9 ms·

The American Who Designed the PlayStation 4 and Remade Sony

99 points by freshrap6 13y ago

sjtgraham 13y ago
The Cerny Method sounds remarkably like the Lean Startup Method, but apparently pre-dates it quite significantly.
- quanticle 13y ago
  That's exactly what I was going to say. Even the terminology, "publishable first playable" echoes the "minimum viable product" terminology that's in vogue with lean startup practitioners.
- ChuckMcM 13y ago
  Agreed, and to their credit both are designed to solve the same problem which is to maximize the likelyhood that you're spending the money on the right thing. Long gone are the days when some decides to plop down a million dollars to make some random game, that will be first seen by customers when it is in the retail box.
- Tiktaalik 13y ago
  The product of this style of production is most often called a "vertical slice." A slice of cake has just a thin amount of cake, but it contains every layer of cake. In this analogy the cake is the whole game and the vertical slice is a tiny snippit of the game (ie. a short level) where all features (every layer of cake) of the core functionality of the game is present.
- infinii 13y ago
  I had the exact same thoughts while reading the article. Cerny created MVPs of games, got feedback and would pivot/change based on user feedback. And he did this in the mid 90's!!
  - robmcm 13y ago
    It's not a MVP if you have to build the whole game engine, but it's simular I guess.
- robmcm 13y ago
  I think this approach is evident in Metal Gear Solid Ground Zeros (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-11-04-metal-gear-solid-5-ground-zeroes-due-spring-2014 http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-11-04-metal-gear-soli...). It's a level of the main game, but they are actually releasing it for $29. Taking this approach to the next level!
ye 13y ago
PS4 is just a PC stuck in one configuration, linked to a popular delivery system. I don't get what the hype is about. Yes, it's a pretty good configuration at a reasonable price. But that will only be the case for a few months. PCs will catch up very quickly and will become cheaper, and then much cheaper. As somebody who loves games, I don't see a reason to buy PS4. I'd rather spend a bit more on a PC, and then upgrade it as I go. The positive thing I see is the PS4 <-> PC game portability. No longer developers need to have to very different engines and codebases. That's why PS4 is a much better option than XBox One in my eyes.
- quanticle 13y ago
  The XBox One is an x86 architecture as well. Pretty much everything that you said about the PS4 also applies to XBox One. Now, there are differences between the consoles, but fundamentally both of the next-gen consoles are x86 CPUs tied to memory architectures that are designed to stream HD content to the screen as fast as possible.
  - ewzimm 13y ago
    What does processor architecture even matter to a consumer? Is the Xbox 360 a pre-Intel Mac because it uses PowerPC archictecture? I don't see why so many people mention this. Consoles have always been about custom software, not unique hardware architecture.
    - lukeman 13y ago
      The boring nature of the architecture is notable as it puts the focus back on software, which is what people care about. That devs this generation can just make shit without discovering the complexities of custom hardware is a good thing.
      - ewzimm 13y ago
        That's probably true for Playstation, but I think developing for Xbox was already pretty much like developing for Windows, even with different hardware architectures. Most game devs don't looking too deeply at the hardware but just use the tools they're given. The ones who want to understand what's going on in hardware will still study the details of the CPU/GPU.
bradleyjg 13y ago
The PS4 may well make for a better video game machine and more profit for Sony, but it's too bad the very interesting and powerful cell processor concept will be relegated to the dustbin.
- ginko 13y ago
  The APU in the PS4 picks up many ideas from the Cell processor. You have some heavy cores for program logic and many small ones for graphics and computation tasks. Both on the same piece of silicon and attached to the same memory space.
  - ekianjo 13y ago
    Maybe, but it does not seem to be very powerful at all. I've seen most of the upcoming games for launch (and played about half of them) and I was far from being impressed. It feels like a mid-range gaming PC kind of power at best, and many games apparently struggled to run in full HD, with the framerate low enough to make you feel you were back in the PS2 days. If they are planning to sell these consoles solely on the graphics, they'll have a tough time.
    - ginko 13y ago
      That's another topic. It's still a lot more powerful than the original Cell in the PS3. (And a lot easier to program to boot) Sony originally intended to have the cell do all the rasterization work in the PS3. They had to add an additional NVidia GPU in the last moment once Cell proved too slow to do that at competitive speed. That was one of the reasons why the PS3 was so expensive at launch.
    - georgemcbay 13y ago
      A mid-range gaming PC that's ready to play out of the box for $400 is nothing to slouch at. Also, keep in mind that the original launch titles for the Xbox 360 looked like this: http://ve3dmedia.ign.com/ve3d/image/article/655/655564/perfect-dark-zero-screenshots-20051003115038069.jpg http://ve3dmedia.ign.com/ve3d/image/article/655/655564/perfe... Launch titles are generally either carry-over concepts from earlier consoles and/or are drastically rushed to hit a very hard deadline, the titles hitting in the next couple of years will up the ante significantly. That aside, I'm personally looking forward to next Friday quite a bit, as my preordered PS4 from Amazon is supposed to be arriving that day and having played around with some of the games already I'm really looking forward to more time with Killzone, Knack and Assassin's Creed 4. FWIW, I'm one of those gamers who was a huge fan of the Xbox, mostly due to Live as a multiplayer platform, but I'm looking much more forward to the PS4 than the Xbox One, in fact I have no immediate plans to buy a One, though I'm sure I'll probably buy one eventually (much like I bought a PS3 eventually, but that wasn't until this year).
ChuckMcM 13y ago
This was a good read, and the narrative between Sony's launch and Microsoft's launch has the feel of some pretty classic hero's journey stuff in it. The interesting upstart this time seems to be the SteamBox.
paulftw 13y ago
They should have mentioned the number of titles at launch for xbox one. If ease of making games is such a big deal why aren't there any facts on how far behind their main competitor is.
- mindrag 13y ago
  Because that will be forgotten in a matter of weeks as more titles begin to roll out for both platforms.
- Narishma 13y ago
  Xbox One only launches with a couple more retail titles. PS4 launches with a dozen or so more PSN titles.
6ren 13y ago
I'm seeing a pattern, a cycle between hubris and humility. When Nintendo ruled, Sony broke in by courting game developers. Then, they became arrogant, and made the best hardware they could, they was difficult to use. Thus, Microsoft won, simply because it was easier for developers. It was then amazing to see how arrogant they had become with the xboxone trying to squeeze everyone, in every way - similar to how they removed the ability to cancel xbox live online. What Microsoft didn't realize is that they didn't win - Sony lost, by shooting themselves in the foot. But in this generation, if PS4 is easy to develop for, cheaper, more powerful, and not trying to squeeze every cent and control every aspect... things will be different. Of course, Microsoft will see their mistake and adjust (as they've done many times). But while they can drop prices and relax controls, it may be difficult to make their console more powerful. Also, next year, mobile devices should reach GPU parity with last gen consoles... and with their faster iteration cycle, match PS4/xboxone three years after that. (unlike CPUs, GPUs scale really well).
- Keyframe 13y ago
  I get what you're saying, but Microsoft never won any console race http://www.geekwire.com/2013/xbox-360-wii-ps3-won-console-generation/ http://www.geekwire.com/2013/xbox-360-wii-ps3-won-console-ge...
  - abarringer 13y ago
    From the original article. "When the PS3 launched, according to most estimates, Sony controlled about 70 percent of the console market. Seven years later, it’s on even terms with Microsoft, whose Xbox 360 outsold the PS3 in the U.S. for 32 consecutive months." Going from 70% to "even" with Microsoft seems like a non-win?
    - deleted 13y ago
      [deleted]
  - sillysaurus2 13y ago
    That graph is incredible. I had no idea holidays mattered so much. They may as well be the reason the industry exists.
6ren 13y ago
It makes a lot of sense to just a build a piece of it first — but that piece needs to be representative. You can’t just hack something together.” He calls this prototype a “publishable first playable,” A better explanation of MVP than most.
AnaRizaMae 13y ago
good article...
blt 13y ago
Unified memory architecture! Should be some cool hybrid cpu/gpu algorithm possibilities. Currently the overhead of copying stuff between the two memories in CUDA prevents any fine-grained cooperation. I wonder how much gpgpu ability is exposed.
jmpeax 13y ago
I want to know how much Sony payed Wired for that advertism... article.
fit2rule 13y ago
So I'm clueless as I haven't been paying attention to this market since the PS4/XBox360 were released - does the PS4 not run PS3 titles? If so, does it have some emulation or is it new hardware sitting on top of the old Cell design?
- chucknelson 13y ago
  Neither PS4 or Xbox One are backwards compatible with their previous generation counterparts. Both of them went x86 this time around with no emulation layer or additional legacy hardware to maintain any sort of backwards compatibility. A little bit of a bummer, but we'll all forget about it in a year or two :)
- robmcm 13y ago
  I don't get this desire for backwards compatibility. Why would you want to play a really old game on a shiny new console? If you really did, then pick up a used ps3 or 360 for about £50 and get the PS4 later!
  - fit2rule 13y ago
    Because maybe I've already got $1000 invested in games I'd like to keep playing? Well, I understand the clean break was necessary .. since their architecture strategy sort of requires it .. but its still a nuisance that we're confronted with yet more consumerist ideals being marketed as 'features'.
    - robmcm 13y ago
      You have two options, keep your old console and keep playing them. Or sell the lot second hand and the IF you want the play them in the future download them on your phone or what ever device can now emulate them in JavaScript ;)
  - ScottWhigham 13y ago
    Says a guy who obviously doesn't have children and who also doesn't own console games :) I bought my kid the new Lego Batman II for PS3 in March for his birthday. We decided to upgrade to the PS4. He can't play this new game - that was recently released - on the PS4. It's a weird thing to not support backward compatibility IMO. It's a win for the developers/Sony but a loss for consumers. I have to now buy all new games and Lego Star Wars isn't going to be any better on PS4 than on PS3. Your question acts as though there should always be this "evolution" going on but I disagree. I like watching Daffy Duck from the 1940s - I don't like watching the Daffy Duck from the 1980s. Sometimes a game is "really good" and doesn't need revving - it just needs to be made available for the current gen console.
csense 13y ago
I wish more people would care about Sony's record. They initially officially supported Linux on the Playstation 3, but later decided not only to remove the feature from new models, but reach out through the cloud to remove the feature from existing consoles [1] [2]. This is also the company that put rootkits on CD's [3]. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5886509 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5886509 [2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otheros http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otheros [3] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootkit_scandal http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootki...

99 points by freshrap6 13y ago

sjtgraham 13y ago

The Cerny Method sounds remarkably like the Lean Startup Method, but apparently pre-dates it quite significantly.

quanticle 13y ago
That's exactly what I was going to say. Even the terminology, "publishable first playable" echoes the "minimum viable product" terminology that's in vogue with lean startup practitioners.
ChuckMcM 13y ago
Agreed, and to their credit both are designed to solve the same problem which is to maximize the likelyhood that you're spending the money on the right thing. Long gone are the days when some decides to plop down a million dollars to make some random game, that will be first seen by customers when it is in the retail box.
Tiktaalik 13y ago
The product of this style of production is most often called a "vertical slice." A slice of cake has just a thin amount of cake, but it contains every layer of cake. In this analogy the cake is the whole game and the vertical slice is a tiny snippit of the game (ie. a short level) where all features (every layer of cake) of the core functionality of the game is present.
infinii 13y ago
I had the exact same thoughts while reading the article. Cerny created MVPs of games, got feedback and would pivot/change based on user feedback. And he did this in the mid 90's!!
- robmcm 13y ago
  It's not a MVP if you have to build the whole game engine, but it's simular I guess.
robmcm 13y ago
I think this approach is evident in Metal Gear Solid Ground Zeros (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-11-04-metal-gear-solid-5-ground-zeroes-due-spring-2014 http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-11-04-metal-gear-soli...). It's a level of the main game, but they are actually releasing it for $29. Taking this approach to the next level!

ye 13y ago

PS4 is just a PC stuck in one configuration, linked to a popular delivery system. I don't get what the hype is about. Yes, it's a pretty good configuration at a reasonable price. But that will only be the case for a few months. PCs will catch up very quickly and will become cheaper, and then much cheaper. As somebody who loves games, I don't see a reason to buy PS4. I'd rather spend a bit more on a PC, and then upgrade it as I go. The positive thing I see is the PS4 <-> PC game portability. No longer developers need to have to very different engines and codebases. That's why PS4 is a much better option than XBox One in my eyes.

quanticle 13y ago
The XBox One is an x86 architecture as well. Pretty much everything that you said about the PS4 also applies to XBox One. Now, there are differences between the consoles, but fundamentally both of the next-gen consoles are x86 CPUs tied to memory architectures that are designed to stream HD content to the screen as fast as possible.
- ewzimm 13y ago
  What does processor architecture even matter to a consumer? Is the Xbox 360 a pre-Intel Mac because it uses PowerPC archictecture? I don't see why so many people mention this. Consoles have always been about custom software, not unique hardware architecture.
  - lukeman 13y ago
    The boring nature of the architecture is notable as it puts the focus back on software, which is what people care about. That devs this generation can just make shit without discovering the complexities of custom hardware is a good thing.
    - ewzimm 13y ago
      That's probably true for Playstation, but I think developing for Xbox was already pretty much like developing for Windows, even with different hardware architectures. Most game devs don't looking too deeply at the hardware but just use the tools they're given. The ones who want to understand what's going on in hardware will still study the details of the CPU/GPU.

bradleyjg 13y ago

The PS4 may well make for a better video game machine and more profit for Sony, but it's too bad the very interesting and powerful cell processor concept will be relegated to the dustbin.

ginko 13y ago
The APU in the PS4 picks up many ideas from the Cell processor. You have some heavy cores for program logic and many small ones for graphics and computation tasks. Both on the same piece of silicon and attached to the same memory space.
- ekianjo 13y ago
  Maybe, but it does not seem to be very powerful at all. I've seen most of the upcoming games for launch (and played about half of them) and I was far from being impressed. It feels like a mid-range gaming PC kind of power at best, and many games apparently struggled to run in full HD, with the framerate low enough to make you feel you were back in the PS2 days. If they are planning to sell these consoles solely on the graphics, they'll have a tough time.
  - ginko 13y ago
    That's another topic. It's still a lot more powerful than the original Cell in the PS3. (And a lot easier to program to boot) Sony originally intended to have the cell do all the rasterization work in the PS3. They had to add an additional NVidia GPU in the last moment once Cell proved too slow to do that at competitive speed. That was one of the reasons why the PS3 was so expensive at launch.
  - georgemcbay 13y ago
    A mid-range gaming PC that's ready to play out of the box for $400 is nothing to slouch at. Also, keep in mind that the original launch titles for the Xbox 360 looked like this: http://ve3dmedia.ign.com/ve3d/image/article/655/655564/perfect-dark-zero-screenshots-20051003115038069.jpg http://ve3dmedia.ign.com/ve3d/image/article/655/655564/perfe... Launch titles are generally either carry-over concepts from earlier consoles and/or are drastically rushed to hit a very hard deadline, the titles hitting in the next couple of years will up the ante significantly. That aside, I'm personally looking forward to next Friday quite a bit, as my preordered PS4 from Amazon is supposed to be arriving that day and having played around with some of the games already I'm really looking forward to more time with Killzone, Knack and Assassin's Creed 4. FWIW, I'm one of those gamers who was a huge fan of the Xbox, mostly due to Live as a multiplayer platform, but I'm looking much more forward to the PS4 than the Xbox One, in fact I have no immediate plans to buy a One, though I'm sure I'll probably buy one eventually (much like I bought a PS3 eventually, but that wasn't until this year).

ChuckMcM 13y ago

This was a good read, and the narrative between Sony's launch and Microsoft's launch has the feel of some pretty classic hero's journey stuff in it. The interesting upstart this time seems to be the SteamBox.

paulftw 13y ago

They should have mentioned the number of titles at launch for xbox one. If ease of making games is such a big deal why aren't there any facts on how far behind their main competitor is.

mindrag 13y ago
Because that will be forgotten in a matter of weeks as more titles begin to roll out for both platforms.
Narishma 13y ago
Xbox One only launches with a couple more retail titles. PS4 launches with a dozen or so more PSN titles.

6ren 13y ago

I'm seeing a pattern, a cycle between hubris and humility. When Nintendo ruled, Sony broke in by courting game developers. Then, they became arrogant, and made the best hardware they could, they was difficult to use. Thus, Microsoft won, simply because it was easier for developers. It was then amazing to see how arrogant they had become with the xboxone trying to squeeze everyone, in every way - similar to how they removed the ability to cancel xbox live online. What Microsoft didn't realize is that they didn't win - Sony lost, by shooting themselves in the foot. But in this generation, if PS4 is easy to develop for, cheaper, more powerful, and not trying to squeeze every cent and control every aspect... things will be different. Of course, Microsoft will see their mistake and adjust (as they've done many times). But while they can drop prices and relax controls, it may be difficult to make their console more powerful. Also, next year, mobile devices should reach GPU parity with last gen consoles... and with their faster iteration cycle, match PS4/xboxone three years after that. (unlike CPUs, GPUs scale really well).

Keyframe 13y ago
I get what you're saying, but Microsoft never won any console race http://www.geekwire.com/2013/xbox-360-wii-ps3-won-console-generation/ http://www.geekwire.com/2013/xbox-360-wii-ps3-won-console-ge...
- abarringer 13y ago
  From the original article. "When the PS3 launched, according to most estimates, Sony controlled about 70 percent of the console market. Seven years later, it’s on even terms with Microsoft, whose Xbox 360 outsold the PS3 in the U.S. for 32 consecutive months." Going from 70% to "even" with Microsoft seems like a non-win?
  - deleted 13y ago
    [deleted]
- sillysaurus2 13y ago
  That graph is incredible. I had no idea holidays mattered so much. They may as well be the reason the industry exists.

6ren 13y ago

It makes a lot of sense to just a build a piece of it first — but that piece needs to be representative. You can’t just hack something together.” He calls this prototype a “publishable first playable,” A better explanation of MVP than most.

AnaRizaMae 13y ago

good article...

blt 13y ago

Unified memory architecture! Should be some cool hybrid cpu/gpu algorithm possibilities. Currently the overhead of copying stuff between the two memories in CUDA prevents any fine-grained cooperation. I wonder how much gpgpu ability is exposed.

jmpeax 13y ago

I want to know how much Sony payed Wired for that advertism... article.

fit2rule 13y ago

So I'm clueless as I haven't been paying attention to this market since the PS4/XBox360 were released - does the PS4 not run PS3 titles? If so, does it have some emulation or is it new hardware sitting on top of the old Cell design?

chucknelson 13y ago
Neither PS4 or Xbox One are backwards compatible with their previous generation counterparts. Both of them went x86 this time around with no emulation layer or additional legacy hardware to maintain any sort of backwards compatibility. A little bit of a bummer, but we'll all forget about it in a year or two :)
robmcm 13y ago
I don't get this desire for backwards compatibility. Why would you want to play a really old game on a shiny new console? If you really did, then pick up a used ps3 or 360 for about £50 and get the PS4 later!
- fit2rule 13y ago
  Because maybe I've already got $1000 invested in games I'd like to keep playing? Well, I understand the clean break was necessary .. since their architecture strategy sort of requires it .. but its still a nuisance that we're confronted with yet more consumerist ideals being marketed as 'features'.
  - robmcm 13y ago
    You have two options, keep your old console and keep playing them. Or sell the lot second hand and the IF you want the play them in the future download them on your phone or what ever device can now emulate them in JavaScript ;)
- ScottWhigham 13y ago
  Says a guy who obviously doesn't have children and who also doesn't own console games :) I bought my kid the new Lego Batman II for PS3 in March for his birthday. We decided to upgrade to the PS4. He can't play this new game - that was recently released - on the PS4. It's a weird thing to not support backward compatibility IMO. It's a win for the developers/Sony but a loss for consumers. I have to now buy all new games and Lego Star Wars isn't going to be any better on PS4 than on PS3. Your question acts as though there should always be this "evolution" going on but I disagree. I like watching Daffy Duck from the 1940s - I don't like watching the Daffy Duck from the 1980s. Sometimes a game is "really good" and doesn't need revving - it just needs to be made available for the current gen console.

csense 13y ago

I wish more people would care about Sony's record. They initially officially supported Linux on the Playstation 3, but later decided not only to remove the feature from new models, but reach out through the cloud to remove the feature from existing consoles [1] [2]. This is also the company that put rootkits on CD's [3]. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5886509 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5886509 [2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otheros http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otheros [3] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootkit_scandal http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootki...