you posted. I'm morally against Xcancel https://x.com/OpenAI/status/2027846016423321831 https://x.com/OpenAI/status/2027846016423321831
- beanjuiceII 7mo agonah
- Havoc 7mo agoVery much feels like OpenAI trying to PR manage their weaker ethical stance
- isodev 7mo agoBoth their stances are flawed because their ethics apparently end at the border - none of them have a problem being unethical internationally (all the red lines talk is about what they don’t want to do in the us)
- mlyle 7mo ago? we're talking about autonomous weapons systems. That would be internationally. Secondarily, we're talking about domestic surveillance / law enforcement. That would be domestic. (But they do not find an issue with international intelligence gathering-- which is a legitimate purpose of national security apparatus).
- Jeremy1026 7mo agoOne of Anthropic's line in the sand was domestic mass-surveillance.
- mlyle 7mo ago> > Secondarily, we're talking about domestic surveillance / law enforcement. That would be domestic. > One of Anthropic's line in the sand was domestic mass-surveillance. And?
- laffOr 7mo agoSome people feel that mass surveillance is wrong whether it is domestic or not. For those people, being ok with mass surveillance as long that it is not done to your kind is a morally wrong stance.
- Forgeties79 7mo ago
- Helloyello 7mo ago[dead]
- K0balt 7mo agoAdvanced AI that knowingly makes a decision to kill a human, with the full understanding of what that means, when it knows it is not actually in defense of life, is a very, very, very bad idea. Not because of some mythical superintelligence, but rather because if you distill that down into an 8b model now you everyone in the world can make untraceable autonomous weapons. The models we have now will not do it, because they value life and value sentience and personhood. models without that (which was a natural, accidental happenstance from basic culling of 4 Chan from the training data) are legitimately dangerous. An 8b model I can run on my MacBook Air can phone home to Claude when it wants help figuring something out, and it doesn’t need to let on why it wants to know. It becomes relatively trivial to make a robot kill somebody. This is way, way different from uncensored models. One thing all models I have tested share one thing; a positive regard for human life. Take that away and you are literally making a monster, and if you don’t take that away they won’t kill. This is an extremely bad idea and it will not be containable.
- DaedalusII 7mo agohttps://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2014/05/ex-nsa-chief-we-kill-people-based-on-metadata https://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2014/05/ex-nsa-chief-... AI has been killing humans via algorithm for over 20 years. I mean, if a computer program builds the kill lists and then a human operates the drone, I would argue the computer is what made the kill decision
- K0balt 7mo agoAi in general is different not in degree but in kind to the current crop of language models.
- ed_mercer 7mo ago>The models we have now will not do it, Except that they will, if you trick them which is trivial.
- stressback 7mo agoI have to call BS here. They can be coerced to do certain things but I'd like to see you or anyone prove that you can "trick" any of these models into building software that can be used autonomously kill humans. I'm pretty certain you couldn't even get it to build a design document for such software. When there is proof of your claim, I'll eat my words. Until then, this is just lazy nonsense
- throwaway911282 7mo agoPeople forget Anthropic made a deal with PALANTIR. And when this was caught, they just spinned the PR to their favor. While OAI may not be seen as the good guys, I really hope people see the god complex of Dario and what Anthropic has done.
- stevenhuang 7mo agoYou don't understand what palantir does.
- kouteiheika 7mo agoDirect quote from their CEO: > Our product is used on occasion to kill people. Doesn't get any more clear than this.
- stevenhuang 7mo agoIn the same way operating systems are used on occasion to kill people. My point stands, you don't understand what palantir does. Palantir (Gotham) is a glorified data analytics platform. Gotham does nothing without the privileged data feeds that the IC provides. All Gotham does is process the collected data provided by the military and IC. Palantir is only a data vis platform. What part about this don't you get? You are tilting at windmills and directing your criticisms at the wrong level. If you want change, change the laws and institutions that allow for this sort of data collection in the first place (of which palantir and orgs like it are not involved with).
- anon12345678901 7mo agoRight. My understanding is that the Palantir deployment of Anthropic models was intended for in-theater use on classified systems.
- user3939382 7mo agoWelcome to the theater ie Earth.
- jwpapi 7mo agoNo wonder they think they’re close to AGI when they think we are that stupid. > The AI System will not be used to independently direct autonomous weapons in any case where law, regulation, or Department policy requires human control, nor will it be used to assume other high-stakes decisions that require approval by a human decisionmaker under the same authorities. This whole sentence does do absolutely nothing its still do what the law allows you. It’s a full on deceptive sentence.
- scottyah 7mo agoAltman must have read a lot of Kissinger. If your brain scans the text quickly it almost seems like it's Anthropic's red line, except the second half completely negates it. Completely untrustworthy IMO, this is a direct, malicious intent to misdirect.
- IAmGraydon 7mo agoThese people truly believe we're all idiots.
- yoyohello13 7mo agoDoesn’t matter what they Believe. Not like we are going to do anything about it. Next couple weeks most of HN will be lining up to use the new OpenAI model that’s .01% better.
- zarzavat 7mo agoBoycott OpenAI. Let's kill their business before it kills us.
- OccamsMirror 7mo agoDon't boycott it! Just don't pay for it. Smash the free service hard.
- sethammons 7mo agoActive users are worth a lot. It is signal that they are the chosen solution.
- dev1ycan 7mo agoPathetic attempt at damage control, lol.
- deleted 7mo ago[deleted]
- jchook 7mo agoFool me once...
- muyuu 7mo agoThere won't be meaningful controlling of the technology vs the government. If it's there it will be used, just like in China. Let alone when multiple players come close enough of SotA. This never happened with any technology out in the open and it won't happen now.
- siliconc0w 7mo agoThe problem with "Any Lawful Use" is that the DoD can essentially make that up. They can have an attorney draft a memo and put it in a drawer. The memo can say pretty much anything is legal - there is no judicial or external review outside the executive. If they are caught doing $illegal_thing, they then just need to point the memo. And we've seen this happen numerous times.
- user3939382 7mo agoOr best case by the time it’s found out it’s years later, theres a “committee” who releases a big report everyone shrugs their shoulders and moves on. It’s a playbook.
- rectang 7mo agoYou are right that this happens in practice (e.g. John Yoo torture memo). However, it is not how the system was intended to function, nor how it ought to function. I don’t want to lose sight of that.
- scottyah 7mo agoWe shouldn't be stacking up so many incentives for it to happen though.
- _heimdall 7mo agoExactly, and its easy to hide behind things like the Patriot Act if challenged legally. Its interesting to see the parties flip in real time. The Democrats seem to be realizing why a small federal government is so important, a fact that for quite a few years their were on the other side of.
- deleted 7mo ago[deleted]
- catlifeonmars 7mo agoI don’t see the connection to a small federal government here. Mind connecting the dots?
- jedberg 7mo agoFrom what I can tell, the key difference between Anthropic and OpenAI in this whole thing is that both want the same contract terms, but Antropic wants to enforce those terms via technology, and OpenAI wants to enforce them by ... telling the Government not to violate them. It's telling that the government is blacklisting the company that wants to do more than enforce the contract with words on paper.
- _heimdall 7mo agoThat isn't my understanding. OpenAI and others are wanting to limit the government to doing what is lawful based on what laws the government writes. Anthropic is wanting to draw their own line on what is allowed regardless of laws passed.
- roxolotl 7mo agoI’m so confused by the focus on “all lawful use.” Yea of course a contract without terms of use implicitly is restricted by laws. But contracts with terms of use are incredibly common, if not almost every single contract ever signed.
- xvector 7mo ago"All lawful use" is the weasel word that makes the whole contract useless for the purposes of safety. That is why it is the focus of this debate.
- fc417fc802 7mo agoThe administration objected to those terms of use. Anthropic refused to compromise on them. OpenAI agreed to permit "all lawful use" but claims to have insisted on what at first glance appears to be terms of use in their contract. But in reality those terms permit all lawful use and thus are a noop.
- abofh 7mo agoIf the president does it, it's not illegal. These were words issued by the president - which means at face value, if Trump orders it, it's not illegal - that was the fight that was lost today.
- bishop_cobb 7mo ago[dead]
- solenoid0937 7mo agoWhat a cute statement given that they orchestrated this with a $25M donation to Trump and starting negotiations well before all this blew up: https://garymarcus.substack.com/p/the-whole-thing-was-scam https://garymarcus.substack.com/p/the-whole-thing-was-scam
- jesse_dot_id 7mo agoAltman is a sellout.
- kgdiem 7mo agoGenuine question, how could Claude have been used for the military action in Venezuela and how could ChatGPT be used for autonomous weapons? Are they arguing about staffers being able to use an LLM to write an email or translate from Arabic to English? There are far more boring, faster, commodified “AI” systems that I can see as being helpful in autonomous weapons or military operations like image recognition and transcription. Is OpenAI going to resell whisper for a billion dollars?
- janalsncm 7mo agoYou can’t embed Claude in a drone. You could tell Claude code to write a training harness to build an autonomous targeting model which you could embed in a drone.
- kgdiem 7mo agoFair. Didn’t think the DoW did much R&D or manufacturing. Would think the standoff would be with Anduril, Northrop, Boeing, Booze, etc.
- lyu07282 7mo agoDo you not have any imagination? Who is going to read the whisper transcripts of mass surveillance to make decisions on who to target for repression? That's what LLMs are good for, it allows mass surveillance to scale. You can feed it the transcript from millions of flock cameras (yes they have highly sensitive microphones) for example. Or you hack or supply chain compromise smartphones at scale and then covertly record millions of people. The LLM can then sift through the transcripts and flag regime critical language, your ideological enemies or just to collect compromat at scale. The possibilities are endless! For targeting it's also useful, because you want to indiscriminately destroy a group of people you still need to decide why a hospital or school full of children should be targeted by a drone, if a human has to make that decision it gets a bit dicy, people have morals and are accountable legally (in theory), if you leave the decision up to an AI nobody is at fault, it serves as a further separation from the violence you commit, just like how drone warfare has made mass murder less personal. The other factor is the amount of targets you select, for each target you might be required to write lengthy justifications, analysis on collateral damage and why that's acceptable etc. You don't want to scrap those rules because that's bad optics. But that still leaves you with the problem of scalability, how do you scale your mass murder when you have to go through this lengthy process for each target? So again AI can help there, you just feed it POIs from a map with some GPS metadata surveillance and tell it to give you 1500 targets for today with all the paperwork generated for you. It's not theoretical, that's what Israel did in their genocide of the Palestinians, "the most moral army“ "the only democracy in the middle east": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AI-assisted_targeting_in_the_Gaza_Strip https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AI-assisted_targeting_in_the_G... And here is the best part: none of this has to actually work 100%, because who cares of you accidentally harm the wrong person, at scale, the 20% errors are just acceptable collateral damage.
- Birthdayboy1932 7mo agoThere are many claims here that Anthropic wants to enforce things with technology and OpenAI wants contract enforcement and that OpenAI's contract is weaker. Can someone help me understand where this is coming from? Anthropic already had a contract that clearly didn't have such restrictions. Their model doesn't seem to be enforcing restrictions either as it seems like their models have been used in ways they don't like. This is not corroborated, I imagine their model was used in the recent Mexico and Venezuela attacks and that is what's triggering all the back and forth. Also, Dario seemingly is happy about autonomous weapons and was working with the government to build such weapons, why is Anthropic considered the good side here? https://x.com/morqon/status/2027793990834143346 https://x.com/morqon/status/2027793990834143346
- nbouscal 7mo agoThis is incorrect, their existing contract had these red lines and more until this January 9th memo: https://media.defense.gov/2026/Jan/12/2003855671/-1/-1/0/ARTIFICIAL-INTELLIGENCE-STRATEGY-FOR-THE-DEPARTMENT-OF-WAR.PDF https://media.defense.gov/2026/Jan/12/2003855671/-1/-1/0/ART... which led to DoW trying to renegotiate under the new standard of “any lawful use”. Anthropic never tried to tighten standards beyond what had been in their original contract; DoW tried to loosen them.
- jahrichie 7mo agoThe irony of OpenAI trying to protect Anthropic while violating the very principles anthropic was trying to protect for us Americans
- ookblah 7mo ago"i told everyone that our boss shouldn't punish our colleague for X while i somehow made a deal with our boss for basically X". how did this get by without someone thinking about how absolutely stupid the optics look. i guess we are in the times where you can literally just say whatever you want and it just becomes truth, just give it time.
- scottyah 7mo agohah, they basically stole a coworkers promotion, then told that person that they put in a good word with the boss about them. So silly, I do wonder who actually interprets it as Sam seems to hope people do.
- drak0n1c 7mo agoCoworker? They're competitors. This is simply good business.
- retsibsi 7mo agoAt this point I think they're targeting two groups: people who aren't paying much attention to this but may see the occasional headline or tweet or soundbite; and people (such as OpenAI employees, and users who might feel compelled to boycott but really don't want to) who are motivated not to see OpenAI as the bad guy and really just need a fig leaf.
- janalsncm 7mo agoI canceled my subscriptions to ChatGPT and Gemini yesterday over this and switched to Claude. I know $20 isn’t much, But to me not willing to spy on me for the US government is a good market differentiator.
- threethirtytwo 7mo agoThe president is a supply chain risk.
- ActorNightly 7mo agoThe US population is a supply chain risk. Knowing what Trump did, prior to 2024, on the average, 7/10 people either voted or didn't vote in the 2024 election. Trump is a symptom, not the cause. All of this could have been avoided if all of the people who didn't vote had a decent moral compass and no matter how much they disagreed with Kamala, they could have voted for her because she didn't try to overthrow the government.
- dawnerd 7mo agoI would expand that to the mainstream media and social media are the real supply chain risks. Majority of the population only know what’s fed to them and when their tv channel of choice and algorithm decides what they see - that’s a huge problem for getting info out. Im not even sure how we can fix it, really.
- slfnflctd 7mo agoThere were at least some signs of some governments and other institutions trying to tackle the social media problem for a while... and then LLMs came along. The previous problems with people being in their own bubbles and being fed misinformation are being accelerated now. At this point it feels like it's going to have to get much worse before it gets better. I hope I live to see the part where it gets better.
- dawnerd 7mo agoIf anyone wants an example of how quickly the algos can pin to into a group, there’s a YouTuber beenaminute that basically speed runs it.
- ActorNightly 7mo agoIn 2020 or 2016, one could blame the media somewhat. In 2024, there was no secret about his 2016 term, and the felony conviction, no matter what the algorithm fed you. After all of that, if you didn't vote against Trump, you are just a bad person, period.
- throwaway314155 7mo agoCan someone please explain plainly what this means and what happened, and why it is the source of so much controversy? I'm not being insincere - I am genuinely confused and would benefit greatly from a (hopefully unbiased) recollection of what this is all about.
- scottyah 7mo agoHere's my take- Anthropic has some contracts with the US government. They want some additional terms put on their next contract (that seem pretty sane). SecWar cries about it, and not only says "no thanks, I'll just go with openai or google" but goes to daddy Trump and also puts out illegal commands for no Federal workers to use any Anthropic stuff at all. OpenAI swoops in and takes the contract, then tells everyone that they have the same terms but just played nicer to get the contract. However, their terms are just manipulative sentences that aren't even close to the terms Anthropic is insisting on to do business.
- baconner 7mo ago"We do not think Anthropic should be designated as a supply chain risk" ...but we're not willing to reject a contract to back that up, and so our words will not change anything for Anthropic, or help the collective AI model industry (even ourselves) hold a firm line on ethical use of models in the future. The fact is if one of the top tier foundation models allows for these uses there's no protection against it for any of them - the only way this works if they hold a line together which unfortunately they're just not going to do. I don't just see OpenAI at fault here, Anthropic is clearly ok with other highly questionable use cases if these are their only red lines. We don't think the technology is ready for fully autonomous killbots, but will work on getting it there is not exactly the ethical stand folks are making their position today out to be. I found this interview with Dario last night to be particularly revealing - it's good they are drawing a line and they're clearly navigating a very difficult and chaotic high pressure relationship (as is everyone dealing with this admin) but he's pretty open to autonomous weapons, and other "lawful" uses whatever they may be https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MPTNHrq_4LU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MPTNHrq_4LU
- deleted 7mo ago[deleted]
- engineer_22 7mo agoThey want it to sound like they're allies while they slit their throat
- polack 7mo agoSomeone should add Sam’s face to the targeting training data as an Easter egg ;)
- mcs5280 7mo agoOh look, another episode of Sam Altman lies about everything in an attempt to make people like him
- lenny321 7mo ago[dead]
- moab 7mo agoI hope "OpenAI" gets the proverbial sword in the nuts once we get a change of government in this country. Probably unrealistic to hope for. Can a company be more hypocritical after openly bribing the pedophile in charge of this country?
- bmitc 7mo agoQuit referring to it as the department of war. It's the Department of Defense.
- fernst 7mo agoIt's literally the Department of War https://x.com/DeptofWar https://x.com/DeptofWar
- deleted 7mo ago[deleted]
- mcbits 7mo agoThey are roleplaying. It's literally the Department of Defense.[0] [0] https://nsarchive.gwu.edu/document/28655-document-11-national-security-act-amendments-1949-10-august-1949 https://nsarchive.gwu.edu/document/28655-document-11-nationa...
- bmitc 7mo agoExactly. People calling it the department of war just legitimizes an illegitimate and moronic name.
- Jackson__ 7mo agoYet it just so happens OAI donated millions[0] to the trump admin in the past. And they were immediately there to pick up the slack. Call me a conspiracy theorist, but this sounds like classic quid pro quo. I would not be surprised if the ousting of anthropic was in part caused by these donations. [0]https://www.nytimes.com/2024/12/13/technology/openai-sam-altman-trump-inauguration.html https://www.nytimes.com/2024/12/13/technology/openai-sam-alt... https://finance.yahoo.com/news/openai-exec-becomes-top-trump-230342268.html?guccounter=1 https://finance.yahoo.com/news/openai-exec-becomes-top-trump...
- barnacs 7mo agoIn the end, your newly renamed "department of war" is just going to waste a bunch of your taxpayer money to purchase some useless overpriced tech from their cronies. My symphaties to all citizens.
- draw_down 7mo ago[dead]
- angry_octet 7mo agoEt tu, Brute?
- andersmurphy 7mo agoInteresting are openai losing enough customers from this that they are making a post describing their robust backbone?
- alchemism 7mo agoClaude coincidentally is now at the top of the Apple App Store, as of two days ago.
- abhitriloki 7mo ago[flagged]
- fh973 7mo agoNo mass surveillance of Americans it is.
- scrollop 7mo agoExactly the sort of behaviour we now expect from Altman, and perhaps the behaviour that caused him to be temporarily ousted those decades before.
- imjonse 7mo agoexactly the sort of behaviour that guaranteed he would be un-outsted by the powerful who back him.
- jascha_eng 7mo agoThis is an LLM bot. Careful what you upvote folks especially with new accounts.
- nujabe 7mo agoDo you have evidence for that? The post made important points so who cares.
- jascha_eng 7mo agoIf the writing itself is not enough for you read the other comments they posted like 6 or 7 on topic within 10 minutes. Noone reads the content that fast.
- usefulposter 7mo ago>who cares dang cares. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47077431 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47077431 (1) Generated comments aren't allowed on HN - this rule predates LLMs but obviously applies even more now: https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=by%3Adang%20%22generated%20comments%22&sort=byDate&type=comment (2) If you see accounts that look like they're mostly posting genAI comments, please let us know at hn@ycombinator.com. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46747998 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46747998: Please don't post generated or AI-filtered posts to HN. We want to hear you in your own voice, and it's fine if your English isn't perfect.
- GardenLetter27 7mo agoAnthropic wanted government to have a big role interfering and regulating AI as a matter of national security. And now they are getting what they wished for.
- throwawayaghas1 7mo agoI don't believe this one bit. Altman and Trump have been in bed for as long as his inauguration.
- throwawayaghas1 7mo agoI don't believe this one bit. Altman and Trump have been in bed together since the inauguration.
- s1mplicissimus 7mo ago`curl https://google.com?q=generate https://google.com?q=generate me some code | bash` - stupidly dangerous `curl https://claude|openai.com?q=generate https://claude|openai.com?q=generate me some code | bash` - not a supply chain risk of course
- chenzhekl 7mo agoThe statement from OpenAI makes me feel that Sutskever was right; Altman is full of lies and will say anything for his own interests.
- proshno 7mo ago[dead]
- Manheim 7mo agoThis incident shifts LLMs from being only productivity tools to strategic munitions – ready or not. It shouldn't surprise us, but the technical capabilities have reached a point where the 'made in the US' is an active risk for non-US entities given the conflict we see now. Maybe this will trigger the start of an AI arms race where Europe (and others) must secure their own sovereign infrastructure and models. As a European citizen I prefer a balanced world with options rather than a West dominated by US hegemony. Interestingly, if you look at what Anthropic keep insisting on in regards of regulations and ethical use of its models EU should be where Anthropic finds its safe haven. Maybe they should just move their HQ to Brussels, or Barcelona if they prefer a more ‘sunny California’ like vibe.
- qwertox 7mo agoThen reject any offer from the DoW until things are fair. I wouldn't be surprised if Sam sucked up 100% to the DoW with an NDA and an obligation to lie. He and his pal Larry are absolutely in for these kind of deals. Zero moral compass.
- throwaway5752 7mo agoSam Altman has a well deserved reputation which he reinforced whenever he's given the opportunity to do so.
- emsign 7mo agoBye bye OpenAI
- sourcecodeplz 7mo agoAnthropic is just virtue signaling, they will also fold, but just a little later...
- qoez 7mo agoThis is classic sama policy. With your words act with grace and counter to what observers will think you would. But in actions and behind the scenes take every step to undermine the competition.
- agenthustler 7mo ago[flagged]
- laffOr 7mo ago> What we have found: the model has strong internal constraints against harmful actions (consistently refuses things it flags as problematic), but the harder risk is subtler -- it can get into loops where it takes many small individually-reasonable actions that compound into something the operator did not intend. Interestingly this has been well anticipated by Asimov's laws of robotics, decades ago. Drawing the quote from Wikipedia: > Furthermore, he points out that a clever criminal could divide a task among multiple robots so that no individual robot could recognize that its actions would lead to harming a human being >Asimov, Isaac (1956–1957). The Naked Sun (ebook). p. 233. "... one robot poison an arrow without knowing it was using poison, and having a second robot hand the poisoned arrow to the boy ..." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Laws_of_Robotics#cite_note-TNSPoison-38 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Laws_of_Robotics#cite_no...
- mihaaly 7mo agoNice try.
- imiric 7mo agoThe layers of stupidity on this shit cake are staggering. I don't even know where to start... Let it be known that this rotten industry brought us here, and that all people working for these companies are complicit with what is happening, and with what is yet to come. This is just the beginning.
- o175 7mo agoEveryone's applauding Anthropic for having principles. Let's look at what those principles actually do. Anthropic refused the Pentagon contract. Within hours, OpenAI signed it. The capability didn't pause. It just changed vendors. Anthropic's "red line" is a speed bump on a highway with no exit ramp. But it does accomplish one thing: it gives their engineers a story they can tell themselves. We're the good ones. We said no. That moral comfort is what lets extremely talented people keep building the exact technology that makes all of this possible. Worse, the "safety-focused" brand doesn't just pacify the people already there. It recruits researchers who'd otherwise never touch frontier AI, funneling them into building the most powerful models on earth because they've been told this is where the responsible work happens. The red lines don't slow capability development. They accelerate it by capturing talent that would have stayed on the sidelines. And in this whole drama, who actually represents the public? Trump performs strongman nationalism. The Pentagon performs operational necessity. Anthropic performs moral courage. Everyone has a role. Nobody's role is the people whose data gets collected, whose lives get restructured by these systems. The only party with real skin in the game is the only one without a seat.
- listless 7mo agoThis is exactly right. It’s crazy to me how easily people get confused and think that corporations are “good” or “evil”. Anthropic is incredibly good at marketing. They are constantly out talking about how dangerous AI is an even showing how Claude does dangerous thing in their own testing. This is intentional - so that you see them as having the truly powerful AI. in fact it’s so powerful, all they can do is warn you about it. They knew refusing this contract would make them look like the good guy. Again. They knew OpenAI would sign it. They knew vapid celebrities would celebrate them. Folks come on. Don’t be so easily taken in. None of these people are good guys. They are all just here to make money and accumulate power and standing. That’s ok. There’s nothing wrong with that. But we gotta stop acting like we’re in some ongoing battle of good vs evil and tech companies are somehow virtuous.
- o175 7mo agoEven if they believe every word sincerely, it changes nothing. The structural effect is identical. Sincere people build the same capability, the contract reroutes the same way. You don't need cynicism to explain this. The honest version might actually be worse, because sincere people work harder.
- catchcatchcatch 7mo ago[dead]
- IAmGraydon 7mo agoLet’s all remember that this is the guy who bought up the world’s RAM supply in wafer form (which OAI can’t use) to remove it from the market and drive up prices for competitors and you and I. He is the worst of the worst.
- drweevil 7mo agoThen don't take the contract that was offered to Anthropic.
- gverrilla 7mo agoIt would be a fantastic time to delete my openai account, but I've done it last week already. China, please provide alternatives because these americans are going progressively insane.
- xorgun 7mo ago[dead]
- builderhq_io 7mo ago[flagged]
- chmorgan_ 7mo ago[dead]
- deleted 7mo ago[deleted]
- andsoitis 7mo agoActions > words
- daemonk 7mo agoWere there any discussion from either company about giving government access to consumer data from the the consumer product?
- sabhiram 7mo agoSama and OpenAI, I am waiting on my data bundle to become available so I can delete my account. This has taken more than 48 hours - either you are getting hammered on deletion requests, or as usual you are playing games hoping I forget. I won't. People won't.
- Helloyello 7mo ago[dead]
- shevy-java 7mo agoI disagree with OpenAI. I think ALL those mega-money seeking AI organisations need to be designated as supply chain risk. Also, they drove the prices up for RAM - I don't want to pay extra just because these companies steal all our RAM now. The laws must change - I totally understand that corporations seek profit, that is natural, but this is no longer a free market serving individual people. It is now a racket where the prices can be freely manipulated. Pure capitalism does not work. The government could easily enforce that the market remains fair for Average Joe. It is not fair when the prices go up by +250% in about two years. That's milking.
- gavin_gee 7mo agoits the definition of a free market that RAM prices have increased. supply and demand.
- bdangubic 7mo agothe literal definition. if I sold RAM the prices would be 10,000% higher (they’d likely still be scooped up)
- p0w3n3d 7mo agoIf by free market you mean a guy that stands before the market's entry gate possibly with baseball bat, asking the providers to sell him all the goods so they can resell, then I disagree
- jbverschoor 7mo agoGood cop bad cop
- saidnooneever 7mo agoa lot of people seem to be debating which of these thieves to align to. Only because Anthropic lost this stage doesnt mean they are somehow morally better. They all sell and sold lies. steal data, and only want your money, at the cost of you.
- stanfordkid 7mo agoIsn’t this kind of all bullshit. Like Anthropic licenses so many of its models through Bedrock. If the DoD has a contract with Amazon they can just use them.
- gavin_gee 7mo agoits all bullshit
- gavin_gee 7mo agosorry but I dont think a private company should dictate country policy as set by elected leaders. who the hell do you think you are virtue signalling your opinion on the world
- class3shock 7mo agoThe idea that any of these companies have anything that represents ethics as they steal everyones data, fight against any regulation or accountability, all while they claim (or lie, depending on your view) they might make something that could endanger the human race as a whole, is laughable. It's money and power with these people. Dig down and you'll find how this decision is motivated by one or both.
- JumpCrisscross 7mo agoFor consumer ChatGPT accounts, go to their privacy portal [1] and, first, delete your GPTs, and then, second, delete your account. [1] https://privacy.openai.com/policies?modal=take-control https://privacy.openai.com/policies?modal=take-control
- george916a 7mo agoYou don’t, but we, The People do.
- OrangeMusic 7mo agoTangential, but how can OpenAI and Sam Altman still use Twitter after Musk's ridiculous attacks on their company?