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The EU still wants to scan your private messages and photos
- 21asdffdsa12 6mo agoDo your part- photograph your ass every day, send the pictures to your representative and EU parliament member.. they need to know. Volunteer the knowledge they crave.
- mediumsmart 6mo agoprivate messages are unrecorded audio and private photos come out of instant cameras. Good luck scanning that.
- SanjayMehta 6mo agoI love this. These are the same people who create think tanks and "international courts" to point fingers at "third world" countries for "authoritarianism," "freedom of speech." Hypocrisy par supreme
- mfru 6mo agoThe EU is a horribly intransparent and dubiously democratic institution. As a normal citizen you have no real possibility to hold MEPs accountable other then writing an angry E-Mail. In an actually democratic system politicians would be in their position only by mercy of the people and can be voted down from their position anytime if enough people petition for it. (and not just maybe be called back when elections at home plummet) Politicians should be afraid of the people and not the other way round.
- outime 6mo agoAfraid of what exactly? Someone starting a Change.org petition that gets a few random signatures and is quickly forgotten? Losing a couple of votes? The consequences are almost nonexistent, so there's nothing to be afraid of.
- c16 6mo agoGreat that MPs are apparently exempt from the scanning. As if there aren’t enough high profile menaces in power. Either include everyone, or accept it’s an awful idea for security and exempt everyone.
- iamskeole 6mo agoIt seems the vote passed [1], meaning the existing Regulation [(EU) 2021/1232] was _extended_ until August 3 2027, with some amendments to the previous text: - added targeted scanning requirement - scanning must be “targeted, specified and limited… where there are reasonable grounds of suspicion… identified by a judicial authority” [1] https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/document/TA-10-2026-0070_EN.html https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/document/TA-10-2026-007...
- gpderetta 6mo agoThat should completely change the regulation from mass surveillance to targeted wiretapping with a warrant.
- solstice 6mo agoThe proposal was rejected: https://chaos.social/@maxim/116294966670838045 https://chaos.social/@maxim/116294966670838045
- exceptione 6mo agoI am not oblivious to the intent behind this push, but even if you focus solely on the technicalities the idea falls apart. Even with only client-side verification this will be a big privacy intrusion. I see current AI's flag prompts for the most stupid reasons for using words that might possibly occur in non-safe contexts too. The human experience is just too complex for a machine to understand. To properly assess something, you need to be bodied in reality, being related to the other human in the same human reality. All the datacenters of the world combined will fail the stated objectives, let alone a stupid phone chip. We should not allow computers to take on the role of policing actors in our human reality, because they even can't perform that role faithfully.
- frail_figure 6mo agoGood news, we held out strong!
- pugchat 6mo ago[dead]
- sayYayToLife 6mo agoImagine the outrage if this happened in the US instead because it's in Europe there's just a bunch of apologists here. The longer I live I think US citizens just have the highest standards for both morals and life expectations. Meanwhile Europe is happy to get anything.
- guzfip 6mo ago> Imagine the outrage if this happened in the US instead There’d be bunch of fat fucks who will write screeds on the internet but won’t get off their fat ass to do anything about it?
- pym4n 6mo agoI honestly think these lawmakers have no idea how deep this rabbit hole goes - it's not possible to implement what they are proposing.
- quater321 6mo agoThe new definition of democracy and freedom is: - censoreship - propaganda - ban of oppositions (anti globalist, conservative parties) - NO privacy
- rheir 6mo agoresults here: https://portal.assisteu.eu/european_parliament/plenary/votes/dossier/01KMMYN452V6X6V9PXXWSZ2F8R https://portal.assisteu.eu/european_parliament/plenary/votes... You can find how present MEPs voted There are 10 votings (not only one), some adopted and some rejected, I am not sure what that means, maybe someone can elaborate.
- _rnmp 6mo agoCurious how they plan to handle encrypted attachments — scanning has to happen either before encryption (client-side) or after decryption (server-side). If E2EE is preserved end-to-end, there's literally no point in the pipeline where a third party can scan without the client's cooperation. So either E2EE breaks, or the law is unenforceable by design.
- functional_dev 6mo agoI agree its unenforceable by design unless they control the OS
- bfelbo 6mo agoIt’s now EOD Thursday. What was the conclusion of the vote? (not shown on the chat control website as far as I can tell)
- tithos 6mo agoWhat do you have to hide except for a couple possible Nudey pics
- MrBruh 6mo agoYou can directly call your representatives by looking them up here: https://www.europarl.europa.eu/portal/en https://www.europarl.europa.eu/portal/en
- vrganj 6mo agoFraming this as the EU's attempt is antieuropean propaganda. It is the Conservatives attempt. The EU parliament is the entity that shot it down last time.
- ab5tract 6mo agoCan you clarify what you mean? The linked website makes it seem that the majority MEPs of the supporting countries are on board. Are all of the (listed as) supporting countries currently under conservative governments?
- vrganj 6mo agoTo quote the banner on said website: > The Conservatives (EPP) are attempting to force a new vote on Thursday (26th), seeking to reverse Parliament's NO on indiscriminate scanning. The vote itself is being forced by the EPP. This article by an MEP has more info: https://www.patrick-breyer.de/en/the-battle-over-chat-control-how-eu-governments-and-the-tech-lobby-are-trying-to-overturn-parliaments-vote-a-comprehensive-fact-check/ https://www.patrick-breyer.de/en/the-battle-over-chat-contro...
- iso1631 6mo agoThere are two elements to the EU The Council, which is headed by the government of each member state in equal measure - similar to the Senate in the US And Parliament, which are directly elected by the people, with each member state having representitives in proportion to their population, so Germany has far more than Ireland. This is similar to Congress. Now this site says Germany supports it, but then says that MEPS > 49 oppose, 47 in favor (45 confirmed, 2 presumed based on government stance) I would thus infer that the "most member states" refer to the national governments (that were elected by their population) position and not the direct MEP position. However a quick look at the json it's loading and I can't see Now as the parliament has blocked it, a grouping, the "EPP" (Think Ronald Reagan type republicans) is trying to use their influence to bring it back to a vote. > "The Conservatives (EPP) are attempting to force a new vote on Thursday (26th), seeking to reverse Parliament's NO on indiscriminate scanning. This is a direct attack on democracy and blatant disregard for your right to privacy."
- leugim 6mo agoSo they will pass it until is a yes?
- seanthemon 6mo agoModern democracy
- tosti 6mo agoWait until you find out it's actually already implemented and they're trying to legitimise it.
- AnssiH 6mo agoThe proposal they are voting on is about continuing the current time-limited implementation (voluntary scanning, Regulation (EU) 2021/1232). This is not about mandatory scanning.
- cess11 6mo agoIt was one of the things Ylva Johansson infamously said about it, Microsoft and Apple are already doing it so what's the big deal? Makes me think about this clip. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CjhsLq3-ZWE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CjhsLq3-ZWE
- RobotToaster 6mo agoExactly what happened when Ireland rejected the Lisbon treaty, they were told to vote again until they voted the "right" way.
- koolala 6mo agoLike UI saying "Yes" | "Ask later"
- gulfofamerica 6mo ago[dead]
- elzbardico 6mo agoThey never quit. They just waited for something else to dominate the news, so they could fly it under the radar. The war started, so, they felt it was now or never.
- fooqux 6mo agoIt's not now or never. It's now, or the next attempt or the next.
- jiggawatts 6mo agoWho is "they"? That's the key question! There's a small group of very powerful people that keep pushing this agenda. Who are those people? Find out. Publicize their names. Make their corruption visible and linked to their identity. In case anyone has an issue with this: Remember! This is what they want! For you! Not for them. Only the plebs.
- elzbardico 6mo agoBureaucratic systems have a internal logic by themselves that goes beyond the agenda of individual actors. The first goal of every bureaucracy is to guarantee its survival and power, all other goals are downstream this first goal.
- adammarples 6mo agoThis isn't a conspiracy... "They" are the EPP, a democratically elected party acting fully in public with their names attached to everything.
- autuni 6mo agowhat still is important though, is to look into who is meeting with them, lobbying them, and how they profit from what they're doing personally. this last part may just be my own bias in observing politicians, but I rarely feel like the top politicians in the EU (or any of their member states really) push for things they themselves actually care about or believe is right "for the people".
- derefr 6mo agoSo... if we all care so much about shooting down the bad idea, why is nobody proposing opposite legislation: a bill enshrining a right to private communications, such that bills like this one would become impossible to even table? Is it just that there's no "privacy lobby" interested in getting even one lawyer around to sit down and write it up? Or is there at least one such bill floating around, but no EU member state has been willing to table it for discussion?
- dgxyz 6mo agoThere’s no point. The only way you can fix this is to pretty heavily market the situation and publicise and shame the lobbyist scum pushing this. And their associated ties.
- triska 6mo agoQuoting from the Charter of Fundamental Rights of the European Union, https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:12012P/TXT https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:12... : "Article 7 Respect for private and family life Everyone has the right to respect for his or her private and family life, home and communications. Article 8 Protection of personal data 1. Everyone has the right to the protection of personal data concerning him or her. 2. Such data must be processed fairly for specified purposes and on the basis of the consent of the person concerned or some other legitimate basis laid down by law. Everyone has the right of access to data which has been collected concerning him or her, and the right to have it rectified. 3. Compliance with these rules shall be subject to control by an independent authority."
- petermcneeley 6mo agoYou know that those pieces of paper mean nothing.
- rvz 6mo agoThank you for telling them. Governments do not care about anyone.
- baal80spam 6mo agoBut of course it's back.
- elzbardico 6mo ago[flagged]
- freehorse 6mo agoI don't think criticisms of chat-control-like legislation attempts are downvoted here?
- Pay08 6mo agoThis guy has gone on a small anti-EU tirade elsewhere in the thread.
- hagbard_c 6mo agoIf my experience is anything to go by the answer is 'yes': https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47412060 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47412060 > The clearest example of lobbying (chat control) has repeatedly been struck down. They can try as often as they want and they only have to win once. We - as in those who don't want this Orwellian monster to be written into law - have to win all the time. That comment was quickly voted down. It is unclear whether this was the usual "don't like this person so I'll downvote all his last posts" or targeted at my statement on how these proposals keep on popping up no matter how often the people - in Greek that spells 'δημόσιο' or 'dèmosio', the root of 'democracy' - have made clear they don't want it.
- layer8 6mo agoOne reason to downvote it is because laws having some stability is generally a good thing. It also doesn’t prevent laws being passed that strengthen the right to privacy. The argument is a too simplistic criticism of the legislative process. And it’s independent from criticizing the actual laws that are attempted to be passed. It applies equally to desirable and undesirable laws.
- hagbard_c 6mo agoIn that case the down-voters could have replied with something like that instead of knee-jerk-pressing that down-vote arrow in an attempt to get rid of a dissenting opinion. I would have responded by pointing out that the repeated attempts at pushing through laws which are clearly unwanted by the voting public has no stabilising effect and only undermines the trust in the legislative process. That my argument of 'they can try as often as they wish because they only have to win once while we have to win every time' is not simplistic but realistic. I would be interested to hear your reasoning behind that statement by the way, in what way is it 'simplistic'? Why should it be acceptable for politicos to keep on attempting to push through unwanted laws while it is clearly not allowed for e.g. commercial entities to keep on pestering you with unwanted offers? Here's the very same EU on the subject [1]: Persistent unwanted offers Under EU law, companies may not make persistent and unwanted offers to you by telephone, fax, e mail or any other media suitable for distance selling. I propose a similar law for politicos: Persistent unwanted law proposals Under EU law, politicians may not make persistent attempts to push through law proposals which have been voted down several times before. The law text needs to make clear that it is not allowed to keep on trying to push through essentially identical law proposals which have been voted down by $X sessions of the EU parliament. After having been voted down $X times there is a mandatory moratorium of $Y years before a similar law can be brought up to the vote again. [1] https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/consumers/unfair-treatment/unfair-commercial-practices/index_en.htm https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/consumers/unfair-treat...
- kleiba 6mo agoIf you're ever unsure about whether a proposed EU regulation may be good or bad, just look at whether Hungary supports it: if so, it's bad; if not, it might be good. Egészségére!
- orleyhuxwell 6mo agoI'm Polish and I was positivity shocked that we oppose it. I remember attending some protests against ACTA which as far as I remember was supposed to be something similar, back in my student days. It was -17°C and people still showed up. Apparently we have some culture of opposing censorship and invigilation by state. May come in handy if the democratic decline keeps progressing...
- warkdarrior 6mo agoDo you mean "surveillance" by the word "invigilation" here?
- subscribed 6mo agoCould be a wordplay due to the fact "invigilation" can be translated to and from the Polish word with a _very_ heavy and long connotations to the USSR state surveillance, oppression and abuse. Surveillance would be a more "modern" (even if more natural or seemingly correct word), without this sort of the implied baggage.
- pietmichal 6mo agoIt's not a wordplay. Poles usually make a mistake because "invigilation" sounds english enough to them and just assume it is an english word.
- orleyhuxwell 6mo agoYes it was my mistake, exactly the case you've described.
- dokyun 6mo agoSo much for "digital soverignty".
- nunobrito 6mo agoThey aid the truth because the complete slogan was about EU's digital sovereignity. Not really your sovereignity nor mine.
- Muromec 6mo agoBeing able to make this policy choice in either direction is in fact an example of digital sovereignty. We just don't like what the sovereign has decided this time.
- dgxyz 6mo agoThe trick here is to make it impossible to do so. Don’t put your shit in the cloud and use proper E2E secure messaging. For me the entire idea of the cloud is dead due to exposure like this.
- cubefox 6mo agoIt's client side scanning.
- dgxyz 6mo agoYou can refuse to use software that does it.
- Zufriedenheit 6mo agoIf they force their spyware into Android/iOS you are running out of options.
- NexRebular 6mo agoGotta get back in time. The Symbian S60/S80 platform will rise again!
- dgxyz 6mo agoPixel and GrapheneOS or something. Already considering it.
- drnick1 6mo agoThen guess what, criminals will use Linux phones running semi-custom apps for their encrypted business while honest citizens will be spied on.
- nunobrito 6mo agoLike others said: this is implemented on operating system level, locally. There isn't much escape other than using messengers which encrypt the data locally. Geogram radio is doing this.
- HelloUsername 6mo agoWhy's there '?foo=bar' in the URL?
- brcmthrowaway 6mo agoIt's a web bug
- mrbruh2 6mo agoTo get around the "dupe" filter, it was trying to mark it as a dupe of a 7 month old post.
- Stagnant 6mo agoOkay so I had to look in to it because the site is not really doing a good job explaining it at all. Turns out[0] that they are voting for the extension of the temporary regulation thats been in effect since 2021 (Regulation (EU) 2021/1232). So this is about the "voluntary scanning of private communications" (which is still bad, but has been in effect for almost 5 years already). [0]: https://www.europarl.europa.eu/sedcms/documents/PRIORITY_INFO/1716/SYN_OJ_March%20II_BRU_EN.pdf https://www.europarl.europa.eu/sedcms/documents/PRIORITY_INF...
- AnssiH 6mo agoHere is the regulation that will be voted on: https://oeil.europarl.europa.eu/oeil/en/procedure-file?reference=2025/0429(COD) https://oeil.europarl.europa.eu/oeil/en/procedure-file?refer... Note that the amendment was already amended on 11th March to set expiry to Aug 2027 and to also exclude E2E communications.
- raverbashing 6mo agoYeah so this is about CC 1.0 (which already exists) While it's still worth fighting, it is less worrying The question of course is, why something is allowed multiple votes (and the basic answer is - if it presented some changed - but I don't know if it's the case)
- foweltschmerz 6mo agoThis is the same EU that blocks and hinders innovation in the name of privacy?
- JodieBenitez 6mo ago"for sure"
- deleted 6mo ago[deleted]
- layer8 6mo agoThe EU isn’t a single mind. There are a multitude of factions trying to get through all kinds of things.
- askonomm 6mo agoYou are aware that EU is not a single country, right? I know American education is third-world levels these days, so unfortunately I have to ask this.
- u8080 6mo ago4 Member States Opposing 23 Member States Supporting 0 Member States Undecided
- deleted 6mo ago[deleted]
- flexagoon 6mo agoWhich law are you talking about? Genuine question, because I know about EU laws that are "in the name of privacy" and about those that (arguably) "hinder innovation", but I don't know which one fits both
- foweltschmerz 6mo agoAt time of writing, I was thinking of GDPR.
- mnewme 6mo agoFun fact: the parties that want this are actually those who criticise the EU the most
- nickslaughter02 6mo agoThe party that wants this the most is EPP - you can't be more pro-EU than that.
- amarant 6mo agoYes well, they're running out of good arguments to show how bad the EU is, so they have to force some bad decisions through so that they may have something to cry about. God I love politics
- cbeach 6mo agoNot true. In the UK, the only party that would repeal the heinous “Online Safety Act” are Reform UK, which is headed by notorious Euroskeptic MP Nigel Farage.
- Muromec 6mo ago"would"
- odiroot 6mo agoNot really. Looking at Polish MPs for example, there's no clear pattern, rather a "healthy" mix from all parties with some random selection of opposing ones.
- doener 6mo agoSee also: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47522647 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47522647
- Smar 6mo agoSo EU syill wants to harm children.
- xeonmc 6mo ago[flagged]
- x775 6mo agoI am the creator of Fight Chat Control. Thank you for sharing. It is unfortunately, once again, needed. The recent events have been rather dumbfounding. On March 11, the Parliament surprisingly voted to replace blanket mass surveillance with targeted monitoring of suspects following judicial involvement [0]. As Council refused to compromise, the trilogue negotiations were set to fail, thus allowing the Commission's current indiscriminate "Chat Control 1.0" to lapse [1]. This would have been the ideal outcome. In an unprecedented move, the EPP is attempting to force a repeat vote tomorrow, seeking to overturn the otherwise principled March 11 decision and instead favouring indiscriminate mass surveillance [1, 2]. In an attempt to avoid this, the Greens earlier today tried to remove the repeat vote from the agenda tomorrow, but this was voted down [3]. As such, tomorrow, the Parliament will once again vote on Chat Control. And unlike March 11, multiple groups are split on the vote, including S&D and Renew. The EPP remains unified in its support for Chat Control. If you are a European citizen, I urge you to contact your MEPs by e-mail and, if you have time, by calling. We really are in the final stretch here and every action counts. I have just updated the website to reflect the votes today, allowing a more targeted approach. Happy to answer any questions. [0] https://mepwatch.eu/10/vote.html?v=188578 https://mepwatch.eu/10/vote.html?v=188578 [1] https://www.patrick-breyer.de/en/the-battle-over-chat-control-how-eu-governments-and-the-tech-lobby-are-trying-to-overturn-parliaments-vote-a-comprehensive-fact-check/ https://www.patrick-breyer.de/en/the-battle-over-chat-contro... [2] https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/document/OJQ-10-2026-03-26_EN.html#V-29 https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/document/OJQ-10-2026-03... [3] https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/document/PV-10-2026-03-25-RCV_EN.pdf https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/document/PV-10-2026-03-...
- mastermedo 6mo agoWhat does this mean for a non-eu citizen communicating with an eu citizen? Is it as simple as using signal/matrix instead of whatsapp/messenger?
- hsuduebc2 6mo agoNice website! Sadly, url stays the same across all coutries. I can't send anyone direct link.
- hsuduebc2 6mo agoI absolutely don't understand how anyone can support this in the context of rising authoritarianism. Even people in my country which are talking about this phenomena support it. I strongly suspect that they do absolutely know shit about why it's problematic. I wonder if they would support that every of paper mail would be opened and checked. I strongly doubt that.
- layer8 6mo agoIt’s a symptom of authoritarianism rising. It wouldn’t be rising if there wasn’t anyone who supports things like that.
- hsuduebc2 6mo agoThat I would understand, but these policies are supported by most liberal politics from my country and opposed by some populists or "strong hand" politicians. I somehow understand that various russian agents are against that, because that can theoretically be used against them but these liberal democrats are somewhat mystery for me.
- stinkbeetle 6mo agoBecause social cohesion is also breaking down (which is also by design). People increasingly do not trust and can not rely on neighbors and their fellow citizens to share similar interests and look out for one another. And they have much less power to organize with other citizens to petition their government. So they feel they must turn to the state for protection.
- hermanzegerman 6mo agoBecause they fall for the "Its for protecting the Children" Bullshit
- hirvi74 6mo agoAn encrypted message has never sexually violated and traumatized a child, but I'd bet good money that many politicians have. So, it's quite apparent what we need to protect children from in my opinion.
- max_ 6mo agoThe lack of accountability after what was exposed in the Epstein files illustrates that not one in power actually care about kids. "Save the kids", is just a ploy to run scams.
- aniviacat 6mo agoWhat are you hoping to happen regarding the Epstein files? The few politicians in the EU that were named in the Epstein files did resign.
- 4ggr0 6mo ago> did resign oh no, they had to resign from their government jobs and in a year will work in the private sector as consultants for double the salary, those poor souls :'( prison, fines, mental asylum, whatever would be an actual consequence. a bit hyperbolic and reactionary from my side, maybe. but you get the gist.
- tjwebbnorfolk 6mo agodoes this violate GDPR?
- gib444 6mo agoMaybe...in a world where lawmakers didn't put huge exemptions into GDPR for governments and law enforcement etc. Which they did.
- Muromec 6mo ago>GDPR Article 2 Material scope >2. This Regulation does not apply to the processing of personal data: >by competent authorities for the purposes of the prevention, investigation, detection or prosecution of criminal offences or the execution of criminal penalties, including the safeguarding against and the prevention of threats to public security.
- shevy-java 6mo agoThey hate us for our freedoms. A shame the EU is just simulation of democracy. Best case in point: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatar_corruption_scandal_at_the_European_Parliament https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatar_corruption_scandal_at_th...
- afh1 6mo agoWhere are all those "as an EU citizen" commenters? You are but a subject of an ultra-national government whose sole objective is ever increased control over your life and euros.
- gpderetta 6mo agoAs an EU citizen, I'm happy that the parliament has once again rejected the proposal, which at least gives credence to the notion that it not just there to rubber-stamp what the commission decides. But the price of freedom is indeed eternal vigilance.
- moffkalast 6mo agoAs an EU citizen I have to remind you that as a (most likely) US citizen, you've had the Patiot act sanction the NSA to have free reign for this sort of thing for the past 25 years. We've shot it down before, and we'll shoot it down again, regardless of how relentless Palantir lobbying gets.
- pessimizer 6mo ago> you've had the Patiot act sanction the NSA to have free reign for this sort of thing for the past 25 years. This is not true. No part of the Patriot Act required all people all private messages and photos to be scanned or have a backdoor to encryption. You're saying this to minimize what's about to happen to Europe, which is not helpful. The NSA made deals with private companies to tap lines, and used its influence and US intelligence's secret ownership of a Swiss encryption company to encourage us to use broken algorithms. > We've shot it down before, and we'll shoot it down again, regardless of how relentless Palantir lobbying gets. I wish you luck. But there's nothing keeping the EU from doing, and having always done, what the NSA has also done. What you're trying to stop is the requirement to serve your communications to your rulers on a silver platter.
- moffkalast 6mo agoThanks for the luck, it got rejected by a single vote, lmao https://howtheyvote.eu/votes/189574 https://howtheyvote.eu/votes/189574
- spwa4 6mo agoBut don't worry, exceptions for ALL officials are built in. And I do mean ALL officials. In this bill, for example, pedophile gym teachers are perfectly safe from getting scanned. Gym teachers are also the largest group of people convicted for pedophilia. So you can be sure they are keeping their priorities straight. States, and the monopoly telco's are also protected from paying even the tiniest amount of money for companies to do these scans, all costs are entirely offloaded to app developers. So the priorities are clear: 1) protecting the state from even the tiniest amount of responsibility, even at the cost of children getting abused 2) keeping some 50 foreign states from the same 3) keeping a whole list of organizations safe from inspections 4) keeping the state safe from actually spending any amount of money on these scans ... n) protecting children
- hkon 6mo agoofc, they only need to get it approved once. they will try until they succeed
- Vinnl 6mo agoJust a heads up that this is being posted late in the European evening here, so that will affect who's commenting.
- drnick1 6mo ago> The "Chat Control" proposal would legalise scanning of all private digital communications, including encrypted messages and photos. How would this be enforced in practice? In other words, what would prevent E.U. users from using encrypted services outside of the jurisdiction of the E.U., to "illegally" encrypt their hard drives or to run their own private encrypted comms servers?
- cbeach 6mo agoThey won’t need to enforce this rigorously. They’ll just need to show some scary examples of people being arrested or having computers seized for using illegal forms of encryption. The mainstream media will go along with the EU, demonising these dangerous individuals, who must have been up to something nefarious if they were using technologies sanctioned by the EU
- Muromec 6mo agoThe same way you can't send money to the best Korea and watch porn on youtube. There is a long chain of actions that ends with you having e2e on your phone (or what not). At the starts of it there is your physical body living in jurisdiction and transacting with (mostly) other people being somewhat present in the same jurisdiction using government-captured money. There are multiply choke points, controlling which will not result in 100% enforcement, but will make whatever you want to do a huge pain in the ass, so most people will not bother (case in point -- jailbraking). Whoever is left self-selects themselves for selective enforcement.
- drnick1 6mo agoI am not sure I follow. I can't watch porn on YT because YT decides not to host it. But I can absolutely use a VPN and access porn in a jurisdiction that does not block it. I can also, and in fact do, encrypt my hard drives. Even China can't reliably prevent communication over private encrypted networks or services hosted overseas.
- ytpron2026 6mo ago
- crest 6mo agoLet the damn politicans go first and make all their private messages public. Yes everything from boring I'm stuck in traffic honey over nudes to insider trading and lobbying.
- smeggysmeg 6mo agoIt can fail 100 times and it won't count, and the one time this surveillance legislation passes it will become law. Thanks EU, nice show of democracy.
- wolvoleo 6mo agoYeah that didn't take long. Of course they keep pushing it. I knew the big 'win' of the 11th was a bit premature and overcelebrated. The dark forces behind all this set to gain a lot of profits once it passes :(
- iam_circuit 6mo ago[dead]
- retinaros 6mo agoFew days ago we had a guy explaining to us at the top of hn page that we should migrate data to europe. Sometimes I miss the internet of before mass surveillance abd ads everywhere
- deleted 6mo ago[deleted]
- rdevilla 6mo agoThey should just ask the Americans. If you are not a US citizen you have zero rights, and any old creep in Silicon Valley can riffle through your personal information with impunity. I realize I am just recapitulating the modus operandi of Five Eyes here...
- deleted 6mo ago[deleted]
- jedisct1 6mo agoThe US doesn't even have to ask, people already give AI providers all their data and full control over all their devices.
- ZetsuBouKyo 6mo agoit's probably best to go with client-side encryption and share keys with friends privately. that pretty much fixes all the privacy issues after the initial registration, but maintaining that extension with all the company and their updates is a bit of a headache.
- jacknews 6mo agoso much for 'democracy' keep voting until you get the right answer at least EU are voting I suppose. some governments just go ahead and mass-surveil illegally
- _the_inflator 6mo agoLet’s migrate our apps to the EU! Trump Derangement Syndrome is widespread in Europe. Quality of life has gotten so bad and continuous to decline except for mainly Poland and Hungary. And what do systems cling to especially in situations like these? Surveillance. Another massive not so funny joke once again hit Germany the week ago - a smear campaign and hit piece to justify even more censorship. Germany is going down the drain - and the elite is trying to silence freedom of speech massively while ignoring doing what’s important and what’s right. Have fun migrating your app to the EU. No one is coming to save you especially not your shitty infrastructure. Energy crisis, and devs think it is a good idea to go for 2% uptime in the near future. It is so ridiculous.
- mpalmer 6mo agoYes, yes, let's all rally around the free speech haven that is Hungary, which only five short years ago banned "the discussion of gender and sexual diversity in schools, the media, advertising, and other public places." Let's all take this person extremely seriously, as they are advocating for free speech.
- petterroea 6mo agoThey only need to win once, while the public has to fight back every time. Incredibly demotivating
- AnonyMD 6mo agoIf you consider who is monitoring us, it's obvious that this is for the benefit of those in power.
- marsven_422 6mo ago[dead]
- moezd 6mo agoThat's the problem with electing too many people with law background to a parliament: They think it's a Model United Nations session and if they can get things their way despite many real world consequences, they celebrate with joy as our governance becomes literally ungovernable.
- Squarex 6mo agoI think that’s a real problem now. In our parliament (Czech) almost every politician is a lawyer or a doctor. Almost no other profession is represented.
- CodinM 6mo agoIt's really hard to not become a euroskeptic, despite being involved with so many EU related things from my youth to now in which I believed wholeheartedly, but this is just... I know - they just need to win once, we need to win every time.
- trelliumD 6mo agoDONT forget that this legislation is the result of a Lobby of META
- WhereIsTheTruth 6mo agoThey want to do what US Big Tech already is doing Y'all are bunch of hypocrites
- teekert 6mo agoI'm happy that the Netherlands is still against this. Our currently largest party (D66) was also always pretty strong on privacy. When I contacted them some time back (I think using this initiative), they ensured me that they remained against, but did feel that something must be done (ok fair enough).
- ZacnyLos 6mo agoThose are Conservatives from EPP group, not some "The EU". Let's be literal.
- elcapitan 6mo agoLet's also be honest, the social democrats are backing this as well.
- littlestymaar 6mo agoReminder: it's not the “EU”, it's the PPE (the union of conservative European parties), and the national governments.
- razkaplan 6mo ago[dead]
- skrebbel 6mo agoI would like to share here that the author of this site made it very easy to call. If you read this and are in the EU, I urge you to try this. Find a representative you think is at least somewhat likely to change their mind, and call their phone nr listed on the site. I tried one rep and couldn't get through, tried another (their Brussels phone) and I got someone on the line. The site helpfully suggests a call script, which you can take hints from. I got a staffer on the line, who didn't want to share what my rep was planning to vote and generally wasn't very excited about calling with me, but I imagine that if lots of people call lots of these staffers, things actually do get through to these MEPs. Please help.
- deleted 6mo ago[deleted]
- smashah 6mo agowhy are the epsteinists so obsessed with destroying our freedoms and privacy?
- kevinbaiv 6mo ago[flagged]