12 ms·

System76 AMD-Only Laptop Returns

231 points by bananicorn 4y ago

driverdan 4y ago
Still only 1920x1080. Come on, give us decent resolution screens already!
- yoyohello13 4y ago
  Honestly, the difference between 1080p and 1440p on a 14in screen is barely perceptible to me. I'd rather have the extra battery life.
  - doix 4y ago
    I run my 1440p screen at 1080p because my portable monitor is 1080p and I don't want to try and setup different scaling on different screens in X or move to Wayland. I'm happy enough.
    - gibspaulding 4y ago
      Not sure why you're getting down voted. This seems like a valid point. I'd also note that if you are connected to a larger 1440p external display, 1080p on the smaller one keeps the dpi closer so you don't have to use different scaling settings.
    - 0x457 4y ago
      I've tried it. Don't do it.
    - aliqot 4y ago
      I run 4 different screens with different resolutions in X with no problem, no setup. Is there a specific error you run into?
      - doix 4y ago
        It's not the resolutions, different resolutions is fine. It's the scaling. 1440p at 14" requires scaling because everything is too small (for me, anyway). But the portable monitor doesn't need scaling. I couldn't get it to work nicely without running two different X servers (one for each display). I am pretty sure it's a limitation in X, the dpi setting is global, not per output. Wayland seems to have solved this, but it has other problems for me (forced vsync being the major one). So I just live in a lower resolution. I don't really care, like some of the other posters in the thread, the lower resolution annoys me less than a 60hz refresh rate (laptop monitor is 144hz). Luckily X can handle different refresh rates for different outputs.
  - 3np 4y ago
    Try Chinese in smaller font sizes...
    - xbar 4y ago
      Thank you for a lesson in empathy. I would be satisfied with a taller 1920x1200 display but maybe you still wouldn't be.
  - barbariangrunge 4y ago
    I find it highly noticeable in a 13 inch screen
  - haspok 4y ago
    But this is not a 14" screen... > Display 15.6″ 1920×1080 FHD, Matte Finish, 144 Hz
- 0xCMP 4y ago
  Agreed. 1080 is probably a good proportion, but I'd prefer 4k resolution at 200% than native 1080.
  - smoldesu 4y ago
    Interestingly, it looks like System76 has 4k options for their Intel machines. Hopefully that's a sign of things to come on their Ryzen line?
  - mmis1000 4y ago
    I am a CJK user, and I can definitely say 4K at 200% is much more better than standard 1080p. Standard 1080p only looks good for English alphabets. Complex Chinese characters like `國` looks blurry(or even s**tty) on that resolution. Reading chinese charaters on a hidpi monitor is really a much better experience.
- coder543 4y ago
  It is a 144Hz display, which makes it significantly more interesting than an average 1080p display. 60Hz just feels so stuttery these days. But, I agree that a higher resolution would be nice, and if I'm being completely honest... I would want OLED. Tons of affordable OLED laptops have come to market over the past year.
  - jesuscript 4y ago
    Why does 144hz matter to you if you aren't playing games? This is not a gaming machine. You absolutely will not notice the difference for non-gaming tasks between 60hz to 80hz/100hz/120hz/144hz/244hz.
    - coder543 4y ago
      > You absolutely will not notice the difference If you make absolutes like that, then everything I could respond with is automatically “wrong”, so that’s not a great conversation opener. My smartphone is not a gaming monitor either, but 120Hz is hugely noticeable. My windows desktop is using a 144Hz monitor. I had a 120Hz MacBook Pro for awhile. I’m familiar with how I experience high refresh rate on different types of devices. You may not care, and that’s fine, but what’s the point of asking why I care and then telling me in no certain terms that I won’t? And how do you know if I would be gaming on this or not? Valve has put immense effort into making Linux viable for gaming. If you’re instead trying to say the monitor’s response times suck, how do you know that already?
    - nullandvoid 4y ago
      I absolutely do notice when my laptop screen defaults back to 60hz, instead of 144hz after some interactions.
    - kitsunesoba 4y ago
      Yeah, I jump between 60hz, 120hz, and 240hz screens several times a day and while the difference in smoothness is very visible, if I'm not gaming I forget about it very quickly. Personally for work machines I find high density (preferably integer scaling friendly) preferable over extra frames.
- vehemenz 4y ago
  Or at least 1920x1200. It's amazing how much 16:10 helps on a small screen.
jesuscript 4y ago
What makes their stuff so great? I was customizing a gaming rig on their site the other day and it was wildly overpriced. I imagine you can match their specs for this laptop at cheaper prices.
- acomjean 4y ago
  You can. Its for people like me who want a linux laptop, but don't want to go through the hassle of installing it. While I could, I just didn't want to spend the time on it, plus setting up some drivers here and there. Thats the value prop. I got one for home use, (Oryx pro with Nvidia) 4 years ago. It worked well enough and had so few issues I got one for work.
  - jesuscript 4y ago
    I totally sympathize with the driver compatibility concern, but what is the hassle of sticking in a linux usb drive to install? In general, how serious are these driver compatibility concerns for modern laptop hardware?
    - kube-system 4y ago
      The driver issues still exist if you don't do research ahead of time. There are laptops on the shelf today that still don't fully work out of the box with Ubuntu.
    - acomjean 4y ago
      I don't know. I think most machines are pretty well supported. 4 years ago when I first bought one reading through the forums it seemed kinda hit or miss with wifi and sound. especially since my initial machine had nvidia graphics it seemed like a throw money at the problem and avoid headaches. If it was a desktop, I probably would have installed myself. The machines I have from system76 are rebadged "Clevos" (I got dog hair in the fan and replaced the fan, which necessitated investigating. My AMD one with original fans is NL50NU) https://www.clevo.com.tw/ https://www.clevo.com.tw/ The POPOS full disc encryption out of the box was another selling point. I'm not sure thats easy to set up on on a new install. The support is good, when I had issues going up a major version (I think steam installed something newer than what it was expecting) and I couldn't figure how to get the OS to upgrade despite tons of command line foo, I put a ticket and they pointed me in the right direction.
indigodaddy 4y ago
Hah I misinterpreted this headline as “people returning” these laptops
piinbinary 4y ago
This feels like somewhat unfortunate timing, with AMD's 7000 series mobile CPUs just around the corner.
- nicolaslem 4y ago
  "U" class chips won't be in laptops on the shelves until this summer, if previous mobile CPU releases are good indicators. Oh and then be ready for months of firmware and kernel patches until the chip is actually usable as a daily driver on Linux. Getting a 6000 series CPU now that the kinks have been ironed out is not a bad idea.
- schaefer 4y ago
  You really have to do your homework with the new AMD processor rebranding. It's super easy to think your getting the latest and greatest, only to end up with Vega 2 graphics like the 5000 series from years ago. I had to whiteboard it to keep it all straight myself. When I look at AMD's new mobile lineup for 2023, and I didn't notice anything "new" in the U-series power profile (15 watts tdp). I'd be more than happy with a 6800U in linux friendly packaging. Let me know if you think there's a specific 7000 series chip I've overlooked. P.S: about the system 76 teaser itself, the static picture used as a "before and after" comparison for 60hz display vs 144 hz display is comedic gold.
  - nicolaslem 4y ago
    > Let me know if you think there's a specific 7000 series chip I've overlooked. The 7040 series, which is Zen 4 & RDNA 3 (so not a Rembrandt refresh) should be available for "thin and light" laptops.
    - schaefer 4y ago
      You are absolutely right about that[1]. but strangely, on the 7640U the CPU core count drops from 8 to 6 in comparison with the 6800U. Presumably to make room for the new AI cores? I'm not sure that trade off is right for me. [1]: https://wccftech.com/amd-debuts-ryzen-7045-dragon-range-enthusiast-ryzen-7040-phoenix-laptop-cpus-with-zen-4-rdna-3/ https://wccftech.com/amd-debuts-ryzen-7045-dragon-range-enth...
deleted 4y ago
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azangru 4y ago
Ooh, it's actually starting to look rather nice, unless these are deceptively flattering angles. Which Clevo is this?
- sliken 4y ago
  Maybe it's the long rumored locally produced System76 laptop.
- trelane 4y ago
  If you believe getting a laptop crom System76 and from Clevo will get you the same laptop, you're quite mistaken.
  - LoganDark 4y ago
    No? Sysmtem76 rebrands Clevo machines and offers them with software support & warranty. That's like, their whole thing.
    - trelane 4y ago
      No, actually, they don't. They work with Clevo to make them, and Clevo can sell the hardware, but the firmware is very different, and possibly some of the hardware as well. see e.g. cassidyjames at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17039414 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17039414 There were a couple of great threads on Twitter, but it looks like Jeremy Soller isn't on anymore. (https://twitter.com/c4software/status/1322954098711400449 https://twitter.com/c4software/status/1322954098711400449 is one guy realizing too late that they're not the same, that likely precipitated https://mobile.twitter.com/jeremy_soller/status/1322954964549824512 https://mobile.twitter.com/jeremy_soller/status/132295496454... still in Google cache saying "A reminder that you shouldn't buy Clevo's and expect them to work like System76's"
CoastalCoder 4y ago
Would it make sense to change the title? I read it to be about people who bought AMD-only laptops from System76, needing to return them to System76 for some reason.
- lwhi 4y ago
  Same here .. I think we need a comma. E.g. "System76 AMD-Only Laptop, Returns"
  - coder543 4y ago
    No, that would actually be less correct and less clear. "System76 brings back AMD-only laptop" would be an extremely clear way to phrase the title. I'm not even sure the "only" is even that helpful; it could probably just be "AMD laptop".
    - lwhi 4y ago
      Perhaps, but it would continue to allow the poster their own choice of words .. which I think is important.
      - coder543 4y ago
        No... it's less clear too. The verb is never isolated from the rest of the sentence by a comma, but a list of nouns will be isolated by commas, even if the conjunction is missing for brevity in a title. Separating "returns" like that makes it appear even more to be a noun, which is the thing that the original comment was confused by. Correct interpretation of the title relies on the reader realizing that it is a verb in this context, and the comma does not help with that. Given the ongoing mess with the AMD 7900 XTX GPU vapor chambers, I initially interpreted the title to mean there was some problem with AMD laptops, so System76 was offering returns only for those laptops with AMD chips. That is not the case.
        Y_Y 4y ago
IronWolve 4y ago
Needs a 2k screen, wont go back to 1080p...
- toast0 4y ago
  If 4k is 3840 × 2160, 1920 × 1080 is 2k, FYI
  - nicolaslem 4y ago
    Nope, 1440p is known as 2k because it is twice the amount of pixels as 1080p.
    - dsr_ 4y ago
      https://www.tomshardware.com/news/2k-definition,37641.html https://www.tomshardware.com/news/2k-definition,37641.html Says that the DCI definition of 2K is 2048x1080, and that 2560x1440 should be called QHD or WQHD. (Quad = 4x, HD = 1280x720). And this aligns with the usage I am accustomed to.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - coder543 4y ago
    This is 100% correct. Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2K_resolution https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2K_resolution > Another resolution that is often referred to as 2K is 2560 × 1440 (1440p) however that is a common mistake in marketing[12] and is called QHD by the DCI. It is a mistake to refer to 2560x1440 as 2K. People calling 1080p "2K" is a pet peeve of mine. 2.5K is a more appropriate name for 2560x1440, if you want to use that naming convention, but I think just saying 1440p is simpler.
    - fomine3 4y ago
      I'm upset for such people too. Chinese smartphone manufacturers tend to say it.
    - 4y ago
renewiltord 4y ago
Been a Linux user for 20+ years. Pretty sick that we have companies like this selling Linux laptops with Coreboot. Man, that was a wild dream back in the day. I'm using a Macbook personally, but this stuff is so sick. To be honest, I never really imagined the future as using Windows + Linux + MacOS without thinking that much about the platform, but about the only thing that sticks out to me is that the command line on Windows is rubbish. Otherwise, it feels very naturally normal to me as I switch between platforms. The web has really changed things. Only thing that surprises me are the screens. I thought the high res screens like in the Macbook were commonplace now.
- mixmastamyk 4y ago
  You need a better adjective and to try Windows Terminal with a modern shell shipped this millennium. ;-) I like yori when in a DOS mood.
  - inetknght 4y ago
    > You need ... to try Windows Hard no from many people including myself. It will be a cold day in hell before I give Microsoft any more of my money or personal information after the abuses they've done to me, my information, and my purchases.
    - mixmastamyk 4y ago
      Preachin' to the choir buddy. Suggestion was for the grandparent post who wanted a better shell for windows.
whalesalad 4y ago
The chassis looks great and is made of magnesium - if it weren't for the tenkey I would be seriously considering this. A smaller thinkpad-esque machine would probably be really popular.
lushdogg 4y ago
I own a LemurPro 9. Love it but the arrow keys are a crime against humanity. It appears they have fixed this (maybe even sooner) with the Pangolin. System76 if you here can you switch chassis :) ?
Symmetry 4y ago
Now that the two big Thinkpad pointer stick patents have expired I wonder why more laptop makers aren't incorporating them?
- uni_rule 4y ago
  Despite the niche love for them on a personal level corporate fleet buyers would still buy DTSN screens if they were $5 cheaper per unit than the regular ones because they are that damn fickle. That is to say their priorities are different.
  - criddell 4y ago
    Corporate fleet buyers purchased a lot of Thinkpads over the years.
- acomjean 4y ago
  Or put that point thing on a mouse. So much better than a scroll wheel. I still miss that mouse.
- linhns 4y ago
  Non-programmers are not really fond of it, unlike you and me. I actually consider it a ThinkPad underutilized selling point but it takes time to master navigation with the pointer stick and sometimes it gets in the way when you need to type fast.
- accrual 4y ago
  If this had a Trackpoint I would consider it instead of a new Lenovo Thinkpad. I love the Trackpoint.
woile 4y ago
Is this a thin and lightweight laptop? I've been looking for a thin powerful AMD laptop with good Linux support
- Beltalowda 4y ago
  Dimensions 14.59″ × 9.76″ × 0.71″ (37.06 × 24.79 × 1.80 cm) Weight 3.95 lbs (1.79kg)
- umvi 4y ago
  I have a System76 galp5. It's fairly thin and lightweight. I have mixed feelings about it. Linux support is good. But Windows support is pretty bad. All available drivers are here: https://github.com/system76/windows-drivers https://github.com/system76/windows-drivers but even after installing everything in that repo listed under galp5, I still have a ton of issues including laptop not going to sleep when lid is closed, touchpad occasionally not working until I toggle it on/off from settings, etc. Getting Windows working from Pop OS using Virtual Box was also a massive, fragile headache. I would get it working, but then sometimes when using Visual Studio from inside virtual box it would freeze and the VM would be permanently bricked unless I had previously saved a snapshot. All this to say that if you care about Linux and only Linux, System76 could be a good choice. But if you need to use Windows at all, I would steer clear of S76 until their Windows support is a little better (also YMMV - I've just had so many issues with Windows on a galp5, but that might not be the case with other models).
  - trelane 4y ago
    I'd recommend using Windows under a VM, for this and myriad other reasons. But it really underscores the point that Linux and Windows hardware really are different.
    - Mikeb85 4y ago
      > But it really underscores the point that Linux and Windows hardware really are different. You mean it underscores the fact that Windows actually has terrible hardware support and the only reason it runs on anything is because OEMs put in work... Linux runs on most Windows hardware OOTB.
acomjean 4y ago
I have one (the previous one with AMD Ryzen 5700u). I've been using it for work the last 6 months coming from an 2015 macbook. Its been great for developing. The battery lasts pretty well (forgetting my power supply when working from home I got almost 7 hours), its fast (I've done some genetics blast runs which take hours, where those extra cores really help). Its pretty quiet too (you can hear the fan when it spins up, but its very reasonable). Returning to a Mat screen has been nice. I really like AMD on the notebook. Compared to my 4 year old Oryx pro (intel 8th gen), which had poor battery life (esp when using the Nvidia graphics) and required a reboot initially if I wanted to switch to intel graphics. This one is much nicer, but it won't game nearly as well as one with dedicated graphics.
karmakaze 4y ago
The first thing I see is a 16x9 screen, think "pass", and close the page. There have to be other LCD panel makers out there. Either their customers don't care and/or the company doesn't care to make a better laptop.
- greyw 4y ago
  Interesting. For me the screen needs to be 16:9 or 16:10 to be even considered.
  - lost_tourist 4y ago
    that's the same for me. I tend to have "two" windows open at most times and that works well for me on my 15" laptop (ancient by most HN standards). I've looked at the ultrawide and 4:3 screens and I'm good with the current "standard" form factor when I can't get to my 3 monitor setup at home.
- inetknght 4y ago
  > The first thing I see is a 16x9 screen, think "pass", and close the page. I like 16x9. What do you want instead?
  - haunter 4y ago
    Not OP but I guess 4:3 or 3:2. Some people prefer those to widescreens, having more vertical space is better MS Surface Books are 3:2 for example (2256 x 1504 on 13,5" / 2496 x 1664 on 15"), or some Thinkpad X1 models are 4:3 (probably just the Fold?). The Framework laptop is also 3:2 (2256 x 1504 on 13,5")
    - RodGodKiller 4y ago
      He probably meant 16:10.
      - karmakaze 4y ago
buster3000 4y ago
'15.6″ 1920×1080' Come on...
- bboygravity 4y ago
  Meanwhile people like me think you're complaining about the tiny screen.
quasarj 4y ago
God damn that is one ugly motherfucker. Why in the world is anyone still squeezing useless numpads onto laptops???
- inetknght 4y ago
  > Why in the world is anyone still squeezing useless numpads onto laptops??? Excuse me?! I will never buy a laptop without a numpad! I use numpads every day! The better question is why is anyone still squeezing a useless touchpad onto laptops???
  - lost_tourist 4y ago
    We can have both. I think we have the tech still. Not sure why OP is angry lol
  - quasarj 4y ago
    Well first, I don't believe you. But let's assume you really do need a numpad for your work or whatever. Wouldn't you rather have one that was... full sized? And wouldn't you rather the keyboard be centered on the laptop, so you can actually use it on a lap?
    - inetknght 4y ago
      > Well first, I don't believe you. No point in arguing what you believe. > Wouldn't you rather have one that was... full sized? Yes, I would. But having a numpad is absolutely better than not having a numpad. > wouldn't you rather the keyboard be centered on the laptop, so you can actually use it on a lap? I can use my laptop on my lap when the keyboard is not centered. Do you have a disability (there's nothing wrong with having one) which prevents you from doing so? No, I wouldn't rather suffer the loss of a numpad just to have the keyboard centered. Having the keyboard centered does not improve my usability in any way whatsoever. Removing the touchpad would, however. Disabling the touchpad is the first thing I do; I use keyboard navigation around things instead. It's faster and far less clumsy.
- RosanaAnaDana 4y ago
ruined 4y ago
still only 1080p
x3n0ph3n3 4y ago
I waited so long to get a new laptop, and System76 was my top choice, except for their awful screens. Finally bit the bullet on got a Macbook Pro 14" instead...
RosanaAnaDana 4y ago
I'm on the Serval 76 with a 2070. I don't really care if they are going team red again. I'll be trying a different manufacturer next time.
- lost_tourist 4y ago
  this is in addition to intel, so what's your point? You don't like system76 hardware at all and will be switching?
  - RosanaAnaDana 4y ago
    From a hardware side things are spec'd fine. The issue is on the firmware/ company side. I no longer have confidence in the company to support their products. A couple of qol firmware updates could have fixed that.
    - rqtwteye 4y ago
      Same for me. The Galago Pro (galp5) is quite ok but the firmware has bugs and they are not fixing them. Over the last 2 years I have had the fan running constantly when a USB-C device was connected, the fan going into full turbo mode over night, the screen started to flicker after wakeup on battery and some other issues. And battery life is beyond terrible. After two years of struggle I have thrown the towel and got a used Macbook for the same price. I am starting to question their engineering priorities. Instead of developing new desktop environments I think they should make sure their devices are rock solid and work perfectly with Linux. That's their USP and they are not delivering on that promise.
Finnucane 4y ago
I am surprised to see that their chosen configuration does not please everyone's contradictory expectations and desires.
- RosanaAnaDana 4y ago
  All I want is a commitment from the company to provide a couple of qol firmware updates. System 76 has burned me in the past in this regard.
snvzz 4y ago
Ryzen 6800U: https://www.amd.com/en/product/11591 https://www.amd.com/en/product/11591 It's a Zen3+ with embedded RDNA2 graphics. Not the state of the art as of CES announcements, but I'd happily get a laptop with one of these if I needed a laptop right now. It's good System76 is offering such an option, because it makes them a candidate. I would not currently consider a laptop that's based on Intel or NVIDIA hardware, due to vastly inferior performance/watt and lack of open documentation, respectively.
Mikeb85 4y ago
Not gonna lie, very underwhelming compared to what's coming out from other manufacturers... Even a budget brand like Acer is releasing Ryzen 7000 chipsets and pairing it with higher resolution OLED screens, probably will be cheaper as well... https://www.acer.com/ca-en/laptops/swift/swift-go-14-amd https://www.acer.com/ca-en/laptops/swift/swift-go-14-amd
- ploxiln 4y ago
  The Ryzen 7000 mobile lineup includes chips based on Zen4, Zen 3+, Zen 3, and even Zen 2 cpu cores, and using RDNA3, RDNA2, and even Vega graphics! An Acer with a Ryzen 7000 series chip could easily have the same or older cpu core or graphics arch, as the Zen 3+ and RDNA2 in Ryzen 6800U. https://www.anandtech.com/show/18718/amd-2023-ryzen-mobile-7000-cpus-unveiled-zen-4-phoenix-takes-point https://www.anandtech.com/show/18718/amd-2023-ryzen-mobile-7... (and honestly, Zen 3 and RDNA 2 are damn good anyway)
  - Mikeb85 4y ago
    The teaser says 8 cores/16 threads so likely will be at least equivalent. With a much better screen. And cheaper.
- teaearlgraycold 4y ago
  System76 is a brand for ideologues. They ship laptops with FOSS UEFI. That’s their gimmick.
  - Mikeb85 4y ago
    I mean, I like Linux and am a bit of an ideologue... I want System76 to succeed and want to buy a laptop from them but I also like using nice hardware.
    - linhns 4y ago
      I think you get what you pay for. Nicer hardware = more expensive. Maybe if this is successful the System76 will consider fast-tracking Ryzen 7000.
droptablemain 4y ago
I've bought a couple of laptops from System76. They charge outrageous prices and and shipping costs for even the smallest part; other than that, getting parts for their rebadged Clevo machines can be a bit challenging because you often have to order from China, so it takes a while.
gjmacd 4y ago
Meh. I won't switch to a Linux laptop until I can get a reasonable resolution on the screen that matches my MBP's output for a reasonable price. I can't understand why I can't get a reasonably good priced laptop with just Linux that doesn't match the video resolution of a MBP.
- vladvasiliu 4y ago
  This is what kills me. At work, they only swear by HP for some reason. So, I've got a shitty Elitebook that cost, after RAM and SSD upgrades, within 100 euros of a same-size MBP with same RAM and SSD. But the build quality is uniformly worse. And the screen... it's an atrocity. You don't have to compare it to an MBP (I only have an old 2013 one, and it still wipes the floor with it). Even compared to an older XPS (7th gen intel), it's horrible.
dfghjkjhg 4y ago
too little too late. since 13months ago, HP sells a elite book G9 for 2k, which have the best combo configuration at, gasp, wallmart for 800... eigth hundred dollars. same cpu, but PRO version. metal and plastic body. scissor waterproof keyboard. usb c charging (system76 is barrel), 2x sodimm ram slots (system76 is soldered, note thay amd zen3+ pro mighty allow ECC ram in a laptop for the first time! so i want slots), the battery have 18Wh less, but it is also 20pct ligther. and all hardware is fully supported with 5.8+ kernel. I always try to buy from linux-first-vendors, but I still deal with a librem13 that have sevral keys fail on their keyboard and support is ghosting me. even had to super-glue the hinge latelly. so awful :(
- vladvasiliu 4y ago
  800 seems cheap for an elitebook. Is that the 8x0 model? I have the older g8. It worked perfectly out of the box on linux since new. Recently, windows started being able to use the webcam, too. But beware the screen. It's absurdly bad. I'd say it's okish for $800. For 2000, it's a bad joke. Some models only have 6-bit screens (at least those have an excuse for being horrible). The fan is sometimes noisy, too. It seems like it's somewhat off-balance, ever since it was new.
jklinger410 4y ago
They should have gone with AMD from the start and the screen is a non-starter. When researching laptops, screen is probably the biggest differentiator at this point. I won't be replacing my Galago Pro with another System76 product when that day finally comes.
lhl 4y ago
This might be the first Ryzen 6800U Linux laptop, which is cool, but it's a bit hard for me to get too excited about it... * One of the biggest selling points of Ryzen 6000 is the chip's USB4 support, but looks like the Pangolin won't have it. It also only has 1 USB-C port, which is a bit of a headscratcher in 2023. Does it support PD even? (Not mentioned) * 16:9 FHD display (no brightness specified) - high refresh is nice, but again, weird that it's not 16:10 in 2023 and IMO, QHD would be better for a 15-16" display. * soldered memory (32GB at least) * Numpad keyboard. This will be a positive for some, but I'm in the centered keyboard camp * Only a 70Wh battery and still not so light (1.8kg) While it's running an older chip, if you're not going to have USB4/TB4, and the points I listed are important, I think the Tuxedo Pulse 15 Gen2 is still a better 15" option atm (5700U chip, but lighter, bigger battery, better (still 16:9) display, Ethernet, SODIMM slots). There are some Ubuntu certified ThinkPads that are an option too (they have Ryzen 6000U chips but also no USB4), although almost all the models are w/ soldered RAM on ThinkPads now, which is a bummer. If you want USB4 on AMD, the best (Linux friendly) options right now are probably the Asus G14 GA402 or a ThinkPad Z16. The HP EliteBook G9s are an option as well, although you need Linux 6.0+ to fix a broken HP BIOS update (HP support is also aggressively indifferent to Linux users) and I've seen lots of complaints about the fan curve and the SureView displays so I'm hesitant to recommend it...
- andreareina 4y ago
  I have a 14” QHD laptop (framework) and it’s really awkward without fractional scaling. I don’t know that 20-25% more screen space would really fix that.
  - joombaga 4y ago
    Agreed. Love the size and aspect ratio, I just wish it was a bit higher resolution so I could use 200% scaling.
  - yellowapple 4y ago
    I just don't scale anything on mine. Obviously not ideal for everyone, but I tend to want to cram as much into the screen as possible.
benlivengood 4y ago
I bought a Lemur because of coreboot but I can't tell if this laptop will have coreboot or a closed BIOS/EFI. Admittedly I haven't played around with customizing the coreboot firmware but that was my intention, mostly to avoid long boot times and potentially to try fitting the whole kernel in firmware.
vetrom 4y ago
Are new S76 laptops still Clevo or some other ODM?
tssva 4y ago
Last time there was a System76 laptop announcement on HN I said I was going to be in the market for a new laptop in the coming year but wouldn't consider a System76 laptop because of the giant logo on the lid. Some people said the logos on their System76 laptops were stickers which could be removed. I contacted System76 and was told that was no longer the case. If anyone from System76 is here, I am currently looking for a new laptop and will not be buying a System76 laptop based entirely upon the giant logo on them. I don't want to put a skin, a cover or stickers over my laptop. My preference would be no logo at all but that seems to be impossible. If you are compelled to use me for free advertising post purchase, at least make it somewhat discreet.
- deleted 4y ago
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- msla 4y ago
  On my Darter Pro 8 (recentish, not top-of-the-line) laptop, the branding on the lid isn't one sticker, it's a sticker per character, which I could likely remove and leave smooth black metal. This Reddit thread seems to agree with me that the stickers can be removed, albeit about a different model: https://old.reddit.com/r/System76/comments/ge0mqz/lemur_pro_lid_logo/ https://old.reddit.com/r/System76/comments/ge0mqz/lemur_pro_... Looks like it has the same kind of lettering as mine, though.
  - tssva 4y ago
    When I contacted System76 sales last year after others posted their logo was stickers they told me their logo was no longer stickers. Maybe that is only on the upper range but the upper range is what I am interested in.
- emaro 4y ago
  I think the Purism laptops have no branding, if that is a priority for you.
_odey 4y ago
OK, let's look and analyse what they have in detail: Operating System: Pop!_OS 22.04 LTS or Ubuntu 22.04 LTS Do they offer any custom software that are only available on these distributions and would be a struggle to find on other? Sone other Clevo resellers have for example custom software to control the fan intensity that's Ubuntu only (and Ubuntu 20.04 only). It's not clear why they restrict it to only these distributions. Also, why did they even bother to develop their own distribution? Every Linux in existence is a combination of 1 DE (Gnome, KDE, XFCE or other), 1 package manager (apt, pacmanm etc...) and some kernel params. Is it really worth spending their time on a custom Linux instead of on hardware/firmware? Speaking of firmware, does it have Coreboot or stock Clevo BIOS? Does it have a fingerprint reader and does it work, can you control the fan speed from anywhere? Nowhere to find answers to these questions... Processor: AMD Ryzen™ 7 6800U: 2.7 up to 4.7 GHz - 8 Cores - 16 Threads Graphics: AMD Radeon™ 680M This is great! my opinion is this is the best laptop processor reasonably available on the market right now. But if you're not desperate to switch your laptop and can wait until the middle or end of this year, buying the next generation Zen4 processor is astronomically better. Display 15.6″ 1920×1080 FHD, Matte Finish, 144 Hz Not bad, not good either, 1440p would have been ideal. They do not specify the sRGB % coverage. Is it 90, 95, 99? The difference between 90 and 95 is definitely noticeable and you would do yourself a big disservice if you don't go for 95% at least. Memory: 32 GB LPDDR5 @ 6400 MHz Yes, amazing, the future is now! But is it 4x8 or 2x16? And is it ECC? What brand? Storage: 2 x M.2 SSD(PCIe NVMe). Up to 16TB total. No problems here, I assume PCIe 4.0, but would be great if they specified. Don't want to accidentally discover it was PCIe 3.0 after the purchase has been made. Also, what brand of SSD do they provide? Brands are important so you can look at benchmarks. Expansion: 3 × USB 3.2 Gen 1 Type-A, 1 × USB 3.2 Gen 2 Type-C, SD Card Reader 3 USBA, 1 USBC? Why not 2 and 2? In the future we will need less USBA and more USBC. Look at macbooks, they have all USBC and everybody eventually copies macbooks anyway (regardless if it's a good or bad decision). The more USBC you have now the better for the future. Input: Multitouch Clickpad, Single-Color Backlit US QWERTY Keyboard Is 100% of the surface area clickable on the clickpad, or is it one of those awkward ones where you have "mouse buttons" at the top/bottom, and you can not press onto the top, only tap? Need more information! Keyboard wise it's great! a 15 inch laptop without a numpad is a waste of potential, as a numpad is immensely helpful when doing any sort of finance work. I definitely would not buy a laptop this big without one. Still some more information non the keyboard layouts available would be nice. Networking: Gigabit Ethernet, WiFi 6E, Bluetooth 5.2 All perfect here! Video Ports: HDMI 2.0, USB 3.2 Gen 2 Type-C w/ DisplayPort I'm assuming this is the same single USBC that they mentioned above. Is it DisplayPort 1.4, or 2.0? Audio: Stereo dual-driver full-range speakers, 1× Headphone/Microphone Combo This is their biggest flaw. If you look at the chassis, you will see, the speakers point DOWNWARD. Speakers are supposed to point towards the listener, not away from them. Also, from previously owning multiple Clevo laptops that I've bought for work purposes, sound quality is so bad, you can simply assume you have no speakers as you'll be using headphones or a conference speaker. If you buy this thinking you'll be able to enjoy any kind of video/movie out of working hours without purchasing and carrying extra peripherals you will be extremely frustrated and disappointed. Low maximum volume, poor quality sound, no base, and pointing away from you; every flaw imaginable. More that 4 people in a conference room and wanting to dial in from one laptop to share? Forget about it, you will be embarrassed to even try as the combination of laptop's built-in speakers and microphone quality will make the whole experience terrible. This is an area where macbooks excel, great speakers and great microphone, and that's why people love them so much, you can actually enjoy the audio interaction. There is no reason for non macbook laptops to be this bad at audio. All they have to do is copy macbooks, like they eventually do anyway... just put in better speakers and microphone, it's that easy. Cost wise it's not an issue either since a machine like this is going to cost in the same ballpark as a macbook anyway, why be cheap on something so insignificant for the overall price but so important for the user experience? Camera: 1.0MP 720p HD Webcam Security: Kensington® Lock, Hardware Camera Kill Switch A camera cover is better than a camera kill switch in my opinion, good to have at least I guess. Battery: Li-Ion - 70 Wh Charger: 65 W, AC-in 100–240 V, 50–60 Hz Why not 99Wh? (the maximum allowed at airports) This is not a macbook, it's a beefy, thick laptop no matter how you look at it, why not outfit it properly? Overall: at least it's guaranteed to run Linux... but from the points I raised above I guess you can see there is no point for me to get excited about this model in particular. Price wise it's going to be over the "expensive" threshold anyway, so might as well find something that ticks most checkboxes. Unless, of course I'm desperate for a new machine, in which case I could settle for this for a while. I'm more hopeful for this vendor instead for higher quality devices: https://starlabs.systems/pages/starfighter https://starlabs.systems/pages/starfighter
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mulmen 4y ago
My 2014 RMBP is finally ready to go to the great messenger bag in the sky. Apple no longer provides updates and the battery is swelling. I'm not excited about the new MacBook offerings. The hardware is neat but the OS really turns me off. Apple is on a crusade to make MacOS unusable and the lack of stability in the environment is too much for me. I'm ready to make the leap into a Linux desktop environment just for the sake of stability but I want well supported hardware. Is System 76 a good option? The advice that makes sense to me is to "use what the devs use". Does an AMD-only System 76 check that box?
- hojjat12000 4y ago
  As far as support goes. System76 would be your best bet. You can also checkout HP Dev One (which comes with System76's Pop!_OS).
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- neither_color 4y ago
  Do you game? Asus Zephyrus G14 is also AMD-only(mobile 6700 or 6800 graphics), premium build quality, and is available with a QHD display.
  - mulmen 4y ago
    But is it well supported by a mainstream Linux distribution?
vouaobrasil 4y ago
I would love for something like this to exist in Canada. Unfortunately import fees make these much less attractive here.
FpUser 4y ago
Nice lappy. I would also like to see max amount of RAM supported. I normally buy laptops with the least amount of RAM and then add max amount that I could buy way cheaper elsewhere. Same with SSDs.
manifoldgeo 4y ago
I recently bought a System76 Oryx Pro 9, and I could not for the life of me get Debian to boot from a USB. The same USB booted on my old Galago Pro, so I know it was good. The Oryx Pro runs on some FOSS UEFI or BIOS made by System76 themselves, and it doesn't play nice with anything but Ubuntu and Pop!_OS. I filed a support ticket asking for help, and they told me they only support Ubuntu and Pop. On one hand, I understand having service desk limits, but their garbage UEFI and lack of support left me no choice but to return the laptop. In fact, I thought this article was going to be about people returning laptops to System76! I really hope they get their game together and make a pre-boot system that can handle non-Ububtu stuff easily. The previous System76 I had was able to handle a Debian install just fine.
- whydid 4y ago
  It's a bit judgmental to call their UEFI "garbage" just because it didn't work correctly for you. I agree it's frustrating they don't support booting other operating systems, but please be fair or provide some more evidence before you call some software "garbage"
snarg 4y ago
I have trouble understanding why every Linux-friendly laptop vendor insists on this godawful arrow key layout. It was a bad idea when Apple did it, and it was a bad idea when you copied them. Apple has even backtracked on this terrible design, but the copycats never got the memo. I'm never, ever buying a laptop with full-height horizontal keys but half-height vertical keys.
_caveman 4y ago
In the last month I bought and returned a Darter Pro from them. Almost immediately I realized what some have mentioned already-- these machines are overpriced and lack build quality you'd get with mainstream laptops. The bezel was messed up, causing light bleed on the display. I'd be better off loading Ubuntu onto a Dell XPS for half the price.
- goodcjw2 4y ago
  +1, System76's build quality is terrible. My company spent lots of $$$ on system76 workstations, only found that GPU card falls off during shipping due to the terrible design they have...
- agdasdigonio 4y ago
  The price and build quality are both bad, but I think you're leaving off the most important one: the software support is bad. I haven't had a Linux machine with unreliable sleep/wake in fifteen years except for my System76 Adder WS. A bulletproof, "Just Works" Linux laptop would have its place even with System76's other problems. But they trail behind the likes of Lenovo even on their supposed strong suit.
virtualritz 4y ago
I bought a Xiaomi RedMiBook Pro 15" 2022 edition last summer. On Aliexpress no less. The machine was a steal at 1.2kEUR. I bought the maxed out config which is about 1.5k if you buy it e.g. via the Xiamomi shop instead [1]. There is excellent support for all hardware on Linux (and even a ICC profile) in [2]. I run System76's pop!_OS on it. Everything works dandy. The machine is a beast. It has a 3.2k (!) res screen. Only 400nits but I find that's plenty for the lighting conditions I use it under. The case is milled from dark alluminum and is frequently mistaken for a macbook. The build quality is top. It's a Ryzen 6800H APU with built in Radeon and an NVIDIA GTX2050. It has 16GB RAM and a 512GB SSD. It's the first non-mac I bought in a decade after getting disappointed with macOS in recent years. The only thing that isn't on par is the touchpad on Linux. On Windows it's very close so this is definitely a config issue. I may just have to spend some time with settings. [1] https://www.xiaomihome.global/xiaomi-laptops/xiaomi-redmibook-15-pro-2022-laptop/ https://www.xiaomihome.global/xiaomi-laptops/xiaomi-redmiboo... [2] https://github.com/vrolife/modern_laptop https://github.com/vrolife/modern_laptop
- ZeroCool2u 4y ago
  Try using Wayland and see how the touchpad feels. Should be much better. Nvidia makes it problematic to use Wayland, but it’s a good test to verify the quality of the trackpad hardware.
- robolion 4y ago
  I've been eying up this laptop. Could you elaborate on your experience with it on Linux? Have the patches in [2] been mainlined? If not, have they worked between kernel releases (e.g. linux-5.x to linux-6.x)? How's the battery life? 3200x2000 @ 15.6" = 242ppi. Are you able to use integer (2x) scaling comfortably?
  - virtualritz 4y ago
    I used Kubuntu on it before switching to pop!_OS because non-integer scaling was blurry on the Ubuntu desktop. Kubuntu was totally fine. I always use around 1.5x scaling on this res/ppi. Integer scaling works fine (and is sharp) on both desktops. There are no patches in this repo but actual driver kernel modules. I don't think any of them have been mainlined but I may be wrong. Whenever I update the kernel, I run a single script from that repo. But I don't update kernels unless there is good reason for my particular hardware. I used the 5.17 kernel series until two weeks ago and switched to 6 since then. Everything works perfectly fine. Feel free to PM me for any other questions about this machine.

231 points by bananicorn 4y ago

driverdan 4y ago

Still only 1920x1080. Come on, give us decent resolution screens already!

yoyohello13 4y ago
Honestly, the difference between 1080p and 1440p on a 14in screen is barely perceptible to me. I'd rather have the extra battery life.
- doix 4y ago
  I run my 1440p screen at 1080p because my portable monitor is 1080p and I don't want to try and setup different scaling on different screens in X or move to Wayland. I'm happy enough.
  - gibspaulding 4y ago
    Not sure why you're getting down voted. This seems like a valid point. I'd also note that if you are connected to a larger 1440p external display, 1080p on the smaller one keeps the dpi closer so you don't have to use different scaling settings.
  - 0x457 4y ago
    I've tried it. Don't do it.
  - aliqot 4y ago
    I run 4 different screens with different resolutions in X with no problem, no setup. Is there a specific error you run into?
    - doix 4y ago
      It's not the resolutions, different resolutions is fine. It's the scaling. 1440p at 14" requires scaling because everything is too small (for me, anyway). But the portable monitor doesn't need scaling. I couldn't get it to work nicely without running two different X servers (one for each display). I am pretty sure it's a limitation in X, the dpi setting is global, not per output. Wayland seems to have solved this, but it has other problems for me (forced vsync being the major one). So I just live in a lower resolution. I don't really care, like some of the other posters in the thread, the lower resolution annoys me less than a 60hz refresh rate (laptop monitor is 144hz). Luckily X can handle different refresh rates for different outputs.
- 3np 4y ago
  Try Chinese in smaller font sizes...
  - xbar 4y ago
    Thank you for a lesson in empathy. I would be satisfied with a taller 1920x1200 display but maybe you still wouldn't be.
- barbariangrunge 4y ago
  I find it highly noticeable in a 13 inch screen
- haspok 4y ago
  But this is not a 14" screen... > Display 15.6″ 1920×1080 FHD, Matte Finish, 144 Hz
0xCMP 4y ago
Agreed. 1080 is probably a good proportion, but I'd prefer 4k resolution at 200% than native 1080.
- smoldesu 4y ago
  Interestingly, it looks like System76 has 4k options for their Intel machines. Hopefully that's a sign of things to come on their Ryzen line?
- mmis1000 4y ago
  I am a CJK user, and I can definitely say 4K at 200% is much more better than standard 1080p. Standard 1080p only looks good for English alphabets. Complex Chinese characters like `國` looks blurry(or even s**tty) on that resolution. Reading chinese charaters on a hidpi monitor is really a much better experience.
coder543 4y ago
It is a 144Hz display, which makes it significantly more interesting than an average 1080p display. 60Hz just feels so stuttery these days. But, I agree that a higher resolution would be nice, and if I'm being completely honest... I would want OLED. Tons of affordable OLED laptops have come to market over the past year.
- jesuscript 4y ago
  Why does 144hz matter to you if you aren't playing games? This is not a gaming machine. You absolutely will not notice the difference for non-gaming tasks between 60hz to 80hz/100hz/120hz/144hz/244hz.
  - coder543 4y ago
    > You absolutely will not notice the difference If you make absolutes like that, then everything I could respond with is automatically “wrong”, so that’s not a great conversation opener. My smartphone is not a gaming monitor either, but 120Hz is hugely noticeable. My windows desktop is using a 144Hz monitor. I had a 120Hz MacBook Pro for awhile. I’m familiar with how I experience high refresh rate on different types of devices. You may not care, and that’s fine, but what’s the point of asking why I care and then telling me in no certain terms that I won’t? And how do you know if I would be gaming on this or not? Valve has put immense effort into making Linux viable for gaming. If you’re instead trying to say the monitor’s response times suck, how do you know that already?
  - nullandvoid 4y ago
    I absolutely do notice when my laptop screen defaults back to 60hz, instead of 144hz after some interactions.
  - kitsunesoba 4y ago
    Yeah, I jump between 60hz, 120hz, and 240hz screens several times a day and while the difference in smoothness is very visible, if I'm not gaming I forget about it very quickly. Personally for work machines I find high density (preferably integer scaling friendly) preferable over extra frames.
vehemenz 4y ago
Or at least 1920x1200. It's amazing how much 16:10 helps on a small screen.

jesuscript 4y ago

What makes their stuff so great? I was customizing a gaming rig on their site the other day and it was wildly overpriced. I imagine you can match their specs for this laptop at cheaper prices.

acomjean 4y ago
You can. Its for people like me who want a linux laptop, but don't want to go through the hassle of installing it. While I could, I just didn't want to spend the time on it, plus setting up some drivers here and there. Thats the value prop. I got one for home use, (Oryx pro with Nvidia) 4 years ago. It worked well enough and had so few issues I got one for work.
- jesuscript 4y ago
  I totally sympathize with the driver compatibility concern, but what is the hassle of sticking in a linux usb drive to install? In general, how serious are these driver compatibility concerns for modern laptop hardware?
  - kube-system 4y ago
    The driver issues still exist if you don't do research ahead of time. There are laptops on the shelf today that still don't fully work out of the box with Ubuntu.
  - acomjean 4y ago
    I don't know. I think most machines are pretty well supported. 4 years ago when I first bought one reading through the forums it seemed kinda hit or miss with wifi and sound. especially since my initial machine had nvidia graphics it seemed like a throw money at the problem and avoid headaches. If it was a desktop, I probably would have installed myself. The machines I have from system76 are rebadged "Clevos" (I got dog hair in the fan and replaced the fan, which necessitated investigating. My AMD one with original fans is NL50NU) https://www.clevo.com.tw/ https://www.clevo.com.tw/ The POPOS full disc encryption out of the box was another selling point. I'm not sure thats easy to set up on on a new install. The support is good, when I had issues going up a major version (I think steam installed something newer than what it was expecting) and I couldn't figure how to get the OS to upgrade despite tons of command line foo, I put a ticket and they pointed me in the right direction.

indigodaddy 4y ago

Hah I misinterpreted this headline as “people returning” these laptops

piinbinary 4y ago

This feels like somewhat unfortunate timing, with AMD's 7000 series mobile CPUs just around the corner.

nicolaslem 4y ago
"U" class chips won't be in laptops on the shelves until this summer, if previous mobile CPU releases are good indicators. Oh and then be ready for months of firmware and kernel patches until the chip is actually usable as a daily driver on Linux. Getting a 6000 series CPU now that the kinks have been ironed out is not a bad idea.
schaefer 4y ago
You really have to do your homework with the new AMD processor rebranding. It's super easy to think your getting the latest and greatest, only to end up with Vega 2 graphics like the 5000 series from years ago. I had to whiteboard it to keep it all straight myself. When I look at AMD's new mobile lineup for 2023, and I didn't notice anything "new" in the U-series power profile (15 watts tdp). I'd be more than happy with a 6800U in linux friendly packaging. Let me know if you think there's a specific 7000 series chip I've overlooked. P.S: about the system 76 teaser itself, the static picture used as a "before and after" comparison for 60hz display vs 144 hz display is comedic gold.
- nicolaslem 4y ago
  > Let me know if you think there's a specific 7000 series chip I've overlooked. The 7040 series, which is Zen 4 & RDNA 3 (so not a Rembrandt refresh) should be available for "thin and light" laptops.
  - schaefer 4y ago
    You are absolutely right about that[1]. but strangely, on the 7640U the CPU core count drops from 8 to 6 in comparison with the 6800U. Presumably to make room for the new AI cores? I'm not sure that trade off is right for me. [1]: https://wccftech.com/amd-debuts-ryzen-7045-dragon-range-enthusiast-ryzen-7040-phoenix-laptop-cpus-with-zen-4-rdna-3/ https://wccftech.com/amd-debuts-ryzen-7045-dragon-range-enth...

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azangru 4y ago

Ooh, it's actually starting to look rather nice, unless these are deceptively flattering angles. Which Clevo is this?

sliken 4y ago
Maybe it's the long rumored locally produced System76 laptop.
trelane 4y ago
If you believe getting a laptop crom System76 and from Clevo will get you the same laptop, you're quite mistaken.
- LoganDark 4y ago
  No? Sysmtem76 rebrands Clevo machines and offers them with software support & warranty. That's like, their whole thing.
  - trelane 4y ago
    No, actually, they don't. They work with Clevo to make them, and Clevo can sell the hardware, but the firmware is very different, and possibly some of the hardware as well. see e.g. cassidyjames at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17039414 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17039414 There were a couple of great threads on Twitter, but it looks like Jeremy Soller isn't on anymore. (https://twitter.com/c4software/status/1322954098711400449 https://twitter.com/c4software/status/1322954098711400449 is one guy realizing too late that they're not the same, that likely precipitated https://mobile.twitter.com/jeremy_soller/status/1322954964549824512 https://mobile.twitter.com/jeremy_soller/status/132295496454... still in Google cache saying "A reminder that you shouldn't buy Clevo's and expect them to work like System76's"

CoastalCoder 4y ago

Would it make sense to change the title? I read it to be about people who bought AMD-only laptops from System76, needing to return them to System76 for some reason.

lwhi 4y ago
Same here .. I think we need a comma. E.g. "System76 AMD-Only Laptop, Returns"
- coder543 4y ago
  No, that would actually be less correct and less clear. "System76 brings back AMD-only laptop" would be an extremely clear way to phrase the title. I'm not even sure the "only" is even that helpful; it could probably just be "AMD laptop".
  - lwhi 4y ago
    Perhaps, but it would continue to allow the poster their own choice of words .. which I think is important.
    - coder543 4y ago
      No... it's less clear too. The verb is never isolated from the rest of the sentence by a comma, but a list of nouns will be isolated by commas, even if the conjunction is missing for brevity in a title. Separating "returns" like that makes it appear even more to be a noun, which is the thing that the original comment was confused by. Correct interpretation of the title relies on the reader realizing that it is a verb in this context, and the comma does not help with that. Given the ongoing mess with the AMD 7900 XTX GPU vapor chambers, I initially interpreted the title to mean there was some problem with AMD laptops, so System76 was offering returns only for those laptops with AMD chips. That is not the case.
      - Y_Y 4y ago

IronWolve 4y ago

Needs a 2k screen, wont go back to 1080p...

toast0 4y ago
If 4k is 3840 × 2160, 1920 × 1080 is 2k, FYI
- nicolaslem 4y ago
  Nope, 1440p is known as 2k because it is twice the amount of pixels as 1080p.
  - dsr_ 4y ago
    https://www.tomshardware.com/news/2k-definition,37641.html https://www.tomshardware.com/news/2k-definition,37641.html Says that the DCI definition of 2K is 2048x1080, and that 2560x1440 should be called QHD or WQHD. (Quad = 4x, HD = 1280x720). And this aligns with the usage I am accustomed to.
- deleted 4y ago
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- coder543 4y ago
  This is 100% correct. Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2K_resolution https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2K_resolution > Another resolution that is often referred to as 2K is 2560 × 1440 (1440p) however that is a common mistake in marketing[12] and is called QHD by the DCI. It is a mistake to refer to 2560x1440 as 2K. People calling 1080p "2K" is a pet peeve of mine. 2.5K is a more appropriate name for 2560x1440, if you want to use that naming convention, but I think just saying 1440p is simpler.
  - fomine3 4y ago
    I'm upset for such people too. Chinese smartphone manufacturers tend to say it.
  - 4y ago

renewiltord 4y ago

Been a Linux user for 20+ years. Pretty sick that we have companies like this selling Linux laptops with Coreboot. Man, that was a wild dream back in the day. I'm using a Macbook personally, but this stuff is so sick. To be honest, I never really imagined the future as using Windows + Linux + MacOS without thinking that much about the platform, but about the only thing that sticks out to me is that the command line on Windows is rubbish. Otherwise, it feels very naturally normal to me as I switch between platforms. The web has really changed things. Only thing that surprises me are the screens. I thought the high res screens like in the Macbook were commonplace now.

mixmastamyk 4y ago
You need a better adjective and to try Windows Terminal with a modern shell shipped this millennium. ;-) I like yori when in a DOS mood.
- inetknght 4y ago
  > You need ... to try Windows Hard no from many people including myself. It will be a cold day in hell before I give Microsoft any more of my money or personal information after the abuses they've done to me, my information, and my purchases.
  - mixmastamyk 4y ago
    Preachin' to the choir buddy. Suggestion was for the grandparent post who wanted a better shell for windows.

whalesalad 4y ago

The chassis looks great and is made of magnesium - if it weren't for the tenkey I would be seriously considering this. A smaller thinkpad-esque machine would probably be really popular.

lushdogg 4y ago

I own a LemurPro 9. Love it but the arrow keys are a crime against humanity. It appears they have fixed this (maybe even sooner) with the Pangolin. System76 if you here can you switch chassis :) ?

Symmetry 4y ago

Now that the two big Thinkpad pointer stick patents have expired I wonder why more laptop makers aren't incorporating them?

uni_rule 4y ago
Despite the niche love for them on a personal level corporate fleet buyers would still buy DTSN screens if they were $5 cheaper per unit than the regular ones because they are that damn fickle. That is to say their priorities are different.
- criddell 4y ago
  Corporate fleet buyers purchased a lot of Thinkpads over the years.
acomjean 4y ago
Or put that point thing on a mouse. So much better than a scroll wheel. I still miss that mouse.
linhns 4y ago
Non-programmers are not really fond of it, unlike you and me. I actually consider it a ThinkPad underutilized selling point but it takes time to master navigation with the pointer stick and sometimes it gets in the way when you need to type fast.
accrual 4y ago
If this had a Trackpoint I would consider it instead of a new Lenovo Thinkpad. I love the Trackpoint.

woile 4y ago

Is this a thin and lightweight laptop? I've been looking for a thin powerful AMD laptop with good Linux support

Beltalowda 4y ago
Dimensions 14.59″ × 9.76″ × 0.71″ (37.06 × 24.79 × 1.80 cm) Weight 3.95 lbs (1.79kg)
umvi 4y ago
I have a System76 galp5. It's fairly thin and lightweight. I have mixed feelings about it. Linux support is good. But Windows support is pretty bad. All available drivers are here: https://github.com/system76/windows-drivers https://github.com/system76/windows-drivers but even after installing everything in that repo listed under galp5, I still have a ton of issues including laptop not going to sleep when lid is closed, touchpad occasionally not working until I toggle it on/off from settings, etc. Getting Windows working from Pop OS using Virtual Box was also a massive, fragile headache. I would get it working, but then sometimes when using Visual Studio from inside virtual box it would freeze and the VM would be permanently bricked unless I had previously saved a snapshot. All this to say that if you care about Linux and only Linux, System76 could be a good choice. But if you need to use Windows at all, I would steer clear of S76 until their Windows support is a little better (also YMMV - I've just had so many issues with Windows on a galp5, but that might not be the case with other models).
- trelane 4y ago
  I'd recommend using Windows under a VM, for this and myriad other reasons. But it really underscores the point that Linux and Windows hardware really are different.
  - Mikeb85 4y ago
    > But it really underscores the point that Linux and Windows hardware really are different. You mean it underscores the fact that Windows actually has terrible hardware support and the only reason it runs on anything is because OEMs put in work... Linux runs on most Windows hardware OOTB.

acomjean 4y ago

I have one (the previous one with AMD Ryzen 5700u). I've been using it for work the last 6 months coming from an 2015 macbook. Its been great for developing. The battery lasts pretty well (forgetting my power supply when working from home I got almost 7 hours), its fast (I've done some genetics blast runs which take hours, where those extra cores really help). Its pretty quiet too (you can hear the fan when it spins up, but its very reasonable). Returning to a Mat screen has been nice. I really like AMD on the notebook. Compared to my 4 year old Oryx pro (intel 8th gen), which had poor battery life (esp when using the Nvidia graphics) and required a reboot initially if I wanted to switch to intel graphics. This one is much nicer, but it won't game nearly as well as one with dedicated graphics.

karmakaze 4y ago

The first thing I see is a 16x9 screen, think "pass", and close the page. There have to be other LCD panel makers out there. Either their customers don't care and/or the company doesn't care to make a better laptop.

greyw 4y ago
Interesting. For me the screen needs to be 16:9 or 16:10 to be even considered.
- lost_tourist 4y ago
  that's the same for me. I tend to have "two" windows open at most times and that works well for me on my 15" laptop (ancient by most HN standards). I've looked at the ultrawide and 4:3 screens and I'm good with the current "standard" form factor when I can't get to my 3 monitor setup at home.
inetknght 4y ago
> The first thing I see is a 16x9 screen, think "pass", and close the page. I like 16x9. What do you want instead?
- haunter 4y ago
  Not OP but I guess 4:3 or 3:2. Some people prefer those to widescreens, having more vertical space is better MS Surface Books are 3:2 for example (2256 x 1504 on 13,5" / 2496 x 1664 on 15"), or some Thinkpad X1 models are 4:3 (probably just the Fold?). The Framework laptop is also 3:2 (2256 x 1504 on 13,5")
  - RodGodKiller 4y ago
    He probably meant 16:10.
    - karmakaze 4y ago

buster3000 4y ago

'15.6″ 1920×1080' Come on...

bboygravity 4y ago
Meanwhile people like me think you're complaining about the tiny screen.

quasarj 4y ago

God damn that is one ugly motherfucker. Why in the world is anyone still squeezing useless numpads onto laptops???

inetknght 4y ago
> Why in the world is anyone still squeezing useless numpads onto laptops??? Excuse me?! I will never buy a laptop without a numpad! I use numpads every day! The better question is why is anyone still squeezing a useless touchpad onto laptops???
- lost_tourist 4y ago
  We can have both. I think we have the tech still. Not sure why OP is angry lol
- quasarj 4y ago
  Well first, I don't believe you. But let's assume you really do need a numpad for your work or whatever. Wouldn't you rather have one that was... full sized? And wouldn't you rather the keyboard be centered on the laptop, so you can actually use it on a lap?
  - inetknght 4y ago
    > Well first, I don't believe you. No point in arguing what you believe. > Wouldn't you rather have one that was... full sized? Yes, I would. But having a numpad is absolutely better than not having a numpad. > wouldn't you rather the keyboard be centered on the laptop, so you can actually use it on a lap? I can use my laptop on my lap when the keyboard is not centered. Do you have a disability (there's nothing wrong with having one) which prevents you from doing so? No, I wouldn't rather suffer the loss of a numpad just to have the keyboard centered. Having the keyboard centered does not improve my usability in any way whatsoever. Removing the touchpad would, however. Disabling the touchpad is the first thing I do; I use keyboard navigation around things instead. It's faster and far less clumsy.
RosanaAnaDana 4y ago

ruined 4y ago

still only 1080p

x3n0ph3n3 4y ago

I waited so long to get a new laptop, and System76 was my top choice, except for their awful screens. Finally bit the bullet on got a Macbook Pro 14" instead...

RosanaAnaDana 4y ago

I'm on the Serval 76 with a 2070. I don't really care if they are going team red again. I'll be trying a different manufacturer next time.

lost_tourist 4y ago
this is in addition to intel, so what's your point? You don't like system76 hardware at all and will be switching?
- RosanaAnaDana 4y ago
  From a hardware side things are spec'd fine. The issue is on the firmware/ company side. I no longer have confidence in the company to support their products. A couple of qol firmware updates could have fixed that.
  - rqtwteye 4y ago
    Same for me. The Galago Pro (galp5) is quite ok but the firmware has bugs and they are not fixing them. Over the last 2 years I have had the fan running constantly when a USB-C device was connected, the fan going into full turbo mode over night, the screen started to flicker after wakeup on battery and some other issues. And battery life is beyond terrible. After two years of struggle I have thrown the towel and got a used Macbook for the same price. I am starting to question their engineering priorities. Instead of developing new desktop environments I think they should make sure their devices are rock solid and work perfectly with Linux. That's their USP and they are not delivering on that promise.

Finnucane 4y ago

I am surprised to see that their chosen configuration does not please everyone's contradictory expectations and desires.

RosanaAnaDana 4y ago
All I want is a commitment from the company to provide a couple of qol firmware updates. System 76 has burned me in the past in this regard.

snvzz 4y ago

Ryzen 6800U: https://www.amd.com/en/product/11591 https://www.amd.com/en/product/11591 It's a Zen3+ with embedded RDNA2 graphics. Not the state of the art as of CES announcements, but I'd happily get a laptop with one of these if I needed a laptop right now. It's good System76 is offering such an option, because it makes them a candidate. I would not currently consider a laptop that's based on Intel or NVIDIA hardware, due to vastly inferior performance/watt and lack of open documentation, respectively.

Mikeb85 4y ago

Not gonna lie, very underwhelming compared to what's coming out from other manufacturers... Even a budget brand like Acer is releasing Ryzen 7000 chipsets and pairing it with higher resolution OLED screens, probably will be cheaper as well... https://www.acer.com/ca-en/laptops/swift/swift-go-14-amd https://www.acer.com/ca-en/laptops/swift/swift-go-14-amd

ploxiln 4y ago
The Ryzen 7000 mobile lineup includes chips based on Zen4, Zen 3+, Zen 3, and even Zen 2 cpu cores, and using RDNA3, RDNA2, and even Vega graphics! An Acer with a Ryzen 7000 series chip could easily have the same or older cpu core or graphics arch, as the Zen 3+ and RDNA2 in Ryzen 6800U. https://www.anandtech.com/show/18718/amd-2023-ryzen-mobile-7000-cpus-unveiled-zen-4-phoenix-takes-point https://www.anandtech.com/show/18718/amd-2023-ryzen-mobile-7... (and honestly, Zen 3 and RDNA 2 are damn good anyway)
- Mikeb85 4y ago
  The teaser says 8 cores/16 threads so likely will be at least equivalent. With a much better screen. And cheaper.
teaearlgraycold 4y ago
System76 is a brand for ideologues. They ship laptops with FOSS UEFI. That’s their gimmick.
- Mikeb85 4y ago
  I mean, I like Linux and am a bit of an ideologue... I want System76 to succeed and want to buy a laptop from them but I also like using nice hardware.
  - linhns 4y ago
    I think you get what you pay for. Nicer hardware = more expensive. Maybe if this is successful the System76 will consider fast-tracking Ryzen 7000.

droptablemain 4y ago

I've bought a couple of laptops from System76. They charge outrageous prices and and shipping costs for even the smallest part; other than that, getting parts for their rebadged Clevo machines can be a bit challenging because you often have to order from China, so it takes a while.

gjmacd 4y ago

Meh. I won't switch to a Linux laptop until I can get a reasonable resolution on the screen that matches my MBP's output for a reasonable price. I can't understand why I can't get a reasonably good priced laptop with just Linux that doesn't match the video resolution of a MBP.

vladvasiliu 4y ago
This is what kills me. At work, they only swear by HP for some reason. So, I've got a shitty Elitebook that cost, after RAM and SSD upgrades, within 100 euros of a same-size MBP with same RAM and SSD. But the build quality is uniformly worse. And the screen... it's an atrocity. You don't have to compare it to an MBP (I only have an old 2013 one, and it still wipes the floor with it). Even compared to an older XPS (7th gen intel), it's horrible.

dfghjkjhg 4y ago

too little too late. since 13months ago, HP sells a elite book G9 for 2k, which have the best combo configuration at, gasp, wallmart for 800... eigth hundred dollars. same cpu, but PRO version. metal and plastic body. scissor waterproof keyboard. usb c charging (system76 is barrel), 2x sodimm ram slots (system76 is soldered, note thay amd zen3+ pro mighty allow ECC ram in a laptop for the first time! so i want slots), the battery have 18Wh less, but it is also 20pct ligther. and all hardware is fully supported with 5.8+ kernel. I always try to buy from linux-first-vendors, but I still deal with a librem13 that have sevral keys fail on their keyboard and support is ghosting me. even had to super-glue the hinge latelly. so awful :(

vladvasiliu 4y ago
800 seems cheap for an elitebook. Is that the 8x0 model? I have the older g8. It worked perfectly out of the box on linux since new. Recently, windows started being able to use the webcam, too. But beware the screen. It's absurdly bad. I'd say it's okish for $800. For 2000, it's a bad joke. Some models only have 6-bit screens (at least those have an excuse for being horrible). The fan is sometimes noisy, too. It seems like it's somewhat off-balance, ever since it was new.

jklinger410 4y ago

They should have gone with AMD from the start and the screen is a non-starter. When researching laptops, screen is probably the biggest differentiator at this point. I won't be replacing my Galago Pro with another System76 product when that day finally comes.

lhl 4y ago

This might be the first Ryzen 6800U Linux laptop, which is cool, but it's a bit hard for me to get too excited about it... * One of the biggest selling points of Ryzen 6000 is the chip's USB4 support, but looks like the Pangolin won't have it. It also only has 1 USB-C port, which is a bit of a headscratcher in 2023. Does it support PD even? (Not mentioned) * 16:9 FHD display (no brightness specified) - high refresh is nice, but again, weird that it's not 16:10 in 2023 and IMO, QHD would be better for a 15-16" display. * soldered memory (32GB at least) * Numpad keyboard. This will be a positive for some, but I'm in the centered keyboard camp * Only a 70Wh battery and still not so light (1.8kg) While it's running an older chip, if you're not going to have USB4/TB4, and the points I listed are important, I think the Tuxedo Pulse 15 Gen2 is still a better 15" option atm (5700U chip, but lighter, bigger battery, better (still 16:9) display, Ethernet, SODIMM slots). There are some Ubuntu certified ThinkPads that are an option too (they have Ryzen 6000U chips but also no USB4), although almost all the models are w/ soldered RAM on ThinkPads now, which is a bummer. If you want USB4 on AMD, the best (Linux friendly) options right now are probably the Asus G14 GA402 or a ThinkPad Z16. The HP EliteBook G9s are an option as well, although you need Linux 6.0+ to fix a broken HP BIOS update (HP support is also aggressively indifferent to Linux users) and I've seen lots of complaints about the fan curve and the SureView displays so I'm hesitant to recommend it...

andreareina 4y ago
I have a 14” QHD laptop (framework) and it’s really awkward without fractional scaling. I don’t know that 20-25% more screen space would really fix that.
- joombaga 4y ago
  Agreed. Love the size and aspect ratio, I just wish it was a bit higher resolution so I could use 200% scaling.
- yellowapple 4y ago
  I just don't scale anything on mine. Obviously not ideal for everyone, but I tend to want to cram as much into the screen as possible.

benlivengood 4y ago

I bought a Lemur because of coreboot but I can't tell if this laptop will have coreboot or a closed BIOS/EFI. Admittedly I haven't played around with customizing the coreboot firmware but that was my intention, mostly to avoid long boot times and potentially to try fitting the whole kernel in firmware.

vetrom 4y ago

Are new S76 laptops still Clevo or some other ODM?

tssva 4y ago

Last time there was a System76 laptop announcement on HN I said I was going to be in the market for a new laptop in the coming year but wouldn't consider a System76 laptop because of the giant logo on the lid. Some people said the logos on their System76 laptops were stickers which could be removed. I contacted System76 and was told that was no longer the case. If anyone from System76 is here, I am currently looking for a new laptop and will not be buying a System76 laptop based entirely upon the giant logo on them. I don't want to put a skin, a cover or stickers over my laptop. My preference would be no logo at all but that seems to be impossible. If you are compelled to use me for free advertising post purchase, at least make it somewhat discreet.

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msla 4y ago
On my Darter Pro 8 (recentish, not top-of-the-line) laptop, the branding on the lid isn't one sticker, it's a sticker per character, which I could likely remove and leave smooth black metal. This Reddit thread seems to agree with me that the stickers can be removed, albeit about a different model: https://old.reddit.com/r/System76/comments/ge0mqz/lemur_pro_lid_logo/ https://old.reddit.com/r/System76/comments/ge0mqz/lemur_pro_... Looks like it has the same kind of lettering as mine, though.
- tssva 4y ago
  When I contacted System76 sales last year after others posted their logo was stickers they told me their logo was no longer stickers. Maybe that is only on the upper range but the upper range is what I am interested in.
emaro 4y ago
I think the Purism laptops have no branding, if that is a priority for you.

_odey 4y ago

OK, let's look and analyse what they have in detail: Operating System: Pop!_OS 22.04 LTS or Ubuntu 22.04 LTS Do they offer any custom software that are only available on these distributions and would be a struggle to find on other? Sone other Clevo resellers have for example custom software to control the fan intensity that's Ubuntu only (and Ubuntu 20.04 only). It's not clear why they restrict it to only these distributions. Also, why did they even bother to develop their own distribution? Every Linux in existence is a combination of 1 DE (Gnome, KDE, XFCE or other), 1 package manager (apt, pacmanm etc...) and some kernel params. Is it really worth spending their time on a custom Linux instead of on hardware/firmware? Speaking of firmware, does it have Coreboot or stock Clevo BIOS? Does it have a fingerprint reader and does it work, can you control the fan speed from anywhere? Nowhere to find answers to these questions... Processor: AMD Ryzen™ 7 6800U: 2.7 up to 4.7 GHz - 8 Cores - 16 Threads Graphics: AMD Radeon™ 680M This is great! my opinion is this is the best laptop processor reasonably available on the market right now. But if you're not desperate to switch your laptop and can wait until the middle or end of this year, buying the next generation Zen4 processor is astronomically better. Display 15.6″ 1920×1080 FHD, Matte Finish, 144 Hz Not bad, not good either, 1440p would have been ideal. They do not specify the sRGB % coverage. Is it 90, 95, 99? The difference between 90 and 95 is definitely noticeable and you would do yourself a big disservice if you don't go for 95% at least. Memory: 32 GB LPDDR5 @ 6400 MHz Yes, amazing, the future is now! But is it 4x8 or 2x16? And is it ECC? What brand? Storage: 2 x M.2 SSD(PCIe NVMe). Up to 16TB total. No problems here, I assume PCIe 4.0, but would be great if they specified. Don't want to accidentally discover it was PCIe 3.0 after the purchase has been made. Also, what brand of SSD do they provide? Brands are important so you can look at benchmarks. Expansion: 3 × USB 3.2 Gen 1 Type-A, 1 × USB 3.2 Gen 2 Type-C, SD Card Reader 3 USBA, 1 USBC? Why not 2 and 2? In the future we will need less USBA and more USBC. Look at macbooks, they have all USBC and everybody eventually copies macbooks anyway (regardless if it's a good or bad decision). The more USBC you have now the better for the future. Input: Multitouch Clickpad, Single-Color Backlit US QWERTY Keyboard Is 100% of the surface area clickable on the clickpad, or is it one of those awkward ones where you have "mouse buttons" at the top/bottom, and you can not press onto the top, only tap? Need more information! Keyboard wise it's great! a 15 inch laptop without a numpad is a waste of potential, as a numpad is immensely helpful when doing any sort of finance work. I definitely would not buy a laptop this big without one. Still some more information non the keyboard layouts available would be nice. Networking: Gigabit Ethernet, WiFi 6E, Bluetooth 5.2 All perfect here! Video Ports: HDMI 2.0, USB 3.2 Gen 2 Type-C w/ DisplayPort I'm assuming this is the same single USBC that they mentioned above. Is it DisplayPort 1.4, or 2.0? Audio: Stereo dual-driver full-range speakers, 1× Headphone/Microphone Combo This is their biggest flaw. If you look at the chassis, you will see, the speakers point DOWNWARD. Speakers are supposed to point towards the listener, not away from them. Also, from previously owning multiple Clevo laptops that I've bought for work purposes, sound quality is so bad, you can simply assume you have no speakers as you'll be using headphones or a conference speaker. If you buy this thinking you'll be able to enjoy any kind of video/movie out of working hours without purchasing and carrying extra peripherals you will be extremely frustrated and disappointed. Low maximum volume, poor quality sound, no base, and pointing away from you; every flaw imaginable. More that 4 people in a conference room and wanting to dial in from one laptop to share? Forget about it, you will be embarrassed to even try as the combination of laptop's built-in speakers and microphone quality will make the whole experience terrible. This is an area where macbooks excel, great speakers and great microphone, and that's why people love them so much, you can actually enjoy the audio interaction. There is no reason for non macbook laptops to be this bad at audio. All they have to do is copy macbooks, like they eventually do anyway... just put in better speakers and microphone, it's that easy. Cost wise it's not an issue either since a machine like this is going to cost in the same ballpark as a macbook anyway, why be cheap on something so insignificant for the overall price but so important for the user experience? Camera: 1.0MP 720p HD Webcam Security: Kensington® Lock, Hardware Camera Kill Switch A camera cover is better than a camera kill switch in my opinion, good to have at least I guess. Battery: Li-Ion - 70 Wh Charger: 65 W, AC-in 100–240 V, 50–60 Hz Why not 99Wh? (the maximum allowed at airports) This is not a macbook, it's a beefy, thick laptop no matter how you look at it, why not outfit it properly? Overall: at least it's guaranteed to run Linux... but from the points I raised above I guess you can see there is no point for me to get excited about this model in particular. Price wise it's going to be over the "expensive" threshold anyway, so might as well find something that ticks most checkboxes. Unless, of course I'm desperate for a new machine, in which case I could settle for this for a while. I'm more hopeful for this vendor instead for higher quality devices: https://starlabs.systems/pages/starfighter https://starlabs.systems/pages/starfighter

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mulmen 4y ago

My 2014 RMBP is finally ready to go to the great messenger bag in the sky. Apple no longer provides updates and the battery is swelling. I'm not excited about the new MacBook offerings. The hardware is neat but the OS really turns me off. Apple is on a crusade to make MacOS unusable and the lack of stability in the environment is too much for me. I'm ready to make the leap into a Linux desktop environment just for the sake of stability but I want well supported hardware. Is System 76 a good option? The advice that makes sense to me is to "use what the devs use". Does an AMD-only System 76 check that box?

hojjat12000 4y ago
As far as support goes. System76 would be your best bet. You can also checkout HP Dev One (which comes with System76's Pop!_OS).
- deleted 4y ago
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neither_color 4y ago
Do you game? Asus Zephyrus G14 is also AMD-only(mobile 6700 or 6800 graphics), premium build quality, and is available with a QHD display.
- mulmen 4y ago
  But is it well supported by a mainstream Linux distribution?

vouaobrasil 4y ago

I would love for something like this to exist in Canada. Unfortunately import fees make these much less attractive here.

FpUser 4y ago

Nice lappy. I would also like to see max amount of RAM supported. I normally buy laptops with the least amount of RAM and then add max amount that I could buy way cheaper elsewhere. Same with SSDs.

manifoldgeo 4y ago

I recently bought a System76 Oryx Pro 9, and I could not for the life of me get Debian to boot from a USB. The same USB booted on my old Galago Pro, so I know it was good. The Oryx Pro runs on some FOSS UEFI or BIOS made by System76 themselves, and it doesn't play nice with anything but Ubuntu and Pop!_OS. I filed a support ticket asking for help, and they told me they only support Ubuntu and Pop. On one hand, I understand having service desk limits, but their garbage UEFI and lack of support left me no choice but to return the laptop. In fact, I thought this article was going to be about people returning laptops to System76! I really hope they get their game together and make a pre-boot system that can handle non-Ububtu stuff easily. The previous System76 I had was able to handle a Debian install just fine.

whydid 4y ago
It's a bit judgmental to call their UEFI "garbage" just because it didn't work correctly for you. I agree it's frustrating they don't support booting other operating systems, but please be fair or provide some more evidence before you call some software "garbage"

snarg 4y ago

I have trouble understanding why every Linux-friendly laptop vendor insists on this godawful arrow key layout. It was a bad idea when Apple did it, and it was a bad idea when you copied them. Apple has even backtracked on this terrible design, but the copycats never got the memo. I'm never, ever buying a laptop with full-height horizontal keys but half-height vertical keys.

_caveman 4y ago

In the last month I bought and returned a Darter Pro from them. Almost immediately I realized what some have mentioned already-- these machines are overpriced and lack build quality you'd get with mainstream laptops. The bezel was messed up, causing light bleed on the display. I'd be better off loading Ubuntu onto a Dell XPS for half the price.

goodcjw2 4y ago
+1, System76's build quality is terrible. My company spent lots of $$$ on system76 workstations, only found that GPU card falls off during shipping due to the terrible design they have...
agdasdigonio 4y ago
The price and build quality are both bad, but I think you're leaving off the most important one: the software support is bad. I haven't had a Linux machine with unreliable sleep/wake in fifteen years except for my System76 Adder WS. A bulletproof, "Just Works" Linux laptop would have its place even with System76's other problems. But they trail behind the likes of Lenovo even on their supposed strong suit.

virtualritz 4y ago

I bought a Xiaomi RedMiBook Pro 15" 2022 edition last summer. On Aliexpress no less. The machine was a steal at 1.2kEUR. I bought the maxed out config which is about 1.5k if you buy it e.g. via the Xiamomi shop instead [1]. There is excellent support for all hardware on Linux (and even a ICC profile) in [2]. I run System76's pop!_OS on it. Everything works dandy. The machine is a beast. It has a 3.2k (!) res screen. Only 400nits but I find that's plenty for the lighting conditions I use it under. The case is milled from dark alluminum and is frequently mistaken for a macbook. The build quality is top. It's a Ryzen 6800H APU with built in Radeon and an NVIDIA GTX2050. It has 16GB RAM and a 512GB SSD. It's the first non-mac I bought in a decade after getting disappointed with macOS in recent years. The only thing that isn't on par is the touchpad on Linux. On Windows it's very close so this is definitely a config issue. I may just have to spend some time with settings. [1] https://www.xiaomihome.global/xiaomi-laptops/xiaomi-redmibook-15-pro-2022-laptop/ https://www.xiaomihome.global/xiaomi-laptops/xiaomi-redmiboo... [2] https://github.com/vrolife/modern_laptop https://github.com/vrolife/modern_laptop

ZeroCool2u 4y ago
Try using Wayland and see how the touchpad feels. Should be much better. Nvidia makes it problematic to use Wayland, but it’s a good test to verify the quality of the trackpad hardware.
robolion 4y ago
I've been eying up this laptop. Could you elaborate on your experience with it on Linux? Have the patches in [2] been mainlined? If not, have they worked between kernel releases (e.g. linux-5.x to linux-6.x)? How's the battery life? 3200x2000 @ 15.6" = 242ppi. Are you able to use integer (2x) scaling comfortably?
- virtualritz 4y ago
  I used Kubuntu on it before switching to pop!_OS because non-integer scaling was blurry on the Ubuntu desktop. Kubuntu was totally fine. I always use around 1.5x scaling on this res/ppi. Integer scaling works fine (and is sharp) on both desktops. There are no patches in this repo but actual driver kernel modules. I don't think any of them have been mainlined but I may be wrong. Whenever I update the kernel, I run a single script from that repo. But I don't update kernels unless there is good reason for my particular hardware. I used the 5.17 kernel series until two weeks ago and switched to 6 since then. Everything works perfectly fine. Feel free to PM me for any other questions about this machine.