10 ms·

Seems like this could be categorized as yet another reason why software developers are not engineers.

by patja 1mo ago

EA-3167 1mo ago
Absolutely. Engineering is defined by it learning from history, it's an art build up from thousands of years of human attempts to alter the world around them. In a modern sense engineers inevitably require a certain amount of schooling, certification, and most critically of all professional and ethical standards.
grebc 1mo ago
I never understood why actual engineers(eg. Civil) have not complained more that programmers/coders stole that title.
- indoorfish 1mo ago
  they have, loudly and repeatedly, it doesn't really make it very far on HN for obvious reasons.
  - grebc 1mo ago
    Not sure it’s obvious reasons, but understandable, sure. When someone questions your credentials the default is to tell them to jump, whether that’s a good idea or not.
    - Jensson 1mo ago
      HN removes every post that doesn't get upvotes, especially if they get lots of comments.
- satvikpendem 1mo ago
  Why would they care? And a lot of them turned to coding anyway.
  - cush 1mo ago
    Because Engineering is an incredibly rigorous discipline and title that requires so much work to obtain. It’s like a massage therapist calling themself a doctor. Computer Science isn’t Engineering.
    - satvikpendem 1mo ago
      Sure but out of my engineer friends I've never heard of them sneering a programmer calling themselves and engineer, they literally don't care and just worry about their own job. It seems only programmers seem to care about their lack of a proper engineer title.
- wink 1mo ago
  I know just as many people who have that title foisted upon them by HR and leadership of their company than others who have taken it up. So I think it sounds more than actual people who would be happy to be called software developers.
arthurjj 1mo ago
A few years ago a software engineer asked a few Chemical/Civil/Mechanical engineers and the majority of "real" engineers seemed to think we were [1]. I'm not aware of a better study but happy to be proven wrong, since I generally refer to myself as a Software Developer [1] https://www.hillelwayne.com/post/are-we-really-engineers/ https://www.hillelwayne.com/post/are-we-really-engineers/
hirvi74 1mo ago
Do people seriously care about this debate? I don't even use the term software engineer. I usually just say [computer] programmer. Though depending on my mood I might say I am virtual firefighter, and believe me, there are always virtual fires that need to be put out.
sscaryterry 1mo ago
I happen to be both. Engineering is a mindset, and to call yourself an engineer, people should be at least this: https://www.internationalengineeringalliance.org/accords/washington-accord https://www.internationalengineeringalliance.org/accords/was...

Seems like this could be categorized as yet another reason why software developers are not engineers.

by patja 1mo ago

Seems like this could be categorized as yet another reason why software developers are not engineers.

Absolutely. Engineering is defined by it learning from history, it's an art build up from thousands of years of human attempts to alter the world around them. In a modern sense engineers inevitably require a certain amount of schooling, certification, and most critically of all professional and ethical standards.

grebc 1mo ago

I never understood why actual engineers(eg. Civil) have not complained more that programmers/coders stole that title.

indoorfish 1mo ago
they have, loudly and repeatedly, it doesn't really make it very far on HN for obvious reasons.
- grebc 1mo ago
  Not sure it’s obvious reasons, but understandable, sure. When someone questions your credentials the default is to tell them to jump, whether that’s a good idea or not.
  - Jensson 1mo ago
    HN removes every post that doesn't get upvotes, especially if they get lots of comments.
satvikpendem 1mo ago
Why would they care? And a lot of them turned to coding anyway.
- cush 1mo ago
  Because Engineering is an incredibly rigorous discipline and title that requires so much work to obtain. It’s like a massage therapist calling themself a doctor. Computer Science isn’t Engineering.
  - satvikpendem 1mo ago
    Sure but out of my engineer friends I've never heard of them sneering a programmer calling themselves and engineer, they literally don't care and just worry about their own job. It seems only programmers seem to care about their lack of a proper engineer title.
wink 1mo ago
I know just as many people who have that title foisted upon them by HR and leadership of their company than others who have taken it up. So I think it sounds more than actual people who would be happy to be called software developers.

arthurjj 1mo ago

A few years ago a software engineer asked a few Chemical/Civil/Mechanical engineers and the majority of "real" engineers seemed to think we were [1]. I'm not aware of a better study but happy to be proven wrong, since I generally refer to myself as a Software Developer [1] https://www.hillelwayne.com/post/are-we-really-engineers/ https://www.hillelwayne.com/post/are-we-really-engineers/

hirvi74 1mo ago

Do people seriously care about this debate? I don't even use the term software engineer. I usually just say [computer] programmer. Though depending on my mood I might say I am virtual firefighter, and believe me, there are always virtual fires that need to be put out.

sscaryterry 1mo ago

I happen to be both. Engineering is a mindset, and to call yourself an engineer, people should be at least this: https://www.internationalengineeringalliance.org/accords/washington-accord https://www.internationalengineeringalliance.org/accords/was...