8 ms·

Well TFA ignored that few to none of the phones on this list that are better than the Pixel 6a include a 3.5mm headphone jack. That's what's wrong with the US

Well TFA ignored that few to none of the phones on this list that are better than the Pixel 6a include a 3.5mm headphone jack. That's what's wrong with the US phone market. No headphone jack. WHY? Over 100 years and dropped for what? No reason, just handwaves about design and 'waterproofing' that are easily debunked by the Samsung Galaxy S5 Active from 2014. Pardon me while I go throw away my custom in-ear headphones I've had for over a decade, or my Ear Hero receiver-in-canal headphones that leave my ears open without pinching my glasses against my head like bone conduction headphones do. Where was I? oh yeah, phones getting designed to death. No removable batteries. So glad Europe did that rule, soon we shall have something again, I am very pleased with that development, I'm happy to say. I will grant the rant about the carriers - it's true. What physical keyboard? What pogo pins? What microSD card? What IR blaster? Nonono we don't need all that, we just need a SLIMMER DEVICE (that you can stick in a huge case)....we just need a new instagram tiktok eating device! Arg.

yellowapple 4y ago
> just handwaves about design and 'waterproofing' that are easily debunked by the Samsung Galaxy S5 Active from 2014. Not to mention continue to be debunked. I'm typing this comment on a Unihertz Titan. Ostensibly waterproof (and in my testing it seems to care very little about whether or not it‘s wet). Still has a 3.5mm jack.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
epa 4y ago
Move on, wireless is better. They have usb-c adapters as well.
- justin_oaks 4y ago
  But then you can't charge with the USB-C port and listen to headphones at the same time.
  - nl 4y ago
    This is such a weird complaint. Firstly, yes, you can can get USB-C to headphone adaptors that allow charging[1] Secondly, the scenarios where this is an issue are combinations of edge cases. You have to choose not to use wireless headphones, not have a wireless charger AND for some reason be unable to spare the 30 minutes to do a rapid boost charge. If that's really a problem then by all means get the charger that allows both. [1] eg, first result: https://www.amazon.com.au/UGREEN-Headphone-Adapter-Charging-Compatible/dp/B08519D4R4 https://www.amazon.com.au/UGREEN-Headphone-Adapter-Charging-...
    - pessimizer 4y ago
      These are a bunch of solutions with their own pluses, minuses, and degree of knowledge that you have to have to even be aware of, in addition to seperate products that you have to purchase - in order to fix a problem that didn't exist before. It's very weird to not understand that people don't want this in their lives in return for little or no benefit.
      - nl 4y ago
        But there is a big benefit! Less connectors save costs and reduce wiring in the phone allowing manufactures to make it smaller. For most people who prefer wireless (I don't think anyone actually likes wires) this is a pretty reasonable compromise.
        RHSeeger 4y ago
        I prefer wires to wireless in pretty much every situation except for chargers. - ethernet vs wifi? ethernet wins hands down - headphones? corded wins hands down Honestly, even for chargers, I still use a wired one anywhere except my home office, because it would be annoying to carry a wireless charge around.
        nl 4y ago
        I'd say you prefer the experience you get with wires, not the wires themselves. That's a reasonable position to take.
- russelg 4y ago
  Yeah OK, let me know when Bluetooth latency is the same as a physical wire connection. Or when a good Bluetooth pair costs the same as a good wired pair.
  - rrrrrrrrrrrryan 4y ago
    A few higher-end commercial headphones now support Bluetooth AptX LL (low latency). Probably won't sway you, but it exists.
    - arvinsim 4y ago
      Bluetooth latency has never been low enough for music production in my use case
    - daedalus_j 4y ago
      - Still sounds like garbage when side-by-side compared to by ATH-AD700X's, or ATH-MSR7NC's though. - Still more irritating to have to keep charged rather than just plug in. Still more irritating to switch back and forth between my phone and my laptop and my desktop though. - Still more irritating (or even impossible) to share my single audio source with someone else's headphones though. - Still more irritating to pipe into the mixer and play back over big speakers though. I had a phone with only USB-C for a while. Sure, dongle's exist. They also get buggy and drop out occasionally, since they've got firmware. They also make it challenging to charge and listen simultaneously. They also get lost easily. There's a lot to recommend a simple 3-wire electrical connection with a standard plug. I don't begrudge people who want to use bluetooth at all, we can all coexist, just keep the headphone jack available so we can. :-)
      - midoridensha 4y ago
        BlueTooth is basically a necessity in a modern phone for many reasons, not just headphones: fitness trackers, automotive system integration, etc. all use BT. And BT doesn't need any physical space on the edge of the device. But yeah, the venerable 3.5mm headphone jack is simple and effective and doesn't have many of the problems that plague wireless headphones. Any good phone should have both.
- boring_twenties 4y ago
  Wireless is worse in every way imaginable. Worse power use, worse quality, worse latency, much worse convenience (now you have to charge the headphones, too).
  - wiseowise 4y ago
    And I assume you type this on device connected to Ethernet, right? And no, Bluetooth headphones are convenient, how often do you think you need to charge them?
    - boring_twenties 4y ago
      Of course I am connected to Ethernet, what kind of question is that? Having headphones that turn out to be uncharged, or undercharged, when I try to use them even once is completely unacceptable. For what benefit, saving myself the 2 seconds of plugging a cable in? Fuck everything about Bluetooth headphones.
- jbay808 4y ago
  My wireless headphones were working great until about two weeks ago. Now when I try to connect to them via Bluetooth, the connection fails, every time, due to an "unknown problem" and I should "try again later". Fortunately the detachable 3.5mm jack still works.
rrrrrrrrrrrryan 4y ago
If you want to use continue using old tech with new tech, you'll have to get used to using an adapter. That's how technology has worked since forever.
- _piif 4y ago
  Except not providing a headphone jack has been a clear regression. Other than saving the manufacturer a few pennies, what benefits do I get from not having one?
- Volundr 4y ago
  Sure, maybe, but usually the new stuff the old is being abandoned for is at least better....
- RHSeeger 4y ago
  When they replace older, functional tech with newer, less functional tech; it's fair to complain about it. I was unable to find a reasonable phone (that had the other features I wanted) with a headphone jack when I bought a new phone recently, and I'm constantly annoyed at the lack of it. Bluetooth is nice to have, but it's not a replacement for a physical jack.
  - encryptluks2 4y ago
    Is there not USB-C headphones and adapters? I can see why it isn't exactly preferable but if they started making phones with 2 USB-C jacks I probably wouldn't mind all that much, but I would prefer a magnetic type of adapter that is low profile so that there is less risk of damaging the port.
    - bitwize 4y ago
      I got some USB buds for my Pixel 6 for about twice the price of a pair of 3.5mm buds. I grumble about not being able to use the buds and charge the phone at the same time, but it's a minor concern overall. The USB buds have equivalent quality and latency to 3.5mm buds, so you're not forced to take a step down like you would be with Bluetooth.
nl 4y ago
Honestly, you can get great USB-C to headphone jack converters for $10. Just accept the market has moved on and live with it. Also the headphone jack isn't 100 years old.
- mortenlarsen 4y ago
  Doesn't work on all phones, like my Pixel 4. That was a big surprise. There is no way to connect anything else but BT.
  - gruez 4y ago
    Are you using the OEM provided adapter? The reason is probably due to the usb-c standard being a clusterfuck and essentially having two different types of "usb-c to 3.5mm dongle": 1. active dongle that gets digital audio signals from the phone, and converts that to analog using an onboard DAC 2. passive dongle that receives analog audio signals from the phone, and simply converts the pinout from usb-c to 3.5mm[1] If you try to use the latter dongle on a phone that doesn't support that use case (ie. it doesn't contain onboard DAC), it will fail to work. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB-C#Audio_Adapter_Accessory_Mode_2 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB-C#Audio_Adapter_Accessory_...
    - seba_dos1 4y ago
      Passive dongles are the only ones that actually have something to do with USB-C standard, as those allow to simply route the analog connection through the USB-C port. Active dongles are just regular USB sound cards that you can plug into a PC too and which could use a USB-A plug just as well.
      - nl 4y ago
        This is an active USB-C to headphone dongle designed for phones: https://www.amazon.com.au/Stereo-Adapter-Hi-res-Headphone-Compatible/dp/B07CN36QVH/r https://www.amazon.com.au/Stereo-Adapter-Hi-res-Headphone-Co... It specifically mentioned Pixel 4 compatibility. Yes, I think it might work on a PC too, but I've never tried that.
tails4e 4y ago
The note was for me the pinnacle of phones. Large display, textured back so it wasn't slippery, and no back to get cracked, metal frame around the screen, sd card, exceptionally easily replaced battery (the back popped off easily) , great battery life for the day, headphone jack. The only thing it lacked that is nice is waterproof. Everyphone I've had since has had a subset of what it had. A SW update bricked mine, and if it was not for that I can't see myself replacing it.
- tarakat 4y ago
  > A SW update bricked mine, and if it was not for that I can't see myself replacing it. And that's why they don't make them like that anymore.
bombcar 4y ago
The "no headphone jack" group is like the "smaller phone" group - very loud but evidently small in actual numbers.
- wyre 4y ago
  Except afaik the market for phones with headphone jacks is larger than actual small phones.
  - wiseowise 4y ago
    Got the numbers?
    - wyre 4y ago
      iPhone 13 mini vs every phone on the market with a headphone jack?
- jbay808 4y ago
  I'm typing this on my small phone with a headphone jack and, equally importantly, an SD card slot. There are dozens of us. Dozens!
  - meetingthrower 4y ago
    Jelly 2 for the win!
- refurb 4y ago
  This is pretty much it. I still use an iPhone 7 because the size is perfect. Good luck finding many options in the <6" smart phone market. That said, Apple sells tens of millions (hundreds of millions) of phones, and the amount of data they get on customer preference must be amazing. They clearly don't feel like the "mini" market is worth spending that much time on. I'm glad to see they offer it, but it's clearly not their key product.
  - 4y ago
jacooper 4y ago
I know the EU mandated UDB-C for all devices, but Removable batteries ? This is new.
- robin_reala 4y ago
  See article 11 of https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:52020PC0798 https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:52... It doesn’t necessarily mean a return to the classic Nokia pop off the back model. As long as it’s user replaceable a couple of screws wouldn’t be a problem. But e.g. soldering the battery to the motherboard, or gluing the case together with no reassembly prospect would be issues.
throwawaylinux 4y ago
It's funny -- and I do sympathize, it's always frustrating when you have some preference and the market moves so you can't get what you want, it happens to all of us -- but when people particularly bemoan newer technology as being unable to be maintained or upgraded or having built-in obsolescence... I have to wonder, why aren't they still using their 12 year old battery-swappable phone, upgrading their pin-compatible 486 motherboard, or driving their all-mechanical car from 1963.
- toastercat 4y ago
  Some people who would rather use their old phones don't because they can no longer receive software updates, either to the apps they use, or the OS. There are other reasons also like replacement parts are no longer easily available. But anyway, you're missing the forest for the trees. Most folks who bemoan what you speak of simply want the option to repair their items easily in the case that something does go wrong.
  - throwawaylinux 4y ago
    > Some people who would rather use their old phones don't because they can no longer receive software updates, either to the apps they use, or the OS. You can though. Many old phones are hackable. > There are other reasons also like replacement parts are no longer easily available. Also doesn't seem to be true. You can still buy second hand parts and whole phones for old models for almost nothing. > But anyway, you're missing the forest for the trees. Most folks who bemoan what you speak of simply want the option to repair their items easily in the case that something does go wrong. You can likewise buy all parts for your 1963 Cadillac, you can buy manuals, you can repair it in a modestly equipped home-garage. Very few who complained about the computerization of cars do though, because new cars are so much more reliable and performant and relatively cheaper (in large part due to said computerization). It wasn't just a conspiracy to prevent people repairing their cars (the few who actually could repair their own cars back in the 60s even). I accept there are real valid concerns about repairability, planned obsolescence, etc. But like I said, a lot of complaints about this stuff is wide of the mark IMO. Having a phone with IR and headphone jack and SD cards and micro USB and replaceable screen and replaceable battery and upgradable RAM and pogo pins and physical keyboards and never-ending software updates sounds great. The reality is it will make it a much worse / more expensive product for the 99.999% of people who don't care for those features.
aimor 4y ago
I got a new phone recently, a Samsung S22. I wasn't worried about the lack of headphone jack because my previous phone came with a USB-C to 3.5mm adapter. I plugged in my headphones through the adapter and my new phone told me it wasn't compatible with that adapter. Smartphones are a mess right now, they're used as platforms to get consumers to buy into other products and services. You don't need a headphone jack because you can buy wireless earbuds, and you don't need an SD card slot because you can back up your photos to the cloud, and you don't need a radio because you can subscribe to a streaming music service, and you don't need a charging brick because you can buy a wireless charging mat. They're very aggressively pushing people towards all this new and expensive tech.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
hakfoo 4y ago
About five years ago, I left a job which had been providing me a phone. I was replacing them every two years since that was the regime at the time, usually for an "exotic" flagship-- I had an early LTE Galaxy S2 which had zero long-term support, a Lumia 1020, and a LG V10, for example. When it stopped being funny money, I ended up buying only low-midrange devices (Motorola E4, Umidigi F1, and most recently, a Nokia G20). Once you get to like $150, you've left the absolute bottom corner-cutting segment of the market and can get a competent device. It seems like at every price increment much above there, they start doing the "hand you something while taking away something else" game. At about $300, you start losing MicroSD and 3.5mm. At about $500, once you get past Pixel territory, you lose the option for vanilla Android and have to deal with big ugly vendor packin BS. At the very top, half the phones are now less usable devices and more science-fair projects to demonstrate how hinge technology is advancing. I suspect it's really "device as jewelry/status symbol" at this point so you need the gimmicks to close the sale. Meanwhile, weird bottomfeeder brands like Oukitel can sell a $200-300 phone with a 10000mAh battery, but the combined engineering might of the Samsung organization seems unable to spin that particular magic even on a $1300 device.
- thoweuiro2343 4y ago
  Sony Phones are still great BTW (if they sell them in your country that is).
  - selimthegrim 4y ago
    They have microSD but not sure if that alone justifies price tag
0x_rs 4y ago
I remember how a set of people back in the day would praise that decision from a certain company and all copycats later as "courageous", "innovative" and so on. "It'll give space for a better battery" may be the most deluded one if you looked at the competition and their offerings at the time, followed by "slimmer phones" (as if a good thing regardless after a certain threshold not limited by the 3.5 jack) and so on. Plenty waterproofed phones before 2015 too. In reality it's more about enforcing a vision and making bucks selling wireless sets, Airpods being annunced back to back with the removal of it. (and a lot of OEMs trying to do the same identical thing, such as Samsung and Google) Apple's 10 bucks USB-C DAC may be great for the price, but dongleism is one of the worst and most disgusting trends hardware has had in the past decades, "just use and carry around an adapter (two if you want to charge at the same time too) at all times with you lmao". I wouldn't even care, if it wasn't forced for the rest of us. Feels like such a weird thing to have to complain about like this, too, it's very divisive.
- thefz 4y ago
  Apple's reasoning was more "why give people a 3.5mm jack when we can separate it from the phone and make them pay for it?"
  - addicted 4y ago
    And also make the default, non-dongle, headphones they buy from us over a hundred dollars more expensive now that we don’t provide headphones in the box anymore.
5350-uiop-1130 4y ago
for me just like agile broke my software enjoyment, annual iterative hardware release broke hardware enjoyment. they intentionally don't build things to last, because the focus always how to sell you next product for you to consoom. one company especially bad, talk about environment while release same product every year with minor changes. changing the appearance of the OS's every year because marketing needs to give superficial illusion of newness
nunb 4y ago
Have you tried the Ear Hero Bluetooth adapter?
tjoff 4y ago
The lack of headphone jack is explained solely by the fact that the consumer now how to buy a pair of wireless headphones. That is the only reason.
- katbyte 4y ago
  I used the wired default iPhone lighting headphones for years. Worked just fine? And came with the phone and was covered by it’s AppleCare for years. I broke so many I must have gotten dozens of free replacements! I only switched to wireless when I got some AirPod pros for 50$ CAD and actually just liked them a lot more.
  - tjoff 4y ago
    Well, that was just a stop-gap to ease the criticism... Also, the included headphones has always been pure garbage. Anything is better, which is of course was the point of the 3.5mm jack - not that it enabled the use of the bundled garbage. Not sure exactly what your point is. I've used bluetooth for well over a decade and they are awesome. But that doesn't mean they somehow could replace the 3.5mm jack.
    - katbyte 4y ago
      Parent comment was basically “removed to force people to wireless” - I disagreed. That’s all said I do still wish the iPhone had a 3.5mm Jack, or heck even 2.5mm would be fine as the dac on the iPhone is better then most you’ll find in a usb-c dongle.
- KingOfCoders 4y ago
  1. Buy headphone company 2. Remove headphone jack 3. $$$
- izacus 4y ago
  And that there's one less component to install, less work to do on the chassis, less lines to draw. It's cheaper. That's what it is.
flarg 4y ago
Just buy a Bluetooth headphone amp and you can use your favourite headphones again. The ones from FiiO are small and pretty good
- LinAGKar 4y ago
  But with all the cons of Bluetooth (need for charging, high latency, lack of high quality bidirectional audio).
  - flarg 4y ago
    Charging is a fact of life for a lot of things, latency is not an issue for the better Bluetooth devices, the brand I mentioned has a good rep in this respect, bidirectional audio quality has been an issue IMHO so I use different headsets for calls and audio and tbh it works out v well. Give it a go at least, the Bluetooth adaptors are not that expensive and may improve your experience.
ThePowerOfFuet 4y ago
> Pardon me while I go throw away my custom in-ear headphones I've had for over a decade, or my Ear Hero receiver-in-canal headphones that leave my ears open without pinching my glasses against my head like bone conduction headphones do. Where was I? oh yeah, phones getting designed to death. Come on. USB-C to headphone jack adapters are $10, and apparently Apple's (which is universal) contains an excellent DAC.
- infinitezest 4y ago
  ive tried several of these and they havent been reliable for me. Lots of cutting out, crackling, etc
  - ThePowerOfFuet 4y ago
    Try the Apple one.
- bvrmn 4y ago
  Perfect, Apple can sell additional device for both user groups.
muro 4y ago
You can use a usb-3.5mm adapter, not that big deal.
thefz 4y ago
> Well TFA ignored that few to none of the phones on this list that are better than the Pixel 6a include a 3.5mm headphone jack. Current 4a owner, always had Google phones, and this is precisely the reason why the next one is going to be a 1+ for me. I don't want to sacrifice all the 3.5mm devices I have for a fad like this ,and Bluetooth audio is horrible anyway.
hammyhavoc 4y ago
Just use an external DAC. Problem solved. DA is better than anything that's ever been on a phone.
- bvrmn 4y ago
  > DA is better than anything that's ever been on a phone. Do you have links to actual tests?
  - dumpsterlid 4y ago
    DACs are essentially a solved problem, the only crap DAC and headphone amp I have found on a device that actually sounds different than any other DAC was on a raspberry pi. Which to be fair they tell you straight up that the audio jack on the raspberry pi sucks. They probably found the one factory in china still bothering to manufacture subpar DACs and amps. Otherwise every other single device with a headphone amp has sounded the same, especially when you factor in normal use of an eq to get your sound system/headphones to sound good. People that say you can tell the difference between audio DACs are letting the placebo effect convince them to support a crap, cottage industry that robs people of their money lol. Now, there are DACs and headphone amps that can put out a LOT more power than other DACs and headphone amps. Yes if you buy headphones that take a lot of power to drive a normal DAC/amp might not be able to drive them but that is an entirely different question than "my DAC just sounds better than yours" snakeoil. Also... hard to drive headphones and speakers are relatively niche and rare. There are PLENTY of """""""audiophile"""""""""" headphones and speakers that are easy to drive.
    - bvrmn 4y ago
      I know that DAC is solved problem. But parent claims external "DA is better than anything that's ever been on a phone".

yellowapple 4y ago

> just handwaves about design and 'waterproofing' that are easily debunked by the Samsung Galaxy S5 Active from 2014. Not to mention continue to be debunked. I'm typing this comment on a Unihertz Titan. Ostensibly waterproof (and in my testing it seems to care very little about whether or not it‘s wet). Still has a 3.5mm jack.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

epa 4y ago

Move on, wireless is better. They have usb-c adapters as well.

justin_oaks 4y ago
But then you can't charge with the USB-C port and listen to headphones at the same time.
- nl 4y ago
  This is such a weird complaint. Firstly, yes, you can can get USB-C to headphone adaptors that allow charging[1] Secondly, the scenarios where this is an issue are combinations of edge cases. You have to choose not to use wireless headphones, not have a wireless charger AND for some reason be unable to spare the 30 minutes to do a rapid boost charge. If that's really a problem then by all means get the charger that allows both. [1] eg, first result: https://www.amazon.com.au/UGREEN-Headphone-Adapter-Charging-Compatible/dp/B08519D4R4 https://www.amazon.com.au/UGREEN-Headphone-Adapter-Charging-...
  - pessimizer 4y ago
    These are a bunch of solutions with their own pluses, minuses, and degree of knowledge that you have to have to even be aware of, in addition to seperate products that you have to purchase - in order to fix a problem that didn't exist before. It's very weird to not understand that people don't want this in their lives in return for little or no benefit.
    - nl 4y ago
      But there is a big benefit! Less connectors save costs and reduce wiring in the phone allowing manufactures to make it smaller. For most people who prefer wireless (I don't think anyone actually likes wires) this is a pretty reasonable compromise.
      - RHSeeger 4y ago
        I prefer wires to wireless in pretty much every situation except for chargers. - ethernet vs wifi? ethernet wins hands down - headphones? corded wins hands down Honestly, even for chargers, I still use a wired one anywhere except my home office, because it would be annoying to carry a wireless charge around.
        nl 4y ago
        I'd say you prefer the experience you get with wires, not the wires themselves. That's a reasonable position to take.
russelg 4y ago
Yeah OK, let me know when Bluetooth latency is the same as a physical wire connection. Or when a good Bluetooth pair costs the same as a good wired pair.
- rrrrrrrrrrrryan 4y ago
  A few higher-end commercial headphones now support Bluetooth AptX LL (low latency). Probably won't sway you, but it exists.
  - arvinsim 4y ago
    Bluetooth latency has never been low enough for music production in my use case
  - daedalus_j 4y ago
    - Still sounds like garbage when side-by-side compared to by ATH-AD700X's, or ATH-MSR7NC's though. - Still more irritating to have to keep charged rather than just plug in. Still more irritating to switch back and forth between my phone and my laptop and my desktop though. - Still more irritating (or even impossible) to share my single audio source with someone else's headphones though. - Still more irritating to pipe into the mixer and play back over big speakers though. I had a phone with only USB-C for a while. Sure, dongle's exist. They also get buggy and drop out occasionally, since they've got firmware. They also make it challenging to charge and listen simultaneously. They also get lost easily. There's a lot to recommend a simple 3-wire electrical connection with a standard plug. I don't begrudge people who want to use bluetooth at all, we can all coexist, just keep the headphone jack available so we can. :-)
    - midoridensha 4y ago
      BlueTooth is basically a necessity in a modern phone for many reasons, not just headphones: fitness trackers, automotive system integration, etc. all use BT. And BT doesn't need any physical space on the edge of the device. But yeah, the venerable 3.5mm headphone jack is simple and effective and doesn't have many of the problems that plague wireless headphones. Any good phone should have both.
boring_twenties 4y ago
Wireless is worse in every way imaginable. Worse power use, worse quality, worse latency, much worse convenience (now you have to charge the headphones, too).
- wiseowise 4y ago
  And I assume you type this on device connected to Ethernet, right? And no, Bluetooth headphones are convenient, how often do you think you need to charge them?
  - boring_twenties 4y ago
    Of course I am connected to Ethernet, what kind of question is that? Having headphones that turn out to be uncharged, or undercharged, when I try to use them even once is completely unacceptable. For what benefit, saving myself the 2 seconds of plugging a cable in? Fuck everything about Bluetooth headphones.
jbay808 4y ago
My wireless headphones were working great until about two weeks ago. Now when I try to connect to them via Bluetooth, the connection fails, every time, due to an "unknown problem" and I should "try again later". Fortunately the detachable 3.5mm jack still works.

rrrrrrrrrrrryan 4y ago

If you want to use continue using old tech with new tech, you'll have to get used to using an adapter. That's how technology has worked since forever.

_piif 4y ago
Except not providing a headphone jack has been a clear regression. Other than saving the manufacturer a few pennies, what benefits do I get from not having one?
Volundr 4y ago
Sure, maybe, but usually the new stuff the old is being abandoned for is at least better....
RHSeeger 4y ago
When they replace older, functional tech with newer, less functional tech; it's fair to complain about it. I was unable to find a reasonable phone (that had the other features I wanted) with a headphone jack when I bought a new phone recently, and I'm constantly annoyed at the lack of it. Bluetooth is nice to have, but it's not a replacement for a physical jack.
- encryptluks2 4y ago
  Is there not USB-C headphones and adapters? I can see why it isn't exactly preferable but if they started making phones with 2 USB-C jacks I probably wouldn't mind all that much, but I would prefer a magnetic type of adapter that is low profile so that there is less risk of damaging the port.
  - bitwize 4y ago
    I got some USB buds for my Pixel 6 for about twice the price of a pair of 3.5mm buds. I grumble about not being able to use the buds and charge the phone at the same time, but it's a minor concern overall. The USB buds have equivalent quality and latency to 3.5mm buds, so you're not forced to take a step down like you would be with Bluetooth.

nl 4y ago

Honestly, you can get great USB-C to headphone jack converters for $10. Just accept the market has moved on and live with it. Also the headphone jack isn't 100 years old.

mortenlarsen 4y ago
Doesn't work on all phones, like my Pixel 4. That was a big surprise. There is no way to connect anything else but BT.
- gruez 4y ago
  Are you using the OEM provided adapter? The reason is probably due to the usb-c standard being a clusterfuck and essentially having two different types of "usb-c to 3.5mm dongle": 1. active dongle that gets digital audio signals from the phone, and converts that to analog using an onboard DAC 2. passive dongle that receives analog audio signals from the phone, and simply converts the pinout from usb-c to 3.5mm[1] If you try to use the latter dongle on a phone that doesn't support that use case (ie. it doesn't contain onboard DAC), it will fail to work. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB-C#Audio_Adapter_Accessory_Mode_2 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB-C#Audio_Adapter_Accessory_...
  - seba_dos1 4y ago
    Passive dongles are the only ones that actually have something to do with USB-C standard, as those allow to simply route the analog connection through the USB-C port. Active dongles are just regular USB sound cards that you can plug into a PC too and which could use a USB-A plug just as well.
    - nl 4y ago
      This is an active USB-C to headphone dongle designed for phones: https://www.amazon.com.au/Stereo-Adapter-Hi-res-Headphone-Compatible/dp/B07CN36QVH/r https://www.amazon.com.au/Stereo-Adapter-Hi-res-Headphone-Co... It specifically mentioned Pixel 4 compatibility. Yes, I think it might work on a PC too, but I've never tried that.

tails4e 4y ago

The note was for me the pinnacle of phones. Large display, textured back so it wasn't slippery, and no back to get cracked, metal frame around the screen, sd card, exceptionally easily replaced battery (the back popped off easily) , great battery life for the day, headphone jack. The only thing it lacked that is nice is waterproof. Everyphone I've had since has had a subset of what it had. A SW update bricked mine, and if it was not for that I can't see myself replacing it.

tarakat 4y ago
> A SW update bricked mine, and if it was not for that I can't see myself replacing it. And that's why they don't make them like that anymore.

bombcar 4y ago

The "no headphone jack" group is like the "smaller phone" group - very loud but evidently small in actual numbers.

wyre 4y ago
Except afaik the market for phones with headphone jacks is larger than actual small phones.
- wiseowise 4y ago
  Got the numbers?
  - wyre 4y ago
    iPhone 13 mini vs every phone on the market with a headphone jack?
jbay808 4y ago
I'm typing this on my small phone with a headphone jack and, equally importantly, an SD card slot. There are dozens of us. Dozens!
- meetingthrower 4y ago
  Jelly 2 for the win!
refurb 4y ago
This is pretty much it. I still use an iPhone 7 because the size is perfect. Good luck finding many options in the <6" smart phone market. That said, Apple sells tens of millions (hundreds of millions) of phones, and the amount of data they get on customer preference must be amazing. They clearly don't feel like the "mini" market is worth spending that much time on. I'm glad to see they offer it, but it's clearly not their key product.
- 4y ago

jacooper 4y ago

I know the EU mandated UDB-C for all devices, but Removable batteries ? This is new.

robin_reala 4y ago
See article 11 of https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:52020PC0798 https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:52... It doesn’t necessarily mean a return to the classic Nokia pop off the back model. As long as it’s user replaceable a couple of screws wouldn’t be a problem. But e.g. soldering the battery to the motherboard, or gluing the case together with no reassembly prospect would be issues.

throwawaylinux 4y ago

It's funny -- and I do sympathize, it's always frustrating when you have some preference and the market moves so you can't get what you want, it happens to all of us -- but when people particularly bemoan newer technology as being unable to be maintained or upgraded or having built-in obsolescence... I have to wonder, why aren't they still using their 12 year old battery-swappable phone, upgrading their pin-compatible 486 motherboard, or driving their all-mechanical car from 1963.

toastercat 4y ago
Some people who would rather use their old phones don't because they can no longer receive software updates, either to the apps they use, or the OS. There are other reasons also like replacement parts are no longer easily available. But anyway, you're missing the forest for the trees. Most folks who bemoan what you speak of simply want the option to repair their items easily in the case that something does go wrong.
- throwawaylinux 4y ago
  > Some people who would rather use their old phones don't because they can no longer receive software updates, either to the apps they use, or the OS. You can though. Many old phones are hackable. > There are other reasons also like replacement parts are no longer easily available. Also doesn't seem to be true. You can still buy second hand parts and whole phones for old models for almost nothing. > But anyway, you're missing the forest for the trees. Most folks who bemoan what you speak of simply want the option to repair their items easily in the case that something does go wrong. You can likewise buy all parts for your 1963 Cadillac, you can buy manuals, you can repair it in a modestly equipped home-garage. Very few who complained about the computerization of cars do though, because new cars are so much more reliable and performant and relatively cheaper (in large part due to said computerization). It wasn't just a conspiracy to prevent people repairing their cars (the few who actually could repair their own cars back in the 60s even). I accept there are real valid concerns about repairability, planned obsolescence, etc. But like I said, a lot of complaints about this stuff is wide of the mark IMO. Having a phone with IR and headphone jack and SD cards and micro USB and replaceable screen and replaceable battery and upgradable RAM and pogo pins and physical keyboards and never-ending software updates sounds great. The reality is it will make it a much worse / more expensive product for the 99.999% of people who don't care for those features.

aimor 4y ago

I got a new phone recently, a Samsung S22. I wasn't worried about the lack of headphone jack because my previous phone came with a USB-C to 3.5mm adapter. I plugged in my headphones through the adapter and my new phone told me it wasn't compatible with that adapter. Smartphones are a mess right now, they're used as platforms to get consumers to buy into other products and services. You don't need a headphone jack because you can buy wireless earbuds, and you don't need an SD card slot because you can back up your photos to the cloud, and you don't need a radio because you can subscribe to a streaming music service, and you don't need a charging brick because you can buy a wireless charging mat. They're very aggressively pushing people towards all this new and expensive tech.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

hakfoo 4y ago

About five years ago, I left a job which had been providing me a phone. I was replacing them every two years since that was the regime at the time, usually for an "exotic" flagship-- I had an early LTE Galaxy S2 which had zero long-term support, a Lumia 1020, and a LG V10, for example. When it stopped being funny money, I ended up buying only low-midrange devices (Motorola E4, Umidigi F1, and most recently, a Nokia G20). Once you get to like $150, you've left the absolute bottom corner-cutting segment of the market and can get a competent device. It seems like at every price increment much above there, they start doing the "hand you something while taking away something else" game. At about $300, you start losing MicroSD and 3.5mm. At about $500, once you get past Pixel territory, you lose the option for vanilla Android and have to deal with big ugly vendor packin BS. At the very top, half the phones are now less usable devices and more science-fair projects to demonstrate how hinge technology is advancing. I suspect it's really "device as jewelry/status symbol" at this point so you need the gimmicks to close the sale. Meanwhile, weird bottomfeeder brands like Oukitel can sell a $200-300 phone with a 10000mAh battery, but the combined engineering might of the Samsung organization seems unable to spin that particular magic even on a $1300 device.

thoweuiro2343 4y ago
Sony Phones are still great BTW (if they sell them in your country that is).
- selimthegrim 4y ago
  They have microSD but not sure if that alone justifies price tag

0x_rs 4y ago

I remember how a set of people back in the day would praise that decision from a certain company and all copycats later as "courageous", "innovative" and so on. "It'll give space for a better battery" may be the most deluded one if you looked at the competition and their offerings at the time, followed by "slimmer phones" (as if a good thing regardless after a certain threshold not limited by the 3.5 jack) and so on. Plenty waterproofed phones before 2015 too. In reality it's more about enforcing a vision and making bucks selling wireless sets, Airpods being annunced back to back with the removal of it. (and a lot of OEMs trying to do the same identical thing, such as Samsung and Google) Apple's 10 bucks USB-C DAC may be great for the price, but dongleism is one of the worst and most disgusting trends hardware has had in the past decades, "just use and carry around an adapter (two if you want to charge at the same time too) at all times with you lmao". I wouldn't even care, if it wasn't forced for the rest of us. Feels like such a weird thing to have to complain about like this, too, it's very divisive.

thefz 4y ago
Apple's reasoning was more "why give people a 3.5mm jack when we can separate it from the phone and make them pay for it?"
- addicted 4y ago
  And also make the default, non-dongle, headphones they buy from us over a hundred dollars more expensive now that we don’t provide headphones in the box anymore.

5350-uiop-1130 4y ago

for me just like agile broke my software enjoyment, annual iterative hardware release broke hardware enjoyment. they intentionally don't build things to last, because the focus always how to sell you next product for you to consoom. one company especially bad, talk about environment while release same product every year with minor changes. changing the appearance of the OS's every year because marketing needs to give superficial illusion of newness

nunb 4y ago

Have you tried the Ear Hero Bluetooth adapter?

tjoff 4y ago

The lack of headphone jack is explained solely by the fact that the consumer now how to buy a pair of wireless headphones. That is the only reason.

katbyte 4y ago
I used the wired default iPhone lighting headphones for years. Worked just fine? And came with the phone and was covered by it’s AppleCare for years. I broke so many I must have gotten dozens of free replacements! I only switched to wireless when I got some AirPod pros for 50$ CAD and actually just liked them a lot more.
- tjoff 4y ago
  Well, that was just a stop-gap to ease the criticism... Also, the included headphones has always been pure garbage. Anything is better, which is of course was the point of the 3.5mm jack - not that it enabled the use of the bundled garbage. Not sure exactly what your point is. I've used bluetooth for well over a decade and they are awesome. But that doesn't mean they somehow could replace the 3.5mm jack.
  - katbyte 4y ago
    Parent comment was basically “removed to force people to wireless” - I disagreed. That’s all said I do still wish the iPhone had a 3.5mm Jack, or heck even 2.5mm would be fine as the dac on the iPhone is better then most you’ll find in a usb-c dongle.
KingOfCoders 4y ago
1. Buy headphone company 2. Remove headphone jack 3. $$$
izacus 4y ago
And that there's one less component to install, less work to do on the chassis, less lines to draw. It's cheaper. That's what it is.

flarg 4y ago

Just buy a Bluetooth headphone amp and you can use your favourite headphones again. The ones from FiiO are small and pretty good

LinAGKar 4y ago
But with all the cons of Bluetooth (need for charging, high latency, lack of high quality bidirectional audio).
- flarg 4y ago
  Charging is a fact of life for a lot of things, latency is not an issue for the better Bluetooth devices, the brand I mentioned has a good rep in this respect, bidirectional audio quality has been an issue IMHO so I use different headsets for calls and audio and tbh it works out v well. Give it a go at least, the Bluetooth adaptors are not that expensive and may improve your experience.

ThePowerOfFuet 4y ago

> Pardon me while I go throw away my custom in-ear headphones I've had for over a decade, or my Ear Hero receiver-in-canal headphones that leave my ears open without pinching my glasses against my head like bone conduction headphones do. Where was I? oh yeah, phones getting designed to death. Come on. USB-C to headphone jack adapters are $10, and apparently Apple's (which is universal) contains an excellent DAC.

infinitezest 4y ago
ive tried several of these and they havent been reliable for me. Lots of cutting out, crackling, etc
- ThePowerOfFuet 4y ago
  Try the Apple one.
bvrmn 4y ago
Perfect, Apple can sell additional device for both user groups.

muro 4y ago

You can use a usb-3.5mm adapter, not that big deal.

thefz 4y ago

> Well TFA ignored that few to none of the phones on this list that are better than the Pixel 6a include a 3.5mm headphone jack. Current 4a owner, always had Google phones, and this is precisely the reason why the next one is going to be a 1+ for me. I don't want to sacrifice all the 3.5mm devices I have for a fad like this ,and Bluetooth audio is horrible anyway.

hammyhavoc 4y ago

Just use an external DAC. Problem solved. DA is better than anything that's ever been on a phone.

bvrmn 4y ago
> DA is better than anything that's ever been on a phone. Do you have links to actual tests?
- dumpsterlid 4y ago
  DACs are essentially a solved problem, the only crap DAC and headphone amp I have found on a device that actually sounds different than any other DAC was on a raspberry pi. Which to be fair they tell you straight up that the audio jack on the raspberry pi sucks. They probably found the one factory in china still bothering to manufacture subpar DACs and amps. Otherwise every other single device with a headphone amp has sounded the same, especially when you factor in normal use of an eq to get your sound system/headphones to sound good. People that say you can tell the difference between audio DACs are letting the placebo effect convince them to support a crap, cottage industry that robs people of their money lol. Now, there are DACs and headphone amps that can put out a LOT more power than other DACs and headphone amps. Yes if you buy headphones that take a lot of power to drive a normal DAC/amp might not be able to drive them but that is an entirely different question than "my DAC just sounds better than yours" snakeoil. Also... hard to drive headphones and speakers are relatively niche and rare. There are PLENTY of """""""audiophile"""""""""" headphones and speakers that are easy to drive.
  - bvrmn 4y ago
    I know that DAC is solved problem. But parent claims external "DA is better than anything that's ever been on a phone".