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A Statement About Mahbod’s Annotations on Elliot Rodger’s Manifesto
- angersock 12y agoI wish they had they shown the annotations that caused the firing. The Valleywag link elsewhere has one screenshot, but other than being in poor taste I'm not sure why this rates a firing/step down.
- minimaxir 12y agoIt's about context: the annotations were glorifying a manifesto that was the prelude to mass murder.
- angersock 12y agoSo, some parts clearly were, right, complimenting the writing style and whatnot (which, honestly, wasn't great, but whatever)? That comment about his sister I viewed more as teasing/disparaging the author--your mileage may vary. Reading a bit more about the dude from Rapgenius, though, he seems like kind of a gangsta-wannabe tool.
- gordonguthrie 12y agoBut they are still turning violence against women into page views.
- jonknee 12y agoBut not any money since they don't have any advertising.
- JumpCrisscross 12y agoAnd employees of charities turn their causes into paycheques. Relationships need not be selfless to be mutually beneficial.
- biaxident 12y agoWhat's the difference between this and any news outlet?
- dmix 12y agoNobody loves glorifying a murderous rampage quite like CNN et al.
- droopyEyelids 12y agoAre you talking about rap music or the Isla Vista massacre?
- thesimpsons1022 12y agodon't forget a majority of the victims were men. 3 stabbed in their apartment and 1 shot. :(
- gordonguthrie 12y agoBecause his planned attack on the sorority failed. The manifesto is gynocidal.
- oh_sigh 12y ago.....and?
- girvo 12y agoAnd his videos were specifcally saying he hated everyone. He was a severely mentally ill sick person who is now dead and took innocent people with him. Seriously, misogyny doesn't have all that much to do with it, from my perspective. Yes, he was a misogynist, but the unsaid implication I've seen all over the web is that "All misogynists are just like this guy!", which doesn't follow, as far as I'm concerned. I just write misogynists off as sad people that I won't associate with, not violent murderers waiting for a chance to "show the world".
- MartinCron 12y agoPart of the fear that many people have is that you can't always tell the difference between a garden-variety "just angry at chicks" guy and a "one bad day away from taking out a sorority guy" until it is too late.
- girvo 12y agoYeah, I'll grant that. Serial killers throughout history often hid their broken-ness for years while getting away with it all... but this isn't a common occurrence. This isn't something that should factor into a persons risk-assessment while going about their daily life. This is a sad, messed up situation, but the reason it's so news-worthy is because this doesn't happen that often (thank <insert deity>)
- onewaystreet 12y agoNo more so than any news site.
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- minimaxir 12y agoMahbod has been fired (i.e. not "resigned") due to these comments. http://recode.net/2014/05/26/rap-genius-co-founder-moghadam-fired/ http://recode.net/2014/05/26/rap-genius-co-founder-moghadam-...
- nightpool 12y agoThat's literally what the OP says, from a primary source.
- deleted 12y ago[deleted]
- nightpool 12y ago>Were Mahbod’s annotations posted by a new Rap Genius user, it would be up to our community leaders, who set the tone of the site and our approach to annotation, to delete them and explain to the new user why they were unacceptable. >Were Mahbod’s annotations posted by a Rap Genius moderator, that person would cease to be an effective community leader and would have to step down. >And Mahbod, our original community leader, is no exception. Sounds pretty conclusive to me. And here's mahbod's tweet from recently >I want to apologize to everyone. I need to hear these criticisms, reflect for real, and work on becoming a better person So I'm guessing its a little of both.
- aroman 12y ago>One implies consent on Mahbod's part (he acknowledges that he did wrong) while the other means he had to be forcibly ejected from RapGenius. That's a false dichotomy. He did acknowledge that he did wrong (although OP's link does not state it — he announced it elsewhere beforehand). That doesn't mean he feels that the proper course of action was his no longer being part of the company. The big difference is whether he decided he should resign, or whether he was either forced or convinced to resigned.
- RKoutnik 12y ago> The entire group of founder already has wallowed into a number of controversial issues, calling attention mostly to their idiotic hijinks than to their business. A claim like that should carry a source at least. Not all of us follow RapGenius' every move.
- JumpCrisscross 12y agoContext: http://gawker.com/rap-genius-co-founders-creepy-comments-on-elliot-rodger-1581469310 http://gawker.com/rap-genius-co-founders-creepy-comments-on-... Mahbod compliments several of Rodger's sentences as "artful" and/or "beautifully written". That is okay, if ill-timed. One can make a stylistic statement about Mein Kampf without endorsing its message. He also, however, speculates that Rodger's "sister is smokin' hot." That is violently inappropriate, particularly given the misogynistic nature of Elliot's crimes.
- grlhgr420 12y agostepping away from the context for a moment, the writing is also fucking terrible and overwrought. it reads like a cross between ignatius reilly and sephiroth
- nailer 12y agoSpeculating Rodger's sister was attractive might be mildly inappropriate, but, it's also relevant to understanding the nature of his killings, particularly as they seem to be based around sexual frustration. I think 'violently inappropriate' is being used by the internet echo chamber to draw attention to themselves.
- Argorak 12y agoThere was, by the way, a german artist (http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serdar_Somuncu http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serdar_Somuncu) who commented that actually reading Mein Kampf exposes it as a very bad and simple book and no one should be surprised of Hitlers actions later after reading. Also, one of his point is that it is terrible in style and mostly rambling. He also went on a tour and actually read the book on > 1000 occasions and won multiple prices. Now, imagine Serdar doing that in 1946. He would - for good reasons - be ostracized. Mahbod, even if he were "only" commenting on stylistic things, shows that he is lacking something very important: tact and empathy. This is not a triviality and as such not "okay". He also didn't frame the comment in any way (e.g. "I am surprised to see such an artfully..."). He should have seen that coming. If he hadn't, he shouldn't be leading any community.
- edwardhotchkiss 12y ago
- cheetos 12y agoWho are RapGenius' investors? Who is bankrolling these people?
- deleted 12y ago[deleted]
- minimaxir 12y agoAndreessen Horowitz, to the tune of $15M. Rap Genius was also a part of YC S11. http://techcrunch.com/2012/10/03/andreessen-horowitz-iinvests-15-million-in-rap-genius/ http://techcrunch.com/2012/10/03/andreessen-horowitz-iinvest... http://www.crunchbase.com/organization/rap-genius http://www.crunchbase.com/organization/rap-genius
- cheetos 12y agoThanks.
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- Asparagirl 12y agoThe same people who bankroll(ed) GitHub. This is my shocked face.
- tptacek 12y agoThat is a tired, cheap, superficial point that is beneath this site. If you want to build a case against valley startup culture --- and there sure are cases to be made --- try to do it without creating a caricature of everyone else who has concerns as well.
- Asparagirl 12y ago
- darkrabbi 12y agoApparently this guy had a brain tumor and this wasn't the first time he's publicly embarrassed the company. He tweeted from the RapGenius account "WARREN BUFFETT CAN SUCK MY DICK". http://www.fastcompany.com/3021564/most-creative-people/how-a-brain-tumor-made-the-cofounder-of-rap-genius-rethink-business http://www.fastcompany.com/3021564/most-creative-people/how-... http://www.slate.com/blogs/browbeat/2013/02/22/rap_genius_warren_buffett_feud_why_does_mahbod_moghadam_hate_the_wizard.html http://www.slate.com/blogs/browbeat/2013/02/22/rap_genius_wa...
- minimaxir 12y agoThe brain tumor was removed...and the public behavior was unchanged. http://valleywag.gawker.com/rap-genius-frontman-blames-brain-tumor-for-asshole-beha-1450872105 http://valleywag.gawker.com/rap-genius-frontman-blames-brain...
- DoubleMalt 12y agoSad but the brain tumour could still be the reason for his behaviour. We don't know nearly enough about the brain to argue that the removal must restore the previous personality.
- dbloom 12y agoBehavior like that is not acceptable for someone in a position of authority at a company no matter what the context. (It's not clear what Moghadam's specific role at Rap Genius was, but he did have a seat on the board of directors) It's the same reason that we shouldn't let blind people fly commercial airliners. Flying requires vision. Running a company requires good judgement.
- throneaway 12y agoBad analogy. Words never hurt anybody, and a healthy society can handle a few tactless words. Our society seeks opportunities to punish. We revel in inflicting pain on others while ourselves feel righteous.
- nightpool 12y agoPersonally, I think this is a long time coming. Like, Tom, I have nothing but respect for Maboo, but I think many, many people have raised the point that his, for lack of a better word, "antics" are holding the site back. I know a lot of people in the HN community have been sharply critical of him, and for good reason. Maybe that's the main driver here, and Maboo's absolutely inappropriate response is the catalyst.
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- billmalarky 12y agoI don't know much about RG's history, but I wonder if his antics are partly why the site was so successful initially? From the little I've seen of RG over the years it seems like they rely heavily on gimmicks and antics as a promotional tool (I guess that's sort of the MO for the music industry though).
- nightpool 12y agoI absolutely believe the site couldn't have gotten where it was today without Mahbod at its head. But I think that the way forward is, regrettably, without him for a while. I fully believe he can come back from this more mature and focused. But I think its going to require a bit of soul-searching.
- billmalarky 12y agoI'm sure he will land on his feet quite well with his connections (and equity no doubt). Everybody goofs and the permanent and public nature of the internet can be very unforgiving. I wish him nothing but the best in the future with his health and career.
- onewaystreet 12y agoIf it was just the annotations I'd be surprised, but this is just another incident by Mahbod that has caused RapGenius bad press. It was the last straw.
- tptacek 12y agoI can appreciate RG's leadership having the self-awareness to see the need to make an Adult Decision in this case, but I think it's probably a mistake for them to continue hosting the Rodgers diary. Contrary to Moghadam's comments, the diary is not particularly well-written. It's long, repetitive, weirdly detailed (the author recounts meals eaten years ago), and studded with evidence of psychopathy. RG's style of annotation works extremely well for some kinds of writing --- song lyrics, The Great Gatsby, TS Eliot poems. What I think those things have in common is that they're hospitable to "riffing" and cross-linking; for instance, the lyrics to the ICP song where they come out of the closet as religious are totally incongruous until RG annotations inform you that they're reprised lyrics from previous ICP songs. But riffing on Rodgers diary doesn't serve the same purpose, at least so close to the event. It is instead a minefield; almost anything you can say risks diminishing the tragedy, or misapprehending how the mind of a deeply mentally ill person functions, or, god help us, using the output of that mind as a platform on which to build suggestions on changing our culture. There may be some point at which RG annotations will add value to this terribly sad artifact of Elliot Rodgers, but it probably won't be in 2014.
- brador 12y ago"It's long, repetitive, weirdly detailed (the author recounts meals eaten years ago), and studded with evidence of psychopathy." That's exactly why it should be studied.
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- arfliw 12y agoSounds like somebody wanted to get rid of a co-founder and found a great opportunity to do it.
- rl3 12y agoObviously Mahbod's latest annotations were inappropriate. Based on his past behavior, these recent antics should not come as much of a surprise. As an aside, it has always amazed me how many people over the years have failed to realize Rap Genius' gimmick is just that, a gimmick. It's their attempt at using an admittedly off-color flavor of comedy to build their brand. Said brand is heavily rooted in rap, which is one of the most politically incorrect and offensive mediums of pop culture in existence today. It stands to reason that when the Rap Genius founders are in character, their behavior should not be taken literally as a reflection of who they really are. A good example of this is when they were featured on stage at TechCrunch Disrupt 2013: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5773556 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5773556 Most people simply took them literally, became offended, and jumped on the revulsion bandwagon. Others understood that the RG guys were essentially mocking the startup scene and the rap scene at the same time, in effect making fun of themselves. --- In Mahbod's case specifically, it seemed like he was aiming for humor that went right up to the line but didn't cross it. Unfortunately, comedy is a hit-or-miss endeavor and some of the misses were bound to cross that line. Add to that his medical issues potentially adversely affecting his judgement, and it's no wonder. Was what he said inappropriate? Absolutely. Should he have been fired for it? Debatable. Should we assume he's a terrible human being (as some other comments have implied)? Certainly not.
- grumpypants666 12y agoThis should have been done long ago when he was caught in the paid link scam - not sure why it took them so long to fire his ass. But then again this is another worthless company with no scruples. Hosting the "manifesto" is nothing but an attempt at link bait via sensationalism. Who gives a crap about what the psycho wrote - Rap Genius is just hosting it for more page views - because well, they'll bend over and drop trou' for anything that will bring them traffic. Can't wait until Rap Genius ends up in the dustbin of dead companies.
- coldtea 12y ago>but went beyond that into gleeful insensitivity and misogyny. All of which is contrary to everything we’re trying to accomplish at Rap Genius. Yeah, because otherwise most rap is all about sensitivity and feminism. I mean, they'd never embrace Ice Cube's records there, right? I just see corporate drones fearing for their dollars because of the backslash against this guy's annotations. The noble thing to do would have been to stand behind their colleague. I'd take a "misogynist" over backstabbing people throwing their friends to the lions. At least a misogynist could either be joking or made to change his mind about women. But their actions are all for personal interests and their bottom line.
- adventured 12y agoYou're not going to find very many people in tech that are going to get within a million miles of seriously discussing that Rap Genius is filled with bigoted, racist, misogynist content. The political correct world today is strictly about inflicting damage upon populist targets, while not targeting other bigots that don't qualify for the agenda. It's a deranged movement of convenient targets.
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