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How is discrimination by citizenship more acceptable than e.g. discrimination by ethnicity or race? All of these are outcomes of birth lottery.
by zerr 22d ago
How is discrimination by citizenship more acceptable than e.g. discrimination by ethnicity or race? All of these are outcomes of birth lottery.
- estearum 22d agoNot taking a position on either side of the underlying debate, but obviously a government has a unique obligation to its own citizens, and ideally no unique obligation to an ethnicity or race.
- ckrapu 22d agoA country's first responsibility should be to its citizens.
- deleted 22d ago[deleted]
- ActionHank 22d agoWhat obligation does the government have to those who are not their citizens? 100% a lottery, but your logic here is willful ignorance.
- zerr 22d agoThe point is to have a system that does not discriminate based on lottery.
- ckrapu 22d agoWell, an American farmer cannot sell his grain in India. That also seems to be discrimination simply because he is in the wrong place. Are you arguing that all protectionism is flawed and wrong?
- __d 22d agoUntil very recently, that was a pretty common view. Countries generally want unconstrained exports, while limiting competitive imports.
- ckrapu 22d agoThat might be true in practice but also 1) completely incompatible with global notions of fairness and justice, and 2) not an especially compelling political argument for getting countries to open up their markets.
- __d 18d ago(1) Agreed. (2) There’s very few sustainable global competitive advantages. Sometimes you might have a better natural resource by virtue of geography and getting in first to “own“ it. But for most businesses, reducing trade barriers really just introduces more competition.
- happytoexplain 22d agoThat's a great ideal, but is obviously impossible to the extent that you are implying, until we can eliminate national and legal borders entirely, which is a distant-future goal. You're putting the horse lightyears before the cart.
- happytoexplain 22d agoMaybe in one thousand years we will all be one joint geo-political entity, which will be great, but until then it is an unassailable fact of physical reality that nations must prioritize their own citizens. That doesn't mean ignoring everybody else - just prioritizing.
- samrus 22d agoCitizenship, while usually a circumstance of birth, comes with a a shared responsibility of the society one is a citizen of. That responsibility also goes the other way, where the society has a duty to look out for the citizen While it sucks that people from other societies dont feel like those societies are good for them, it doesnt mean that citizens of the host society should extend that responsibility to people who do not share responsibility for that society like citizens do. Essentially these foreign workers are mercenaries, and do not derserve the same loyalty and protections that citizens do
- paleotrope 22d agoWe are on the tail end of a 75 year old experiment in the West of divorcing where you live or were born from any sort of responsibility for anything in either direction, except for paying taxes to government and fees to your patron.
- happytoexplain 22d agoCan you elaborate? I'm not quite following this.
- unified101 22d agopost WW2 basically.
- samrus 21d agoYeah and thats going really shittily. The richest country in the world has housing crisises while the stock market reaches all time highs. Veterans are homeless. Teachers are quiting because theyre underpaid. Its clear the deal was ruined and needs to be refreshed otherwise this society will be hollowed out by the wealthy before they abscond away to somewhere better managed
- zerr 22d agoSo citizenship is yet another contract - between an individual and a society. To eliminate the unfairness of lottery, changing citizenships should be as easy as changing jobs.
- gos9 22d agoI vote to discriminate citizenship, economic or otherwise, based on the answer to this being a self evident truth
- Tabular-Iceberg 22d agoNonsense. There is no lottery, children are born of their parents 100% of the time. Those children have a right to what their parents built, and a duty to leave it better than they found it for their children, and that includes their nations.
- gadders 21d agoBecause a country is not an economic unit.