12 ms·

Microsoft to permanently close its retail stores

489 points by snake117 6y ago

softwaredoug 6y ago
Wow went to MS story on 5th avenue NYC in late Feb and was impressed. My son loved the video gaming floor, and the hololens demo. Gave us free t-shirts! I must say the experience is very impactful to your perception of the brand and a lot of fun
- AgloeDreams 6y ago
  I had a like experience.. but uh..when do they close the sale? To me they seemed so try-hard that you couldn't actually think about 'buying something', you know what I mean? Like an apple store (for a non-owner) is purely a low-pressure sales experience. You walk in, you see products you might buy and you can use and see them in a great environment.. but the MS store? They didn't even have pure confidence in their own products (due to fear of upsetting partners) that they sold 5+ competing brands that you could buy instead of a Surface. from there it devolved into a best-buy-like 'whichever computer you want!' instead of 'this MacBook Air is our right computer for you'. They lacked focus.
  - city41 6y ago
    I liked that they offered other brands. But what I really wanted was a curated collection of the best Windows laptops, not the rather random assortment they actually had. With an Apple laptop you know what you're getting. But with a Dell, Sony, HP, Lenovo, etc, the quality is all over the map. I would have loved a single location where I could test out all the best laptops available, and I always wished the MS store had evolved into that.
nerdjon 6y ago
While I am not surprised, I am disappointed by this. Only because of the state of tech stores in Boston, if I needed something that wasn't Apple (gaming mostly) they were the only other tech store I could reasonably walk or take the train too. Microcenter isn't super close to a train station.
- mc32 6y ago
  Congregating near Apple stores helped too. If the Apple stores were too busy I’d swing by the MS store. They actually had good product and presented them well. I also liked that their staff seemed more like regular kids rather than “cool” kids, but maybe it’s a misreading.
  - nerdjon 6y ago
    I think your right, the Microsoft stores... they always just kinda felt like they had to try harder. Where the Apple stores they kinda took being Apple for granted. I can't exactly blame them. The Microsoft Store in Boston would regularly hold Halo tournaments and similar events later in the day. However I am torn on being so near Apple Stores. I feel like it caused them to choose worse locations. In Boston, Apple has their 3 story street level location, while Microsoft was across the street but hidden in a mall. I can't think of an event where I needed to go to the Apple store and would have been able to go to Microsoft Store instead.
- sushshshsh 6y ago
  I always remembered walking along the Charles, really far west of the Mass Ave bridge and asking myself "why is there a Microcenter here?"
  - sylens 6y ago
    Same, it's a huge hike from the center of Boston
  - MivLives 6y ago
    It is right next to Harvard and pretty close to MIT. There's a bunch of other larger stores in the area. Beats the one closest to Philly, which was a decent drive out of town.
    - sushshshsh 6y ago
      I guess I should be happy that there was a microcenter within walking distance of those schools, but if you live on the other side of the Charles like me and the other commenter, you will experience many a frosty 20 minute walk across that cursed bridge to get from the Green line to the Red line :)
sneak 6y ago
Turns out that building radio sets out of coconut shells won’t actually make the planes come back. Were these ever super profitable, or did they just count under brand marketing?
- dgellow 6y ago
  Those kind of stores are mostly a marketing tool. That works quite well if done correctly.
DJBunnies 6y ago
These stores always seemed like a desperate attempt to copy apple. Which would be fine if they had product lines that were interesting. But they don't.
- dgellow 6y ago
  The surface product lines generates a lot of interest.
  - lotsofpulp 6y ago
    Apparently not enough to offset the costs of dealing with retail problems and customer service. Much easier to sit back and collect rent on software.
  - ntsplnkv2 6y ago
    Outside of HN, I don't know of anyone who cares about the next surface release. Anecdotally, of course.
  - AgloeDreams 6y ago
    Apple sells 100s of phones and iPads for each surface sold. One can't just take their store model without their context and think it will be as successful. Plus you can get a surface at any store, no need to go to a Microsoft store that sells a random assortment of a computers (not just their own) where a new user might not realize a Surface is a Microsoft product.
    - dgellow 6y ago
      Sure but you don't have to be Apple successful for the physical store project to be considered successful.
- softwaredoug 6y ago
  I think in the case its more that Apple has discovered what retail really is in a digital-first world. It's a way to build brand relationship, not a retail storefront. I suspect this will be the paradigm for brick & mortar for decades, and I don't think MS is wrong to copy this pattern (many others are!)
jaybeeayyy 6y ago
Wow...TIL Microsoft had retail stores.
- neilsimp1 6y ago
  Same. Wondering if it is a regional thing? Never in my life have I heard of or seen a Microsoft store.
  - blntechie 6y ago
    They were almost in every major US city or their suburbs I think. In suburbs, they were predominantly in malls.
    - WorldMaker 6y ago
      Pretty much every US city with an Apple Store had at least the mall kiosk version of the Microsoft Store, almost always within earshot or horizon distance from the Apple Store "coincidentally".
      - jodrellblank 6y ago
        Why “coincidentally” in scare quotes? If one company is going to open an electronics store, they will put it where it is accessible to the most possible customers. If another company wants to open one they can either put it in the same place for the same reason - and now there are customers who go to that region to buy that kind of goods making it more desirable - or they can put it somewhere else where it is accessible to fewer customers, and that’s a silly decision.
        WorldMaker 6y ago
        Not so much "scare quotes" as "wink, wink" quotes, somewhere between a joke and reality. Some of it was documented as intentional. The one specific one I know was that Microsoft was said very explicitly in location scouting in New York that their NYC store needed to be close the Apple Store. Anecdotally, my city has two malls on the same side of the same street with an interstate in between them (and today owned by the same management company even). Apple for various reasons chose the smaller of the two with less overall foot traffic. Microsoft could have gone to the mall with more foot traffic, but didn't. While anecdotes are not proof, it is amusing sign.
ibero 6y ago
very interesting on the verge of their new console hardware launch. the stores had a such a strong "games" presence that I assumed it would be critical showpiece of them-- especially if they have an All Digital hardware edition which meant (albeit dying) retailers like Gamestop would probably not carry the console. it's a shame, regardless. i always had such a good customer experience there.
softwaredoug 6y ago
How much is this MS deciding they’re really not a consumer brand - but rather one focused on cloud and enterprises?
- jsnell 6y ago
  Huh. I was going to say that it was absurd to suggest they were giving up on consumers, given just how heavy they've been investing in gaming for the last year. But writing that out made me realize they unceremoniously killed Mixer just three days ago.
  - 0x8BADF00D 6y ago
    It’s better to dump dead weight early than have it eat into your profits long term.
    - echelon 6y ago
      Not just profits, but opportunity cost as well. Unfortunately a string of failed attempts to find the correct evolutionary gradient will leave customers with a sour taste. There's a lot to balance. Running a company is hard.
- macspoofing 6y ago
  You mean *this year? Because MS has been unfocused in whether they are a consumer brand or not for many years.
- mytherin 6y ago
  Looks more to me like they are giving up on their Surface line-up specifically, rather than all their consumer focused products. The Microsoft stores & Surface line was Microsoft's attempt at copying Apple with expensive devices with solid build quality and good support. It saw some success but apparently not enough.
  - baybal2 6y ago
    > expensive devices with solid build quality and good support. The part in the middle was definitely missing
dade_ 6y ago
I think the stores were always about building the Surface brand and relaunching the Windows & Office brand. Demonstrating touch interfaces in the COVID world simply isn't going to work anymore. The cloud has won, COVID killed prem. Mission Accomplished! Was it profitable? Doesn't matter.
- campl3r 6y ago
  it might be related to covid, but I fail to see how touch interfaces are problematic for the store, people (and regulations) don't care anymore.
  - rsynnott 6y ago
    For now. Given the sharp rise in US cases, they will care soon.
  - asveikau 6y ago
    I don't know where you are that people and regulations don't care, but I am still going to stores that wipe payment touchscreens with sanitizer between individual uses.
josephpmay 6y ago
I think one point people are missing: Apple stores, even if they exist mainly to promote the brand, are MASSIVELY profitable. In fact, they are one of the most profitable store chains in the world. By contract, I believe that Microsoft was always running most of their stores at a loss. Even for a massive company like Microsoft, continuously running an unprofitable division is hard to maintain.
- thrwn_frthr_awy 6y ago
  Also, Apple has continued to pay their retail employees throughout the closures. If the Microsoft stores were already struggling for profitability, closing the stores may have been the better choice rather than to having to layoff and then try to rehire.
  - josephpmay 6y ago
    Except that they are keeping all of them employed.
  - postingawayonhn 6y ago
    The article mentions that there will be no layoffs and the staff have already been redeployed to remote roles.
- bredren 6y ago
  I saw Ron Johnson speak around 2012 in San Mateo. He oversaw the initial rise of the Apple Store. I remember him saying Jobs told him there was basically an unlimited budget to make the stores a success. The difference is it only took Apple three years to reach $1B in annual sales.
  - lotsofpulp 6y ago
    > The difference is it only took Apple three years to reach $1B in annual sales. It took far more than that to earn the trust of consumers. Microsoft decided to sit back, collect rent on Windows/Office, and let other business do the hard work of customer service and let their customers deal with malware on their laptops. Contrast with Apple, who put customer service front and center, opened stores that my parents could go to and talk to someone if they had a problem. They took ownership of the product. And now they are rewarded with the profits. Microsoft had all the cash in the world to make it happen. But instead, they put Candy Crush in the start menu.
kemiller2002 6y ago
I'm bummed about that. The store was nice but no where near as full as Apple's. They did a number of things for the community there. They held training classes for kids etc. I'm sad to hear them leave.
geerlingguy 6y ago
A lot of people mention that the MS stores were a 'brand image' or 'marketing' front, but if that's the case, I can see why they closed. The three or four I visited were very near an Apple Store, and while the Apple Store across the way was always bustling and had people standing around with their Apple devices even outside the store front (I guess waiting for Genius appointments)... the Microsoft stores were always sparsely populated with maybe 5-10 brightly colored shirt employees and one or two customers.
- chadcmulligan 6y ago
  > I guess waiting for Genius appointments I'm convinced this is deliberate - the apple store is full of blue shirts and people waiting for their appointments / devices to be fixed. It makes the shops look like they're busy, most shops would not make people wait around like that for things to be fixed, but apple gets away with it somehow. It's all very clever - I call it apple theatre, and yes I participate myself. I'd never wait that long to get my PC fixed, I'd drop it off and come back to pick it up - total time 5 minutes, but somehow apple make it so people happily sit round while the genii investigate things and engage in the mystical business of fixing the phone/Mac, challenging the apple hierarchy to get that special repair price for you, and I don't think I've paid full price for a repair for a long time (ever?), so I indulge them.
  - ogre_codes 6y ago
    > people waiting for their appointments Most Apple stores are located in malls and adjacent to other retail outlets. If you have to wait for an appointment, they take your number and give you a five minute notification when your Genius is going to be ready. Every time I've done it, they've encouraged me to go shop the rest of the mall (not linger). > It makes the shops look like they're busy, most shops would not make people wait around like that for things to be fixed, but apple gets away with it somehow. Apple used to get a lot bit of flack for struggling to keep up with Genius appointment loads. I'm not sure if their service has improved or people just accept that wait times are a thing. The few times I've dealt with them it's been reasonable considering the store was basically packed and all 4 Geniuses at the desk working with someone constantly.
AlphaWeaver 6y ago
This is a real shame. We have (had?) a Microsoft Store in the Triangle (Raleigh-Durham), and my visits to that store were always really enjoyable. I made several warranty claims in-store, and they went above and beyond to help me out, even when my grounds for a claim were kinda shaky. Microsoft did a really good job of hiring diverse talent, and every store-clerk I ever interacted with was smart, nice, and seemed to genuinely care about fixing your issue. Throughout the day, they held tech demos and video game competitions, and all the kids I saw in the store always seemed to be enjoying themselves. I wouldn't be surprised to hear that a kid visiting the Microsoft store in the mall was inspired to learn more about computers and technology based on their experience. This sucks.
- mc32 6y ago
  I wish announcements were more straightforward. I’m looking at their announcement but can’t figure out what they mean by: “...We will continue to co-locate engineering, sales, support, envisioning centers, executive briefing centers, and retail spaces for maximum impact for our customers and our company.” What does that actually mean in real terms?
  - parsimo2010 6y ago
    They will keep a support team (not just salespeople) near big customers where it would be better to employ people locally compared to having to send support staff from Redmond each time a customer has a problem.
  - dylan604 6y ago
    Probably something along the lines of GeekSquad inside BestBuy.
- xphilter 6y ago
  I agree, but I kinda feel like the relaxed and comfortable atmosphere was more of an indication that the stores weren’t doing so hot. Every time I went to one is was because it was quieter and lower key than other stores. And I never actually wanted to buy things. Maybe that’s good(ish) marketing but probably doesn’t make good business sense.
sys_64738 6y ago
Apple stores had specific function and well-defined goals. Brand, hands on, direct sale, all spring to mind. Microsoft stores seemed to have a motto of "Copy Apple stores". I didn't get their reason for existing.
- Octoth0rpe 6y ago
  Their reasons for existing were the same as the ones you listed for Apple stores: Brand, hands on, direct sale. I'd also add that they serve as a place where buyers believe that they can get support on product, thus increasing their trust in the product. That's an incredibly valuable thing IMO.
  - sys_64738 6y ago
    What products did Microsoft support there? I only have Microsoft OS and none of their devices so maybe I'm missing their value. FWIW, if I have Windows issues on a Dell laptop then I call Dell for vendor support.
    - postingawayonhn 6y ago
      Mainly Surface and Xbox. Remember that Microsoft launched the Microsoft Store model under Ballmer when they were trying to go head on with Apple in the consumer space.
    - busyant 6y ago
      I had a surface book2. I bought the accidental damage protection. A year after I bought it, I cracked the screen. Took me all of 60 min to get the problem fixed: 20 min to drive to the store. 20 min to get a replacement. 20 min to drive home. The store was remarkably convenient for me (for this and just for seeing the sb2 in action). Not sure if I would have purchased it without the store.
  - dangus 6y ago
    I don't agree with this. The Microsoft Store was basically a bad version of Best Buy that happened to sell Microsoft's hardware products front and center. Why would a customer go to a Microsoft Store instead of a Best Buy? It has less selection, fewer locations, and likely worse prices, while selling essentially the same product categories. The Apple Store, in contrast, is arguably mostly possible because it's a massive cell phone store, and before that an iPod store. They didn't exist before the iPod era. By now, Macs probably only account for 5% of the economic activity that takes place in Apple Stores.
sambroner 6y ago
This is disappointing, although I'm not surprised. One of the best things about the Microsoft stores is that they provided an obvious way to get individual attention on software issues. My grandfather was a frequent visitor of the Microsoft stores to resolve his software issues with his SurfaceBook and his generic Dell Laptop. This type of one on one, in person attention was really useful to him and made the Microsoft brand much more approachable. He loved going and he's gotten really great with his computers! Disappointing news for him and for me, although I can understand the business justification.
- macspoofing 6y ago
  That's a great point and an understated value-add to the Microsoft/Windows ecosystem. There is something to be said for not having to call a tech support line, but going to a physical location (where you may have bought your device) to get help and support. Even if the MS stores were run as a loss, MS should have eaten those costs.
- lotsofpulp 6y ago
  > Disappointing news for him and for me, although I can understand the business justification. Understanding the business justification is why I don’t understand why people think Apple products are overpriced. Not a single other tech organization wants to provide customer service other than Apple, even one with as much cash as Microsoft. Why should I not reward Apple for putting their money where their mouth is? Obviously, anything less expensive than Apple products makes it unfeasible to offer customer service in person and only merits waiting in a phone queue.
  - canada_dry 6y ago
    > Not a single other tech organization wants to provide customer service other than Apple That's a stretch. I'd argue the level of support they're providing is the of the lowest-hanging-fruit level (e.g. how do I transfer my contacts, setup the device). Support forums are full of stories (and from my own experience) where hardware related issues are dismissed and rejected at their stores.
johnvega 6y ago
Bought this computer I'm using right now from a Microsoft retail store. Great place to try out new computers. Disappointed.
- AgloeDreams 6y ago
  > Great place to try out new computers. Maybe that was the issue. At an Apple store if you said 'my kid needs a laptop for college' they will walk you to ONE computer (MBA) and say 'it's the best one' it's painless whereas MS was tied down by their partners to being non-confident in their own line and basically being a Best Buy.
gjsman-1000 6y ago
Correction for the headline: They are closing all stores, not nearly all. The 4 remaining locations will be "reimagined" and will not handle any retail sales.
vondur 6y ago
I wonder if they did tech support like the Apple store does. In my opinion that’s why the Apple stores are so popular.
Fiveplus 6y ago
I scoured through two financial annual reports of MS for 2018 and 2019 but found no emphasis on the growth/profit or loss margins of their retail outlets. Though, I've heard a great deal about them and it seems like they were useful. Fun fact: MS always aimed to open their outlets in serious close proximity to Apple stores.
gjsman-1000 6y ago
It is a shame, but not unexpected. I visited the one in the Mall of America, which was ironically directly across the Apple Store. The Apple Store had much more foot traffic every single time.
- donatj 6y ago
  I kind of liked that they were right across from each other. Had a nice sense of competition. The Apple store moved to the other side of the mall about a year ago.
wronglebowski 6y ago
Wonder what will happen to the products at these locations. As someone who lives very close to one (King of Prussia), I'd love to see a chance to pick up some display models on the cheap.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
Theodores 6y ago
The London store is on Oxford Street and a lot of stores in that area are flagships that don't have to make money directly. Not having to have stock or cash registers just saves money, the main mission of having an impressive presence need not be burdened with actual retail sales. Some Oxford Street stores do make lots of money but there are many others where ten minutes in the store is enough for you to see what is going on. The whole range can be on show whereas in your regional town there is a fraction of the range. But you can experience the brand. Adjacent to Oxford Street is Tottenham Court Road. This was legendary in the 1990s for computer shops with fairs in nearby halls where you could buy components for competitive prices, as if nobody was paying VAT. That scene went a long time ago for more flagship stores to come along. These flagship stores don't have to make sales to cover the rent. Microsoft are part of the theme park.
thecrumb 6y ago
They should put BSOD in the windows when they close.
quicklime 6y ago
> Reimagined as experience centers Ugh, I wish we lived in a world where they could just say “converted to showrooms”.
draw_down 6y ago
The MS store in my city looks really nice. Just don't know why I would ever go in there. I don't particularly enjoy going to the Apple store either, for entirely different reasons, but maybe once or twice a year I need to.
blntechie 6y ago
Real shame. Their stores were always interesting with a mix of people checking out anything from Surface Books to kids checking out Xbox consoles and playing games etc. Unlike Apple stores, which I have always felt like a sterile hospital wing, it was a very diverse mix of people in Microsoft stores.
spunker540 6y ago
When I was in a high school busking band, we went to the local mall to make some money playing Christmas songs. We set up in front of the Apple store and within 10 minutes we’re kicked out by security. As we were leaving, someone from the fledgling Microsoft store told us they had a stage we could play on in front of their store the following day (our first “paid” gig, they gave us gift cards). The joke was on us though as it was an outdoor mall, and the temperature didn’t break 20 degrees. The guitarists fingers could barely play, but it was memorable nonetheless and presented a clear contrast in how the Apple store vs Microsoft store treated young buskers!
- donarb 6y ago
  Most malls don't allow buskers, solicitations or petition signing within their properties.
otterpro 6y ago
I've been to MS store only once last year to buy a laptop that was on sale. It was a good and pleasant buying experience and the staff was very friendly. However, I noticed that there weren't a lot of variety of hardware on sale. I wish they had more computer stuff, like GPU, mechanical keyboards, motherboards, etc.... Imagine if they were like mini Micro-center, I'd bet they would've been a lot more popular than Apple store. The foot traffic alone would've given them some good will for MS, if that was their intent.
- sylens 6y ago
  This would have been a great direction for them to go in - but the desktop building market is pretty niche these days compared to the people in the market for a MacBook Air or similar alternative.
- sleepybrett 6y ago
  I feel like they can't really be sure that they can push that kind of 'partsy' inventory. USB stuff sure, but GPUs, MBs, ram etc... bitsy and complicated.
- mdip 6y ago
  > mini Micro-center There used to be variations of a lot of these all over the place. Some were exclusively software (Babbages), some had a mix (we had a local franchise called Computer Warehouse, often located in small strip-mall locations). I loved working at CompUSA (more like Microcenter; a little smaller than the Microcenter that is a half-mile from where I worked, also formerly two miles away from a Computer City). Retail computer hardware is basically gone these days except for small, independent, shops. I'm so glad I live 20 minutes from a Micro Center. I used to live about as far from a Microsoft store, too. :)
- askafriend 6y ago
  > Imagine if they were like mini Micro-center, Not to be rude, but this idea is out of touch. Basically no one would want this and the PC building market is impossibly tiny today. You'd get zero foot traffic. No one is building their own computers anymore and those that are, are serviced incredibly well by Amazon/Newegg/etc.
limeblack 6y ago
In my opinion this is linked to the shutdown of windows phone. If you haven’t been following it it went from Windows Phone is dead[1]. To Bill Gates use Android[2]. Subsequently Windows Phone was removed from the Microsoft Store. [1]: https://windowsphone.stackexchange.com/questions/16686/as-2018-is-windows-phone-dead#16688 https://windowsphone.stackexchange.com/questions/16686/as-20... [2]: https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/26/16365424/bill-gates-android-phone-switch https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/26/16365424/bill-gates-andro...
JoeMayoBot 6y ago
Sad - their service was exceptional. Once had a problem with my Surface Book and they replaced it right there.
nanna 6y ago
Whenever I go past the Oxford Circus store I think to myself, if only we had stores like this for Linux.
- joveian 6y ago
  There are, at least here in Portland, Or (US). FreeGeek is a recycler and resells used equipment, usually with Ubuntu. They have made their store more like the Apple store over the years and reduced the number of random parts they sell (although they still have quite a few things). For Linux, any computer made in the past seven years or so that is well supported works great for a lot of people. They have a tech support window that will spend hours with people having trouble and classes in a different part of the building. The hardware itself is fairly expensive considering its age but for anyone who is likely to use the tech support it is likely one of the best deals available. https://www.freegeek.org/ https://www.freegeek.org/
ChicagoDave 6y ago
This is disappointing. The pandemic is certainly a change in my own behavior, but I regularly visited two Microsoft stores in the Chicago area and have made large purchases in each. Especially when new hardware is released, it’s great to see it within the construct of a corporate setting. Of course the Best Buy model of having manufacturer space like a mini mall helps balance this loss, it’s not the same level of interaction. Very disappointing.
matthewfelgate 6y ago
Microsoft had retail stores?
tolger 6y ago
This makes me sad. I thought the Microsoft Store at the Domain in Austin was very cool and I visited from time to time. There was also an Apple store in the same location so I could visit both! And there was a Borders Bookstore, which I loved browsing in, and is also closed now :-(
jkinudsjknds 6y ago
I wonder if we'll see large corp retail outlets disappear faster than small businesses
sbisson 6y ago
Of course the other question is: will there be any malls left open for stores like these? I suspect this a calculation many retail stores are toying with at the moment; we're in the middle of a fundamental shift in retail to online and local stores. We've already seen one mall owner in the UK go into administration.
yodon 6y ago
The service I've received in Microsoft stores when I've needed tech support has been nothing short of phenomenal. Their "genius bar" equivalent is simply the best I've ever used.
gojomo 6y ago
If past is prelude, they'll try again, within about a decade. They first tried a retail store ~1999-2001, before even Apple, with at least one outlet being in San Francisco's downtown 'Metreon': https://www.technologizer.com/2009/10/20/1999-microsoft-store-vs-2009-microsoft-store/ https://www.technologizer.com/2009/10/20/1999-microsoft-stor... (By my recollection, it was somewhere within the 2nd-floor footprint of the Target that's there now... not far from the bowling alley/arcade.)
yarrel 6y ago
This makes sense. Microsoft are not a retail company. Copying Apple's stores made no sense either economically or aesthetically.
sleepybrett 6y ago
I'm not a huge fan of microsoft, but I think this is a huge mistake. I've been into the local MS store here in seattle (uvillage) on occasion to quickly grab hardware or software from time to time. While it is clearly a sad apple follow it always makes me feel a little better about MS as a company. It does something to humanize them. So yeah, do they make a ton of money for them? Of course not. Are they great for the brand, I'd argue yes.
martinesko36 6y ago
How is this the news to come from a company with $1.5T mkt cap? How is Microsoft possibly valued so highly? They can't even ship a redesign on Windows.
yahyaheee 6y ago
Guess the “we’re cool like apple” play didn’t work out
partiallypro 6y ago
I'm going to miss this. I was at a conference in San Francisco, dropped my Surface. Shattering the screen. Luckily I could just walk to thew Microsoft Store and they replaced it. I would have been so screwed if that store wasn't there. I liked being able to go in and see the new Surface hardware before launches. Best Buy would usually not get display units until after launch. I've replaced an Xbox that had a bad HDMI unit...I'd had have to have waited a week to get a new unit, but instead I just went to the Microsoft Store and got it done immediately. I wish they would just scale them down instead of shutting it all down.
gentleman11 6y ago
Microsoft’s stores were very nice except that they had double the staff they needed and were using headsets to coordinate their sales efforts and pressure me into buying things... several of their main brands also had histories of installing spyware on their consumer devices which made me really uncomfortable and kept me from buying a couple of times (Lenovo, Dell, razer, another I forget)
- WorldMaker 6y ago
  Microsoft Stores actually had a policy that the PCs they sold were only allowed to have clean OS images ("Signature Edition" was the branding term), which means that it was the safest place to buy Lenovo/Dell/etc. You'd pay on average about $50 more than if you bought directly from Lenovo or Dell, but you'd have peace of mind that you wouldn't need to reinstall Windows to make sure that you had removed all the spyware/adware. ETA: Which is maybe the biggest loss with the Microsoft Stores going away. You could point a relative at a Microsoft Store and not worry about any PC they picked, but any other store you'd need to expect to do a reinstall for them or worry about which specific brand name they picked.
chasd00 6y ago
they could probably turn half the store into xbox arcades and break even. However, covid19 throws that and probably any other investment heavy retail idea right out the window.
alexashka 6y ago
It'll be interesting to see what happens when most Best Buys follow suit and we have no stores left to come in and try non-Apple products. In some sense, this is a big window of opportunity for Dell to get smart and fix their website from looking like a warehouse dump for nerds who want the best deal and give a shit about specs, to actual customers who just to see an intuitive product line-up and extra details if and when they want that.
smoyer 6y ago
Apparently if you're not dramatically over-charging for your consumer technology products, you can't afford brick-and-mortar locations. Those who do pay for the premium platform should realize that not (nearly) all of the additional cost goes into product quality. Note that this discounts design superiority/inferiority.
- scarface74 6y ago
  By definition, if people are buying at the price that Apple sets at the margins Apple wants and there are alternatives, the product is not “overpriced”. That’s kind of Economics 101
  - smoyer 6y ago
    True ... I should have used the word "premium" instead to represent the economic difference in the unit price and associated margins.
coliveira 6y ago
MS stores were created trying to emulate the success of Apple stores. However, from the get go this was a strange decision, since MS has no exclusivity on HW. Even Xbox can be purchased on other physical and online stores, sometimes at a cheaper price. They also don't provide support to a lot of this hardware, opposed to Apple that also uses stores as as service centers.
- smabie 6y ago
  You can buy Apple products from other places too, though.
twblalock 6y ago
At one of the biggest malls in San Jose, there is a Microsoft Store and an Apple Store right across the hallway from each other. On a normal day, anyone walking by could see that the Apple Store was packed with people, and the bored employees at the Microsoft store were standing around with nothing to do. It was kind of sad. It's not like Microsoft didn't have popular stuff to sell, especially the Xbox.
awa 6y ago
I am bummed about this. The Microsoft store near me was a great place to check out the latest windows hardware and what xbox is upto nowadays. I liked that I could just hang out at the store and browse around with no sales pressure.
racl101 6y ago
Apple stores, on the other hands, are like popular night clubs these days. I was at the mall the other day and saw a long line up of people looking to get in and a girl with an iPad looking through her list to see if she could admit people immediately (the people who made appointments), or make them wait (those who didn't).
topkai22 6y ago
Not surprising to me, but its really too bad. The consumer side was always hopeless, but I thought the stores provided a great hook into the small business, education, and non-profit sectors- orgs too small to have anything resembling a decent IT department who needed help. I wonder what the effort would look like if those customers had been the focus instead of individual consumers.
legitster 6y ago
Microsoft stores are (were?) magical places full of bizarre and weird devices. I actually had fun going in and seeing all sorts of gadgets and devices and playing with demos. A candy store for futurists. In comparison Apple stores are dystopian places full of rows of identical looking people looking at rows of identical beige phones. But I think it's pretty telling that I loved hanging out in them, but never spent any money there.
- alexchantavy 6y ago
  So funny that 10 years ago views about Microsoft and Apple were near the exact opposite of what you described here.
  - nolok 6y ago
    They really weren't. Ten years ago Apple had even more conformity and less choice than now, while Microsoft offering already full of fun stuff that would not exist anymore 3 years later.
- buzzert 6y ago
  I couldn’t agree more. I absolutely fell in love with the Surface Studio they had on display there. It was really set up to make a great demo too, preloaded with software that takes advantage of the “wheel” device and stylus. Not only that, it was the only place where I’m sure I’ll ever see the Surface Hub[0]. An incredible “interactive whiteboard” running a special version of Windows 10, the price of which is “please ask for a quote”. The Microsoft store was really like a mini CES more than a showroom for Microsoft things. I will miss it dearly. [0] https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/business/surface-hub-2 https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/business/surface-hub...
thordenmark 6y ago
Sad to hear, but unsurprising. The MS store near us looked nice yet was always a ghost town. They're just not as sexy as an Apple store, though they've done a great job with the latest versions of Windows and the XBox is fairly popular.
- gketuma 6y ago
  So you mean Steve Jobs was right when he said: "They just have no taste." https://www.computerworld.com/article/2471632/steve-jobs-on-microsoft---they-just-have-no-taste--.html https://www.computerworld.com/article/2471632/steve-jobs-on-...
skuthus 6y ago
I guess I can say this now. I worked for 5 years at the most revenue-generating microsoft store in the world. We were near the official Microsoft campus. The short answer is that things started to change internally around 2017, where stores changed their hiring requirements and excised a lot of their top talent in favor of lower-paid, less enthusiastic management and employees. This has been a steady downhill process since - It is a shame that the stores will no longer be. I loved my time working there, and loved the people and connections I made there both personally and professionally. We genuinely went out of our way to make customers happy, no matter the cost. It was inevitable that kind of goodwill would be snuffed out by profit motive eventually.
- quyleanh 6y ago
  It is disappointed. I love Microsoft and their services. I do expect Microsoft will take their real effort and focus to customer, the end user, but looks like it will never happen.
m3kw9 6y ago
Went in to a MS store just once ever. Before I go in, I always ask myself what have I not seen in windows already? Touch screen with a windows, not very hard to predict how it is same as using a pointer. That VR demo? I’m not gonna wait and look stupid. Maybe they failed to sell intrigue compared to Apple stores. Their products has mystique to it when they first come out and you always want to try it.
- city41 6y ago
  Apple hasn't really released anything new in quite some time. Pretty much just iterative releases and upgrades. yet Apple stores are often so crowded you can't even walk in them. I think it's more than just new product launches.
PaulWaldman 6y ago
This is disappointing because the Microsoft stores seemed to be the only retail B&Ms that carried premium Windows hardware. Aside from a few outliers, stores like Best Buy tend to focus on volume Windows machines (Inspiron, IdealPad, Pavillion). What's the alternative, buying three computers online and returning the two you don't like?
Redoubts 6y ago
The company tells The Verge that no layoffs will result from today’s decision. “Our commitment to growing and developing careers from this diverse talent pool is stronger than ever,” Impressive, but pretty curious how they plan to successfully pull this off.
MisterBiggs 6y ago
I've always had great experiences at the Microsoft store especially with purchases and replacements. Right after the pandemic caused Microsoft to close all their physical locations my Surface Pro 7 started getting green spots on the screen that I've been waiting for the stores to reopen to get replaced. Hearing the news today that the store wasn't going to be open I decided to try the online support and it is a total mess. I tried to use text chat but after an hour my position in the queue actually went up. So I decided to have them call me which the wait took much longer than quoted. Then I spent over an hour on the phone with a representative for what they even admitted was obviously a manufacturer defect. They didn't want to send me a new device before I shipped them my RMA unit so they expected me to be without my laptop for a week while they processed the claim. Then when they finally caved they couldn't tell me how large of a hold they would put on my card while before my RMA reached them. This whole process would have taken 5 minutes at the store, and I would have walked out with a new laptop right then. All in all I feel like all my Microsoft hardware products just massively depreciated in value.
- WWLink 6y ago
  I had a surface pro 1, and when it decided to randomly completely fail, I called and was met with the same kinda customer service treatment you explained. They offered to replace my week old tablet with a refurb if I shipped mine to them and waited a couple weeks. I found out there was a MS store right by where my internship was, so I stopped by, explained my problem and showed it to them, and they handed me a new replacement on the spot. So yeah, same experience here lol. I wasn't going to mention it because I figured they had gotten better by now. I'm sad to hear they haven't! That.. means I probably won't be buying any surface hardware again lol.
- TwoNineFive 6y ago
  > All in all I feel like all my Microsoft hardware products just massively depreciated in value. Great observation. Top comment in this thread.
goatherders 6y ago
I always enjoyed the store, there is one 100 yards from where I sit right now. But a store where the point is for people to touch as many things as possible is probably not a viable thing anymore.
ryuukk_ 6y ago
good hardware trash software
LeicaLatte 6y ago
Surprised they took this decision on a console launch year.
hosker4u 6y ago
Maybe because im based in the North of the UK, I've never been or should I say seen a Microsoft Retail Store. Walked past plenty of Apple Stores.

489 points by snake117 6y ago

Wow went to MS story on 5th avenue NYC in late Feb and was impressed. My son loved the video gaming floor, and the hololens demo. Gave us free t-shirts! I must say the experience is very impactful to your perception of the brand and a lot of fun

AgloeDreams 6y ago
I had a like experience.. but uh..when do they close the sale? To me they seemed so try-hard that you couldn't actually think about 'buying something', you know what I mean? Like an apple store (for a non-owner) is purely a low-pressure sales experience. You walk in, you see products you might buy and you can use and see them in a great environment.. but the MS store? They didn't even have pure confidence in their own products (due to fear of upsetting partners) that they sold 5+ competing brands that you could buy instead of a Surface. from there it devolved into a best-buy-like 'whichever computer you want!' instead of 'this MacBook Air is our right computer for you'. They lacked focus.
- city41 6y ago
  I liked that they offered other brands. But what I really wanted was a curated collection of the best Windows laptops, not the rather random assortment they actually had. With an Apple laptop you know what you're getting. But with a Dell, Sony, HP, Lenovo, etc, the quality is all over the map. I would have loved a single location where I could test out all the best laptops available, and I always wished the MS store had evolved into that.

nerdjon 6y ago

While I am not surprised, I am disappointed by this. Only because of the state of tech stores in Boston, if I needed something that wasn't Apple (gaming mostly) they were the only other tech store I could reasonably walk or take the train too. Microcenter isn't super close to a train station.

mc32 6y ago
Congregating near Apple stores helped too. If the Apple stores were too busy I’d swing by the MS store. They actually had good product and presented them well. I also liked that their staff seemed more like regular kids rather than “cool” kids, but maybe it’s a misreading.
- nerdjon 6y ago
  I think your right, the Microsoft stores... they always just kinda felt like they had to try harder. Where the Apple stores they kinda took being Apple for granted. I can't exactly blame them. The Microsoft Store in Boston would regularly hold Halo tournaments and similar events later in the day. However I am torn on being so near Apple Stores. I feel like it caused them to choose worse locations. In Boston, Apple has their 3 story street level location, while Microsoft was across the street but hidden in a mall. I can't think of an event where I needed to go to the Apple store and would have been able to go to Microsoft Store instead.
sushshshsh 6y ago
I always remembered walking along the Charles, really far west of the Mass Ave bridge and asking myself "why is there a Microcenter here?"
- sylens 6y ago
  Same, it's a huge hike from the center of Boston
- MivLives 6y ago
  It is right next to Harvard and pretty close to MIT. There's a bunch of other larger stores in the area. Beats the one closest to Philly, which was a decent drive out of town.
  - sushshshsh 6y ago
    I guess I should be happy that there was a microcenter within walking distance of those schools, but if you live on the other side of the Charles like me and the other commenter, you will experience many a frosty 20 minute walk across that cursed bridge to get from the Green line to the Red line :)

sneak 6y ago

Turns out that building radio sets out of coconut shells won’t actually make the planes come back. Were these ever super profitable, or did they just count under brand marketing?

dgellow 6y ago
Those kind of stores are mostly a marketing tool. That works quite well if done correctly.

DJBunnies 6y ago

These stores always seemed like a desperate attempt to copy apple. Which would be fine if they had product lines that were interesting. But they don't.

dgellow 6y ago
The surface product lines generates a lot of interest.
- lotsofpulp 6y ago
  Apparently not enough to offset the costs of dealing with retail problems and customer service. Much easier to sit back and collect rent on software.
- ntsplnkv2 6y ago
  Outside of HN, I don't know of anyone who cares about the next surface release. Anecdotally, of course.
- AgloeDreams 6y ago
  Apple sells 100s of phones and iPads for each surface sold. One can't just take their store model without their context and think it will be as successful. Plus you can get a surface at any store, no need to go to a Microsoft store that sells a random assortment of a computers (not just their own) where a new user might not realize a Surface is a Microsoft product.
  - dgellow 6y ago
    Sure but you don't have to be Apple successful for the physical store project to be considered successful.
softwaredoug 6y ago
I think in the case its more that Apple has discovered what retail really is in a digital-first world. It's a way to build brand relationship, not a retail storefront. I suspect this will be the paradigm for brick & mortar for decades, and I don't think MS is wrong to copy this pattern (many others are!)

jaybeeayyy 6y ago

Wow...TIL Microsoft had retail stores.

neilsimp1 6y ago
Same. Wondering if it is a regional thing? Never in my life have I heard of or seen a Microsoft store.
- blntechie 6y ago
  They were almost in every major US city or their suburbs I think. In suburbs, they were predominantly in malls.
  - WorldMaker 6y ago
    Pretty much every US city with an Apple Store had at least the mall kiosk version of the Microsoft Store, almost always within earshot or horizon distance from the Apple Store "coincidentally".
    - jodrellblank 6y ago
      Why “coincidentally” in scare quotes? If one company is going to open an electronics store, they will put it where it is accessible to the most possible customers. If another company wants to open one they can either put it in the same place for the same reason - and now there are customers who go to that region to buy that kind of goods making it more desirable - or they can put it somewhere else where it is accessible to fewer customers, and that’s a silly decision.
      - WorldMaker 6y ago
        Not so much "scare quotes" as "wink, wink" quotes, somewhere between a joke and reality. Some of it was documented as intentional. The one specific one I know was that Microsoft was said very explicitly in location scouting in New York that their NYC store needed to be close the Apple Store. Anecdotally, my city has two malls on the same side of the same street with an interstate in between them (and today owned by the same management company even). Apple for various reasons chose the smaller of the two with less overall foot traffic. Microsoft could have gone to the mall with more foot traffic, but didn't. While anecdotes are not proof, it is amusing sign.

ibero 6y ago

very interesting on the verge of their new console hardware launch. the stores had a such a strong "games" presence that I assumed it would be critical showpiece of them-- especially if they have an All Digital hardware edition which meant (albeit dying) retailers like Gamestop would probably not carry the console. it's a shame, regardless. i always had such a good customer experience there.

softwaredoug 6y ago

How much is this MS deciding they’re really not a consumer brand - but rather one focused on cloud and enterprises?

jsnell 6y ago
Huh. I was going to say that it was absurd to suggest they were giving up on consumers, given just how heavy they've been investing in gaming for the last year. But writing that out made me realize they unceremoniously killed Mixer just three days ago.
- 0x8BADF00D 6y ago
  It’s better to dump dead weight early than have it eat into your profits long term.
  - echelon 6y ago
    Not just profits, but opportunity cost as well. Unfortunately a string of failed attempts to find the correct evolutionary gradient will leave customers with a sour taste. There's a lot to balance. Running a company is hard.
macspoofing 6y ago
You mean *this year? Because MS has been unfocused in whether they are a consumer brand or not for many years.
mytherin 6y ago
Looks more to me like they are giving up on their Surface line-up specifically, rather than all their consumer focused products. The Microsoft stores & Surface line was Microsoft's attempt at copying Apple with expensive devices with solid build quality and good support. It saw some success but apparently not enough.
- baybal2 6y ago
  > expensive devices with solid build quality and good support. The part in the middle was definitely missing

dade_ 6y ago

I think the stores were always about building the Surface brand and relaunching the Windows & Office brand. Demonstrating touch interfaces in the COVID world simply isn't going to work anymore. The cloud has won, COVID killed prem. Mission Accomplished! Was it profitable? Doesn't matter.

campl3r 6y ago
it might be related to covid, but I fail to see how touch interfaces are problematic for the store, people (and regulations) don't care anymore.
- rsynnott 6y ago
  For now. Given the sharp rise in US cases, they will care soon.
- asveikau 6y ago
  I don't know where you are that people and regulations don't care, but I am still going to stores that wipe payment touchscreens with sanitizer between individual uses.

josephpmay 6y ago

I think one point people are missing: Apple stores, even if they exist mainly to promote the brand, are MASSIVELY profitable. In fact, they are one of the most profitable store chains in the world. By contract, I believe that Microsoft was always running most of their stores at a loss. Even for a massive company like Microsoft, continuously running an unprofitable division is hard to maintain.

thrwn_frthr_awy 6y ago
Also, Apple has continued to pay their retail employees throughout the closures. If the Microsoft stores were already struggling for profitability, closing the stores may have been the better choice rather than to having to layoff and then try to rehire.
- josephpmay 6y ago
  Except that they are keeping all of them employed.
- postingawayonhn 6y ago
  The article mentions that there will be no layoffs and the staff have already been redeployed to remote roles.
bredren 6y ago
I saw Ron Johnson speak around 2012 in San Mateo. He oversaw the initial rise of the Apple Store. I remember him saying Jobs told him there was basically an unlimited budget to make the stores a success. The difference is it only took Apple three years to reach $1B in annual sales.
- lotsofpulp 6y ago
  > The difference is it only took Apple three years to reach $1B in annual sales. It took far more than that to earn the trust of consumers. Microsoft decided to sit back, collect rent on Windows/Office, and let other business do the hard work of customer service and let their customers deal with malware on their laptops. Contrast with Apple, who put customer service front and center, opened stores that my parents could go to and talk to someone if they had a problem. They took ownership of the product. And now they are rewarded with the profits. Microsoft had all the cash in the world to make it happen. But instead, they put Candy Crush in the start menu.

kemiller2002 6y ago

I'm bummed about that. The store was nice but no where near as full as Apple's. They did a number of things for the community there. They held training classes for kids etc. I'm sad to hear them leave.

geerlingguy 6y ago

A lot of people mention that the MS stores were a 'brand image' or 'marketing' front, but if that's the case, I can see why they closed. The three or four I visited were very near an Apple Store, and while the Apple Store across the way was always bustling and had people standing around with their Apple devices even outside the store front (I guess waiting for Genius appointments)... the Microsoft stores were always sparsely populated with maybe 5-10 brightly colored shirt employees and one or two customers.

chadcmulligan 6y ago
> I guess waiting for Genius appointments I'm convinced this is deliberate - the apple store is full of blue shirts and people waiting for their appointments / devices to be fixed. It makes the shops look like they're busy, most shops would not make people wait around like that for things to be fixed, but apple gets away with it somehow. It's all very clever - I call it apple theatre, and yes I participate myself. I'd never wait that long to get my PC fixed, I'd drop it off and come back to pick it up - total time 5 minutes, but somehow apple make it so people happily sit round while the genii investigate things and engage in the mystical business of fixing the phone/Mac, challenging the apple hierarchy to get that special repair price for you, and I don't think I've paid full price for a repair for a long time (ever?), so I indulge them.
- ogre_codes 6y ago
  > people waiting for their appointments Most Apple stores are located in malls and adjacent to other retail outlets. If you have to wait for an appointment, they take your number and give you a five minute notification when your Genius is going to be ready. Every time I've done it, they've encouraged me to go shop the rest of the mall (not linger). > It makes the shops look like they're busy, most shops would not make people wait around like that for things to be fixed, but apple gets away with it somehow. Apple used to get a lot bit of flack for struggling to keep up with Genius appointment loads. I'm not sure if their service has improved or people just accept that wait times are a thing. The few times I've dealt with them it's been reasonable considering the store was basically packed and all 4 Geniuses at the desk working with someone constantly.

AlphaWeaver 6y ago

This is a real shame. We have (had?) a Microsoft Store in the Triangle (Raleigh-Durham), and my visits to that store were always really enjoyable. I made several warranty claims in-store, and they went above and beyond to help me out, even when my grounds for a claim were kinda shaky. Microsoft did a really good job of hiring diverse talent, and every store-clerk I ever interacted with was smart, nice, and seemed to genuinely care about fixing your issue. Throughout the day, they held tech demos and video game competitions, and all the kids I saw in the store always seemed to be enjoying themselves. I wouldn't be surprised to hear that a kid visiting the Microsoft store in the mall was inspired to learn more about computers and technology based on their experience. This sucks.

mc32 6y ago
I wish announcements were more straightforward. I’m looking at their announcement but can’t figure out what they mean by: “...We will continue to co-locate engineering, sales, support, envisioning centers, executive briefing centers, and retail spaces for maximum impact for our customers and our company.” What does that actually mean in real terms?
- parsimo2010 6y ago
  They will keep a support team (not just salespeople) near big customers where it would be better to employ people locally compared to having to send support staff from Redmond each time a customer has a problem.
- dylan604 6y ago
  Probably something along the lines of GeekSquad inside BestBuy.
xphilter 6y ago
I agree, but I kinda feel like the relaxed and comfortable atmosphere was more of an indication that the stores weren’t doing so hot. Every time I went to one is was because it was quieter and lower key than other stores. And I never actually wanted to buy things. Maybe that’s good(ish) marketing but probably doesn’t make good business sense.

sys_64738 6y ago

Apple stores had specific function and well-defined goals. Brand, hands on, direct sale, all spring to mind. Microsoft stores seemed to have a motto of "Copy Apple stores". I didn't get their reason for existing.

Octoth0rpe 6y ago
Their reasons for existing were the same as the ones you listed for Apple stores: Brand, hands on, direct sale. I'd also add that they serve as a place where buyers believe that they can get support on product, thus increasing their trust in the product. That's an incredibly valuable thing IMO.
- sys_64738 6y ago
  What products did Microsoft support there? I only have Microsoft OS and none of their devices so maybe I'm missing their value. FWIW, if I have Windows issues on a Dell laptop then I call Dell for vendor support.
  - postingawayonhn 6y ago
    Mainly Surface and Xbox. Remember that Microsoft launched the Microsoft Store model under Ballmer when they were trying to go head on with Apple in the consumer space.
  - busyant 6y ago
    I had a surface book2. I bought the accidental damage protection. A year after I bought it, I cracked the screen. Took me all of 60 min to get the problem fixed: 20 min to drive to the store. 20 min to get a replacement. 20 min to drive home. The store was remarkably convenient for me (for this and just for seeing the sb2 in action). Not sure if I would have purchased it without the store.
- dangus 6y ago
  I don't agree with this. The Microsoft Store was basically a bad version of Best Buy that happened to sell Microsoft's hardware products front and center. Why would a customer go to a Microsoft Store instead of a Best Buy? It has less selection, fewer locations, and likely worse prices, while selling essentially the same product categories. The Apple Store, in contrast, is arguably mostly possible because it's a massive cell phone store, and before that an iPod store. They didn't exist before the iPod era. By now, Macs probably only account for 5% of the economic activity that takes place in Apple Stores.

sambroner 6y ago

This is disappointing, although I'm not surprised. One of the best things about the Microsoft stores is that they provided an obvious way to get individual attention on software issues. My grandfather was a frequent visitor of the Microsoft stores to resolve his software issues with his SurfaceBook and his generic Dell Laptop. This type of one on one, in person attention was really useful to him and made the Microsoft brand much more approachable. He loved going and he's gotten really great with his computers! Disappointing news for him and for me, although I can understand the business justification.

macspoofing 6y ago
That's a great point and an understated value-add to the Microsoft/Windows ecosystem. There is something to be said for not having to call a tech support line, but going to a physical location (where you may have bought your device) to get help and support. Even if the MS stores were run as a loss, MS should have eaten those costs.
lotsofpulp 6y ago
> Disappointing news for him and for me, although I can understand the business justification. Understanding the business justification is why I don’t understand why people think Apple products are overpriced. Not a single other tech organization wants to provide customer service other than Apple, even one with as much cash as Microsoft. Why should I not reward Apple for putting their money where their mouth is? Obviously, anything less expensive than Apple products makes it unfeasible to offer customer service in person and only merits waiting in a phone queue.
- canada_dry 6y ago
  > Not a single other tech organization wants to provide customer service other than Apple That's a stretch. I'd argue the level of support they're providing is the of the lowest-hanging-fruit level (e.g. how do I transfer my contacts, setup the device). Support forums are full of stories (and from my own experience) where hardware related issues are dismissed and rejected at their stores.

johnvega 6y ago

Bought this computer I'm using right now from a Microsoft retail store. Great place to try out new computers. Disappointed.

AgloeDreams 6y ago
> Great place to try out new computers. Maybe that was the issue. At an Apple store if you said 'my kid needs a laptop for college' they will walk you to ONE computer (MBA) and say 'it's the best one' it's painless whereas MS was tied down by their partners to being non-confident in their own line and basically being a Best Buy.

gjsman-1000 6y ago

Correction for the headline: They are closing all stores, not nearly all. The 4 remaining locations will be "reimagined" and will not handle any retail sales.

vondur 6y ago

I wonder if they did tech support like the Apple store does. In my opinion that’s why the Apple stores are so popular.

Fiveplus 6y ago

I scoured through two financial annual reports of MS for 2018 and 2019 but found no emphasis on the growth/profit or loss margins of their retail outlets. Though, I've heard a great deal about them and it seems like they were useful. Fun fact: MS always aimed to open their outlets in serious close proximity to Apple stores.

gjsman-1000 6y ago

It is a shame, but not unexpected. I visited the one in the Mall of America, which was ironically directly across the Apple Store. The Apple Store had much more foot traffic every single time.

donatj 6y ago
I kind of liked that they were right across from each other. Had a nice sense of competition. The Apple store moved to the other side of the mall about a year ago.

wronglebowski 6y ago

Wonder what will happen to the products at these locations. As someone who lives very close to one (King of Prussia), I'd love to see a chance to pick up some display models on the cheap.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

Theodores 6y ago

The London store is on Oxford Street and a lot of stores in that area are flagships that don't have to make money directly. Not having to have stock or cash registers just saves money, the main mission of having an impressive presence need not be burdened with actual retail sales. Some Oxford Street stores do make lots of money but there are many others where ten minutes in the store is enough for you to see what is going on. The whole range can be on show whereas in your regional town there is a fraction of the range. But you can experience the brand. Adjacent to Oxford Street is Tottenham Court Road. This was legendary in the 1990s for computer shops with fairs in nearby halls where you could buy components for competitive prices, as if nobody was paying VAT. That scene went a long time ago for more flagship stores to come along. These flagship stores don't have to make sales to cover the rent. Microsoft are part of the theme park.

thecrumb 6y ago

They should put BSOD in the windows when they close.

quicklime 6y ago

> Reimagined as experience centers Ugh, I wish we lived in a world where they could just say “converted to showrooms”.

draw_down 6y ago

The MS store in my city looks really nice. Just don't know why I would ever go in there. I don't particularly enjoy going to the Apple store either, for entirely different reasons, but maybe once or twice a year I need to.

blntechie 6y ago

Real shame. Their stores were always interesting with a mix of people checking out anything from Surface Books to kids checking out Xbox consoles and playing games etc. Unlike Apple stores, which I have always felt like a sterile hospital wing, it was a very diverse mix of people in Microsoft stores.

spunker540 6y ago

When I was in a high school busking band, we went to the local mall to make some money playing Christmas songs. We set up in front of the Apple store and within 10 minutes we’re kicked out by security. As we were leaving, someone from the fledgling Microsoft store told us they had a stage we could play on in front of their store the following day (our first “paid” gig, they gave us gift cards). The joke was on us though as it was an outdoor mall, and the temperature didn’t break 20 degrees. The guitarists fingers could barely play, but it was memorable nonetheless and presented a clear contrast in how the Apple store vs Microsoft store treated young buskers!

donarb 6y ago
Most malls don't allow buskers, solicitations or petition signing within their properties.

otterpro 6y ago

I've been to MS store only once last year to buy a laptop that was on sale. It was a good and pleasant buying experience and the staff was very friendly. However, I noticed that there weren't a lot of variety of hardware on sale. I wish they had more computer stuff, like GPU, mechanical keyboards, motherboards, etc.... Imagine if they were like mini Micro-center, I'd bet they would've been a lot more popular than Apple store. The foot traffic alone would've given them some good will for MS, if that was their intent.

sylens 6y ago
This would have been a great direction for them to go in - but the desktop building market is pretty niche these days compared to the people in the market for a MacBook Air or similar alternative.
sleepybrett 6y ago
I feel like they can't really be sure that they can push that kind of 'partsy' inventory. USB stuff sure, but GPUs, MBs, ram etc... bitsy and complicated.
mdip 6y ago
> mini Micro-center There used to be variations of a lot of these all over the place. Some were exclusively software (Babbages), some had a mix (we had a local franchise called Computer Warehouse, often located in small strip-mall locations). I loved working at CompUSA (more like Microcenter; a little smaller than the Microcenter that is a half-mile from where I worked, also formerly two miles away from a Computer City). Retail computer hardware is basically gone these days except for small, independent, shops. I'm so glad I live 20 minutes from a Micro Center. I used to live about as far from a Microsoft store, too. :)
askafriend 6y ago
> Imagine if they were like mini Micro-center, Not to be rude, but this idea is out of touch. Basically no one would want this and the PC building market is impossibly tiny today. You'd get zero foot traffic. No one is building their own computers anymore and those that are, are serviced incredibly well by Amazon/Newegg/etc.

limeblack 6y ago

In my opinion this is linked to the shutdown of windows phone. If you haven’t been following it it went from Windows Phone is dead[1]. To Bill Gates use Android[2]. Subsequently Windows Phone was removed from the Microsoft Store. [1]: https://windowsphone.stackexchange.com/questions/16686/as-2018-is-windows-phone-dead#16688 https://windowsphone.stackexchange.com/questions/16686/as-20... [2]: https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/26/16365424/bill-gates-android-phone-switch https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/26/16365424/bill-gates-andro...

JoeMayoBot 6y ago

Sad - their service was exceptional. Once had a problem with my Surface Book and they replaced it right there.

nanna 6y ago

Whenever I go past the Oxford Circus store I think to myself, if only we had stores like this for Linux.

joveian 6y ago
There are, at least here in Portland, Or (US). FreeGeek is a recycler and resells used equipment, usually with Ubuntu. They have made their store more like the Apple store over the years and reduced the number of random parts they sell (although they still have quite a few things). For Linux, any computer made in the past seven years or so that is well supported works great for a lot of people. They have a tech support window that will spend hours with people having trouble and classes in a different part of the building. The hardware itself is fairly expensive considering its age but for anyone who is likely to use the tech support it is likely one of the best deals available. https://www.freegeek.org/ https://www.freegeek.org/

ChicagoDave 6y ago

This is disappointing. The pandemic is certainly a change in my own behavior, but I regularly visited two Microsoft stores in the Chicago area and have made large purchases in each. Especially when new hardware is released, it’s great to see it within the construct of a corporate setting. Of course the Best Buy model of having manufacturer space like a mini mall helps balance this loss, it’s not the same level of interaction. Very disappointing.

matthewfelgate 6y ago

Microsoft had retail stores?

tolger 6y ago

This makes me sad. I thought the Microsoft Store at the Domain in Austin was very cool and I visited from time to time. There was also an Apple store in the same location so I could visit both! And there was a Borders Bookstore, which I loved browsing in, and is also closed now :-(

jkinudsjknds 6y ago

I wonder if we'll see large corp retail outlets disappear faster than small businesses

sbisson 6y ago

Of course the other question is: will there be any malls left open for stores like these? I suspect this a calculation many retail stores are toying with at the moment; we're in the middle of a fundamental shift in retail to online and local stores. We've already seen one mall owner in the UK go into administration.

yodon 6y ago

The service I've received in Microsoft stores when I've needed tech support has been nothing short of phenomenal. Their "genius bar" equivalent is simply the best I've ever used.

gojomo 6y ago

If past is prelude, they'll try again, within about a decade. They first tried a retail store ~1999-2001, before even Apple, with at least one outlet being in San Francisco's downtown 'Metreon': https://www.technologizer.com/2009/10/20/1999-microsoft-store-vs-2009-microsoft-store/ https://www.technologizer.com/2009/10/20/1999-microsoft-stor... (By my recollection, it was somewhere within the 2nd-floor footprint of the Target that's there now... not far from the bowling alley/arcade.)

yarrel 6y ago

This makes sense. Microsoft are not a retail company. Copying Apple's stores made no sense either economically or aesthetically.

sleepybrett 6y ago

I'm not a huge fan of microsoft, but I think this is a huge mistake. I've been into the local MS store here in seattle (uvillage) on occasion to quickly grab hardware or software from time to time. While it is clearly a sad apple follow it always makes me feel a little better about MS as a company. It does something to humanize them. So yeah, do they make a ton of money for them? Of course not. Are they great for the brand, I'd argue yes.

martinesko36 6y ago

How is this the news to come from a company with $1.5T mkt cap? How is Microsoft possibly valued so highly? They can't even ship a redesign on Windows.

yahyaheee 6y ago

Guess the “we’re cool like apple” play didn’t work out

partiallypro 6y ago

I'm going to miss this. I was at a conference in San Francisco, dropped my Surface. Shattering the screen. Luckily I could just walk to thew Microsoft Store and they replaced it. I would have been so screwed if that store wasn't there. I liked being able to go in and see the new Surface hardware before launches. Best Buy would usually not get display units until after launch. I've replaced an Xbox that had a bad HDMI unit...I'd had have to have waited a week to get a new unit, but instead I just went to the Microsoft Store and got it done immediately. I wish they would just scale them down instead of shutting it all down.

gentleman11 6y ago

Microsoft’s stores were very nice except that they had double the staff they needed and were using headsets to coordinate their sales efforts and pressure me into buying things... several of their main brands also had histories of installing spyware on their consumer devices which made me really uncomfortable and kept me from buying a couple of times (Lenovo, Dell, razer, another I forget)

WorldMaker 6y ago
Microsoft Stores actually had a policy that the PCs they sold were only allowed to have clean OS images ("Signature Edition" was the branding term), which means that it was the safest place to buy Lenovo/Dell/etc. You'd pay on average about $50 more than if you bought directly from Lenovo or Dell, but you'd have peace of mind that you wouldn't need to reinstall Windows to make sure that you had removed all the spyware/adware. ETA: Which is maybe the biggest loss with the Microsoft Stores going away. You could point a relative at a Microsoft Store and not worry about any PC they picked, but any other store you'd need to expect to do a reinstall for them or worry about which specific brand name they picked.

chasd00 6y ago

they could probably turn half the store into xbox arcades and break even. However, covid19 throws that and probably any other investment heavy retail idea right out the window.

alexashka 6y ago

It'll be interesting to see what happens when most Best Buys follow suit and we have no stores left to come in and try non-Apple products. In some sense, this is a big window of opportunity for Dell to get smart and fix their website from looking like a warehouse dump for nerds who want the best deal and give a shit about specs, to actual customers who just to see an intuitive product line-up and extra details if and when they want that.

smoyer 6y ago

Apparently if you're not dramatically over-charging for your consumer technology products, you can't afford brick-and-mortar locations. Those who do pay for the premium platform should realize that not (nearly) all of the additional cost goes into product quality. Note that this discounts design superiority/inferiority.

scarface74 6y ago
By definition, if people are buying at the price that Apple sets at the margins Apple wants and there are alternatives, the product is not “overpriced”. That’s kind of Economics 101
- smoyer 6y ago
  True ... I should have used the word "premium" instead to represent the economic difference in the unit price and associated margins.

coliveira 6y ago

MS stores were created trying to emulate the success of Apple stores. However, from the get go this was a strange decision, since MS has no exclusivity on HW. Even Xbox can be purchased on other physical and online stores, sometimes at a cheaper price. They also don't provide support to a lot of this hardware, opposed to Apple that also uses stores as as service centers.

smabie 6y ago
You can buy Apple products from other places too, though.

twblalock 6y ago

At one of the biggest malls in San Jose, there is a Microsoft Store and an Apple Store right across the hallway from each other. On a normal day, anyone walking by could see that the Apple Store was packed with people, and the bored employees at the Microsoft store were standing around with nothing to do. It was kind of sad. It's not like Microsoft didn't have popular stuff to sell, especially the Xbox.

awa 6y ago

I am bummed about this. The Microsoft store near me was a great place to check out the latest windows hardware and what xbox is upto nowadays. I liked that I could just hang out at the store and browse around with no sales pressure.

racl101 6y ago

Apple stores, on the other hands, are like popular night clubs these days. I was at the mall the other day and saw a long line up of people looking to get in and a girl with an iPad looking through her list to see if she could admit people immediately (the people who made appointments), or make them wait (those who didn't).

topkai22 6y ago

Not surprising to me, but its really too bad. The consumer side was always hopeless, but I thought the stores provided a great hook into the small business, education, and non-profit sectors- orgs too small to have anything resembling a decent IT department who needed help. I wonder what the effort would look like if those customers had been the focus instead of individual consumers.

legitster 6y ago

Microsoft stores are (were?) magical places full of bizarre and weird devices. I actually had fun going in and seeing all sorts of gadgets and devices and playing with demos. A candy store for futurists. In comparison Apple stores are dystopian places full of rows of identical looking people looking at rows of identical beige phones. But I think it's pretty telling that I loved hanging out in them, but never spent any money there.

alexchantavy 6y ago
So funny that 10 years ago views about Microsoft and Apple were near the exact opposite of what you described here.
- nolok 6y ago
  They really weren't. Ten years ago Apple had even more conformity and less choice than now, while Microsoft offering already full of fun stuff that would not exist anymore 3 years later.
buzzert 6y ago
I couldn’t agree more. I absolutely fell in love with the Surface Studio they had on display there. It was really set up to make a great demo too, preloaded with software that takes advantage of the “wheel” device and stylus. Not only that, it was the only place where I’m sure I’ll ever see the Surface Hub[0]. An incredible “interactive whiteboard” running a special version of Windows 10, the price of which is “please ask for a quote”. The Microsoft store was really like a mini CES more than a showroom for Microsoft things. I will miss it dearly. [0] https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/business/surface-hub-2 https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/business/surface-hub...

thordenmark 6y ago

Sad to hear, but unsurprising. The MS store near us looked nice yet was always a ghost town. They're just not as sexy as an Apple store, though they've done a great job with the latest versions of Windows and the XBox is fairly popular.

gketuma 6y ago
So you mean Steve Jobs was right when he said: "They just have no taste." https://www.computerworld.com/article/2471632/steve-jobs-on-microsoft---they-just-have-no-taste--.html https://www.computerworld.com/article/2471632/steve-jobs-on-...

skuthus 6y ago

I guess I can say this now. I worked for 5 years at the most revenue-generating microsoft store in the world. We were near the official Microsoft campus. The short answer is that things started to change internally around 2017, where stores changed their hiring requirements and excised a lot of their top talent in favor of lower-paid, less enthusiastic management and employees. This has been a steady downhill process since - It is a shame that the stores will no longer be. I loved my time working there, and loved the people and connections I made there both personally and professionally. We genuinely went out of our way to make customers happy, no matter the cost. It was inevitable that kind of goodwill would be snuffed out by profit motive eventually.

quyleanh 6y ago
It is disappointed. I love Microsoft and their services. I do expect Microsoft will take their real effort and focus to customer, the end user, but looks like it will never happen.

m3kw9 6y ago

Went in to a MS store just once ever. Before I go in, I always ask myself what have I not seen in windows already? Touch screen with a windows, not very hard to predict how it is same as using a pointer. That VR demo? I’m not gonna wait and look stupid. Maybe they failed to sell intrigue compared to Apple stores. Their products has mystique to it when they first come out and you always want to try it.

city41 6y ago
Apple hasn't really released anything new in quite some time. Pretty much just iterative releases and upgrades. yet Apple stores are often so crowded you can't even walk in them. I think it's more than just new product launches.

PaulWaldman 6y ago

This is disappointing because the Microsoft stores seemed to be the only retail B&Ms that carried premium Windows hardware. Aside from a few outliers, stores like Best Buy tend to focus on volume Windows machines (Inspiron, IdealPad, Pavillion). What's the alternative, buying three computers online and returning the two you don't like?

Redoubts 6y ago

The company tells The Verge that no layoffs will result from today’s decision. “Our commitment to growing and developing careers from this diverse talent pool is stronger than ever,” Impressive, but pretty curious how they plan to successfully pull this off.

MisterBiggs 6y ago

I've always had great experiences at the Microsoft store especially with purchases and replacements. Right after the pandemic caused Microsoft to close all their physical locations my Surface Pro 7 started getting green spots on the screen that I've been waiting for the stores to reopen to get replaced. Hearing the news today that the store wasn't going to be open I decided to try the online support and it is a total mess. I tried to use text chat but after an hour my position in the queue actually went up. So I decided to have them call me which the wait took much longer than quoted. Then I spent over an hour on the phone with a representative for what they even admitted was obviously a manufacturer defect. They didn't want to send me a new device before I shipped them my RMA unit so they expected me to be without my laptop for a week while they processed the claim. Then when they finally caved they couldn't tell me how large of a hold they would put on my card while before my RMA reached them. This whole process would have taken 5 minutes at the store, and I would have walked out with a new laptop right then. All in all I feel like all my Microsoft hardware products just massively depreciated in value.

WWLink 6y ago
I had a surface pro 1, and when it decided to randomly completely fail, I called and was met with the same kinda customer service treatment you explained. They offered to replace my week old tablet with a refurb if I shipped mine to them and waited a couple weeks. I found out there was a MS store right by where my internship was, so I stopped by, explained my problem and showed it to them, and they handed me a new replacement on the spot. So yeah, same experience here lol. I wasn't going to mention it because I figured they had gotten better by now. I'm sad to hear they haven't! That.. means I probably won't be buying any surface hardware again lol.
TwoNineFive 6y ago
> All in all I feel like all my Microsoft hardware products just massively depreciated in value. Great observation. Top comment in this thread.

goatherders 6y ago

I always enjoyed the store, there is one 100 yards from where I sit right now. But a store where the point is for people to touch as many things as possible is probably not a viable thing anymore.

ryuukk_ 6y ago

good hardware trash software

LeicaLatte 6y ago

Surprised they took this decision on a console launch year.

hosker4u 6y ago

Maybe because im based in the North of the UK, I've never been or should I say seen a Microsoft Retail Store. Walked past plenty of Apple Stores.