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LAPD lets contract with surveillance giant Flock expire
- shevy-java 2mo agoFlock has been critisized a lot. Unfortunately it seems that technology will overrule civil rights; there are a ton of youtube videos about that topic from all involved views.
- forks 2mo agohttps://archive.is/zUou2 https://archive.is/zUou2
- superkuh 2mo agoThis is good. But unfortunately it doesn't mean the Flock cameras will be removed because the city doesn't own them. Flock does. And Flock will likely want to keep them there. In other cities when the contract is canceled or let expire Flock prevented those cities from removing the cameras. Some had to resort to covering them with trash bags because they could not legally remove them. This happened in Dayton, Ohio and many other cities. https://www.cnet.com/news/privacy/cities-covering-flock-surveillance-cameras-with-trash-bags/ https://www.cnet.com/news/privacy/cities-covering-flock-surv... > "Some locals have taken matters into their own hands by dismantling Flock cameras and covering them with trash bags" This techcrunch article incorrectly characterizes this need and required behavior as something done by random citizens. But it is actually the cities themselves having to resort to it, totally officially and legally, because of Flock behaving badly.
- srameshc 2mo agoThanks !! It is so easy to assume that ending contract means turning off the cameras. Hopefully ciities can fight back harder for them to remove them, specially when people don't want that surveillance.
- bombcar 2mo agoIt could also mean "we get the cameras for free now ..."
- bdavbdav 2mo agoPresumably the license to surveil the city is extended to flock by the city? Presumably they should be able to compel them to disable them, and provide proof of this (whether they’re trusted or not…)
- kortilla 2mo agoI think the problem is that people are allowed to set up cameras of public spaces without requiring any “license to surveil”.
- cucumber3732842 2mo agoI assure you that if I slapped a camera on city infrastructure they would absolutely find some license or permission that I don't have and threaten me with a million+ dollar fine over it.
- nemomarx 2mo agoare they on land flock owns though? I don't think I could go put up a camera on city infrastructure like traffic lights without their permission. does flock buy a lot of little permissions to install and power their cameras or something?
- logancbrown 2mo agoMaking recording in public require a license is a very easy way to cut free speech and document wrong-doing of a system.
- buzer 2mo agoAren't the cameras on city's land or did city lease the land to Flock? If they are on city's land couldn't city require that Flock removes their stuff from city's property or city will do it on Flock's expense?
- MengerSponge 2mo agoI've seen videos of flock cameras installed improperly (missing a breakaway device) right next to roads. The city must be able to remove unsafe devices! https://highways.dot.gov/safety/local-rural/maintenance-signs-and-sign-supports/iv-sign-supports https://highways.dot.gov/safety/local-rural/maintenance-sign...
- bko 2mo agoI don't know, I'd prefer cops have access to technology that helps them apprehend criminals and enforce the law. Better audits and accountability are the solution, not removing technology.
- hightrix 2mo agoI do know. I do not want to live in a society that is under 24/7 surveillance. Of course, if the cops can watch everything you do all the time, there will be less crime. But that is not a sacrifice I’m willing to make.
- annoyingnoob 2mo ago> if the cops can watch everything you do all the time, there will be less crime I disagree there. If cops watch us at all times then more crimes will be prosecuted, think they'll just sit bored with nothing happening? They will find things, real or not. The reality is that crime is way down, we do not need more enforcement. Leave us alone already. https://www.opencrime.us/years https://www.opencrime.us/years
- bko 2mo agoWhat planet do you live on? Go to a low crime neighborhood. Cops are super friendly and basically spend their day happily helping old ladies cross the street or getting cats down from trees. If you think cops like cracking heads and dealing with petty crime that they'll just invent otherwise and use to harass people, you're out of your mind. You really need to get out more.
- MiloLeo 2mo agoI could show you 10,000 yt videos that show there are plenty of cops that abuse power and harass.
- bko 2mo agoPolice body cameras have completely dispelled this notion and are a god-send to the vast majority of police officers that want to do good work. So much so the left has turned against them https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jP4_2soVZe0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jP4_2soVZe0
- someperson 2mo agoAre there any privacy-first security camera provider where it's the city that manages data access and uses it purely for local law enforcement purposes?
- SoftTalker 2mo agoWhy would you trust the city more than Flock. One of the common claimed abuses of Flock data is city cops using it to stalk exes and crushes. The problem with Flock is not who owns the data, it's the potential for abuse.
- nemomarx 2mo agoflock shares the data with other cities and jurisdictions a little more easily, and also flock workers can see your videos. That's some amount of extra abuse potential?
- cucumber3732842 2mo agoBecause there's a more robust legal framework for curtailing the inevitable abuse when the government does it than when it's done via the "oops our contractor who's a private company" slight of hand. Same basic reason I'd rather have the cops after me than have the environmental/zoning/whatever civil enforcement jerks after me. There's just sooooo much more scrutiny (which really says a lot considering how bad the cops are).
- moate 2mo agoSaid by someone who's clearly never had cops after them...
- deleted 2mo ago[deleted]
- cucumber3732842 2mo agoSaid by someone who's clearly never tangled with civil enforcement. Nearly your rights go out the window when it's non-criminal prosecution. The organizations also aren't nearly as robustly structured to limit damage by "bad apples" as real police departments are. I know this sounds insane in light of how bad the cops are. That's because it is. Civil enforcement is essentially 50yr behind policing when it comes to transparency and accountability.
- CurbStomper 2mo ago[dead]
- kotaKat 2mo agoFun fact: When they switch to Axon Outposts instead, just know that they have Amazon Sidewalk modules inside them, too for backdoor C2 to Axon. (Go check the FCC docs for X4GS06009 and note that there's a Quectel KG100S sitting on the power supply board. https://fccid.io/X4GS06009 https://fccid.io/X4GS06009)
- the_sleaze_ 2mo agoThis means that they connect to Ring and Amazon devices too right?
- declan_roberts 2mo agoI don't understand flock cameras in high crime areas. Every time somebody commits a heinous crime it's always like "they were arrested 72 times and were well known by the police" What's the point in helping the police catch criminals when they don't do anything after the fact!
- copper-float 2mo agoThese high crime areas are predominantly in blue counties/states, and liberal judges are typically soft on crime.
- deleted 2mo ago[deleted]
- stackghost 2mo ago>liberal judges are typically soft on crime. You're going to need to back that claim up with statistics
- Varelion 2mo agoEasily disproved. So much inaccurate malarky on this thread. I would assume it's bots AstroTurfing, if American zeitgeist wasn't already so demonstrably poisoned.
- bflesch 2mo agoSomeone is spending $500M per month on AI to generate grassroots support...
- copper-float 2mo agoI'm not AI, but thanks for the rudeness.
- AlexErrant 2mo agoMy man, if your comments can't be distinguished from a bot's, you're no better than one. Also if you can't tell that your comment's unsubstantiated bait, you really need to go touch grass. Everyone has an annecdote. "it's common enough to be recognized as a trend" is equally justification for racial profiling, and at least racial crime statistics are easily citable. And you still haven't even put forth that modicum of effort.
- jabedude 2mo ago[flagged]
- Varelion 2mo agoCivil disobedience is a civic duty when the state is tyrannical.
- alex43578 2mo ago[flagged]
- Varelion 2mo agoNonsense.
- alex43578 2mo agoWhich part?
- Varelion 2mo agoAll of it Fox News drivel. Hence if was flagged.
- alex43578 2mo agoCan you dispute any of it with facts? In CA: Kostas Linardos had 17 tickets — including for speeding, reckless driving and street racing — and had been in four collisions. Then, in November 2022, he gunned his Ram 2500 truck as he entered a Placer County highway and slammed into the back of a disabled sedan, killing a toddler, court records show. He’s now facing felony manslaughter charges. In December of last year, while that case was open, the DMV renewed his driver’s license. https://calmatters.org/investigation/2025/04/license-to-kill/ https://calmatters.org/investigation/2025/04/license-to-kill... Voting in CA:In most cases, a California voter is not required to show identification to a polling place worker before casting a ballot https://www.sos.ca.gov/elections/voting-resources/voting-california/what-bring https://www.sos.ca.gov/elections/voting-resources/voting-cal... 3D printer regulation: A.B. 2047 goes further than any other legislation on algorithmic print-blocking by making it a misdemeanor for the owners of these devices to disable, deactivate, or otherwise circumvent these mandated algorithms. Not only does this effectively criminalize use of any third-party, open-source 3D printer firmware, but it also enables print-blocking algorithms to parallel anti-consumer behaviors seen with DRM. https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2026/04/dangers-californias-legislation-censor-3d-printing https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2026/04/dangers-californias-le...
- etdznots 2mo agoThe best part is that flock owns the cameras and the poles so even when the contract expires the cameras keep running and recording data that flock can sell to e.g. CHP, LASD, FBI, Palantir; and LAPD can just call them and access the data the flock scam was engineered to be resilient to political pressure by giving departments and jursidictions this fake exit ability while the data continues to be harvested, it is a noose that only tightens; the amount of flock cameras recording only ever goes up not down.
- gxs 2mo agoI didn’t know this but it’s the kind of stuff our tax dollars pay for and ultimately why I’m so disgruntled about the high taxes we pay - especially in the middle class No problem paying taxes - my entire gripe is with what what the moneys spent on
- wilg 2mo agoThe US has below average middle class tax rates. But luckily we can just choose what our tax dollars are spent on through democracy! The main problem is nobody agrees about anything and lots of people are really dumb and can't handle the responsibility of electing competent people into government.
- clickety_clack 2mo agoIt would be a mistake to assume that people who don’t agree with you are really dumb.
- m0llusk 2mo agoThey should hire some juniors to patch together analysis with local LLMs and do that on an as needed basis to avoid the creepiness. Networks of cameras remain a highly powerful way of holding evildoers accountable.
- dude741 2mo ago[flagged]
- Ancapistani 2mo agoThere is a lot of middle ground between ">100k cameras tracking the movement of every vehicle in the country and retaining those data indefinitely" and "cameras in a private neighborhood in response to a specific crime wave".
- mixdup 2mo agoThere is a difference between this situation, a targeted install in a problem situation, and hundreds of thousands of these cameras at every intersection in the country Also, Flock cameras are not just on roads. Many institutions use them for surveillance inside buildings. There is a community center in Atlanta that has them and there is evidence that random people with access to all Atlanta area cameras, including Flock employees and police officers in other jurisdictions, were watching juveniles at the pool. More than one deputy at a suburban Atlanta sheriff's department has been fired for abusing Flock cameras to track romantic interests Like everything else in this country we've taken something that has a useful purpose when used in a limited, controlled fashion and pushed it to the maximum extreme. We can't do anything based on nuance anymore
- dwrodri 2mo agoSomething of consideration: Flock cameras were installed after discussions across the HOA and local police department, after a multiple crimes happened in an area. So long as a discussion about the lifetime of the cameras is raised eventually, this sounds like a measured and reasonable use of surveillance. There is still something to be said about the lack of alignment between Flock the company and the HOA as to how that data is used, but the compromise was explicit, and there was at least some coordination within the community. At the heart of the issue with automatic surveillance is the lack of accountability over those who retain the data and the lack of consent of those surveilled, and measures were taken to address one of those two within your community.
- infecto 2mo agoDoes it say how many cameras the LAPD pays for or if they are getting rid of the flock software from their org? Folks conflate this a lot but often times most regions have a substantial number of private flock deployments, city owned, rarely directly with the police. Police get access to software no costs (AFAIK) for BOLO alerts on tags.
- AbrahamParangi 2mo agoit needs to be illegal for the government to buy data or intelligence that it could not otherwise legally collect itself.
- smalltorch 2mo agoThats a perfect statement to close the loophole. It obvious this should be the case, but when you dump billions of dollars getting around 4th amendment protections, lets just say it takes awhile to close the loopholes.
- alex43578 2mo agoWhy do you think the government couldn’t collect this information themselves? ALPRs are legal, cameras covering a public roadway are legal, and the 4th amendment doesn’t extend to driving on a public roadway.
- smalltorch 2mo agoCould the government set up 80,000 cameras to spy on everyone? No, they are not aloud to create dragnets or conduct mass surveillance. They need warrants. Thats the loophole that flock capitalized on.
- dpoloncsak 2mo agoThere is no expectation of privacy in public. Look at NYC, the government most certainly has setup a network of cameras without a warrant. Flock cameras are all (to my knowledge) in public as well Reference: https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2021/06/scale-new-york-police-facial-recognition-revealed/ https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2021/06/scale-new-yor...
- cj 2mo agoHow many highways and bridges charge tolls via license plate reading cameras? A lot, it's legal, and I would be surprised if that data was used only for processing tolls.
- MAGAtssuck 2mo ago[dead]
- infamouscow 2mo agoThis is easily solved by paying homeless people to destroy the devices.
- eth0up 2mo ago[flagged]
- saagarjha 2mo agoDoesn't he show up regardless
- eth0up 2mo agoI have had my rough brushes with the mutant laureate, but I do miss his presence. Always compelling, and rarely if ever without substance. And Flock (among obviously everything else) happens to be a familiar subject to him/it. He has done local work, in his area, on surveillance and accomplished unusual things. If you have a super computer, mine his/its comment history. It's a trove.
- lowmagnet 2mo agoThey aren't crash compliant, aren't tagged with inspection stickers for signage, and the county/state road agencies could remove them for that alone.
- mchusma 2mo agoI stayed in downtown LA recently and looked like the set from the walking dead. Literally blocks of people wandering in traffic. I guess you could argue you definitely don't need flock cameras to see the problem, but also I don't know how anyone would not do everything possible to stop it.
- advisedwang 2mo agoJay walking is the big crime here?
- cdrnsf 2mo agoWhat's really surprising is that it's the LAPD, of all agencies, that are making this decision while violating civil rights concerns. https://lapublicpress.org/2025/11/lapd-settlements/ https://lapublicpress.org/2025/11/lapd-settlements/ > The top three payout categories totaled $345 million. Civil rights violations, police shootings, excessive use of force, and illegal searches collectively accounted for $183 million, almost half of the claim amounts. Plenty of civil rights violations, but Flock is too much even for them.
- nunez 2mo agoHonestly, if Flock forces people to enforce speed limits and follow the rules of the road, its expansion can't come fast enough. I realize how contrarian of a view this is to the mainstream, but car accidents are a leading cause of death worldwide, and it's my belief that many of them wouldn't have happened if driving rules were respected.
- krupan 2mo agoI agree with you 100% that cars are super dangerous, but that's a whole 'nother discussion
- advisedwang 2mo agoWe've had speed cameras and red-light cameras for years. Flock cameras are not traffic enforcement cameras.
- hinkley 2mo agoOne of the best sound designs ever invented was the 'you just lost' melody created for The Price is Right. That is not a non sequitur.
- deleted 2mo ago[deleted]