8 ms·

Google Is Target of European Backlash on U.S. Tech Dominance

28 points by maclaren 12y ago

deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
Mithaldu 12y ago
> “We are afraid of Google,” wrote Mathias Döpfner, chief executive of Axel Springer By quoting him the article has directly made itself extremely suspect, since the publishing house Springer owns the biggest and worst fact- and politics-mangling tabloid in germany, Bild.
- rdjik 12y ago
  Not to mention the irony that is a man powerful enough not only to influence politicians but to seemigly appointment them complaining about some other entity's supposed influence, that entity unsurprisingly being a competitor.
- CurtHagenlocher 12y ago
  I don't know anything about Bild, and only know Springer as the publisher of expensive low-print-run sometimes-poorly-formatted academic books. But isn't this like saying that the Wall Street Journal isn't credible because the same company also publishes the New York Post?
  - Mithaldu 12y ago
    No, it's like saying the Wall Street Journal would be suspect if the same company publishes FOX News, or the Daily Mail. Publications that openly lie, distort and abuse; on a massive scale; to serve their own political slant. Addendum: To clarify how terrible Bild is, consider this website: http://www.bildblog.de/ http://www.bildblog.de/ It is a blog dedicated to pointing out factual mistakes in the Bild publication. They have been running since 2004.
    - alex8022 12y ago
      I'm not sure if this is deliberate or not, but until 2013, the Wall Street Journal and FOX News were owned by the same company.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/News_Corporation http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/News_Corporation
      - Mithaldu 12y ago
        I was not aware of that, but it leads me to ask a question: I have seen first-hand that the thinking of Bild extends to other companies owned by Springer, companies that have nothing to do with what Bild does, like the price comparison portal http://idealo.de http://idealo.de I have seen this in person when i attended job interviews for programming positions at those companies. That is my reason to not give anything or anyone connected to Bild, directly or indirectly, any iota of trust in their honesty. So, what is your reason for giving WSJ any trust?
  - Zigurd 12y ago
    Wrong Springer.
    - CurtHagenlocher 12y ago
      So it is. Thanks for pointing that out!
plesner 12y ago
"Google competitors say: google is bad"
- ghostdiver 12y ago
  lack of competitors for Google is bad
  - spindritf 12y ago
    It is pretty embarassing that we completely rely on Americans for tech. And that's despite larger population and higher density, better Internet connectivity, free higher education in many places... I don't think it's Google's fault though.
    - virmundi 12y ago
      I'm curious why Europe is in such a situation. There seems to be something pathological behind trend. I'm not sure what. I've seen free higher education, or at least heavily subsided education. There is a great safety-net available too in most European countries. These two should make for a greater tech culture, at least abstractly. Now I've worked with Americans and Europeans who had an MS or PhD in CS (full disclosure I started to get a MS, but had to stop because I couldn't do that, a marriage and 60 hrs a week for work). Most couldn't code worth a damn. They could probably discuss abstract CS concepts. They couldn't leverage those to solve a problem. It could be that the higher education is perhaps a hindrance to getting things done? There could be a difference in how the two see failure. America seems to be open to it. Europe seems to be opposed. I think this is reflected in the history of the countries. America wanted the people who felt penned in by their countries hierarchy. Europe wanted those people gone. Perhaps it's a combination of the two that's lead to the European problems. Education is seen as an end in itself, while the environment is such that people are told not to aim to high lest they melt there wings?
      - Mithaldu 12y ago
        The difference? 1. The internet was developed in the USA. 2. Language. The first point simply means that whatever was done with the internet, the USA got the first crack at it. In american TV it's common now to tell people two tweet about the show they're watching, with hash tags on screen and whatnot. In germany, europe's technology powerhouse, it's still extremely common for a person to have never even heard of twitter, if they have internet at all. Further: Anything you do in tech has profits that scale with the audience you can reach. Companies starting out in the USA are able to access all of the USA, all of the UK, and anyone from any other country who has learned one of the most wide-spread languages on the planet; with exactly zero special consideration at any point. Companies in Europe have two choices: Either they build with localization in the product from the start, which is hard, and provide both their local language and english, which also costs more; or they ignore the local market and work entirely in english; or they stick to their own language entirely and ignore the world. In addition to that, due the great employee safety neat, which also means that employees have protection from things like capricious firings, taking risks is more expensive for european companies. Whichever way they go, european companies either have to live with less growth potential, less ability to take risks, or spend more to get the same opportunities as their american counterparts.
bowlofpetunias 12y ago
Yes, we hate them for their freedom. Oh, wait, we're trying to protect our freedom. US tech companies are on a rampage attempting to destroy civil rights, consumer rights and labor rights in Europe. Often openly breaking laws that aren't outdated and in need of "disruption", but very much explicitly exist to prevent what these companies are trying to do. This insanity has got to end at some point. Imagine if a foreign companies started liquor stores across the US that sold alcohol to under 21 year olds, flaunting US law, claiming to be innovative and disruptive, and accusing the US of just trying to protect it's internal market. We've been pretty fucking tolerant of this shit so far, acknowledging that some things may be up for debate. Regulators have mostly limited themselves to diplomatically urging companies to adjust their practices. But it's getting ridiculous. Especially Uber has demonstrated that US companies have absolutely no scruples anymore about launching businesses that openly and deliberately break local laws. This isn't business, it's organized crime.
- jedmeyers 12y ago
  > Imagine if a foreign companies started liquor stores across the US that sold alcohol to under 21 year olds, flaunting US law, claiming to be innovative and disruptive, and accusing the US of just trying to protect it's internal market. We have literally discussed this idea at work last week. Air France should park their Airbuses in some airport and sell wine there to 18-year-olds during their prom nights since the laws of France are in effect aboard a ship.
- yohui 12y ago
  Grouping "US tech companies" together based solely on their place of origin, and tarring them all with the same brush, is naked nationalism.
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]

28 points by maclaren 12y ago

deleted 12y ago

[deleted]

> “We are afraid of Google,” wrote Mathias Döpfner, chief executive of Axel Springer By quoting him the article has directly made itself extremely suspect, since the publishing house Springer owns the biggest and worst fact- and politics-mangling tabloid in germany, Bild.

rdjik 12y ago
Not to mention the irony that is a man powerful enough not only to influence politicians but to seemigly appointment them complaining about some other entity's supposed influence, that entity unsurprisingly being a competitor.
CurtHagenlocher 12y ago
I don't know anything about Bild, and only know Springer as the publisher of expensive low-print-run sometimes-poorly-formatted academic books. But isn't this like saying that the Wall Street Journal isn't credible because the same company also publishes the New York Post?
- Mithaldu 12y ago
  No, it's like saying the Wall Street Journal would be suspect if the same company publishes FOX News, or the Daily Mail. Publications that openly lie, distort and abuse; on a massive scale; to serve their own political slant. Addendum: To clarify how terrible Bild is, consider this website: http://www.bildblog.de/ http://www.bildblog.de/ It is a blog dedicated to pointing out factual mistakes in the Bild publication. They have been running since 2004.
  - alex8022 12y ago
    I'm not sure if this is deliberate or not, but until 2013, the Wall Street Journal and FOX News were owned by the same company.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/News_Corporation http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/News_Corporation
    - Mithaldu 12y ago
      I was not aware of that, but it leads me to ask a question: I have seen first-hand that the thinking of Bild extends to other companies owned by Springer, companies that have nothing to do with what Bild does, like the price comparison portal http://idealo.de http://idealo.de I have seen this in person when i attended job interviews for programming positions at those companies. That is my reason to not give anything or anyone connected to Bild, directly or indirectly, any iota of trust in their honesty. So, what is your reason for giving WSJ any trust?
- Zigurd 12y ago
  Wrong Springer.
  - CurtHagenlocher 12y ago
    So it is. Thanks for pointing that out!

plesner 12y ago

"Google competitors say: google is bad"

ghostdiver 12y ago
lack of competitors for Google is bad
- spindritf 12y ago
  It is pretty embarassing that we completely rely on Americans for tech. And that's despite larger population and higher density, better Internet connectivity, free higher education in many places... I don't think it's Google's fault though.
  - virmundi 12y ago
    I'm curious why Europe is in such a situation. There seems to be something pathological behind trend. I'm not sure what. I've seen free higher education, or at least heavily subsided education. There is a great safety-net available too in most European countries. These two should make for a greater tech culture, at least abstractly. Now I've worked with Americans and Europeans who had an MS or PhD in CS (full disclosure I started to get a MS, but had to stop because I couldn't do that, a marriage and 60 hrs a week for work). Most couldn't code worth a damn. They could probably discuss abstract CS concepts. They couldn't leverage those to solve a problem. It could be that the higher education is perhaps a hindrance to getting things done? There could be a difference in how the two see failure. America seems to be open to it. Europe seems to be opposed. I think this is reflected in the history of the countries. America wanted the people who felt penned in by their countries hierarchy. Europe wanted those people gone. Perhaps it's a combination of the two that's lead to the European problems. Education is seen as an end in itself, while the environment is such that people are told not to aim to high lest they melt there wings?
    - Mithaldu 12y ago
      The difference? 1. The internet was developed in the USA. 2. Language. The first point simply means that whatever was done with the internet, the USA got the first crack at it. In american TV it's common now to tell people two tweet about the show they're watching, with hash tags on screen and whatnot. In germany, europe's technology powerhouse, it's still extremely common for a person to have never even heard of twitter, if they have internet at all. Further: Anything you do in tech has profits that scale with the audience you can reach. Companies starting out in the USA are able to access all of the USA, all of the UK, and anyone from any other country who has learned one of the most wide-spread languages on the planet; with exactly zero special consideration at any point. Companies in Europe have two choices: Either they build with localization in the product from the start, which is hard, and provide both their local language and english, which also costs more; or they ignore the local market and work entirely in english; or they stick to their own language entirely and ignore the world. In addition to that, due the great employee safety neat, which also means that employees have protection from things like capricious firings, taking risks is more expensive for european companies. Whichever way they go, european companies either have to live with less growth potential, less ability to take risks, or spend more to get the same opportunities as their american counterparts.

bowlofpetunias 12y ago

Yes, we hate them for their freedom. Oh, wait, we're trying to protect our freedom. US tech companies are on a rampage attempting to destroy civil rights, consumer rights and labor rights in Europe. Often openly breaking laws that aren't outdated and in need of "disruption", but very much explicitly exist to prevent what these companies are trying to do. This insanity has got to end at some point. Imagine if a foreign companies started liquor stores across the US that sold alcohol to under 21 year olds, flaunting US law, claiming to be innovative and disruptive, and accusing the US of just trying to protect it's internal market. We've been pretty fucking tolerant of this shit so far, acknowledging that some things may be up for debate. Regulators have mostly limited themselves to diplomatically urging companies to adjust their practices. But it's getting ridiculous. Especially Uber has demonstrated that US companies have absolutely no scruples anymore about launching businesses that openly and deliberately break local laws. This isn't business, it's organized crime.

jedmeyers 12y ago
> Imagine if a foreign companies started liquor stores across the US that sold alcohol to under 21 year olds, flaunting US law, claiming to be innovative and disruptive, and accusing the US of just trying to protect it's internal market. We have literally discussed this idea at work last week. Air France should park their Airbuses in some airport and sell wine there to 18-year-olds during their prom nights since the laws of France are in effect aboard a ship.
yohui 12y ago
Grouping "US tech companies" together based solely on their place of origin, and tarring them all with the same brush, is naked nationalism.

deleted 12y ago

[deleted]