7 ms·

Fortunately someone had the foresight to make a backup: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32972923 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32972923 Z-library

Fortunately someone had the foresight to make a backup: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32972923 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32972923 Z-library were in it for commercial gain (you could access a certain number of books but to get more you had to pay for a subscription). They started out as a fork of library genesis, whose mission has always been strictly non-commercial and about providing free access to everyone without limits. Hopefully this will encourage more people to go back to the original libgen. I suspect Z-library's popularity was because of a better interface and larger collection, but I think lots of people didn't realize libgen offers all its books/papers for free without limits.

braingenious 4y ago
Well damn, I guess I’ve gotta figure out how to get 30+TB of storage. Does anybody have any suggestions for doing that as cheaply as possible?
- tttttt5ts 4y ago
  Buy 3x 16 or 18 TB external harddrives on black Friday and shuck them. It is still going to run you $400-$500. Can't do it cheaper as far as I know.
  - flaviut 4y ago
    Black Friday isn't always the best time: https://camelcamelcamel.com/product/B08KTRBHP1 https://camelcamelcamel.com/product/B08KTRBHP1 But great advice and the route I've personally taken :)
    - tttttt5ts 4y ago
      Yep, just predictably has some deals. eBay can be a reasonable option too.
    - flutas 4y ago
      Best source I've found is BestBuy with Easystore drives. In fact they have 14TBs for $199.99 right now ($14.28/TB) https://www.bestbuy.com/site/wd-easystore-14tb-external-usb-3-0-hard-drive-black/6425303.p?skuId=6425303 https://www.bestbuy.com/site/wd-easystore-14tb-external-usb-...
  - bl4ckneon 4y ago
    Yep I have done that before to make a 6 bay NAS. Gotta tape over a couple connectors on the sata connector but works great. Datahorders on reddit is a great sub for that sort of stuff. Guides as well as people posting when the deals happen for WD elements (external hdds)
    - mister_tee 4y ago
      not an argument but just an FYI for people reading about that idea for the first time: some NAS enclosures (QNAP, Synology?) and some power supplies can use the drives directly without disabling that 3.3V pin.
      - zaarn 4y ago
        Most enterprise level stuff can (ie, anything that'll go into a rack, the expensive QNAPs/Synos, any supermicro I've encountered, etc.) handle the 3V3 pin issue just fine, in my experience.
- 1ark 4y ago
  4-5 Bay hard drive enclosure (with RAID)?
  - boardwaalk 4y ago
    RAID isn’t cool anymore. Maybe ZFS.
- tuco86 4y ago
  big HDDs are getting cheap. just checked, 16 tb is only 260E by now
- fanick 4y ago
  With obvious limitations you could use backblaze. Back of the napkin calculation this will cost you only $150 per month in storage fees.
- crumpled 4y ago
  If you can't seed the whole collection, just seed a random portion. You can still cherry pick what you like.
- snvzz 4y ago
  IPFS would be a start. Actually, aren't they already using that?
- OmarAssadi 4y ago
  It'll depend on where you live and what your goals are. If you have free-time to tinker and enjoy that kind of thing, you can build something very fast and reliable and prevent e-waste by building your own storage server with used parts on the cheap. If you're in the United States, electricity is cheap enough that you can pick up much older SAS drives for really low $/TB cost and have it be worthwhile. For example, I bought a used Supermicro CSE-836 [1], which is like a 3U server chassis with 16 hot-swappable drive bays and a backplane of some sort. The backplanes vary, but mine came with the BPN-SAS2-836EL1. I paid $300 in total for the chassis itself, backplane, dual power supplies, heatsinks, etc, along with a Supermicro X9DRi-LN4F+ [2] and two Xeon E5 2660 V2s as a bundle from someone in the 'ServeTheHome' classifieds section [3]. From there, I picked up a load of HGST 3TB 7200rpm SAS2 drives on eBay for about $10 each from a recycling company. And then 192GB of DDR3 ECC memory from the same place for about $80. I also grabbed a couple less-than-production-ready 3.84TB U.2 NVMe drives on eBay for a little over $100 each. I think if I were to do it again, I'd have gotten slightly larger, newer drives. These are all totally fine, but I started seeing ~6TB drives for about 3x the cost per terabyte, which would pay itself off quickly with the energy reduction. The other reason is that I ended up going a little overboard; I have about 56x3TB drives right now, which is a lot more than 16, so I needed to get a couple of JBOD expansions to put them in, each of which were like $250 -- if I had gotten fewer, larger drives, I'd have had another $500 to work with & be saving on energy. Another thing I'd have done differently is get fewer but larger sticks of memory. I have a really nice amount of RAM right now, but the energy consumption with 24x8GB isn't worth the upfront savings compared to getting 16 or 32GB DIMMs. All the storage is in OpenZFS on Linux. The 56x3TB drives are configured as 7 RAIDZ2 vdevs, so 2 drives each are for redundancy, and 6 for actual usable storage. This leaves me with a bit over 100TB of usable space. And the 3.84TB U.2 drives are mirrored and act as a "special" device (lol, literally what they are called) [4] to automatically store small blocks and ZFS metadata. I am sure I could have done a bunch better, but, so far, everything has been lightning fast and reliable. I am using ZFSBootMenu [5] as my bootloader. It's cool since it is basically a tiny Linux distro that lives in your EFI and comes with a recent version of ZFS, so you can store your entire OS, including your actual kernel and such in ZFS, and you can enable all sorts of ZFS features that GRUB doesn't support, etc. This is nice because, since the entire OS is living in ZFS, when I take snapshots, it is always of a bootable, working state, and ZFSBootMenu lets me roll-back to a selected snapshot from within the bootloader. The Supermicro board has a slot for a SATA DOM [6], which is sort of like the form fact of an SD card. I picked up the smallest, cheapest one I could on eBay for like $15 and use that to store my bootloader. I did this so that my tiny 128GB SSDs that I use for my OS could be given to ZFS directly for simplicity instead of having to carve out a small boot partition, etc. All in all, I'm probably out about $1750 for >100TB usable, redundant, fast storage, and a decent bit of power for virtualization and whatever else. It costs me like $50ish a month in electricity because of all the drives and DIMMs. But I was already paying 65 euros a month for a 4x8TB server from LeaseWeb to use as a seedbox, and ran out of space, so it's been worth it, even with my dumb decision to use 3TB drives. [1]: <https://www.supermicro.com/en/products/chassis/3u/836/sc836be1c-r1k03b https://www.supermicro.com/en/products/chassis/3u/836/sc836b...> [2]: <https://www.supermicro.com/products/archive/motherboard/x9dri-ln4f_ https://www.supermicro.com/products/archive/motherboard/x9dr...> [3]: <https://forums.servethehome.com/index.php?forums/for-sale-for-trade-want-to-buy.2/ https://forums.servethehome.com/index.php?forums/for-sale-fo...> [4]: <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QI4SnKAP6cQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QI4SnKAP6cQ> [5]: <https://zfsbootmenu.org https://zfsbootmenu.org> [6]: <https://www.supermicro.com/products/nfo/SATADOM.cfm https://www.supermicro.com/products/nfo/SATADOM.cfm> --- Edit: Also, figured it'd be worth mentioning, but the way I got the chassis+motherboard+cpu bundle for such a decent price was by posting my own thread. So, if anyone reading this is broke like me and not finding anything suitable, that is an option. You won't always find exactly what you're looking for if you just browse around. But I've always had good luck explaining my situation, my budget, my goals, and someone tends to have stuff they don't need. eBay seems to be pretty useless right now for the chassises (chasses? chassi? I give up) due to memecoin Chia miners. Forums are your best bet if you don't want to pay scalper rates.
pilimi_anna 4y ago
Holy shit! Did not see this coming, but glad we saved this collection just in time. (I'm Anna, the one who made the backup). We are working on hosting this collection, as well as saving other large collections. Please consider supporting us, donation details at http://pilimi.org http://pilimi.org (we'll set up a patreon-like system soon)
- pilimi_anna 4y ago
  Note that their TOR domains are still up: http://zlibrary24tuxziyiyfr7zd46ytefdqbqd2axkmxm4o5374ptpc52fad.onion/ http://zlibrary24tuxziyiyfr7zd46ytefdqbqd2axkmxm4o5374ptpc52... and http://loginzlib2vrak5zzpcocc3ouizykn6k5qecgj2tzlnab5wcbqhembyd.onion/ http://loginzlib2vrak5zzpcocc3ouizykn6k5qecgj2tzlnab5wcbqhem...
  - luiseduaguil 4y ago
  - lgoex11 4y ago
    They stopped being active.
    - dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
      Still working for me.
  - dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
    Those domains are up, but downloading doesn't work right now, possibly because their CDN uses non-onion domain names. They're timing out.
    - dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
      A work around for PDFs it to select "Open in Browser" from the download popup menu.
    - 4y ago
zozbot234 4y ago
I wonder if there's any worthwhile public domain content in that backup? E.g. stuff published prior to 1925, that's not otherwise findable on the usual services (Gutenberg, IA etc.)
robertwt7 4y ago
when I go to libgen though, link number 2/3 always point to zlib though.. am I on the right libgen? are they connected?
bawolff 4y ago
> Z-library were in it for commercial gain (you could access a certain number of books but to get more you had to pay for a subscription). They started out as a fork of library genesis, whose mission has always been strictly non-commercial and about providing free access to everyone without limits. Ick. I'm sympathetic to piracy, but the moment people start to make money off of pirated works it starts to feel much more wrong.
- flyingsky 4y ago
  > [...] but the moment people start to make money off of pirated works it starts to feel much more wrong. "Piracy" is expensive! Most people do not donate to support these things it's understandable if they decide to charge a few cents or bucks to keep the light on.
  - acomjean 4y ago
    Are you suggesting people who pirate don’t want to pay?
- 1dry 4y ago
  - hdjjhhvvhga 4y ago
    Personally, I use libgen to check if I actually want a given book, and if I do, I buy it (a physical copy, if possible). So, for me, it's a kind of a virtual bookshop.
    - 1dry 4y ago
      That's great of you to buy the book as well, major kudos. I would bet most are not as altruistic as you. Do not traditional libraries and their ebook lending systems, however inconvenient, provide the same service? All one needs to do is be patient until the book you are interested in becomes available. In the meantime, maybe you can check out a different book that is available that you might not have discovered otherwise!
dghlsakjg 4y ago
I'm not so sure there was commercial intent. Their policy was basically around discouraging datahoarders and scrapers as far as I could tell. If I recall correctly, the limit was something like 10 e-books per day per ip address. Not really a huge limit when you consider that there was no limit on file size for things like graphic novels. They never required accounts, and the only thing locked behind a required donation was compute intense tasks like conversion, and send-to-kindle. The kind of bandwidth/storage that they had to be consuming is quite expensive and I don't blame the organizers for soliciting donations.
- yencabulator 4y ago
  > 10 e-books per day per ip address That's a silly policy in a world of shared VPN endpoints and Tor exit nodes.
- ezplorer 4y ago
  You're right. I don't know why there's people repeating that "they have commercial intent" when it's actually not true. That's unfair, ZLib is a really good web
- meltedcapacitor 4y ago
  They used various dark pattern marketing techniques to try and convince people to pay and make the site look like a legit library, so clearly some commercial intent even if it was always possible to download for free (maybe to provide some deniability?).
  - dghlsakjg 4y ago
    I disagree. The only thing approaching a dark pattern is asking you to sign in for advanced features. A free account gets you a bunch of those features. The main page has a single 'donate' link in the upper right corner. A contribution as low $1usd was enough to unlock all features except higher daily download limits. What dark patterns did you see?
    - meltedcapacitor 4y ago
fr4nov 4y ago
lgoex11 4y ago
Z-library has books that Libgen doesn't have... I tested them.
roel_v 4y ago
0 seeders on the few torrents I checked though. I mean, can't blame people for not seeding 350GB+ torrents, but still - if there aren't any seeders, what good are the torrents?
- golem14 4y ago
  [this is not legal advice] Practically speaking, if you are in the US, you could download stuff from zlib and get away with it - I believe that's not illegal. Hosting on the other hand is. Using torrents to download is legally also hosting, albeit some random parts of what you are downloading yourself. So to stay legal in the US, you can't really use torrents. Maybe some enterprising person in Russia or China can become a reseller of hard drives and preload them with chunks of libgen ? I mean, it's sad that the greatest country on earth has a sneakernet gap with Cuba [1]! ;) [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_Paquete_Semanal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_Paquete_Semanal
sansan81 4y ago
nephanth 4y ago
I thought only the domain name was seized though ? Couldn't one make a backup now bu connecting using ip address, or an alternatie DNS server

braingenious 4y ago

Well damn, I guess I’ve gotta figure out how to get 30+TB of storage. Does anybody have any suggestions for doing that as cheaply as possible?

tttttt5ts 4y ago
Buy 3x 16 or 18 TB external harddrives on black Friday and shuck them. It is still going to run you $400-$500. Can't do it cheaper as far as I know.
- flaviut 4y ago
  Black Friday isn't always the best time: https://camelcamelcamel.com/product/B08KTRBHP1 https://camelcamelcamel.com/product/B08KTRBHP1 But great advice and the route I've personally taken :)
  - tttttt5ts 4y ago
    Yep, just predictably has some deals. eBay can be a reasonable option too.
  - flutas 4y ago
    Best source I've found is BestBuy with Easystore drives. In fact they have 14TBs for $199.99 right now ($14.28/TB) https://www.bestbuy.com/site/wd-easystore-14tb-external-usb-3-0-hard-drive-black/6425303.p?skuId=6425303 https://www.bestbuy.com/site/wd-easystore-14tb-external-usb-...
- bl4ckneon 4y ago
  Yep I have done that before to make a 6 bay NAS. Gotta tape over a couple connectors on the sata connector but works great. Datahorders on reddit is a great sub for that sort of stuff. Guides as well as people posting when the deals happen for WD elements (external hdds)
  - mister_tee 4y ago
    not an argument but just an FYI for people reading about that idea for the first time: some NAS enclosures (QNAP, Synology?) and some power supplies can use the drives directly without disabling that 3.3V pin.
    - zaarn 4y ago
      Most enterprise level stuff can (ie, anything that'll go into a rack, the expensive QNAPs/Synos, any supermicro I've encountered, etc.) handle the 3V3 pin issue just fine, in my experience.
1ark 4y ago
4-5 Bay hard drive enclosure (with RAID)?
- boardwaalk 4y ago
  RAID isn’t cool anymore. Maybe ZFS.
tuco86 4y ago
big HDDs are getting cheap. just checked, 16 tb is only 260E by now
fanick 4y ago
With obvious limitations you could use backblaze. Back of the napkin calculation this will cost you only $150 per month in storage fees.
crumpled 4y ago
If you can't seed the whole collection, just seed a random portion. You can still cherry pick what you like.
snvzz 4y ago
IPFS would be a start. Actually, aren't they already using that?
OmarAssadi 4y ago
It'll depend on where you live and what your goals are. If you have free-time to tinker and enjoy that kind of thing, you can build something very fast and reliable and prevent e-waste by building your own storage server with used parts on the cheap. If you're in the United States, electricity is cheap enough that you can pick up much older SAS drives for really low $/TB cost and have it be worthwhile. For example, I bought a used Supermicro CSE-836 [1], which is like a 3U server chassis with 16 hot-swappable drive bays and a backplane of some sort. The backplanes vary, but mine came with the BPN-SAS2-836EL1. I paid $300 in total for the chassis itself, backplane, dual power supplies, heatsinks, etc, along with a Supermicro X9DRi-LN4F+ [2] and two Xeon E5 2660 V2s as a bundle from someone in the 'ServeTheHome' classifieds section [3]. From there, I picked up a load of HGST 3TB 7200rpm SAS2 drives on eBay for about $10 each from a recycling company. And then 192GB of DDR3 ECC memory from the same place for about $80. I also grabbed a couple less-than-production-ready 3.84TB U.2 NVMe drives on eBay for a little over $100 each. I think if I were to do it again, I'd have gotten slightly larger, newer drives. These are all totally fine, but I started seeing ~6TB drives for about 3x the cost per terabyte, which would pay itself off quickly with the energy reduction. The other reason is that I ended up going a little overboard; I have about 56x3TB drives right now, which is a lot more than 16, so I needed to get a couple of JBOD expansions to put them in, each of which were like $250 -- if I had gotten fewer, larger drives, I'd have had another $500 to work with & be saving on energy. Another thing I'd have done differently is get fewer but larger sticks of memory. I have a really nice amount of RAM right now, but the energy consumption with 24x8GB isn't worth the upfront savings compared to getting 16 or 32GB DIMMs. All the storage is in OpenZFS on Linux. The 56x3TB drives are configured as 7 RAIDZ2 vdevs, so 2 drives each are for redundancy, and 6 for actual usable storage. This leaves me with a bit over 100TB of usable space. And the 3.84TB U.2 drives are mirrored and act as a "special" device (lol, literally what they are called) [4] to automatically store small blocks and ZFS metadata. I am sure I could have done a bunch better, but, so far, everything has been lightning fast and reliable. I am using ZFSBootMenu [5] as my bootloader. It's cool since it is basically a tiny Linux distro that lives in your EFI and comes with a recent version of ZFS, so you can store your entire OS, including your actual kernel and such in ZFS, and you can enable all sorts of ZFS features that GRUB doesn't support, etc. This is nice because, since the entire OS is living in ZFS, when I take snapshots, it is always of a bootable, working state, and ZFSBootMenu lets me roll-back to a selected snapshot from within the bootloader. The Supermicro board has a slot for a SATA DOM [6], which is sort of like the form fact of an SD card. I picked up the smallest, cheapest one I could on eBay for like $15 and use that to store my bootloader. I did this so that my tiny 128GB SSDs that I use for my OS could be given to ZFS directly for simplicity instead of having to carve out a small boot partition, etc. All in all, I'm probably out about $1750 for >100TB usable, redundant, fast storage, and a decent bit of power for virtualization and whatever else. It costs me like $50ish a month in electricity because of all the drives and DIMMs. But I was already paying 65 euros a month for a 4x8TB server from LeaseWeb to use as a seedbox, and ran out of space, so it's been worth it, even with my dumb decision to use 3TB drives. [1]: <https://www.supermicro.com/en/products/chassis/3u/836/sc836be1c-r1k03b https://www.supermicro.com/en/products/chassis/3u/836/sc836b...> [2]: <https://www.supermicro.com/products/archive/motherboard/x9dri-ln4f_ https://www.supermicro.com/products/archive/motherboard/x9dr...> [3]: <https://forums.servethehome.com/index.php?forums/for-sale-for-trade-want-to-buy.2/ https://forums.servethehome.com/index.php?forums/for-sale-fo...> [4]: <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QI4SnKAP6cQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QI4SnKAP6cQ> [5]: <https://zfsbootmenu.org https://zfsbootmenu.org> [6]: <https://www.supermicro.com/products/nfo/SATADOM.cfm https://www.supermicro.com/products/nfo/SATADOM.cfm> --- Edit: Also, figured it'd be worth mentioning, but the way I got the chassis+motherboard+cpu bundle for such a decent price was by posting my own thread. So, if anyone reading this is broke like me and not finding anything suitable, that is an option. You won't always find exactly what you're looking for if you just browse around. But I've always had good luck explaining my situation, my budget, my goals, and someone tends to have stuff they don't need. eBay seems to be pretty useless right now for the chassises (chasses? chassi? I give up) due to memecoin Chia miners. Forums are your best bet if you don't want to pay scalper rates.

pilimi_anna 4y ago

Holy shit! Did not see this coming, but glad we saved this collection just in time. (I'm Anna, the one who made the backup). We are working on hosting this collection, as well as saving other large collections. Please consider supporting us, donation details at http://pilimi.org http://pilimi.org (we'll set up a patreon-like system soon)

pilimi_anna 4y ago
Note that their TOR domains are still up: http://zlibrary24tuxziyiyfr7zd46ytefdqbqd2axkmxm4o5374ptpc52fad.onion/ http://zlibrary24tuxziyiyfr7zd46ytefdqbqd2axkmxm4o5374ptpc52... and http://loginzlib2vrak5zzpcocc3ouizykn6k5qecgj2tzlnab5wcbqhembyd.onion/ http://loginzlib2vrak5zzpcocc3ouizykn6k5qecgj2tzlnab5wcbqhem...
- luiseduaguil 4y ago
- lgoex11 4y ago
  They stopped being active.
  - dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
    Still working for me.
- dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
  Those domains are up, but downloading doesn't work right now, possibly because their CDN uses non-onion domain names. They're timing out.
  - dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
    A work around for PDFs it to select "Open in Browser" from the download popup menu.
  - 4y ago

zozbot234 4y ago

I wonder if there's any worthwhile public domain content in that backup? E.g. stuff published prior to 1925, that's not otherwise findable on the usual services (Gutenberg, IA etc.)

robertwt7 4y ago

when I go to libgen though, link number 2/3 always point to zlib though.. am I on the right libgen? are they connected?

bawolff 4y ago

> Z-library were in it for commercial gain (you could access a certain number of books but to get more you had to pay for a subscription). They started out as a fork of library genesis, whose mission has always been strictly non-commercial and about providing free access to everyone without limits. Ick. I'm sympathetic to piracy, but the moment people start to make money off of pirated works it starts to feel much more wrong.

flyingsky 4y ago
> [...] but the moment people start to make money off of pirated works it starts to feel much more wrong. "Piracy" is expensive! Most people do not donate to support these things it's understandable if they decide to charge a few cents or bucks to keep the light on.
- acomjean 4y ago
  Are you suggesting people who pirate don’t want to pay?
1dry 4y ago
- hdjjhhvvhga 4y ago
  Personally, I use libgen to check if I actually want a given book, and if I do, I buy it (a physical copy, if possible). So, for me, it's a kind of a virtual bookshop.
  - 1dry 4y ago
    That's great of you to buy the book as well, major kudos. I would bet most are not as altruistic as you. Do not traditional libraries and their ebook lending systems, however inconvenient, provide the same service? All one needs to do is be patient until the book you are interested in becomes available. In the meantime, maybe you can check out a different book that is available that you might not have discovered otherwise!

dghlsakjg 4y ago

I'm not so sure there was commercial intent. Their policy was basically around discouraging datahoarders and scrapers as far as I could tell. If I recall correctly, the limit was something like 10 e-books per day per ip address. Not really a huge limit when you consider that there was no limit on file size for things like graphic novels. They never required accounts, and the only thing locked behind a required donation was compute intense tasks like conversion, and send-to-kindle. The kind of bandwidth/storage that they had to be consuming is quite expensive and I don't blame the organizers for soliciting donations.

yencabulator 4y ago
> 10 e-books per day per ip address That's a silly policy in a world of shared VPN endpoints and Tor exit nodes.
ezplorer 4y ago
You're right. I don't know why there's people repeating that "they have commercial intent" when it's actually not true. That's unfair, ZLib is a really good web
meltedcapacitor 4y ago
They used various dark pattern marketing techniques to try and convince people to pay and make the site look like a legit library, so clearly some commercial intent even if it was always possible to download for free (maybe to provide some deniability?).
- dghlsakjg 4y ago
  I disagree. The only thing approaching a dark pattern is asking you to sign in for advanced features. A free account gets you a bunch of those features. The main page has a single 'donate' link in the upper right corner. A contribution as low $1usd was enough to unlock all features except higher daily download limits. What dark patterns did you see?
  - meltedcapacitor 4y ago

fr4nov 4y ago

lgoex11 4y ago

Z-library has books that Libgen doesn't have... I tested them.

roel_v 4y ago

0 seeders on the few torrents I checked though. I mean, can't blame people for not seeding 350GB+ torrents, but still - if there aren't any seeders, what good are the torrents?

golem14 4y ago
[this is not legal advice] Practically speaking, if you are in the US, you could download stuff from zlib and get away with it - I believe that's not illegal. Hosting on the other hand is. Using torrents to download is legally also hosting, albeit some random parts of what you are downloading yourself. So to stay legal in the US, you can't really use torrents. Maybe some enterprising person in Russia or China can become a reseller of hard drives and preload them with chunks of libgen ? I mean, it's sad that the greatest country on earth has a sneakernet gap with Cuba [1]! ;) [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_Paquete_Semanal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_Paquete_Semanal

sansan81 4y ago

nephanth 4y ago

I thought only the domain name was seized though ? Couldn't one make a backup now bu connecting using ip address, or an alternatie DNS server