11 ms·
I recently moved to the St. Louis area for a software job at Boeing. I'm actually in a nice quiet neighborhood in St. Charles right under the flight path for pl
by msisk6 2mo ago
I recently moved to the St. Louis area for a software job at Boeing. I'm actually in a nice quiet neighborhood in St. Charles right under the flight path for planes landing at Lambert Field.
The fireworks last night were insane. All around me folks were setting off commercial grade fireworks bursting hundreds of feet in the air. The house was shaking, my dogs were freaking out, one of them had a seizure. The air was filled with smoke and smelled of gun powder. It was one of the craziest things I've ever experienced.
Next year I'll definitely be planning an out-of-town vacation for the 4th to some location with firework restrictions.
I don't know what the planes were doing; I didn't hear or see any landing with all the smoke and noise.
- greggoB 2mo ago> one of them had a seizure It's insane to me how much dogs are supposedly loved by such a large chunk of the pop, and yet people proceed to go apeshit with fireworks fully knowing how badly this affects them.
- xeromal 2mo agoMy guess because we just read of the seizure stories online but 95% of dogs are ok with it. Mine is. There's a limit to dealing with edge cases that most people have. Not saying this is how I feel or act though.
- nozzlegear 2mo agoWe have three dogs of different breeds and ages, none of them handle fireworks well. They don't have seizures, but one of them turns into a quivering, shaking mess and the other two try to hide under couches and beds. I wish they were okay with it, but my wife and I have to plan our 4th around the dogs because of how they react.
- mikeocool 2mo agoI think you’re probably right about people’s feelings on the matter. Though in my experience dogs that are ok with fireworks are the edge case.
- strken 2mo agoI've had two dogs. One didn't like fireworks but would just turn his head towards the noise then walk over to the nearest human, and the other completely ignored them. However! The first was a Labrador cross and the second was full lab. Breeds intended for use as gun dogs might not react to gunpowder and explosions as much.
- erikerikson 2mo agoMy dog, now passed after a long and happy life, loved fireworks deeply. It was his favorite day of the year. He would chase and pretend to bite, bark, and run around with joy. To be fair, I am quite certain he was an outlier.
- tessierashpool 2mo agono, 95% of dogs are not okay with it. 95% of the dogs in your home are okay with it. this study from Psychology Today finds that 83% of dogs freak out when they hear loud noises: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/canine-corner/202202/how-common-is-the-fear-loud-noises-in-dogs https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/canine-corner/202202...
- mminer237 2mo agoThat study doesn't say "freak out". It says 83% ever showed "any fear" of fireworks, which is a huge variation. My doesn't like going outside when there are fireworks, but the sound of rain freaks him out way more.
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- BenjiWiebe 2mo agoOur dog is not ok with fireworks or gunshots. He either goes into the basement (normally off limits) or into the bedroom (mostly off limits) when he hears them. However it also took him quite a few years to get over his fear of thunder. I think he'll survive even though he'd be included in the 83%.
- gadders 2mo agoYeah, my dog either looks at them or ignores them. Same with thunderstorms.
- lazystar 2mo agofrom OP: >setting off commercial grade fireworks bursting hundreds of feet in the air. The house was shaking, I'm in Bellevue, WA, and experienced house-shaking fireworks for the first time this year. I was inside with my cats - theyve always been more or less fine with fireworks, just hiding under the bed - but this year's house shakers were on another level. When the first one went off, I thought an accident had happened and a cache of fireworks had exploded. Scared the hell outta me. Then there were about 5 more like that spread across the next 5 hours. 0% of pets would be ok with these ones, I guarantee it. Idk if theyre new this year or what but Ill be doing the same as OP next year.
- chrismorgan 2mo agoNot just dogs; more than a few humans don’t cope with loud noises of various kinds.
- billfor 2mo agoGood thing we didn’t have too many of those people during the revolution or we would still be part of Great Britain.
- jltsiren 2mo agoI guess you had more of those people after the revolution. Many combat veterans react to anything resembling gunfire and explosions. And you can add drone noise to that these days.
- gosub100 2mo agoHey, we cannot be patriotic here. The only fighting we support is the genocide in Gaza and helping Ukraine because "russia bad".
- chneu 2mo agoLike 80% of dog owners treat dogs like possessions. When I say "like possessions" I mean they abuse them by physical means or by locking them into small apartments and not meeting the animals basic needs. It's wild how people trap dogs into small city/suburb boxes and then 'train' them to be good(break them). I stand by 80% if you account for global numbers and not just western/developed nations. In much of the developed world it's weirdly mandatory to have a dog or cat. The way folks treat them is so messed up. Then these folks turn around and claim they love animals. It's nonsense. Most people don't need a pet nor do they treat them like an animal lover would. But words have no meaning nowadays. Everyone is everything they want to be.
- colechristensen 2mo agoThe degradation of canine genetics and behavior to the point where loud noises cause seizures is pretty absurd. I love dogs but I grew up around working dogs. City people have pushed dog breeding to the point where the desirable dog is riddled with some pretty extreme codependency and anxiety that they mistake for affection and companionship. The poor animals spending their lives in a few hundred square feet and completely alone for a large majority of their lives kinda sickens me.
- petre 2mo agoI agree, but luckily my terrier apparently doesn't give a poo about fireworks. Probably nobody jad thrown fireworks at him yet. My inlaws' country dog (also a fox terrier mix with the same temperament) growls at people, especially teens, smelling of powder and barks at fireworks and motorbikes. Good thing he's not a Malinois to nip those teens and chase the motorbikes. So it'a more of a nature vs. nurture thing.
- colechristensen 2mo agodog behavior is strictly a reflection of their owner
- borski 2mo agoGiven that most dogs are adopted from shelters, dog behavior is often a reflection of early upbringing. The current owner can train and teach their dog, but some behaviors and fears set in fairly early on. Moreover, many dogs are beaten or worse when they’re young, and undoing that fear and trauma is a lifelong (for the dog) struggle. Thus, dog behavior is far from “strictly a reflection of their [current] owner.”
- anon7725 2mo agoNearly all animals are afraid of fireworks: https://thereader.mitpress.mit.edu/the-devastating-effects-of-fireworks-on-pets-and-wildlife/ https://thereader.mitpress.mit.edu/the-devastating-effects-o... Fireworks are a traumatic and disruptive intrusion on their environment akin to a temporary war. We (humans) already do enough traumatic and disruptive intrusions on the lives of wild animals, that doing this wholly unnecessary “just for funsies” thing is particularly cruel. It’s rich how you’ve decided to call out “city people” as being responsible for the situation rather than the trash individuals who set off illegal fireworks.
- thebruce87m 2mo agoI’m not a dog owner but aren’t you supposed to play fireworks on your TV at increasing volume in the preceding days to get them used to it? That seems a better option than expecting everyone else to change their behaviour because of a pet you chose.
- jjtheblunt 2mo agoI've never heard that, like fireworks homeopathy or something? Where did you hear that?
- thebruce87m 2mo agoHere is the first non-Reddit link from Google: https://www.royalkennelclub.com/health-and-dog-care/health-dog-care/health/health-and-care/a-z-of-health-and-care-issues/fireworks/ https://www.royalkennelclub.com/health-and-dog-care/health-d... > Getting your dog used to loud and sudden noises can make them more relaxed and less reactive when the fireworks outside get going. There’s a good range of CDs and playlists of fireworks, storms, and loud noises available, and playing these can really help your dog desensitise to the noise. > Start by playing the sounds at a low volume, and as your dog gets used to it you can slowly increase the volume over a period of time so that they become used to the noise. This can work especially well with young dogs and puppies, and can let you nip any problems in the bud before they even arise.
- jjtheblunt 2mo agointeresting!
- AngryData 2mo agoLoud action movies seem to help a friend of mine's dog who otherwise acted like fireworks were the devil incarnate.
- aaron695 2mo ago[dead]
- billfor 2mo agoMost dogs in my neighborhood are ok with them. My own dog loves them. I try to keep him inside only because I think it might be bad for his hearing if he gets too close. Beyond basic temperament I wonder if owner training is implicated, as more people become annoyed by fireworks they don’t expose the dog to them at a young age.
- IAmBroom 2mo agoHow on earth would you even presume to know this?
- billfor 2mo agoJust as you don't need to be a vet to know the difference between a dog and a cat. I own a dog and it's common sense that a dog is a reflection of the owner, and when you have a dog you know every other owner and dog in the neighborhood (and the ones that use fireworks have dogs that don't mind fireworks). If you don't enjoy fireworks then you tend not to introduce the dog to fireworks at a young age, and the dog will tend to be afraid of them. Look up "optimal age to train a dog".
- 9dev 2mo agoAll other animals too. There are tons studies about the effects of New Year’s Eve fireworks on birds, for example, that are devastating. Most people just don’t care about anything but themselves. It’s disgusting me to no end.
- tick_tock_tick 2mo agoI mean I think most people would agree it's completely irresponsible and borderline absuive to own a dog and stay in nearly any city in the USA during the 4th. People rightfully blame the owners it's not like this is a surprise for them.....
- redsocksfan45 2mo ago[dead]
- Amezarak 2mo agoWhat do they do during thunderstorms?
- dylan604 2mo ago> Next year I'll definitely be planning an out-of-town vacation for the 4th to some location with firework restrictions Fireworks are not legal to shoot in pretty much any city. They are not legal in my city. That did not stop them from being used. In fact, they are going off around me the night after too
- firesteelrain 2mo agoDepends on the state.
- wonnage 2mo agoThey're legal to buy like an hour out of the city unfortunately Also the 2A wingnuts think banning fireworks is akin to gun control https://www.tully-weiss.com/blog/fireworks-and-the-second-amendment/ https://www.tully-weiss.com/blog/fireworks-and-the-second-am...
- fumeux_fume 2mo agoIn rural places where wildfire risks are very high, firework bans are usually enforced and respected.
- geerlingguy 2mo agoAs another STL resident, fireworks are illegal everywhere in the County (not sure if St. Charles as well, but probably), and our local muni PD even sent out multiple warnings about prosecution. But our inner ring suburb was similarly full of smoke last night and the smell of many amateur fireworks shows. Only a few in my neighborhood, but they were quite the production. I remember firing a few bottle rockets as a kid, but these were definitely a few steps above that! Sounded like mini mortars, maybe those boxes with a bunch of shells timed to go after each other.
- chasil 2mo agoIt would be more practical if major cities had "fireworks zones" with ambulances on call and perhaps some safety advice.
- jandrewrogers 2mo ago40-50 years ago, fireworks were largely unregulated across the US and were a major part of the 4th of July cultural experience. Dangerous, slightly reckless, and incredibly fun. I have fond memories of this as a child. It is a big part of American culture, like turkey on Thanksgiving. Every country has rules that exist but which are culturally unenforceable. Today, fireworks are outlawed in much of the US because safety. Americans refuse to comply across such a broad cross-section of people that it is effectively unenforceable. The cultural contradiction is too strong, people won’t give up their traditions for mere safety reasons. Even the nominal enforcers don’t believe in it. No one is motivated to actually enforce it. This may be unsatisfying for many people but the impossibility of enforcing fireworks bans in the US captures an important component of the American zeitgeist. It is annoying for me sometimes but I recognize that this reflects an aspect of American culture that you can’t just erase.
- hdgvhicv 2mo ago> Today, fireworks are outlawed in much of the US because safety Hang on, fireworks are banned in the land of the free? But every kid should own an assault rifle?
- AstroNutt 2mo agoThere are some states where you can still buy them year round. Holiday or not. South Carolina comes to mind because I was there a few months ago. They have giant stores all over the state.
- hylaride 2mo agoAs a Canadian, the earliest memories I have of driving into the United States were seeing the giant "fireworks" billboards lining the interstate. I know it depends on the state, but it's one of those things you notice as an outsider.
- fragmede 2mo agoYes, proper fireworks are banned in much of America. Guns aren't a total free for all, either.
- techcode 2mo agoThat description sounds like every New Years Eve in The Netherlands. Few days ago a law that forbids non professionals to set off fireworks started applying... We'll see if that makes any difference.
- messe 2mo agoDenmark too. Aarhus looks like a war zone from the smoke on new years.
- ricardobayes 2mo agoWe'll see if we ever get something like that in Spain. I guess not, fireworks are just too deep in the culture here.
- thx67 2mo agoSTL is famous for having a large number of folks shooting guns into the air on New Years. So much so that there are warnings to not go outside. Stay safe.
- SilverElfin 2mo agoThere have also been incidents of people being hit by those bullets. It’s just so reckless and dangerous for people to do that. But there’s always someone doing it …
- incanus77 2mo ago> Next year I'll definitely be planning an out-of-town vacation for the 4th to some location with firework restrictions. Then like me you can just worry about whether some dipshit is going to burn your house down while you're away.
- msisk6 2mo agoIt'll be fine; the house is insured. ;) Luckily it's so wet here at the moment the fire risk is minimal.
- ricardobayes 2mo agoFallas festival in Valencia is not your thing then. But at least I realized why there is an audiologist on every corner.
- celrod 2mo agoA few years ago, on July 4th one of my mom's dogs freaked out, somehow managed to escape, and got hit by a car before my mom found her. She loved that dog, regularly attending nose work competitions with it. One of your pets getting a seizure must be harrowing for both you and the dog. I don't light fireworks.
- stasomatic 2mo agoMy female Weimaraner was terrified of thunderstorms and fireworks. Once, she managed to squeeze herself under my Mini Cooper. I didn't know at the time that panic vests were a thing. The breed is a gun dog ¯\_(ツ)_/¯. I forget how we managed to get her out from under there, but it took a bit. My Akita doesn't care, he checks the balcony, yawns, and back to his toys. But he is a afraid of air balloons and blow up Christmas Santas. Go figure.
- fumeux_fume 2mo agoMy opinion about how people use fireworks changed when I adopted a dog from a shelter and discovered how deeply traumatizing booms are to her. From chatting with other dog owners this seems to be common. If my neighbors could see the extent fireworks affect the same friendly, silly pup their children love greeting everyday, they would probably think twice about how they use them. We can manage the night of the 4th by traveling out of town, but the 1-2 weeks of random booms that follow the holiday are really tough for us.
- duskdozer 2mo agoYou certainly have a higher opinion of neighbors than I do. As far as any action that negatively intrudes on others, it seems the most likely responses are either that they are allowed to do what they want and you need to deal with it, or to do it even more now that they know it bothers you as punishment for you daring to ask.
- crassus_ed 2mo agoI used to love the tradition of lighting fireworks but I think the way people have been using them has changed in the last decade. Everything seems to transform into a war zone and some people do incredibly dangerous things.
- CableNinja 2mo agoIts become a dick waggling contest. It will be quiet all night and then one person sets something off. Some other person "well ill show them who has better booms" and gets a bigger one, sets it off. Next thing you know its 30 minutes of booms and pops culminating in the largest boom possible, its goddamn irritatibg
- FatherOfCurses 2mo agoYeah first 4th of July as a dog owner. He did relatively OK inside but we had a hell of a time taking him out for a walk. Every time we thought everyone was done blowing their loads someone else refueled and things started over again.
- moralestapia 2mo ago>one of them had a seizure People might say you just made this up for internet points. But this is real, this is an actual thing that happens to dogs (and other pets) when exposed to prolong fireworks noise!
- msisk6 2mo agoYeah, it really happened. But to be fair the little dog in question is prone to seizures and all the booming certainly set this one off. She was fine after things calmed down around midnight.
- deleted 2mo ago[deleted]
- AmVess 2mo agoI moved across states a few years ago. In the old neighborhood, people would be drunk and lighting that crap off for hours and hours. Completely moronic and thoughtless. Here, it is illegal. First offense is a fine, second offense is jail.
- fortran77 2mo agoHowdy, neighbor! (We are on Main Street)
- PaulHoule 2mo agoI spent a year in Germany and Oh God do Germans shoot off fireworks for the New Year. Most of the time Germans live up to the stereotype of neat, clean, quiet, polite but the next day there is a mess of firework wrappers all over the street.
- scrapcode 2mo ago> out-of-town vacation for the 4th to some location with firework restrictions. You have quite the faith in code enforcement.
- jtbayly 2mo agoGiven your statement of "hundreds of feet" I guess I can take the rest of your post with a large pinch of salt, too.
- msisk6 2mo agoI don't know fireworks that well, but these appeared to be the commercial type, with a large lift-charge that lights the sky up with a lightning style flash followed by a sky burst and the house-shaking boom of the sort I usually associate with shows put on the city or whatnot. I had two of these "shows" going on just north of me and one to the south. And I have a pretty good idea of heights around here. I mentioned I work at Boeing on flying things so I track the ones that fly over me. They're usually about 1000 to 1500 ft. AGL on approach when they go over my house and about 200 knots. Southwest has the most flights into and out of St. Louis so it's usually a 737, and those have a wingspan of just over 100 feet on the newer models. So yeah, I'd say these fireworks were going up at least 300 feet.
- jtbayly 2mo agoMy apologies. Apparently my own estimate about how high fireworks generally go was way off.
- ButlerianJihad 2mo agoOn Reddit last year, I found a link to a City of Phoenix dashboard that monitors all the county-wide emergency dispatch calls that are not suppressed for privacy/security reasons. I watch it throughout the day and night, especially on holidays like this one. I counted upwards of 23 fires on the map at any single point in time, between sunset and 11pm. Most of those calls indicated either debris fires, or Dumpster fires, but there were also roof fires and vehicle fires, including one police-involved car accident. I stayed inside all weekend after attending church on Saturday evening. The Air Force flyover was not visible in my area. I immensely enjoyed the celebrations on live streaming. And singing my heart out, creating new playlists.
- agensaequivocum 2mo ago> Next year I'll definitely be planning an out-of-town vacation for the 4th to some location with firework restrictions. Opposite for me, I plan on vacationing to somewhere I can have more fun with my kids.
- emeril 2mo ago-having lived in MO, yeah, pretty scary -don't miss the hill restaurants -maybe still stick around if you own a house such as to help prevent it being set ablaze that night inadvertently...