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If you don't want to engage on the offensive side, there is plenty of work on the defensive side of things. * Detect and notify the Ukrainian government about

If you don't want to engage on the offensive side, there is plenty of work on the defensive side of things. * Detect and notify the Ukrainian government about threats or upcoming attacks. * Identify coordinated manipulative behaviour on social media. * Last but not least contact Patreon's management to release the funds that have been donated to Ukrainian veterans (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30461038 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30461038) Feel free to add to the list, as there is going to be a lot of work in the upcoming days.

black_puppydog 5y ago
Sorry but what? * It looks like there won't be a Ukrainian government to speak of in a few days. * Manipulative behaviour has been identified on twitter and Facebook almost every day for the last few years, and it hasn't really led to much anything. The Ukrainian government can't do anything about that, if the independent banana republics of FAANG don't decide to act, nothing is gonna change. * Likewise for patreon. It's a private Company and thus sadly, regrettably, out of reach of public scrutiny or regulation. Thoughts and prayers are free and abundant though! Besides, what is the Ukrainian government gonna do with money right now? I bet tanks and air defense systems have long lead times these days, chip shortage and all. Sorry for the overboarding sarkasm... I guess. But these are my points. Edit: Collecting downvotes for that. Not surprised, but I'm not seeing any counterpoints, really. It's okay if you just need a valve to let off your frustration, have at it, but what the parent suggested seems.... pointless, sorry to be blank. I mean, this sort of soft influence might be useful, but we ("the west") have been proving, on an ongoing basis, for multiple years now, that corporate decisions shall not and will not be questioned by our governments, that essentially an american-based platform has unbridled control over what they want to do, and that if they don't care about trolls and bots and harassment and nationalism andandand then there's not much "we" (read: the government, first of all the US government) can^Wwill do. What is the ukraininan government gonna do with more intel on russian propaganda? What's the actionable on that? Start a war with twitter? As for the first point. Yeah... I don't see the mechanism by which any of this will slow down the physical process of soldiers marching on Kyiv. No NATO state will enter into this conflict, Putin has been pretty openly threatening with nuclear annihilation. And I would doubt that the russian soldiers will be hanging out on twitter enough to really get distracted by some well thought-through anti-propaganda measures.
- glogla 5y ago
  I'm guessing you're getting downvoted for aggresive tone. But you are right that social media networks are strong enablers of evil and helpers to enemies of freedom and democracy. Facebook and Twitter could easily stop (almost) all the misinformation and propaganda, but they don't because it makes them money.
  - thesz 5y ago
    What you consider misinformation and propaganda I may consider valuable vantage points. I also should point that any defense of the freedom of speech also defends freedom of misinformation and propaganda.
    - watwut 5y ago
      > What you consider misinformation and propaganda I may consider valuable vantage points. If they are actual misinformation and propaganda and you are unwilling to even admit existence of that category, then you yourself are threat to freedom - of speech or otherwise. > I also should point that any defense of the freedom of speech also defends freedom of misinformation and propaganda. Nah. Defenders of free speech not being willing to criticize misinformation and propaganda, calling those "valuable vantage points" and being quick to criticize and attempt to shut up criticism of those is what is dangerous for free speech. Pointing out misinformation and propaganda as such is a good thing.
      - thesz 5y ago
        I think I clearly pointed out that there is misinformation and there is propaganda. Yet those are classes of speech. Let me point out that I was answering the call to stop these classes of speech nearly completely, using magic of Twitter and Facebook.
      - glogla 5y ago
        I agree, drowning out normal voices in fake news and bots is as much censorship as banning them outright - it is just a form of censorship that (some) free speech advocates are complicit with. But the biggest issue in my mind is that fake news, misinformation and bot bullying makes social media money, so they are never going to stop it.
gjsman-1000 5y ago
Ukraine VPNs are probably still up - in which case, another way you could serve is by doing analysis and writing documentation on Russia's cyberattack methods, where they come from, patterns in their design, but most importantly, how they may best be prevented or reduced in their effectiveness. Documenting the behavior and collecting intelligence is a difficult skill and intensely valuable even if it is not direct retaliation.
- spockz 5y ago
  I have a limited understanding of large scale networking. Can you explain how using a vpn to an endpoint in the Ukraine allows someone to observe behaviour? I imagine if you are on an isp or IX backbone you could observe flows of packets. But how do you do that from a vpn? Or should they break in to target systems first, shore up the defences, and then document who else tries to break in?
Terry_Roll 5y ago
I wonder if Reuters is trying to create a cyber war much like the BBC has been blasted by some in the UK for sparking Xmas panic buying and the fuel crisis. https://www.express.co.uk/showbiz/tv-radio/1506903/BBC-blasted-fuel-petrol-panic-buying-Christmas-news-latest-update https://www.express.co.uk/showbiz/tv-radio/1506903/BBC-blast... https://www.express.co.uk/showbiz/tv-radio/1497043/BBC-backlash-petrol-shortage-fuel-bbc-breakfast https://www.express.co.uk/showbiz/tv-radio/1497043/BBC-backl...
- midasuni 5y ago
  So let me get this straight, on 27th September it’s the BbC causing panic, despite every petrol forecourt in the country having the print press on display showing these headlines https://www.expressandstar.com/news/uk-news/2021/09/27/what-the-papers-say--september-27/ https://www.expressandstar.com/news/uk-news/2021/09/27/what-... And the government promising the send the army in?
  - Terry_Roll 5y ago
    The BBC broke the news first. Today's media are quite rapid and who knows what's been discussed down the pub the night before. When looking at the 30-40min delays in filling in which was largely concentrated in cities, how many people sat queueing for fuel were considering an electric car? And then those filling up were limited to £20 or £30 of fuel so they experienced the same range anxiety as someone with an electric car. Sometimes its not the message that is important, its the resulting changes that are more important. So the fuel crisis created an uptick in electric vehicle sales. Its not just Govt discounts for new tech like solar cells that cause a change in behaviour, other entities can also take advantage of situations, or just be manipulated into reporting it. Take the chip shortage and the Ukraine crisis when thinking of Ukraine being the largest Neon producer and its relevance to the chip supply chain. Neon production is a global supply change risk at the moment so events are making changes occur. Bosch is now fabricating their own chips albeit 300mm https://techcrunch.com/2021/06/07/bosch-opens-1-2-billion-chip-plant-in-germany/ https://techcrunch.com/2021/06/07/bosch-opens-1-2-billion-ch... and Intel have also announced a new chip fab in Germany. https://siliconangle.com/2021/12/23/report-intel-build-new-chip-fab-sites-germany-france-italy/ https://siliconangle.com/2021/12/23/report-intel-build-new-c... So Russia going into secure Ukraine and thus Neon means the EU & US get a stick poked into their bike wheel! Nothing is ever what it seems!
unconed 5y ago
>Identify coordinated manipulative behaviour on social media. You mean the Russian propaganda, or the West's propaganda? Seriously, two years after "two weeks to flatten the curve" everyone is at it _again_ and it's embarrasing.
agumonkey 5y ago
Also preemptive detection of flaws in their own safety.

black_puppydog 5y ago

Sorry but what? * It looks like there won't be a Ukrainian government to speak of in a few days. * Manipulative behaviour has been identified on twitter and Facebook almost every day for the last few years, and it hasn't really led to much anything. The Ukrainian government can't do anything about that, if the independent banana republics of FAANG don't decide to act, nothing is gonna change. * Likewise for patreon. It's a private Company and thus sadly, regrettably, out of reach of public scrutiny or regulation. Thoughts and prayers are free and abundant though! Besides, what is the Ukrainian government gonna do with money right now? I bet tanks and air defense systems have long lead times these days, chip shortage and all. Sorry for the overboarding sarkasm... I guess. But these are my points. Edit: Collecting downvotes for that. Not surprised, but I'm not seeing any counterpoints, really. It's okay if you just need a valve to let off your frustration, have at it, but what the parent suggested seems.... pointless, sorry to be blank. I mean, this sort of soft influence might be useful, but we ("the west") have been proving, on an ongoing basis, for multiple years now, that corporate decisions shall not and will not be questioned by our governments, that essentially an american-based platform has unbridled control over what they want to do, and that if they don't care about trolls and bots and harassment and nationalism andandand then there's not much "we" (read: the government, first of all the US government) can^Wwill do. What is the ukraininan government gonna do with more intel on russian propaganda? What's the actionable on that? Start a war with twitter? As for the first point. Yeah... I don't see the mechanism by which any of this will slow down the physical process of soldiers marching on Kyiv. No NATO state will enter into this conflict, Putin has been pretty openly threatening with nuclear annihilation. And I would doubt that the russian soldiers will be hanging out on twitter enough to really get distracted by some well thought-through anti-propaganda measures.

glogla 5y ago
I'm guessing you're getting downvoted for aggresive tone. But you are right that social media networks are strong enablers of evil and helpers to enemies of freedom and democracy. Facebook and Twitter could easily stop (almost) all the misinformation and propaganda, but they don't because it makes them money.
- thesz 5y ago
  What you consider misinformation and propaganda I may consider valuable vantage points. I also should point that any defense of the freedom of speech also defends freedom of misinformation and propaganda.
  - watwut 5y ago
    > What you consider misinformation and propaganda I may consider valuable vantage points. If they are actual misinformation and propaganda and you are unwilling to even admit existence of that category, then you yourself are threat to freedom - of speech or otherwise. > I also should point that any defense of the freedom of speech also defends freedom of misinformation and propaganda. Nah. Defenders of free speech not being willing to criticize misinformation and propaganda, calling those "valuable vantage points" and being quick to criticize and attempt to shut up criticism of those is what is dangerous for free speech. Pointing out misinformation and propaganda as such is a good thing.
    - thesz 5y ago
      I think I clearly pointed out that there is misinformation and there is propaganda. Yet those are classes of speech. Let me point out that I was answering the call to stop these classes of speech nearly completely, using magic of Twitter and Facebook.
    - glogla 5y ago
      I agree, drowning out normal voices in fake news and bots is as much censorship as banning them outright - it is just a form of censorship that (some) free speech advocates are complicit with. But the biggest issue in my mind is that fake news, misinformation and bot bullying makes social media money, so they are never going to stop it.

gjsman-1000 5y ago

Ukraine VPNs are probably still up - in which case, another way you could serve is by doing analysis and writing documentation on Russia's cyberattack methods, where they come from, patterns in their design, but most importantly, how they may best be prevented or reduced in their effectiveness. Documenting the behavior and collecting intelligence is a difficult skill and intensely valuable even if it is not direct retaliation.

spockz 5y ago
I have a limited understanding of large scale networking. Can you explain how using a vpn to an endpoint in the Ukraine allows someone to observe behaviour? I imagine if you are on an isp or IX backbone you could observe flows of packets. But how do you do that from a vpn? Or should they break in to target systems first, shore up the defences, and then document who else tries to break in?

Terry_Roll 5y ago

I wonder if Reuters is trying to create a cyber war much like the BBC has been blasted by some in the UK for sparking Xmas panic buying and the fuel crisis. https://www.express.co.uk/showbiz/tv-radio/1506903/BBC-blasted-fuel-petrol-panic-buying-Christmas-news-latest-update https://www.express.co.uk/showbiz/tv-radio/1506903/BBC-blast... https://www.express.co.uk/showbiz/tv-radio/1497043/BBC-backlash-petrol-shortage-fuel-bbc-breakfast https://www.express.co.uk/showbiz/tv-radio/1497043/BBC-backl...

midasuni 5y ago
So let me get this straight, on 27th September it’s the BbC causing panic, despite every petrol forecourt in the country having the print press on display showing these headlines https://www.expressandstar.com/news/uk-news/2021/09/27/what-the-papers-say--september-27/ https://www.expressandstar.com/news/uk-news/2021/09/27/what-... And the government promising the send the army in?
- Terry_Roll 5y ago
  The BBC broke the news first. Today's media are quite rapid and who knows what's been discussed down the pub the night before. When looking at the 30-40min delays in filling in which was largely concentrated in cities, how many people sat queueing for fuel were considering an electric car? And then those filling up were limited to £20 or £30 of fuel so they experienced the same range anxiety as someone with an electric car. Sometimes its not the message that is important, its the resulting changes that are more important. So the fuel crisis created an uptick in electric vehicle sales. Its not just Govt discounts for new tech like solar cells that cause a change in behaviour, other entities can also take advantage of situations, or just be manipulated into reporting it. Take the chip shortage and the Ukraine crisis when thinking of Ukraine being the largest Neon producer and its relevance to the chip supply chain. Neon production is a global supply change risk at the moment so events are making changes occur. Bosch is now fabricating their own chips albeit 300mm https://techcrunch.com/2021/06/07/bosch-opens-1-2-billion-chip-plant-in-germany/ https://techcrunch.com/2021/06/07/bosch-opens-1-2-billion-ch... and Intel have also announced a new chip fab in Germany. https://siliconangle.com/2021/12/23/report-intel-build-new-chip-fab-sites-germany-france-italy/ https://siliconangle.com/2021/12/23/report-intel-build-new-c... So Russia going into secure Ukraine and thus Neon means the EU & US get a stick poked into their bike wheel! Nothing is ever what it seems!

unconed 5y ago

>Identify coordinated manipulative behaviour on social media. You mean the Russian propaganda, or the West's propaganda? Seriously, two years after "two weeks to flatten the curve" everyone is at it _again_ and it's embarrasing.

agumonkey 5y ago

Also preemptive detection of flaws in their own safety.