10 ms·

I liked Kenton's take on this: https://x.com/KentonVarda/status/2084990137180590572?s=20 https://x.com/KentonVarda/status/2084990137180590572?s=20 Text from tw

by rozenmd 1mo ago

I liked Kenton's take on this: https://x.com/KentonVarda/status/2084990137180590572?s=20 https://x.com/KentonVarda/status/2084990137180590572?s=20 Text from tweet: Today we are releasing Cloudflare OS, a chatbot with connectors, just like every other tech company is doing. Except actually, it's different. This is a remake of Sandstorm[.]io, my startup from 10 years ago, except this time built on Cloudflare Workers (the platform I've spent the last 9 years building) and deeply leveraging AI. This is more or less the culmination of my secret 10-year master plan. This is a full-on personal app vibe coding platform, in which the sandbox is so secure that you can pretty much go wild -- the AI cannot introduce a significant security bug. We believe a company's security team can feel comfortable giving non-technical users permission to vibe code and then sleep soundly at night. How is that possible? It's the Sandstorm security model, revisited. A "Gadget" is the same thing as a Sandstorm "Grain": a fine-grained app instance. For example, if you have a document editor app, each document runs as a separate instance of the app, in a separate sandbox (one "Gadget"). This means two things, both of which I think are Big Deals: 1. The platform can manage all access control, by controlling who can access the Gadget at all. There is no way the Gadget can accidentally leak itself to an attacker -- even an attacker who has access to other Gadgets based on the same app. 2. Since everyone is running their own copy of the code, everyone can freely modify their copy of the code. Think about #2 a bit more. What if, when you wanted a new feature in the software you are using, you could just prompt your agent to add it? This doesn't work in the cloud Software-as-a-Service model, because you are not running your own copy of the app. Sandstorm tried to change that 10 years ago, but the world wasn't ready, because not enough people had the skills or patience to actually modify their software. AI has changed that. Now you just ask the agent -- the same agent that you are using to help you interact with the Gadget can also modify the code of the Gadget. And it is so fun.

NetOpWibby 1mo ago
Damn, this is a pretty big deal!
- BonerWiener 1mo ago
  Can you explain why you think this is a big deal? What particular feature/capability made you think this? I do not disagree but i am curios. Lets have a discussion instead of just throwing feel good vibes around...
  - NetOpWibby 1mo ago
    [flagged]
    - BonerWiener 1mo ago
      [flagged]
mosura 1mo ago
Sandstorm without self hosting has no interest though. (Edit: see below, where the creator states it _can_ be run locally) Buzz looks like a more reasonable direction than this does.
- hobofan 1mo ago
  Yes, just like SaaS was a limitation to it's utility, PaaS is still a limitation, just on a different level.
- kentonv 1mo ago
  What do you mean? This is 100% open source and self-hostable! https://github.com/cloudflare/cloudflare-os https://github.com/cloudflare/cloudflare-os It runs on the open source Workers Runtime: https://github.com/cloudflare/workerd https://github.com/cloudflare/workerd You can run it at home if you want. There's even a Home Assistant Gatekeeper.
  - mosura 1mo ago
    So you can run it off the public internet with no sneaky external dependency on cloudflare, slack etc? And it would be functionally the same? With the same performance if you put enough hardware there? If so cool, and that should have been clearly in the announcement, because as it sounded it is “I am a sucker, lock me in!”
    - kentonv 1mo ago
      > So you can run it off the public internet with no sneaky external dependency on cloudflare, slack etc? Yes. It even supports ollama and works decently well with some local LLMs. > And it would be functionally the same? With the same performance if you put enough hardware there? Honestly it is faster running locally. > If so cool, and that should have been clearly in the announcement, We had so many things we wanted to say, it was hard to fit them all into one story. The blog post is for an enterprise audience. My tweet thread is for the hacker audience.
layer8 1mo ago
> the sandbox is so secure that you can pretty much go wild -- the AI cannot introduce a significant security bug. This can only be correct when the application can’t affect anything outside the sandbox. Which would significantly restrict useful applications.
- kentonv 1mo ago
  See my next tweet in the chain: https://x.com/KentonVarda/status/2084990302784307363 https://x.com/KentonVarda/status/2084990302784307363 ------------- Of course, personal apps are more useful if they can connect to external services. Cloudflare OS introduces a "connector" system we call Gatekeepers. This is sort of like MCP (and MCP is supported as a kind of Gatekeeper), but with a lot more: * Instead of exposing tools, a Gatekeeper exposes a Cap'n Web RPC API. That makes it appropriate for use by both agents (via code mode) and Gadgets. * Gatekeepers integrate with the Cloudflare OS UI to provide inline audit logging and human-in-the-loop approvals for all side-effecting actions. * When an action requires approval, the agent does not need to stop and wait for it. A Gatekeeper will simulate the outcome, allowing the agent to keep running and queue up more work. You can then approve everything in a batch at the end. Hopefully, this means you no longer feel the need to turn on auto-approve! (But you still can if you want.) We have already built Gatekeepers for a huge number of services, from GitHub to Home Assistant. We've found, with the right skills, AI can basically crank these things out for any given API, solving the chicken-and-egg ecosystem problem. We are working on a "software factory" of sorts where you can input the API docs for your favorite service and get a well-written Gatekeeper. That's not quite ready yet -- so for now use the ones we provide or use the write-gatekeeper skill to write your own. You can add your own Gatekeepers to your personal deployment.
  - kentonv 1mo ago
    Or more directly: When you share a Gadget, we verify that anyone you share with also has direct permission to access each of the resources it is connected to (via the Gatekeeper system). Hence, no security bug in the Gadget itself could accidentally grant people access to things they don't already have.
fny 1mo ago
That should have been the announcement. The article posted buries the lead. Cloudflare OS reads like almost any other AI knowledge base until midway when apps are introduced and then becomes overly technical with a code snippet.
- kentonv 1mo ago
  We really struggled with how to present this to multiple audiences at once. My tweet thread, and the GitHub readme, is really the presentation intended for the HN crowd. The blog post is for a different audience. https://github.com/cloudflare/cloudflare-os https://github.com/cloudflare/cloudflare-os
  - philistine 1mo ago
    > The blog post is for a different audience. No one? Like literally, I don't understand a thing of what the blog post is saying. It's vague to the point of meaning nothing. Every piece of text I've seen that explains CloudflareOS is clear except the blog post.
    - QuantumNoodle 1mo ago
      I used to read their blog regularly because it had lots of interesting technical details. Lately, though, there’s less of that, and I can’t quite put my finger on what changed. My guess is that they realized how popular the blog had become and started using that attention more for advertising. There’s nothing wrong with that, but earlier the “advertisements” actually made me want to try things out and bring them back to my team. I even considered applying to work there. Not so much anymore. I’ve even removed it from my RSS feed. I don’t like offering criticism without a solution, but I’m not really motivated to come up with one here. It looks like employees may read this, so maybe someone will see the feedback.
      - jtwocents 1mo ago
        https://blog.cloudflare.com/three-chapters-at-cloudflare-programmer-to-cto-to-board-of-directors/ https://blog.cloudflare.com/three-chapters-at-cloudflare-pro... TL;DR; jgc stopped editing the blog, and AI slop took over: > Today, after more than 13 years at the company, I am joining Cloudflare’s board of directors and retiring from my full-time position as CTO. > ... > I wrote for, and edited, the Cloudflare Blog for many, many years
ManuelKiessling 1mo ago
> What if, when you wanted a new feature in the software you are using, you could just prompt your agent to add it? Yep, that's precisely the vision I formulated some months ago: https://manuel.kiessling.net/2025/11/04/what-if-software-shipped-with-a-software-engineer/ https://manuel.kiessling.net/2025/11/04/what-if-software-shi...
tinco 1mo ago
This is really interesting. I built a similar product (not released yet), but it uses Kubernetes as the infrastructure layer instead of Cloudflare OS. I guess all these years later I am left with the same existential question that plagued Sandstorm. What is its relevance in the context of Linux containers? This is not a rhetorical question, is there a real benefit for a Sandstorm grain over a docker style Linux container? Does a containerized process not have all the same benefits of a Sandstorm grain, with the added benefit of not requiring any modifications of the containerized software? One argument I could bring is that despite all its claims, OpenAI still had to switch from containers to MicroVMs because its agents under test still managed to break out from their containers. Is the security model of a Sandstorm grain so much better that agents wouldn't figure out how to break out of it?
- kentonv 1mo ago
  Sandstorm's use of containers was just a means to an end. The real innovation was the fine-grained instances -- each document in its own container. No other container platform did that. But honestly, it didn't work well, because of cold start times and memory usage. It's bad enough when a server takes seconds to start, but if every document you open has a long startup time and uses hundreds of MB of RAM, it's really painful. Cloudflare OS doesn't use containers. It uses Dynamic Workers, which are 100x more efficient: https://blog.cloudflare.com/dynamic-workers/ https://blog.cloudflare.com/dynamic-workers/ So the stuff I have been building in Workers for the past 9 years turns out to be the thing that Sandstorm needed all along. What a coincidence. :)
  - echelon 1mo ago
    This is far too Cloudflare flavored to be interesting to me. It's using Workers (capital W) and the core Cloudflare primitives. I don't feel safe building on this or touching this. I'd be happier if a startup or neutral party built this in a more agnostic way.
    - kentonv 1mo ago
      I'm sorry but Workers is the technology that makes this all possible. I don't think I could have built this without Workers as a foundation. (I tried once, with Sandstorm, and like I said, it didn't work well.) Sometimes you just can't advance the state of the art while also maintaining broad compatibility. It's all open source, though. You can run the whole stack on your own machine.
LeBit 1mo ago
https://xcancel.com/KentonVarda/status/2084990137180590572 https://xcancel.com/KentonVarda/status/2084990137180590572
ignoramous 1mo ago
You should probably add a disclaimer you work at Cloudflare yourself? > I liked Kenton's take on this: https://x.com/KentonVarda/status/2084990137180590572 https://x.com/KentonVarda/status/2084990137180590572 https://archive.vn/wvgxq https://archive.vn/wvgxq
spooneybarger 1mo ago
Thank you. The tweet values the readers time. The blog post. Dear lord. So much noise. This was a great summation.
deleted 1mo ago
[deleted]
ashu1461 1mo ago
I don't get it How is this different than the capabilities which cowork by claude / chat gpt desktop apps now a days give in terms of core capabilities. The fact that you can maybe fetch bugs from jira and present in the way you want is true for any of the agentic orchestrators, so is it really the USP ? One difference I found against other orchestrators was that they work on a per seat billing model. Example if you have 10 team members who want access to a shared agent infrastructure, you would end up paying 10 * 20$ = 200$ per month while in this case it is probably just the AI and infrastructure bill that you have to spend, which probably might cross 200 dollars as well.
losvedir 1mo ago
Oh, wow! This is a lot clearer to me. I've long had a soft spot in my heart about Sandstorm. Here's a comment[0] I made 11 years ago about what Sandstorm was, to me: > I'm a web developer, but I can't really use my skills to provide an open source web app the way I'd like to. I'd like to build a small server-side budgeting app that people can use from their computers or phones to record expenses, but there's no way I can ask people to find a web host that lets them run rails, or set up a heroku account or whatever. > So my only alternative would be to run the service myself, but then I'm storing other people's data, I have to worry about scaling if lots of people use it, and user accounts, and all this stuff. > The idea of sandstorm is folks run this platform on their personal servers, and then it lets you browse an app store like interface and one-click install these server side apps. So I'd bundle up my budgeting rails app as a sandstorm package, and if someone wants to track their expenses from a variety of devices, they install the app. Now they're running it so the data is theirs, there's no scaling issues, and user authentication is provided by sandstorm. It was a beautiful thing that tried to thread the needle between personal, self-hosted software and cloud-based "software as a service". I've long thought that "federated" software is the sweetspot, since it allows people to control software in more natural organizational units like families or communities, without being centrally controlled or devolving into the craziness that is "decentralized". However, while the functionality of Cloudflare OS may be Sandstorm-inspired, I feel like it doesn't really have its soul. What a difference a decade makes! Here's another comment[1] from me 10 years ago about why I loved sandstorm, which begins: > Oh no! I really believe sandstorm (or something like it) is what we need the future to be. Rather than having everything get sucked up into Google, Facebook, Apple, or these other few centralized services, imagine where everyone has a personal (or family, or church group or whatever) server, and they can one-click install their email apps, their document apps, etc. These days Cloudflare has become one of the "Google, Facebook, Apple" that I mentioned. I'm still a fan of Cloudflare generally, and with kentonv behind this I absolutely have to try it out, but it doesn't have the open source, community-oriented charm that I think Sandstorm had. edit: Oh, I didn't read far enough down the tweet chain: > I am so proud to say, we are making this whole thing open source, Apache 2.0 license, no catch. Hooray! Sandstorm's back on the menu, boys! This really does make me happy. I never should have doubted, ha. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10237821 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10237821 [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13589471 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13589471
nijave 1mo ago
>This doesn't work in the cloud Software-as-a-Service model, because you are not running your own copy of the app. Let me introduce you to scrapling+MCP--the closest I've come. Stealthed, controllable browser gives you an API to arbitrary web things You can't modify it, but you can extend it which imo is the next best thing adb (Android) is close albeit a bit more tedious. It's fun watching an LLM take screenshots, read them, then send input events back to the phone. If you have a rooted Android, you _can_ modify the apps. Xposed, ReVanced, et al subject to Play Integrity's ever growing pervasiveness
MattCruikshank 1mo ago
Great! I'm really excited. So, I want to make an RSS feed Gadget. And you will run an RSS Aggregator Gadget, and then some Presentation Gadget. Do I have that roughly right? How does my Gadget talk to yours? Cloudflare Tunnels for CGNAT, NAT traversal? CapnProto for the schema? Fire and forget? Online only? Queuing? Store and forward? How do I keep track of my Contacts? Who is allowed to read my feed? Are controls built in? So so so many questions. Do you have office hours? :D
VladVladikoff 1mo ago
It is quite foolish to believe that now that we have AI generated code that people will suddenly choose the more secure option rather than the cheapest. My evidence in exhibit A: The success of Wordpress.
millsau 1mo ago
do you think this would do a better job then hermes? Also would it run on a rasberry pi?
maCDzP 1mo ago
Reminds me of EMacs, which I really like.
chinathrow 1mo ago
> the AI cannot introduce a significant security bug. Famous last words.
- deleted 1mo ago
  [deleted]
MWil 1mo ago
I vividly remember Sandstorm. It was very intuitive and easy to use for a non-technical user like myself.
ThePowerOfFuet 1mo ago
> the AI cannot introduce a significant security bug. Uh-huh.

by rozenmd 1mo ago

NetOpWibby 1mo ago

Damn, this is a pretty big deal!

BonerWiener 1mo ago
Can you explain why you think this is a big deal? What particular feature/capability made you think this? I do not disagree but i am curios. Lets have a discussion instead of just throwing feel good vibes around...
- NetOpWibby 1mo ago
  [flagged]
  - BonerWiener 1mo ago
    [flagged]

mosura 1mo ago

Sandstorm without self hosting has no interest though. (Edit: see below, where the creator states it _can_ be run locally) Buzz looks like a more reasonable direction than this does.

hobofan 1mo ago
Yes, just like SaaS was a limitation to it's utility, PaaS is still a limitation, just on a different level.
kentonv 1mo ago
What do you mean? This is 100% open source and self-hostable! https://github.com/cloudflare/cloudflare-os https://github.com/cloudflare/cloudflare-os It runs on the open source Workers Runtime: https://github.com/cloudflare/workerd https://github.com/cloudflare/workerd You can run it at home if you want. There's even a Home Assistant Gatekeeper.
- mosura 1mo ago
  So you can run it off the public internet with no sneaky external dependency on cloudflare, slack etc? And it would be functionally the same? With the same performance if you put enough hardware there? If so cool, and that should have been clearly in the announcement, because as it sounded it is “I am a sucker, lock me in!”
  - kentonv 1mo ago
    > So you can run it off the public internet with no sneaky external dependency on cloudflare, slack etc? Yes. It even supports ollama and works decently well with some local LLMs. > And it would be functionally the same? With the same performance if you put enough hardware there? Honestly it is faster running locally. > If so cool, and that should have been clearly in the announcement, We had so many things we wanted to say, it was hard to fit them all into one story. The blog post is for an enterprise audience. My tweet thread is for the hacker audience.

layer8 1mo ago

> the sandbox is so secure that you can pretty much go wild -- the AI cannot introduce a significant security bug. This can only be correct when the application can’t affect anything outside the sandbox. Which would significantly restrict useful applications.

kentonv 1mo ago
See my next tweet in the chain: https://x.com/KentonVarda/status/2084990302784307363 https://x.com/KentonVarda/status/2084990302784307363 ------------- Of course, personal apps are more useful if they can connect to external services. Cloudflare OS introduces a "connector" system we call Gatekeepers. This is sort of like MCP (and MCP is supported as a kind of Gatekeeper), but with a lot more: * Instead of exposing tools, a Gatekeeper exposes a Cap'n Web RPC API. That makes it appropriate for use by both agents (via code mode) and Gadgets. * Gatekeepers integrate with the Cloudflare OS UI to provide inline audit logging and human-in-the-loop approvals for all side-effecting actions. * When an action requires approval, the agent does not need to stop and wait for it. A Gatekeeper will simulate the outcome, allowing the agent to keep running and queue up more work. You can then approve everything in a batch at the end. Hopefully, this means you no longer feel the need to turn on auto-approve! (But you still can if you want.) We have already built Gatekeepers for a huge number of services, from GitHub to Home Assistant. We've found, with the right skills, AI can basically crank these things out for any given API, solving the chicken-and-egg ecosystem problem. We are working on a "software factory" of sorts where you can input the API docs for your favorite service and get a well-written Gatekeeper. That's not quite ready yet -- so for now use the ones we provide or use the write-gatekeeper skill to write your own. You can add your own Gatekeepers to your personal deployment.
- kentonv 1mo ago
  Or more directly: When you share a Gadget, we verify that anyone you share with also has direct permission to access each of the resources it is connected to (via the Gatekeeper system). Hence, no security bug in the Gadget itself could accidentally grant people access to things they don't already have.

fny 1mo ago

That should have been the announcement. The article posted buries the lead. Cloudflare OS reads like almost any other AI knowledge base until midway when apps are introduced and then becomes overly technical with a code snippet.

kentonv 1mo ago
We really struggled with how to present this to multiple audiences at once. My tweet thread, and the GitHub readme, is really the presentation intended for the HN crowd. The blog post is for a different audience. https://github.com/cloudflare/cloudflare-os https://github.com/cloudflare/cloudflare-os
- philistine 1mo ago
  > The blog post is for a different audience. No one? Like literally, I don't understand a thing of what the blog post is saying. It's vague to the point of meaning nothing. Every piece of text I've seen that explains CloudflareOS is clear except the blog post.
  - QuantumNoodle 1mo ago
    I used to read their blog regularly because it had lots of interesting technical details. Lately, though, there’s less of that, and I can’t quite put my finger on what changed. My guess is that they realized how popular the blog had become and started using that attention more for advertising. There’s nothing wrong with that, but earlier the “advertisements” actually made me want to try things out and bring them back to my team. I even considered applying to work there. Not so much anymore. I’ve even removed it from my RSS feed. I don’t like offering criticism without a solution, but I’m not really motivated to come up with one here. It looks like employees may read this, so maybe someone will see the feedback.
    - jtwocents 1mo ago
      https://blog.cloudflare.com/three-chapters-at-cloudflare-programmer-to-cto-to-board-of-directors/ https://blog.cloudflare.com/three-chapters-at-cloudflare-pro... TL;DR; jgc stopped editing the blog, and AI slop took over: > Today, after more than 13 years at the company, I am joining Cloudflare’s board of directors and retiring from my full-time position as CTO. > ... > I wrote for, and edited, the Cloudflare Blog for many, many years

ManuelKiessling 1mo ago

> What if, when you wanted a new feature in the software you are using, you could just prompt your agent to add it? Yep, that's precisely the vision I formulated some months ago: https://manuel.kiessling.net/2025/11/04/what-if-software-shipped-with-a-software-engineer/ https://manuel.kiessling.net/2025/11/04/what-if-software-shi...

tinco 1mo ago

This is really interesting. I built a similar product (not released yet), but it uses Kubernetes as the infrastructure layer instead of Cloudflare OS. I guess all these years later I am left with the same existential question that plagued Sandstorm. What is its relevance in the context of Linux containers? This is not a rhetorical question, is there a real benefit for a Sandstorm grain over a docker style Linux container? Does a containerized process not have all the same benefits of a Sandstorm grain, with the added benefit of not requiring any modifications of the containerized software? One argument I could bring is that despite all its claims, OpenAI still had to switch from containers to MicroVMs because its agents under test still managed to break out from their containers. Is the security model of a Sandstorm grain so much better that agents wouldn't figure out how to break out of it?

kentonv 1mo ago
Sandstorm's use of containers was just a means to an end. The real innovation was the fine-grained instances -- each document in its own container. No other container platform did that. But honestly, it didn't work well, because of cold start times and memory usage. It's bad enough when a server takes seconds to start, but if every document you open has a long startup time and uses hundreds of MB of RAM, it's really painful. Cloudflare OS doesn't use containers. It uses Dynamic Workers, which are 100x more efficient: https://blog.cloudflare.com/dynamic-workers/ https://blog.cloudflare.com/dynamic-workers/ So the stuff I have been building in Workers for the past 9 years turns out to be the thing that Sandstorm needed all along. What a coincidence. :)
- echelon 1mo ago
  This is far too Cloudflare flavored to be interesting to me. It's using Workers (capital W) and the core Cloudflare primitives. I don't feel safe building on this or touching this. I'd be happier if a startup or neutral party built this in a more agnostic way.
  - kentonv 1mo ago
    I'm sorry but Workers is the technology that makes this all possible. I don't think I could have built this without Workers as a foundation. (I tried once, with Sandstorm, and like I said, it didn't work well.) Sometimes you just can't advance the state of the art while also maintaining broad compatibility. It's all open source, though. You can run the whole stack on your own machine.

LeBit 1mo ago

https://xcancel.com/KentonVarda/status/2084990137180590572 https://xcancel.com/KentonVarda/status/2084990137180590572

ignoramous 1mo ago

You should probably add a disclaimer you work at Cloudflare yourself? > I liked Kenton's take on this: https://x.com/KentonVarda/status/2084990137180590572 https://x.com/KentonVarda/status/2084990137180590572 https://archive.vn/wvgxq https://archive.vn/wvgxq

spooneybarger 1mo ago

Thank you. The tweet values the readers time. The blog post. Dear lord. So much noise. This was a great summation.

deleted 1mo ago

[deleted]

ashu1461 1mo ago

I don't get it How is this different than the capabilities which cowork by claude / chat gpt desktop apps now a days give in terms of core capabilities. The fact that you can maybe fetch bugs from jira and present in the way you want is true for any of the agentic orchestrators, so is it really the USP ? One difference I found against other orchestrators was that they work on a per seat billing model. Example if you have 10 team members who want access to a shared agent infrastructure, you would end up paying 10 * 20$ = 200$ per month while in this case it is probably just the AI and infrastructure bill that you have to spend, which probably might cross 200 dollars as well.

losvedir 1mo ago

Oh, wow! This is a lot clearer to me. I've long had a soft spot in my heart about Sandstorm. Here's a comment[0] I made 11 years ago about what Sandstorm was, to me: > I'm a web developer, but I can't really use my skills to provide an open source web app the way I'd like to. I'd like to build a small server-side budgeting app that people can use from their computers or phones to record expenses, but there's no way I can ask people to find a web host that lets them run rails, or set up a heroku account or whatever. > So my only alternative would be to run the service myself, but then I'm storing other people's data, I have to worry about scaling if lots of people use it, and user accounts, and all this stuff. > The idea of sandstorm is folks run this platform on their personal servers, and then it lets you browse an app store like interface and one-click install these server side apps. So I'd bundle up my budgeting rails app as a sandstorm package, and if someone wants to track their expenses from a variety of devices, they install the app. Now they're running it so the data is theirs, there's no scaling issues, and user authentication is provided by sandstorm. It was a beautiful thing that tried to thread the needle between personal, self-hosted software and cloud-based "software as a service". I've long thought that "federated" software is the sweetspot, since it allows people to control software in more natural organizational units like families or communities, without being centrally controlled or devolving into the craziness that is "decentralized". However, while the functionality of Cloudflare OS may be Sandstorm-inspired, I feel like it doesn't really have its soul. What a difference a decade makes! Here's another comment[1] from me 10 years ago about why I loved sandstorm, which begins: > Oh no! I really believe sandstorm (or something like it) is what we need the future to be. Rather than having everything get sucked up into Google, Facebook, Apple, or these other few centralized services, imagine where everyone has a personal (or family, or church group or whatever) server, and they can one-click install their email apps, their document apps, etc. These days Cloudflare has become one of the "Google, Facebook, Apple" that I mentioned. I'm still a fan of Cloudflare generally, and with kentonv behind this I absolutely have to try it out, but it doesn't have the open source, community-oriented charm that I think Sandstorm had. edit: Oh, I didn't read far enough down the tweet chain: > I am so proud to say, we are making this whole thing open source, Apache 2.0 license, no catch. Hooray! Sandstorm's back on the menu, boys! This really does make me happy. I never should have doubted, ha. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10237821 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10237821 [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13589471 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13589471

nijave 1mo ago

>This doesn't work in the cloud Software-as-a-Service model, because you are not running your own copy of the app. Let me introduce you to scrapling+MCP--the closest I've come. Stealthed, controllable browser gives you an API to arbitrary web things You can't modify it, but you can extend it which imo is the next best thing adb (Android) is close albeit a bit more tedious. It's fun watching an LLM take screenshots, read them, then send input events back to the phone. If you have a rooted Android, you _can_ modify the apps. Xposed, ReVanced, et al subject to Play Integrity's ever growing pervasiveness

MattCruikshank 1mo ago

Great! I'm really excited. So, I want to make an RSS feed Gadget. And you will run an RSS Aggregator Gadget, and then some Presentation Gadget. Do I have that roughly right? How does my Gadget talk to yours? Cloudflare Tunnels for CGNAT, NAT traversal? CapnProto for the schema? Fire and forget? Online only? Queuing? Store and forward? How do I keep track of my Contacts? Who is allowed to read my feed? Are controls built in? So so so many questions. Do you have office hours? :D

VladVladikoff 1mo ago

It is quite foolish to believe that now that we have AI generated code that people will suddenly choose the more secure option rather than the cheapest. My evidence in exhibit A: The success of Wordpress.

millsau 1mo ago

do you think this would do a better job then hermes? Also would it run on a rasberry pi?

maCDzP 1mo ago

Reminds me of EMacs, which I really like.

chinathrow 1mo ago

> the AI cannot introduce a significant security bug. Famous last words.

deleted 1mo ago
[deleted]

MWil 1mo ago

I vividly remember Sandstorm. It was very intuitive and easy to use for a non-technical user like myself.

ThePowerOfFuet 1mo ago

> the AI cannot introduce a significant security bug. Uh-huh.