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There was a more detailed account floating around. Essentially, each battery cell is in its own fire-resistant compartment. The fire crew that responded to the
by mdmarra 13y ago
There was a more detailed account floating around. Essentially, each battery cell is in its own fire-resistant compartment. The fire crew that responded to the call used procedures that are standard for other electric cars, but are not proper for a Tesla. Essentially, they "punched through" these compartments in an attempt to extinguish the fire, which actually exacerbated the problem by allowing the fire to spread to other battery cells.
When the fire department arrived, they observed standard procedure, which was to gain access to the source of the fire by puncturing holes in the top of the battery's protective metal plate and applying water. For the Model S lithium-ion battery, it was correct to apply water (vs. dry chemical extinguisher), but not to puncture the metal firewall, as the newly created holes allowed the flames to then vent upwards into the front trunk section of the Model S. Nonetheless, a combination of water followed by dry chemical extinguisher quickly brought the fire to an end.
http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/model-s-fire http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/model-s-fire
I saw a Nissan in fire a month or so ago outside of Philly. Car fires happen regardless of engine technology.
- threeseed 13y ago> Car fires happen regardless of engine technology. Of course. But nobody has statistics about the rate of fires per accident type. And remember that this isn't necessarily a reflection on the engine technology but more so the design of the car. Given that accidents often result in debris and also that people drive over stupid things maybe batteries shouldn't be under the cabin floor.
- 001sky 13y agohttp://www.nfpa.org/~/media/files/research/nfpa%20reports/vehicles/osautomobilefires.pdf http://www.nfpa.org/~/media/files/research/nfpa%20reports/ve... Its pretty rare for car fires to happen on public highways. Most car fires are incidents with a vehicle at rest, or deliberately set. Something like 2% of accidents involve petrol based fuels systems. Many more are cuased by other issues. Telsla (as an example) previously recalled ~40% of its Roadster models in 2010 for fire-hazard related faulty wiring. That kind of thing would be attributable to any type of car. The high incidence of Model S LiIon fires in the field, is much more problematic and worrisome, IMHO. Like you say, it may just be a design flaw on the location of the battery pack. Aft of the front axle is a debri-zone, wheras aft of the rear axle would be more protected from debris (but subject to crumple zone impacts compromizing the integrity of the pack directly or through shrapnel)
- cma 13y agoThe problem with tesla is the active suspension dropping you to a couple inches off the road on the highway. Debris that you would normally pass over shoots into the under carraige..
- sjwright 13y agoPerhaps they could use a radar scanner at the front to look for oversized objects, and react by pumping the suspension up to maximum height?
- cma 13y agoWould probably cause instability and loss of traction (at apex) right before a defensive swerve.
- sjwright 13y agoBy apex I presume you're saying that as the suspension finishes lifting the car, the act of effectively "throwing" the car up into the air will momentarily lower the apparent sprung weight. Makes sense. If the suspension can act very suddenly, it could execute only when collision is unavoidably imminent.
- andrew3000 13y agomercedes has something sorta similar... it adjust the suspension to adjust for pot holes.
- jthol 13y agoDoes anyone know what the size of this hitch was? What I'm picturing isn't all that large.
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- ajcarpy2005 13y ago
- moocowduckquack 13y agoBut nobody has statistics about the rate of fires per accident type. What planet are you on?
- JoeAltmaier 13y agoLink?
- moocowduckquack 13y agoThink.
- 001sky 13y agoSame problem in the WA fire. You cannot extinguish a LiIon fire without (it seems) cutting the car open. In Wa, they put out the fire and it restarted. They had to flip it over and cut holes in it (presumably, through the floor) see > https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6498232 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6498232
- MertsA 13y agoThe thing to remember with a battery fire is that it's not enough to just put out the flaming electrolyte, when the battery is shorted out you don't just lose all that energy, it gets converted into heat which is what ignites the electrolyte. The battery in a Model S is made up of 11 modules so when one of these modules is shorted you don't have the entire capacity of the battery being turned into heat but depending on if an entire module was shorted out or maybe two adjoining modules that's still a lot of energy and once the whole thing starts burning you might compromise the other batteries in the system. Tesla engineered firewalls in between the battery modules but it's not like it's fireproof forever, it just means the heat has to transfer through conduction and gives the driver additional time before the vehicle goes up or before the fire department gets there. What might be a good improvement is a 2.5 inch fire hydrant fitting under the back of the car that the fire department could connect to to flood the battery compartment with water and just hook the car up to a hydrant for 30 minutes to make sure the fire stays out.
- taternuts 13y agoI've never seen a car fire until last week, when I passed by this: http://i.imgur.com/k0xylRe.png http://i.imgur.com/k0xylRe.png. I was really surprised at how large the fire was (it looked worse in person)
- tedunangst 13y agoIt seems putting the onus on every fire department to learn new tesla procedures may be the wrong approach.
- alayne 13y agoWhy do you say that? The fire department is a service hired by us to extinguish our stuff. Didn't they learn how to put out gasoline engine car fires 100 years ago? They should have refused because they only knew how to put out horse fires?
- midgetjones 13y agoDon't joke, horse fires are a very real problem.
- tedunangst 13y agoIn those 100 years, we've learned a thing or two. Which is why we have fire codes and whatnot. We reduce the variation in the number of expected scenarios. I'll also note that in general, it is easier to learn something different when it's not similar to what you already know. Horse fire vs car fire is easy. Car type A vs car type B vs car type C is more difficult.
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- JshWright 13y agoTesla is actually _really_ good at distributing training materials to emergency responders. All vehicle manufacturers do it some some extent, but Tesla sets a very high bar. As an example, check out this training video they put together: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntK3rvVl2Qw http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntK3rvVl2Qw (skip to 26:45 for the fun part ;) This video in particular is about extrication, not firefighting, but you get the idea... We train frequently to deal with the new challenges presented by electric vehicles.
- tedunangst 13y ago
- chenster 13y agoTesla has no engine. Oh, don't follow a truck. http://www.teslamotors.com/models/features#/safety http://www.teslamotors.com/models/features#/safety