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euhm, well. 112 programmer here. There are multiple levels. Cell tower triangulation come in automatically from providers. But they are only in tower numbers. T
by AlexanderYamanu 8mo ago
euhm, well. 112 programmer here. There are multiple levels. Cell tower triangulation come in automatically from providers. But they are only in tower numbers. They might be wrongly entered by engineers, hence the confirming question about where you are. Second is subscription information, as in registered address. Chances are if called from nearby your address, you are at your address. Next is a text to your phone number, which is intercepted by firmware and sends gps coords back. This can be turned off, since implementation.
- IshKebab 8mo ago> This can be turned off, since implementation. Not by users. The new thing is that Apple allows users to disable this feature. Hopefully they still detect emergency calls on the phone and enable it unconditionally for those.
- AlexanderYamanu 8mo agoyeah, there always was. It's a service code, like getting your imei. But it was a weird long one, and manufacturer dependent. Now UI switches are created for it apparantly. Can't find it anywhere on the internet though. I don't work there anymore, so can't look it up.
- jeroenhd 8mo agoI believe they're talking about this feature (https://support.google.com/android/answer/9319337?sjid=18079157704703435596-EU#send_location_automatically https://support.google.com/android/answer/9319337?sjid=18079...). This is a system you can disable as a user, but it's not the on-modem feature discussed in the article.
- jojobas 8mo agoHow would the modem know your coordinates if the OS doesn't provide them?
- retsl 8mo ago> [...] The baseband implements other functionality such as Wi-Fi and GPS functionality [...] https://grapheneos.org/faq https://grapheneos.org/faq It doesn't need to ask the OS, it can just get the coordinates and send them off.
- KellyCriterion 8mo agoNote sure: In my country exactly this feature is used by police & state enforcement to find locatin, because this "ping" message is not forwarded from the modem to the OS, so the OS is not aware of any of these messages
- jeroenhd 8mo agoAmerican carriers have a different protocol than the EU. The EU (and probably EU derived networks) uses a """secret""" SMS format that's opt-in, but the 911 system works differently. The 911 feature can be activated fully remotely, the 112 feature is supposed to only activate when dialing an emergency number.
- yencabulator 8mo agoThe US one is called E911: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced_911 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced_911
- gruez 8mo ago>The 911 feature can be activated fully remotely Source? Even if the phone isn't actively doing a 911 call?
- Havoc 8mo agoGP likely means any 911 call automatically has geo tracing. >The dispatcher's computer receives information from the telephone company about the physical address (for landlines) or geographic coordinates (for wireless) of the caller.
- jeroenhd 8mo agoWikipedia links https://propertyofthepeople.org/document-detail/?doc-id=21088576 https://propertyofthepeople.org/document-detail/?doc-id=2108... as proof that the E911 feature is used by the FBI to track phones. Unfortunately, definitive capabilities and constraints of this kind of cellular technology is hard to come by.
- stavros 8mo agoWait wait, so if I know the "secret" SMS format I can text someone's phone and get their coordinates back?
- defer 8mo agoNo, the SMS is initiated by the device upon calling emergency, not requested by the emergency service. The standard is called AML. The format is not secret either, it's just binary encoded.
- dfc 8mo agoDid you read the article or are you merely responding to the title? The article begins by acknowledging triangulation and then moving on to the point of the article. The article is about commands built into the UMTS and LTE specs for requesting GPS from the device. Your comment seems to be about everything but the main point of the article.
- M95D 8mo agoDid you read the complete comment? > Next is a text to your phone number, which is intercepted by firmware and sends gps coords back.
- dfc 8mo agoYes I saw that and also took it to mean the person didn't read the article. A text to your phone number? The article never mentions SMS. Heck I think the 2g/3g "feature" does not even require the phone to even have a SIM installed. This next sentence also seems to have been written without reading the article: "This can be turned off, since implementation."
- jfyi 8mo agoThe poster is giving information relevant only to the European Union ("112"). They are talking about https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Mobile_Location https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Mobile_Location I believe. I don't think it indicates their article reading either way and wouldn't personally wager a guess. They are just adding their own personal experience to the conversation.
- AlexanderYamanu 8mo agoI have read the article. It's speculative and not a reveal of anything new. All is ITU spec and came down from there. So there is quite some overlap in emergency service short code regions. Another poster mentions 'ping', which is called pinprick for 112, which does work always, but requires authorization to be used. That I can confirm from experience.
- ErroneousBosh 8mo agoDo you use triangulation or GPS? EISEC in the UK only uses GPS, never triangulation.