6 ms·

See links further down: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49448069 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49448069

by TehCorwiz 22d ago

throwawaypath 22d ago
Nothing in that linked comment points to where DHH specifically takes a stand against the "freedom to exist."
- TehCorwiz 22d ago
  I disagree. Calling for ethnic cleansing counts to me as taking a stance against a group's right to existence.
  - deleted 22d ago
    [deleted]
  - throwawaypath 21d ago
    He didn't call for ethnic cleansing.
    - stymaar 21d ago
      He did. He claimed that the demographic has changed and he advocates for reverting this change. And it turns out that forcibly altering the demographic of an era is the literal definition of ethnic cleansing (and by the way the phrass has historicallt been coined with the specific meaning of removing Muslim people from Serbia, by the people who intended to perform that “cleansing”, so it's particularly apt here).
      - throwawaypath 21d ago
        [flagged]
        e12e 21d ago
        >> He did not call for forcibly altering the demographic. > When wolves get out of control, you shoot them. When gypsies take over public spaces, you deport them. And while I'm quoting: MerriamWebster: Xenophobe > one unduly fearful of what is foreign and especially of people of foreign origin DHH: > You can rest assured that I'd be in the streets waving a Danish flag if these were my conditions in my native country. I think that's a pretty universal sentiment. There's absolutely nothing racist or xenophobic in saying that Denmark is primarily a country for the Danes, Britain primarily a united kingdom for the Brits, and Japan primarily a set of islands for the Japanese. I would say saying that is pretty much the definition of xenophobic. Worse, in the context of DHHs rants, it comes off as racist - I don't get the sense he wants to throw out Norwegians from Denmark, for example. Although shurly there are Norwegian migrants and foreign workers in Denmark.
        throwawaypath 21d ago
        No where did you quote where he's calling for forcibly altering the demographic. Enforcing immigration laws is not ethnic cleansing. >And while I'm quoting: >MerriamWebster: Xenophobe >> one unduly fearful of what is foreign and especially of people of foreign origin He doesn't fear foreign people or things so this definition doesn't apply. >I would say saying that is pretty much the definition of xenophobic. Except it's not, words have meaning. Supporting indigenous people and their rights to their native homelands is not xenophobic. >Worse, in the context of DHHs rants, it comes off as racist - I don't get the sense he wants to throw out Norwegians from Denmark, for example. That's your interpretation, not the facts, and not what DHH has said.
        e12e 21d ago
        > Supporting indigenous people and their rights to their native homelands is not xenophobic. Xenophobia leads to the belief that white Danes need support for their rights to their native homeland. It's not like this is some great battle to rise restitution for Native Americans, Maori or Aborigines. It's about not having to see so many non-white faces in Copenhagen or London. > Enforcing immigration laws is not ethnic cleansing. That certainly depends on the law, and the enforcement. More to the point: trampling nomadic sub- cultures, forcefully denying them access where they have lived for centuries, denying them their way of life - can certainly result in genocide ("the deliberate and systematic destruction of a racial, political, or cultural group").
  - majorchord 21d ago
    I'm not seeing anywhere that he actually claims someone doesn't have a right to exist. I see lots of people using colorful, subjective interpretations of other things he said to try and push a narrative, but that's all.
- ath3nd 22d ago
  DHH has the capacity to assess that going full on white supremacist is still relatively frowned upon, so he does only as much as he thinks he can get away with. Sponsoring his badly made OSS and giving him any type of a limelight will only embolden him and the likes of him. I personally want nothing to do with him and anything he touches.
dijit 22d ago
I'm becoming really upset at people whom I otherwise align with for taking absolute statements that don't make sense. DHH said some stuff you disagree with, incidentally while I have always identified with strong social systems, welfare, high taxes and things like free healthcare, I can't say I disagree with the core of what he tried to say, because there has been seizemic ethnic change within a single generation - and people not talking about it is actually fuelling the extreme position. So when you say "has a right to exist", what do you mean exactly? Because if I was to stand in the lobby of a parliamentary building and was forcibly removed, would that mean I don't have the right to exist? You have a right to exist, just not here, just like how White English people have no right to exist in India, and White Dutch people don't have a right to live in Zimbabwe. Saying "Hey, this demographic and major cultural change in the last 20 years makes the environment different" is considered racism- which has the obvious consenquence of making the word "racist" have less power.. It's not racism to notice this, it's racist to think anyone else is lesser than natives or to group "them" and treat an ethnic group as a homogenous bloc. I'm reminded of the phrase "if you don't respect me, I won't respect you" whereby respect can mean as an authority or as a person, and they mean "if you don't respect me as an authority, then I won't respect you as a person". You're saying "if you don't let me do everything I want then you're denying that I have the right to exist at all" which is a type of hysteric language which permits any atrocity in response it can be framed as an act of self defence. Stop it.
- john_strinlai 22d ago
  >Saying "Hey, this demographic and major cultural change in the last 20 years makes the environment different" is considered racism perhaps if he said it like this, rather than comparing Roma to wolves that should be shot and comparing immigration as something to be survived like a bombing blitz, people wouldnt care as much >it's racist to think anyone else is lesser than natives or to group "them" and treat an ethnic group as a homogenous bloc. that is what he is doing
  - dijit 21d ago
    [flagged]
- 22d ago

See links further down: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49448069 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49448069

throwawaypath 22d ago

Nothing in that linked comment points to where DHH specifically takes a stand against the "freedom to exist."

TehCorwiz 22d ago
I disagree. Calling for ethnic cleansing counts to me as taking a stance against a group's right to existence.
- deleted 22d ago
  [deleted]
- throwawaypath 21d ago
  He didn't call for ethnic cleansing.
  - stymaar 21d ago
    He did. He claimed that the demographic has changed and he advocates for reverting this change. And it turns out that forcibly altering the demographic of an era is the literal definition of ethnic cleansing (and by the way the phrass has historicallt been coined with the specific meaning of removing Muslim people from Serbia, by the people who intended to perform that “cleansing”, so it's particularly apt here).
    - throwawaypath 21d ago
      [flagged]
      - e12e 21d ago
        >> He did not call for forcibly altering the demographic. > When wolves get out of control, you shoot them. When gypsies take over public spaces, you deport them. And while I'm quoting: MerriamWebster: Xenophobe > one unduly fearful of what is foreign and especially of people of foreign origin DHH: > You can rest assured that I'd be in the streets waving a Danish flag if these were my conditions in my native country. I think that's a pretty universal sentiment. There's absolutely nothing racist or xenophobic in saying that Denmark is primarily a country for the Danes, Britain primarily a united kingdom for the Brits, and Japan primarily a set of islands for the Japanese. I would say saying that is pretty much the definition of xenophobic. Worse, in the context of DHHs rants, it comes off as racist - I don't get the sense he wants to throw out Norwegians from Denmark, for example. Although shurly there are Norwegian migrants and foreign workers in Denmark.
        throwawaypath 21d ago
        No where did you quote where he's calling for forcibly altering the demographic. Enforcing immigration laws is not ethnic cleansing. >And while I'm quoting: >MerriamWebster: Xenophobe >> one unduly fearful of what is foreign and especially of people of foreign origin He doesn't fear foreign people or things so this definition doesn't apply. >I would say saying that is pretty much the definition of xenophobic. Except it's not, words have meaning. Supporting indigenous people and their rights to their native homelands is not xenophobic. >Worse, in the context of DHHs rants, it comes off as racist - I don't get the sense he wants to throw out Norwegians from Denmark, for example. That's your interpretation, not the facts, and not what DHH has said.
        e12e 21d ago
        > Supporting indigenous people and their rights to their native homelands is not xenophobic. Xenophobia leads to the belief that white Danes need support for their rights to their native homeland. It's not like this is some great battle to rise restitution for Native Americans, Maori or Aborigines. It's about not having to see so many non-white faces in Copenhagen or London. > Enforcing immigration laws is not ethnic cleansing. That certainly depends on the law, and the enforcement. More to the point: trampling nomadic sub- cultures, forcefully denying them access where they have lived for centuries, denying them their way of life - can certainly result in genocide ("the deliberate and systematic destruction of a racial, political, or cultural group").
- majorchord 21d ago
  I'm not seeing anywhere that he actually claims someone doesn't have a right to exist. I see lots of people using colorful, subjective interpretations of other things he said to try and push a narrative, but that's all.
ath3nd 22d ago
DHH has the capacity to assess that going full on white supremacist is still relatively frowned upon, so he does only as much as he thinks he can get away with. Sponsoring his badly made OSS and giving him any type of a limelight will only embolden him and the likes of him. I personally want nothing to do with him and anything he touches.

dijit 22d ago

I'm becoming really upset at people whom I otherwise align with for taking absolute statements that don't make sense. DHH said some stuff you disagree with, incidentally while I have always identified with strong social systems, welfare, high taxes and things like free healthcare, I can't say I disagree with the core of what he tried to say, because there has been seizemic ethnic change within a single generation - and people not talking about it is actually fuelling the extreme position. So when you say "has a right to exist", what do you mean exactly? Because if I was to stand in the lobby of a parliamentary building and was forcibly removed, would that mean I don't have the right to exist? You have a right to exist, just not here, just like how White English people have no right to exist in India, and White Dutch people don't have a right to live in Zimbabwe. Saying "Hey, this demographic and major cultural change in the last 20 years makes the environment different" is considered racism- which has the obvious consenquence of making the word "racist" have less power.. It's not racism to notice this, it's racist to think anyone else is lesser than natives or to group "them" and treat an ethnic group as a homogenous bloc. I'm reminded of the phrase "if you don't respect me, I won't respect you" whereby respect can mean as an authority or as a person, and they mean "if you don't respect me as an authority, then I won't respect you as a person". You're saying "if you don't let me do everything I want then you're denying that I have the right to exist at all" which is a type of hysteric language which permits any atrocity in response it can be framed as an act of self defence. Stop it.

john_strinlai 22d ago
>Saying "Hey, this demographic and major cultural change in the last 20 years makes the environment different" is considered racism perhaps if he said it like this, rather than comparing Roma to wolves that should be shot and comparing immigration as something to be survived like a bombing blitz, people wouldnt care as much >it's racist to think anyone else is lesser than natives or to group "them" and treat an ethnic group as a homogenous bloc. that is what he is doing
- dijit 21d ago
  [flagged]
22d ago