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Bah. Personally my take on the entire affair is quite negative, whatever Jarred or Simonw says about it. I think Bun owned by Anthropic and the entire rewrite
by gabrieledarrigo 2mo ago
Bah.
Personally my take on the entire affair is quite negative, whatever Jarred or Simonw says about it.
I think Bun owned by Anthropic and the entire rewrite with AI is not the real point (even if it's quite interesting, though).
My take is that Jarred, and Bun,didn't demonstrate a serious, adult approach, from "this is my branch, you are overreacting" message to just proceeding with a 1mil+ PR merged in less than month.
The communication is the issue, and it was handled very badly, in a way that impacted trust and divisions.
Was it so difficult to adopt the approach that the TS team adopted for 7.0?
- baq 2mo agoI guess the point is none of it matters, CC users didn't notice or don't care except an exceptionally small minority.
- deleted 2mo ago[deleted]
- ai_fry_ur_brain 2mo ago[dead]
- snemvalts 2mo agoThe lowest of the bars
- drodgers 2mo agoBut the only one that matters? Seems like this is delivering business value.
- conartist6 2mo agoHaha TS7 is the next biggest example of, "Let's just do a line by line port to another language instead of seriously examining our architecture"
- deleted 2mo ago[deleted]
- zarzavat 2mo agoIndeed as much I dislike the approach Bun took, at least the port appears to be working. TS7 is going to cause problems for downstream users because Go is the wrong language to use for something that has to run in WASM.
- nicce 2mo ago> TS7 is going to cause problems for downstream users because Go is the wrong language to use for something that has to run in WASM. Is there a huge need to run that typechecking on browsers?
- zarzavat 2mo agoYes, in the Monaco editor (https://microsoft.github.io/monaco-editor/ https://microsoft.github.io/monaco-editor/). It's not just typechecking, the typescript library is also the reference parser for TypeScript and reference emit. Emitting JS from TypeScript is non-trivial and non-local. It's not just in browsers, you might want to run the typescript library on the edge or in some restricted environment where JS/WASM is OK but native code is not. You may want to use the typescript library as a dependency in your own package. TypeScript becoming non-pure JS means that your library also becomes non-pure JS.
- anon7000 2mo agoNodeJS can strip types internally without a straight TS dependency. I don’t think this matters, TS was a huge bottleneck for many build pipelines because it never parallelized well
- zarzavat 2mo agoType stripping is not the same as emit, it only gets you a subset of TypeScript. Fine if you're running your own code, not fine if you want to run arbitrary TypeScript.
- CrimsonRain 2mo ago[flagged]
- amazingman 2mo agoNormal users, anti-AI dinosaurs / zig fanatics, and no one else. That's a nice echo chamber you have going there.
- Sammi 2mo ago"Normal users" haven't even heard of Bun and are still on Node.
- cush 2mo agoThere's literally nothing stopping anyone from continuing the Zig version if they want to
- mlsu 2mo agoIt really does seem like they should have been able to do an incremental rewrite with FFI. Could have easily done it with AI too.
- classicposter 2mo agoYes, they probably don't know C ABI.
- ozozozd 2mo agoSerious adults? They are in extremely short supply right now. It’s a mix of serious-wanna be, quasi religious, quasi-technical people running the show right now. I am so happy to I got to read about the 90s-2000s tech culture, and experienced the post-2008 startup culture. Just about 10 years ago people were really serious, but chill-looking. Somehow that got flipped.
- polynomial 2mo agoThe wig-vs-grok periodic cycle.
- kzrdude 2mo agoMario Zechner's talk "Building Pi in a World of Slop" is a good listen, on the topic of adults in a "world of slop". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjfbvDXpFls https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjfbvDXpFls
- randysalami 2mo agoSometimes being unserious is actually very serious. See current US administration.
- NewsaHackO 2mo agoI don't know, I feel as though Bun went about it much more maturely than zig at any point in the process, from the initial attempted zig compiler commit by the Bun team to the Zig dev team member response to the Bun Rust blog post. Also, I think that fallout over this whole event will definitely favor Bun versus Zig.
- raincole 2mo agoIt's a weird way to frame the event. Yeah, Andrew (Zig)'s responses were astonishingly immature, but it doesn't matter. Even if Andrew literally ate baby seals for breakfast and kicked puppies as a hobby, it wouldn't make Bun look better. You'd notice that the parent comment didn't even mention zig at all.
- NewsaHackO 2mo agoSaying Bun's communication was an issue here is clutching pearls. There is no evidence that Bun ever acted in bad faith, Jared definitely seemed to initally think it was just a trial, until he realized that it was actually something feasible. He isn't clairvoyant; there is no way he would have known it was going to be successful when he initially made the post.
- simondotau 2mo agoBun isn't Bun, it's a (notionally) trillion dollar AI company famous for ruthlessness and engineering controversy for marketing purposes. Zig just happens to be a language led by someone with an AI-skeptic philosophy. Are you saying I should just believe that their strategically deniable negative insinuations about Zig are not bad faith? Sorry, but I'm calling bullshit. I know there's no absolute smoking gun here, but it's all a bit too cute to be unintentional. They are very very smart people. They knew what they were doing.
- foldr 2mo agoThe simplest explanation is that the Bun team decided to try rewriting Bun in Rust because they had some frustrations with Zig. I haven't seen any evidence that there's more to it than that. It's easy to get sucked into all the internet drama, but that only exists because Zig's author lost his cool and wrote a salty blog post, not because of any conniving on Athropic's part.
- pier25 2mo agoThis is the exact reason I stopped using Bun for new projects. Terrible project governance. TS 7 is a good example of what a responsible team that cares about their users should have done.
- randysalami 2mo agoThere was a recent post on here with a Claude Code issue I and others responses to. Specifically, the person from Anthropic who caused the issue replied on HackerNews. In it, he claimed he was the sole contributor and reviewer of the code into production, that he would “do better” in the future. Commenters were confused how a company like Anthropic could allow something like this occur and for an engineer to publicly admit a complete failure and negligence of build processes. It’s clear seeing your post here a couple days later what’s going on. It’s deliberate. I can only speculate on their reasons why but it seems to be an intentional form of disrespect on the engineering culture. “Your norms, your work, your principles” mean nothing. We can spend money and invalidate your life’s work. We don’t need your consent or support. That’s my personal guess at a surface level.