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I have this saved in my notes. Forgot from where I saved it from, but it’s so accurate: "I work in the cyber security industry, and I can tell you over the yea

I have this saved in my notes. Forgot from where I saved it from, but it’s so accurate: "I work in the cyber security industry, and I can tell you over the years, I've seen kids - including my own - do things that first-world government teams and crack white hat groups could not have done any better. Give up now. There is no app, no operating system, no proxy, scanner or firewall, and no setting that will ever defeat a determined kid. Plus, they work in groups, and are able to coordinate even better than their adult counterparts to find and disseminate new hacks. It's an arms race that cannot be won with technology. You find a setting, they find a workaround. Apple updates, they find a new weakness. Take their phones. Put them in a box. Sit on the box and guard it. Maybe buy a Faraday bag or something. Watch them cry and talk about how they'll be social outcasts and their friends will mock them, or moan about how they need it for school to check the Facebook page their teacher posts assignments to. Turn a deaf ear. Know that you are helping them just like our parents were when they made us eat vegetables (which you know, are actually pretty darned good - thanks, Mom). "

sharemywin 5y ago
don't forget threats of suicide.
reayn 5y ago
While I agree with the sentiment that a determined kid would go to just about any length to get something, even if that something is bad for him, I will have to give a hard "no" to what you said afterwards. Pointlessly denying a child what he deems to be a necessity in his modern life without giving valid reasoning is a terrible idea and will just make the kid despise his parents. A much better tactic, and one that I see neglected far too often is to instill the reasoning into the kids from a young age, don't bar them from what's bad from them, teach them that why and how it's bad so they themselves keep a distance. My parents did his very effectively with me and my siblings, and we, despite our age and frequent exposure to such things, naturally gravitate away from obsession. And this isn't just a niche case, there are many people, even in my generation, who are waking up to the reality and behaving in a similar manner, although it's hard to get that fact out there with all the stigma surrounding basically any teenager nowadays. And saying that this strategy "doesn't work" or is "too hard" is usually just cope for parents with poor skills in my experience. >Watch them cry and talk about how they'll be social outcasts and their friends will mock them, or moan about how they need it for school to check the Facebook page their teacher posts assignments to. I genuinely can't tell if this is some sort of meta-ironic take but no, just no. The vast majority of even elementary school childrens' lives are being moved online slowly but surely, and whether you like it or not they are going to have to pull out that laptop or phone for hours a day, can you sit and watch them for that entire time?
- Prestoon 5y ago
  I'm sure that works for a certain demographic, but on the other hand for a lot of kids after a certain point the advice provided by the parent falls on deaf ears. They have to make mistakes and suffer the consequences of them before they ever truly learn from them. You're not dealing with a rational adult, for many of them I'm sure it's more or less "there goes mom, lecturing me again." and at this period in their lives they're just about to begin their ascent into puberty, one of the most transformative periods that involves a lot of rebellion and a lot of risky behavior. Kids need to see that there's consequences to their actions and if their parents can provide that in a controlled environment, I don't think its poor skills. I think it's being ahead of the curve. Setting the expectation for not only what they might run into out there, but what to expect when they get home. If anything you should combine the two approaches.
  - reayn 5y ago
    Yes, this, 100% agreed. Having the kids learn on their own and experience things (and their consequences) firsthand is the right way to do things, I didn't get that far in my comment but yours sums it up fantastically. The parent comments' take of just brainlessly shielding them from everything is the absolute worst thing you can do in such a scenario.
  - grvdrm 5y ago
    >I think it's being ahead of the curve. Setting the expectation for not only what they might run into out there, but what to expect when they get home. If anything you should combine the two approaches. Wholeheartedly agree with this. Well said. I think you see this in kids of almost any age. Saying no can backfire. I do my best with my own kids to explain why I'm allowing or disallowing something, and find it works better than hard and fast restrictions. My hope is to translate this frequent conversation into the same conversation when they're older, opinionated, and rebellious. It will not work perfectly, but I think that a lifetime of deliver no answers won't work in my favor.
  - ashtonkem 5y ago
    > They have to make mistakes and suffer the consequences of them before they ever truly learn from them. This seems to be a good strategy for things with obvious and immediate consequences. Eat too much ice cream, feel sick, etc. It seems like social media seems to have a much more slow burning, pernicious impact on your quality of life. Adults struggle to accurately diagnose this, expecting a child to do so seems unwise.
lindwhi 5y ago
Yes, determine kids will much likely find a way to find a workaround, especially if it is something that they want to do.
- elpakal 5y ago
  100% agree because I was once that kid. Now I have them
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
tomjen3 5y ago
Then watch them go behind your back and use the internet with their friends.
- mixmastamyk 5y ago
  As long as it isn't 8 hours a day, and someone else is bearing the brunt of the surveillance. That's not as big a problem.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
Kiro 5y ago
First two paragraphs - amazing. Gives me hope for future generations! Last paragraph - what? Why would I want to stifle this?
- micromacrofoot 5y ago
  Because kids are sometimes capable of getting themselves in more trouble than they realize, and this can have long-term consequences beyond childhood.
- boppo 5y ago
  I'm 29 and struggle with attention, procrastination, brain fog, and depression. I have since I was 12. It's only lately that I'm realizing that it's almost certainly connected to my usage of internet forums/stimulation (SA, 4chan, Gamefaqs, stumbleupon, etc.) which started right around that same time. There's something wrong with me and there really are no other explanations than my compulsive internet usage.
  - heartbreak 5y ago
    I’m no internet psychologist, but the underlying issue is probably what drove you to those sites in the first place. Does your therapist agree with you?
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
sandworm101 5y ago
>> Watch them cry and talk about how they'll be social outcasts Until they are. Parent always think that society is the same as it was when they were kids. They think kids can socialize the same way they did in the 80s/90s. That just isn't true anymore. Kids aren't allowed to hang out at malls. Kids don't go to parties. Kids don't listen to CDs with their friends nor get together to play video games in a friend's basement. They don't have cool part time jobs at pizza joints. Kids hang out online. They listen to music online. They work/live/play online. Trying to recreate some 80s nostalgia version of teenage social circles will end in failure every time. Those that don't learn how to exist online will be the ones a step behind their peers at every turn.
- mattgreenrocks 5y ago
  > Those that don't learn how to exist online will be the ones a step behind their peers at every turn. Worse, they may end up with actual personalities and interests other than scrolling their phone!
- codingdave 5y ago
  That may be too far the other direction. My teens do hang out at malls, just hang out with friends and listen to music. They do have parties, they have jobs. They do many of the things we did. They also do text between all those things, and coordinate which parents is driving which kids where and when in the process. It is different, yes. But today's teens are not just sitting in their rooms to be online together. Honestly, they seem fairly similar to how we were, but they have replaced phone calls with apps.
- honkdaddy 5y ago
  Teens still hang out. Every single weekend night in the summer in my hometown, a hundred plus teens flock to the “pier”, park their cars and bikes, and do what teens do best. Vape, drink, and loudly carry on. It really doesn’t seem all that different from the teen hangouts of the 80s/90s lore, except juuls have replaced cigarettes I suppose.
- mixmastamyk 5y ago
  Great recipe to "get ahead" at being a maladjusted-borderline-suicidal-anorexic with poor social and zero survival skills. Thanks helicopter parents!
dotancohen 5y ago
> I've seen kids - including my own - do things that > first-world government teams and crack white hat > groups could not have done any better. My highest-voted Stack Exchange Group answer is an anecdote about kids solving a tech problem that I was unable to solve: https://superuser.com/a/1063708/93684 https://superuser.com/a/1063708/93684
comeonseriously 5y ago
> Turn a deaf ear. Nope. Always keep that line of communication open. Always.
- steve_adams_86 5y ago
  Absolutely, there's no other way to build your relationship and their trust in you as a parent. And that goes several ways - are you sure your decisions are correct and therefor should be trusted? Do you know with absolute certainty that your child understands your decisions? Have you heard them out on the matter? Is there room for a compromise, and are you showing your child a reasonable degree of trust in return? Without any of this, I don't see how it's a success. Your kids won't learn these strategies without seeing them. It leaves a lot of room for resentment. It seems very dysfunctional. My kids like when I talk to them about this stuff, even if they disagree. They like to hear my anecdotes about being a dumb kid. Knowing I'm human, that my parents made mistakes, that I made mistakes, I still do - they like knowing the lines are open and I'm not a brick wall.
watwut 5y ago
Lol, no. First, many many many kids are very clueless about technology and computers. Some kids will figure these or will be shown them by older siblings. And some other kids in their network will learn about these. But generally, majority of kids by themselves cant figure these at all. To add to it, many kids dont really have access to computer and all they know are phones and tablets. Consequently, they struggle with very basics. Second, it is also not true that all the kids would be constantly trying to go out of bounds. There are many kids who are smart and actually don't want to break rules, fear breaking them or just simply wont go out of way to make adults angry.
spansoa 5y ago
Agreed. Leave a kid with a locked device, and with enough poking around, it will be unlocked. They will exhaust every possible route, and seek the most optimal solution to any restrictions.
- mixmastamyk 5y ago
  Modern security is pretty good. If the kid can leverage CVEs, well, I'm less worried.
el_nahual 5y ago
> Take their phones. Put them in a box. Sit on the box and guard it. Maybe buy a Faraday bag or something. A family member tried this. The kid's bicycle was stolen (no it wasn't, the kid traded it for a "secret" phone he used during no-phone hours). This reinforces the "Give up now" point. You won't control access for your kids, but you can try to give them better emotional tools to cope with the world they live in.
- mixmastamyk 5y ago
  Innovative thinking, I like it. What about internet access, which generally requires a credit card? Moreover, if the kid has many hours alone outside schoolwork, clubs, or sports, there is something wrong. There's a reason why after-school programs were invented over a century ago.
balls187 5y ago
> Know that you are helping them just like our parents were when they made us eat vegetables (which you know, are actually pretty darned good - thanks, Mom). " "Eat your vegetables" is hardly the right analogous situation to cellphone use. I can't imagine what my life would be like if my parents instead decided not to buy a PC (circa 1994), nor have the internet because of all the bad things that a child could be exposed to via the internet.
- mixmastamyk 5y ago
  Social media surveillance != PC literacy. http://coding2learn.org/blog/2013/07/29/kids-cant-use-computers/ http://coding2learn.org/blog/2013/07/29/kids-cant-use-comput...
  - balls187 5y ago
    Exactly. Prohibiting access to smart phones to prevent social media surveillance is like prohibiting access to computers to prevent accessing pornography.
    - mixmastamyk 5y ago
      In your metaphor, the bad actors are inverted. Few here are arguing for prohibition as well.
      - balls187 5y ago
        Except the commenter I quoted and directly replied too...
nemothekid 5y ago
>Watch them cry and talk about how they'll be social outcasts and their friends will mock them I don't see how potentially making your child a social outcast is healthier than just fucking talking to them. It's strange how an entire generation that grew up on goatse, single click hardcore porn, and generally unadulterated internet access have become the very luddites they used to make fun of on phpBB forums. An incredible amount of socialization happens online today. Even if you believe that they will form "real" connections with "real" people, only the most determined of hormone raged boys will overcome the friction to include them. Secondly, the failure to actually communicate the problems of social media and resorting to lockdown is essentially sex education through abstinence. It demonstrably doesn't work. I imagine there's a middle ground between 16 hours of Roblox every day and 0 hours of any internet access. Apps, proxies and firewalls aren't an adequate replacement to communication.
fsflover 5y ago
Can you kid hack Qubes OS?
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
ineedasername 5y ago
nothing will ever defeat a determined X from doing Y I hate when this line of thinking is marched out in defense of an all/nothing approach-- The idea that you don't have a perfect solution, so you shouldn't even bother trying to implement something less than perfect. There's no reason not to do something that discourages bad activity just because it won't be perfect. With kids especially, they may find a way around a restriction, but that doesn't mean they will always avoid detection (though sometimes they will) And in those cases it also provides a good parenting opportunity to teach lessons on consequences for the decisions made. At a minimum, you can't simply fail to set reasonable limits just because they may not be followed. An understanding of such limits, if not a full appreciation of them, it pretty critical. And a total lock-down approach of "no X ever ever" is fairly likely to catalyze into a backlash much worse than trying to work with your kids on appropriate limits and then monitory things as they go.
oriki 5y ago
You can't socially outcast your kid like that. Seriously, any problems you thought they'd have because of Instagram are nothing in comparison to being a social outcast that never develops skills for making friends and forming relationships because their parents felt the need to kneecap that communication method which is so modern. Teach your kid about the dangers. Use the systems in place (ie Screen Time on iOS) to help shape the way they use the technology, and be open and honest about what worries you. If your strategy for helping the kid is predicated on "I told you so"s, I may have found the reason why they keep breaking security systems.
- JoeAltmaier 5y ago
  Wow, now not using Instagram is child abuse? That's a reach by anybody's standard. Not being in the 'in crowd' is not crippling. It will not result in stunted social skills.
  - detaro 5y ago
    The GP didn't advocate for "don't let your kids use instagram".
CamperBob2 5y ago
Also, I've heard that Kevin Mitnick can start a nuclear war by whistling into a payphone. Better lock him up without trial, just to be safe.
kova12 5y ago
I have a feeling it's not the determined smart kids that this app targets as a primary product...
908B64B197 5y ago
> Watch them cry and talk about how they'll be social outcasts and their friends will mock them I hope you are at least sending them to a private school that's low tech as well. If not, then yeah, you're probably creating social pariah. They won't be bullied or mocked, just, left out... hopefully.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

sharemywin 5y ago

don't forget threats of suicide.

reayn 5y ago

While I agree with the sentiment that a determined kid would go to just about any length to get something, even if that something is bad for him, I will have to give a hard "no" to what you said afterwards. Pointlessly denying a child what he deems to be a necessity in his modern life without giving valid reasoning is a terrible idea and will just make the kid despise his parents. A much better tactic, and one that I see neglected far too often is to instill the reasoning into the kids from a young age, don't bar them from what's bad from them, teach them that why and how it's bad so they themselves keep a distance. My parents did his very effectively with me and my siblings, and we, despite our age and frequent exposure to such things, naturally gravitate away from obsession. And this isn't just a niche case, there are many people, even in my generation, who are waking up to the reality and behaving in a similar manner, although it's hard to get that fact out there with all the stigma surrounding basically any teenager nowadays. And saying that this strategy "doesn't work" or is "too hard" is usually just cope for parents with poor skills in my experience. >Watch them cry and talk about how they'll be social outcasts and their friends will mock them, or moan about how they need it for school to check the Facebook page their teacher posts assignments to. I genuinely can't tell if this is some sort of meta-ironic take but no, just no. The vast majority of even elementary school childrens' lives are being moved online slowly but surely, and whether you like it or not they are going to have to pull out that laptop or phone for hours a day, can you sit and watch them for that entire time?

Prestoon 5y ago
I'm sure that works for a certain demographic, but on the other hand for a lot of kids after a certain point the advice provided by the parent falls on deaf ears. They have to make mistakes and suffer the consequences of them before they ever truly learn from them. You're not dealing with a rational adult, for many of them I'm sure it's more or less "there goes mom, lecturing me again." and at this period in their lives they're just about to begin their ascent into puberty, one of the most transformative periods that involves a lot of rebellion and a lot of risky behavior. Kids need to see that there's consequences to their actions and if their parents can provide that in a controlled environment, I don't think its poor skills. I think it's being ahead of the curve. Setting the expectation for not only what they might run into out there, but what to expect when they get home. If anything you should combine the two approaches.
- reayn 5y ago
  Yes, this, 100% agreed. Having the kids learn on their own and experience things (and their consequences) firsthand is the right way to do things, I didn't get that far in my comment but yours sums it up fantastically. The parent comments' take of just brainlessly shielding them from everything is the absolute worst thing you can do in such a scenario.
- grvdrm 5y ago
  >I think it's being ahead of the curve. Setting the expectation for not only what they might run into out there, but what to expect when they get home. If anything you should combine the two approaches. Wholeheartedly agree with this. Well said. I think you see this in kids of almost any age. Saying no can backfire. I do my best with my own kids to explain why I'm allowing or disallowing something, and find it works better than hard and fast restrictions. My hope is to translate this frequent conversation into the same conversation when they're older, opinionated, and rebellious. It will not work perfectly, but I think that a lifetime of deliver no answers won't work in my favor.
- ashtonkem 5y ago
  > They have to make mistakes and suffer the consequences of them before they ever truly learn from them. This seems to be a good strategy for things with obvious and immediate consequences. Eat too much ice cream, feel sick, etc. It seems like social media seems to have a much more slow burning, pernicious impact on your quality of life. Adults struggle to accurately diagnose this, expecting a child to do so seems unwise.

lindwhi 5y ago

Yes, determine kids will much likely find a way to find a workaround, especially if it is something that they want to do.

elpakal 5y ago
100% agree because I was once that kid. Now I have them

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

tomjen3 5y ago

Then watch them go behind your back and use the internet with their friends.

mixmastamyk 5y ago
As long as it isn't 8 hours a day, and someone else is bearing the brunt of the surveillance. That's not as big a problem.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

Kiro 5y ago

First two paragraphs - amazing. Gives me hope for future generations! Last paragraph - what? Why would I want to stifle this?

micromacrofoot 5y ago
Because kids are sometimes capable of getting themselves in more trouble than they realize, and this can have long-term consequences beyond childhood.
boppo 5y ago
I'm 29 and struggle with attention, procrastination, brain fog, and depression. I have since I was 12. It's only lately that I'm realizing that it's almost certainly connected to my usage of internet forums/stimulation (SA, 4chan, Gamefaqs, stumbleupon, etc.) which started right around that same time. There's something wrong with me and there really are no other explanations than my compulsive internet usage.
- heartbreak 5y ago
  I’m no internet psychologist, but the underlying issue is probably what drove you to those sites in the first place. Does your therapist agree with you?

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

sandworm101 5y ago

>> Watch them cry and talk about how they'll be social outcasts Until they are. Parent always think that society is the same as it was when they were kids. They think kids can socialize the same way they did in the 80s/90s. That just isn't true anymore. Kids aren't allowed to hang out at malls. Kids don't go to parties. Kids don't listen to CDs with their friends nor get together to play video games in a friend's basement. They don't have cool part time jobs at pizza joints. Kids hang out online. They listen to music online. They work/live/play online. Trying to recreate some 80s nostalgia version of teenage social circles will end in failure every time. Those that don't learn how to exist online will be the ones a step behind their peers at every turn.

mattgreenrocks 5y ago
> Those that don't learn how to exist online will be the ones a step behind their peers at every turn. Worse, they may end up with actual personalities and interests other than scrolling their phone!
codingdave 5y ago
That may be too far the other direction. My teens do hang out at malls, just hang out with friends and listen to music. They do have parties, they have jobs. They do many of the things we did. They also do text between all those things, and coordinate which parents is driving which kids where and when in the process. It is different, yes. But today's teens are not just sitting in their rooms to be online together. Honestly, they seem fairly similar to how we were, but they have replaced phone calls with apps.
honkdaddy 5y ago
Teens still hang out. Every single weekend night in the summer in my hometown, a hundred plus teens flock to the “pier”, park their cars and bikes, and do what teens do best. Vape, drink, and loudly carry on. It really doesn’t seem all that different from the teen hangouts of the 80s/90s lore, except juuls have replaced cigarettes I suppose.
mixmastamyk 5y ago
Great recipe to "get ahead" at being a maladjusted-borderline-suicidal-anorexic with poor social and zero survival skills. Thanks helicopter parents!

dotancohen 5y ago

> I've seen kids - including my own - do things that > first-world government teams and crack white hat > groups could not have done any better. My highest-voted Stack Exchange Group answer is an anecdote about kids solving a tech problem that I was unable to solve: https://superuser.com/a/1063708/93684 https://superuser.com/a/1063708/93684

comeonseriously 5y ago

> Turn a deaf ear. Nope. Always keep that line of communication open. Always.

steve_adams_86 5y ago
Absolutely, there's no other way to build your relationship and their trust in you as a parent. And that goes several ways - are you sure your decisions are correct and therefor should be trusted? Do you know with absolute certainty that your child understands your decisions? Have you heard them out on the matter? Is there room for a compromise, and are you showing your child a reasonable degree of trust in return? Without any of this, I don't see how it's a success. Your kids won't learn these strategies without seeing them. It leaves a lot of room for resentment. It seems very dysfunctional. My kids like when I talk to them about this stuff, even if they disagree. They like to hear my anecdotes about being a dumb kid. Knowing I'm human, that my parents made mistakes, that I made mistakes, I still do - they like knowing the lines are open and I'm not a brick wall.

watwut 5y ago

Lol, no. First, many many many kids are very clueless about technology and computers. Some kids will figure these or will be shown them by older siblings. And some other kids in their network will learn about these. But generally, majority of kids by themselves cant figure these at all. To add to it, many kids dont really have access to computer and all they know are phones and tablets. Consequently, they struggle with very basics. Second, it is also not true that all the kids would be constantly trying to go out of bounds. There are many kids who are smart and actually don't want to break rules, fear breaking them or just simply wont go out of way to make adults angry.

spansoa 5y ago

Agreed. Leave a kid with a locked device, and with enough poking around, it will be unlocked. They will exhaust every possible route, and seek the most optimal solution to any restrictions.

mixmastamyk 5y ago
Modern security is pretty good. If the kid can leverage CVEs, well, I'm less worried.

el_nahual 5y ago

> Take their phones. Put them in a box. Sit on the box and guard it. Maybe buy a Faraday bag or something. A family member tried this. The kid's bicycle was stolen (no it wasn't, the kid traded it for a "secret" phone he used during no-phone hours). This reinforces the "Give up now" point. You won't control access for your kids, but you can try to give them better emotional tools to cope with the world they live in.

mixmastamyk 5y ago
Innovative thinking, I like it. What about internet access, which generally requires a credit card? Moreover, if the kid has many hours alone outside schoolwork, clubs, or sports, there is something wrong. There's a reason why after-school programs were invented over a century ago.

balls187 5y ago

> Know that you are helping them just like our parents were when they made us eat vegetables (which you know, are actually pretty darned good - thanks, Mom). " "Eat your vegetables" is hardly the right analogous situation to cellphone use. I can't imagine what my life would be like if my parents instead decided not to buy a PC (circa 1994), nor have the internet because of all the bad things that a child could be exposed to via the internet.

mixmastamyk 5y ago
Social media surveillance != PC literacy. http://coding2learn.org/blog/2013/07/29/kids-cant-use-computers/ http://coding2learn.org/blog/2013/07/29/kids-cant-use-comput...
- balls187 5y ago
  Exactly. Prohibiting access to smart phones to prevent social media surveillance is like prohibiting access to computers to prevent accessing pornography.
  - mixmastamyk 5y ago
    In your metaphor, the bad actors are inverted. Few here are arguing for prohibition as well.
    - balls187 5y ago
      Except the commenter I quoted and directly replied too...

nemothekid 5y ago

>Watch them cry and talk about how they'll be social outcasts and their friends will mock them I don't see how potentially making your child a social outcast is healthier than just fucking talking to them. It's strange how an entire generation that grew up on goatse, single click hardcore porn, and generally unadulterated internet access have become the very luddites they used to make fun of on phpBB forums. An incredible amount of socialization happens online today. Even if you believe that they will form "real" connections with "real" people, only the most determined of hormone raged boys will overcome the friction to include them. Secondly, the failure to actually communicate the problems of social media and resorting to lockdown is essentially sex education through abstinence. It demonstrably doesn't work. I imagine there's a middle ground between 16 hours of Roblox every day and 0 hours of any internet access. Apps, proxies and firewalls aren't an adequate replacement to communication.

fsflover 5y ago

Can you kid hack Qubes OS?

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

ineedasername 5y ago

nothing will ever defeat a determined X from doing Y I hate when this line of thinking is marched out in defense of an all/nothing approach-- The idea that you don't have a perfect solution, so you shouldn't even bother trying to implement something less than perfect. There's no reason not to do something that discourages bad activity just because it won't be perfect. With kids especially, they may find a way around a restriction, but that doesn't mean they will always avoid detection (though sometimes they will) And in those cases it also provides a good parenting opportunity to teach lessons on consequences for the decisions made. At a minimum, you can't simply fail to set reasonable limits just because they may not be followed. An understanding of such limits, if not a full appreciation of them, it pretty critical. And a total lock-down approach of "no X ever ever" is fairly likely to catalyze into a backlash much worse than trying to work with your kids on appropriate limits and then monitory things as they go.

oriki 5y ago

You can't socially outcast your kid like that. Seriously, any problems you thought they'd have because of Instagram are nothing in comparison to being a social outcast that never develops skills for making friends and forming relationships because their parents felt the need to kneecap that communication method which is so modern. Teach your kid about the dangers. Use the systems in place (ie Screen Time on iOS) to help shape the way they use the technology, and be open and honest about what worries you. If your strategy for helping the kid is predicated on "I told you so"s, I may have found the reason why they keep breaking security systems.

JoeAltmaier 5y ago
Wow, now not using Instagram is child abuse? That's a reach by anybody's standard. Not being in the 'in crowd' is not crippling. It will not result in stunted social skills.
- detaro 5y ago
  The GP didn't advocate for "don't let your kids use instagram".

CamperBob2 5y ago

Also, I've heard that Kevin Mitnick can start a nuclear war by whistling into a payphone. Better lock him up without trial, just to be safe.

kova12 5y ago

I have a feeling it's not the determined smart kids that this app targets as a primary product...

908B64B197 5y ago

> Watch them cry and talk about how they'll be social outcasts and their friends will mock them I hope you are at least sending them to a private school that's low tech as well. If not, then yeah, you're probably creating social pariah. They won't be bullied or mocked, just, left out... hopefully.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]