7 ms·

"At the risk of stating the obvious, the reason Madoff was arrested so quickly is because he confessed to every element of criminal fraud — including both the u

"At the risk of stating the obvious, the reason Madoff was arrested so quickly is because he confessed to every element of criminal fraud — including both the underlying scheme and his criminal intent. This meant that the FBI had both that confession and highly potent, admissible evidence of guilt in the form of testimony from his adult children (who had no apparent axe to grind)." Right, I mean, I'm not saying he's not guilty, but does anyone at this point really understand it deeply enough to file an arrest warrant? I understand the impatience emotionally, but not logically.

HWR_14 4y ago
Also, it's not like he's about to hop in a private jet and evade the jurisdiction. He's constrained in an extradition friendly country. And to the extent it's not extradition friendly (mostly if they want to press charges first), it doesn't help to file an arrest warrant. Speed isn't required here.
sidewndr46 4y ago
Hasn't SBF given long detailed interviews about the activity of FTX & his roles there?
- kasey_junk 4y ago
  Yes but it’s fairly complex and he keeps presenting it as a mistake and a lack of controls. He hasn’t admitted to it as fraud, which is (I’ve heard) hard to prove.
  - pierrebai 4y ago
    Spending your customer deposit that are legally off-limits, and that he said were off-limit, on things like houses, properties, etc for your own self and family is not a straight-up admission of wrong doing? Since when breaking and entering a looting a house can be defended with "well, I thought all was fine"? He admitted numerous times doing things that are straight up illegal.
    - tick_tock_tick 4y ago
      > customer deposit that are legally off-limits Where did you get this impression? Even that part is potentially up for debate. FTX isn't a bank or anything like that and they say that FTX USA is actually still solvent and will payout. I have my doubts about the last one but if he actually pays all US customers back he might get away with this.
    - wmf 4y ago
      Spending your customer deposit that are legally off-limits, and that he said were off-limit, on things like houses, properties, etc for your own self and family This isn't proven. He could have bought those houses with VC money not customer deposits.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
tedunangst 4y ago
Everyone says they know all the facts, but I haven't seen anyone post a draft of what they imagine the indictment will look like to gist or pastebin.
pessimizer 4y ago
I was jailed for sitting on the sidewalk in front of my old high school when I was 18. The police were called on me by the vice-principal, who could see from his office that I was rolling cigarettes, and thought I was rolling joints. The police showed up, realized that the call was bad because it was obviously loose tobacco, and decided to charge me with "criminal trespassing" because it's a charge that the police can press themselves without a complainant (the vice-principal was informed by others what had happened, would have never pressed charges, and was extremely regretful about it afterwards.) I spent the night in jail, and part of the next day, until my family could raise the money to bond me out (money completely lost; a bond, not a bail.) Luckily my uncle knew a bailbondsman personally, because as a loser black punk rocker teenager no other bailbondsman would take our money. If that hadn't happened, I would have spent a week in jail waiting for my hearing. My entire relationship with my public defender took place walking down a hallway towards the courtroom, where he told me that I could take a plea bargain (i.e. plead guilty) in exchange for no time, no fine, no probation, and a removal from my record if I stayed out of any trouble for six months (and of course the opposite if sitting on the sidewalk went so badly for me again.) I took the plea bargain, which required me to admit to the crime and pay court costs. The reason SBF isn't arrested is because the people who would have to order him to be arrested relate to him personally, and coddle people like him as they would wish to be coddled themselves.
- patrec 4y ago
  How would sitting on the side walk in front of a school constitute a criminal trespass?
- dullcrisp 4y ago
  That’s true but what you’re describing is an example of injustice. It would probably be better if everyone were treated like SBF than if everyone were treated like you were.
  - luckylion 4y ago
    Do you believe it's possible that everyone is treated like royalty? And if not, wouldn't it be better if royalty was treated like poor people instead of having a multi-tiered justice system where the fairness of the system depends on your class?
yamtaddle 4y ago
I think part of it's because when a poor person looks vaguely associated with a crime, it's straight to jail. When it's a rich person it's all "well IDK we just can't be sure, can we?"
- savryn 4y ago
  ah so that's why my city is so crime free, I and all the women I know are never hypervigilant taking public transport, I'm never afraid for my elderly relatives to be bashed in the head or pushed onto the tracks by 9 time offenders out on bail, and everyone working exhausting retail hours from cvs to applestore doesn't know why all these totally-prejudiced shoplifting deepfakes go viral I'd be fine with the new surveillance state if it actually delivered some safety-dividends, but i guess lawlessness keeps the working class in line
rpgmaker 4y ago
>but does anyone at this point really understand it deeply enough to file an arrest warrant? That hasn't stopped prosecutors before. This is happening because there is no appetite to go after him, people can take a look at the public record so far and wonder why this might be the case.
- cryptonector 4y ago
  In principle charges are not to be brought unless the prosecutor believes they have enough evidence to win a conviction in court.
ZephyrBlu 4y ago
This is a simple explanation: https://twitter.com/compound248/status/1598446656634191872 https://twitter.com/compound248/status/1598446656634191872

HWR_14 4y ago

Also, it's not like he's about to hop in a private jet and evade the jurisdiction. He's constrained in an extradition friendly country. And to the extent it's not extradition friendly (mostly if they want to press charges first), it doesn't help to file an arrest warrant. Speed isn't required here.

sidewndr46 4y ago

Hasn't SBF given long detailed interviews about the activity of FTX & his roles there?

kasey_junk 4y ago
Yes but it’s fairly complex and he keeps presenting it as a mistake and a lack of controls. He hasn’t admitted to it as fraud, which is (I’ve heard) hard to prove.
- pierrebai 4y ago
  Spending your customer deposit that are legally off-limits, and that he said were off-limit, on things like houses, properties, etc for your own self and family is not a straight-up admission of wrong doing? Since when breaking and entering a looting a house can be defended with "well, I thought all was fine"? He admitted numerous times doing things that are straight up illegal.
  - tick_tock_tick 4y ago
    > customer deposit that are legally off-limits Where did you get this impression? Even that part is potentially up for debate. FTX isn't a bank or anything like that and they say that FTX USA is actually still solvent and will payout. I have my doubts about the last one but if he actually pays all US customers back he might get away with this.
  - wmf 4y ago
    Spending your customer deposit that are legally off-limits, and that he said were off-limit, on things like houses, properties, etc for your own self and family This isn't proven. He could have bought those houses with VC money not customer deposits.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

tedunangst 4y ago

Everyone says they know all the facts, but I haven't seen anyone post a draft of what they imagine the indictment will look like to gist or pastebin.

pessimizer 4y ago

I was jailed for sitting on the sidewalk in front of my old high school when I was 18. The police were called on me by the vice-principal, who could see from his office that I was rolling cigarettes, and thought I was rolling joints. The police showed up, realized that the call was bad because it was obviously loose tobacco, and decided to charge me with "criminal trespassing" because it's a charge that the police can press themselves without a complainant (the vice-principal was informed by others what had happened, would have never pressed charges, and was extremely regretful about it afterwards.) I spent the night in jail, and part of the next day, until my family could raise the money to bond me out (money completely lost; a bond, not a bail.) Luckily my uncle knew a bailbondsman personally, because as a loser black punk rocker teenager no other bailbondsman would take our money. If that hadn't happened, I would have spent a week in jail waiting for my hearing. My entire relationship with my public defender took place walking down a hallway towards the courtroom, where he told me that I could take a plea bargain (i.e. plead guilty) in exchange for no time, no fine, no probation, and a removal from my record if I stayed out of any trouble for six months (and of course the opposite if sitting on the sidewalk went so badly for me again.) I took the plea bargain, which required me to admit to the crime and pay court costs. The reason SBF isn't arrested is because the people who would have to order him to be arrested relate to him personally, and coddle people like him as they would wish to be coddled themselves.

patrec 4y ago
How would sitting on the side walk in front of a school constitute a criminal trespass?
dullcrisp 4y ago
That’s true but what you’re describing is an example of injustice. It would probably be better if everyone were treated like SBF than if everyone were treated like you were.
- luckylion 4y ago
  Do you believe it's possible that everyone is treated like royalty? And if not, wouldn't it be better if royalty was treated like poor people instead of having a multi-tiered justice system where the fairness of the system depends on your class?

yamtaddle 4y ago

I think part of it's because when a poor person looks vaguely associated with a crime, it's straight to jail. When it's a rich person it's all "well IDK we just can't be sure, can we?"

savryn 4y ago
ah so that's why my city is so crime free, I and all the women I know are never hypervigilant taking public transport, I'm never afraid for my elderly relatives to be bashed in the head or pushed onto the tracks by 9 time offenders out on bail, and everyone working exhausting retail hours from cvs to applestore doesn't know why all these totally-prejudiced shoplifting deepfakes go viral I'd be fine with the new surveillance state if it actually delivered some safety-dividends, but i guess lawlessness keeps the working class in line

rpgmaker 4y ago

>but does anyone at this point really understand it deeply enough to file an arrest warrant? That hasn't stopped prosecutors before. This is happening because there is no appetite to go after him, people can take a look at the public record so far and wonder why this might be the case.

cryptonector 4y ago
In principle charges are not to be brought unless the prosecutor believes they have enough evidence to win a conviction in court.

ZephyrBlu 4y ago

This is a simple explanation: https://twitter.com/compound248/status/1598446656634191872 https://twitter.com/compound248/status/1598446656634191872