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I kind of understand that, although of course i completely disagree with their line of thinking. Iran is everyones problem and open conflict like this would hav

I kind of understand that, although of course i completely disagree with their line of thinking. Iran is everyones problem and open conflict like this would have been hard to avoid down the road. Point is they had months to anticipate this latest conflict, why did they do absolutely nothing to mitigate this? Why was the UK apparently completely unprepared? Europe's economy is suffering, more then America. Why do we even bother with a Navy if we don't wan't to use it? Also what military support did they drop exactly? Ukraine isn't part of NATO, and the US has been carrying 90% of NATO since forever. I will point out that it was the US, through a combination of bombing and diplomacy that got rid of the Houthi threat to shipping. Nobody else succeeded.

Maken 6mo ago
How is Iran anyone but Israel and USA's problem?
- Jensson 6mo ago
  They fund terrorism in the countries around them, all the neighboring countries there hates Iran. That is why they aren't really angry that USA is bombing Iran.
  - forty 6mo ago
    I think they are kind of angry? At least they don't seem interested in participating despite being targeted by Iran themselves, I don't know how more they could express their disagreement with this operation than even accepting to be bombed without any reaction?
lm28469 6mo ago
> Iran is everyones problem It was at best a regional problem until the US and israel decided to fuck things up and make it a global problem, they didn't have nukes, they were not building nukes, even if they had nukes they would not have used them for anything other than extinction level threats, so just like israel, everyone is OK with them having nukes despite being the same type of religious nutjob thecracy, strange. Iranians are very rational when it comes to escalation, more so than israel. > Ukraine isn't part of NATO, and the US has been carrying 90% of NATO since forever Yeah idk, maybe don't put cia bases there then? And maybe don't antagonize russia for decades and act surprised when they act like enemies. You won't catch me defending Russia or Iran but get the fuck out of here with the "the US are the good guys and we're doing god's work by wiping out evil regimes" rhetoric lmao > Nobody else succeeded. Yes because that's the only thing they know and understand, bombs, if the problem cannot be solved with bombs they're useless
- Jensson 6mo ago
  > even if they had nukes they would not have used them for anything other than extinction level threats I'd agree for just about any other country, but Iran have a terrorist regime that is funding terrorists everywhere. They are not like Pakistan or North Korea etc, Iran is crazy and doesn't follow normal international norms. Even Russia and Ukraine doesn't bomb third party countries in war just for supporting the other side, that is a crazy stupid thing to do and any country behaving like that should never ever have nukes.
  - ImPostingOnHN 6mo ago
    > Even Russia and Ukraine doesn't bomb third party countries in war just for supporting the other side, that is a crazy stupid thing to do and any country behaving like that should never ever have nukes. To the extent this might be true, it seems like it would be even more true of the two countries that unprovokedly bombed a third party country to start the war in the first place.
    - Jensson 6mo ago
      > two countries that unprovokedly It isn't unprovoked, Iran current regime has chanted "Death to America" since its founding. USA has plenty of reasons to attack here which is why you don't see more international outcry or support for Iran. Iran are on their own.
      - lm28469 6mo ago
        > USA has plenty of reasons to attack Yet none have been provided, remember the anthrax scam at the united nations? At least they put some efforts into it
        Jensson 6mo ago
        They don't need to provide a reason, its probably related to greed etc, but greed is still a rational reason. Iran attacking their neighbors is not rational here, it just makes the middle east hate them more. I am not talking about international laws here, just the norms everyone follows in wars. Everyone breaks the international laws, but the norms of not attacking third parties etc are there for rational reasons, since you don't gain anything for doing so its just stupid and causes damage and strife and hurts you for doing it.
ImPostingOnHN 6mo ago
Generally, the one who causes the problem should fix it. Especially when the problem they caused is hurting their friends. It takes a really good friend to not only accept and forgive the hurt caused, but to help fix the problem, too. Usually an apology from the problem-causer must come first. I think what we're seeing is that the USA has un-good-friended so many countries that it has no good friends left with the military capabilities to help. It has allies maybe, but nobody who would do such a favor after being victimized by the asker and the problems they caused, without even so much as an apology. It certainly doesn't help that the USA is asking for help, but probably wants to boss around anybody who volunteers, and it is doing none of the work itself. Sounds like a toxic team. > Iran is everyones problem Iran is not everyone's problem. The effects of israel and the USA's war of choice on Iran are everyone's problem. What we're seeing now is not a result of anything Iran did, but rather something the USA and israel did. The worse the effects get, the more blame will be heaped upon the USA and israel. To that end, most countries are likely of the attitude that they have already incurred enough costs from the USA and israel's war, and that the USA and israel had better fix the problem they caused ASAP.
- chasd00 6mo ago
  there are no friends at the global scale just alliances. If Europe doesn't want to help then there's no forcing them to. Conversely, if the US manages to get the strait open and oil flowing there's no stopping them from requiring Europe to pay a little extra for the trouble. Fair or not, who's going to stop the other side? You can't exactly ask to speak to the manager.
  - ImPostingOnHN 6mo ago
    If the USA manages to get the strait open and oil flowing, then allies might be satisfied with the harms the USA caused, even if there is no apology, much less restitution. At that point, we will be back to the status quo. If, at that point, the USA perpetrates any sort of further economic attacks on allies, then of course they will respond appropriately.
  - rcxdude 6mo ago
detaro 6mo ago
Again, how should the UK use the Navy here?
cwillu 6mo ago
The pan of oil on the stove is everyone's problem, but when the dumbass decides the way to deal with it is to pour water on it, it is now in everyone's interest to leave the area.
mrguyorama 6mo ago
>Ukraine isn't part of NATO, and the US has been carrying 90% of NATO since forever. This has always been the stupidest take. Do you know how Europe always planned to pay their part of NATO? Blood. Go look at war plans if things ever got hot with the soviets. Germany would be gone. The plan was always hundreds of thousands of dead Europeans while the US geared up to come save the day. America's plan for NATO was the same as it's contribution to the first two world wars: Sell all the guns, ammo, fuel, and food required to keep Europe alive while their territory was wiped clean by war. Compare US casualties in either World War with European casualties. That was always the plan. Europe's contribution was the graveyards they would have to plow after the war. Complaining about some budgeting is insane. That was always just a bonus kickback. So, exactly how things go with Ukraine. They die, we profit, maybe their country survives after, US remains basically untouched, though that part is no longer reality.

Maken 6mo ago

How is Iran anyone but Israel and USA's problem?

Jensson 6mo ago
They fund terrorism in the countries around them, all the neighboring countries there hates Iran. That is why they aren't really angry that USA is bombing Iran.
- forty 6mo ago
  I think they are kind of angry? At least they don't seem interested in participating despite being targeted by Iran themselves, I don't know how more they could express their disagreement with this operation than even accepting to be bombed without any reaction?

lm28469 6mo ago

> Iran is everyones problem It was at best a regional problem until the US and israel decided to fuck things up and make it a global problem, they didn't have nukes, they were not building nukes, even if they had nukes they would not have used them for anything other than extinction level threats, so just like israel, everyone is OK with them having nukes despite being the same type of religious nutjob thecracy, strange. Iranians are very rational when it comes to escalation, more so than israel. > Ukraine isn't part of NATO, and the US has been carrying 90% of NATO since forever Yeah idk, maybe don't put cia bases there then? And maybe don't antagonize russia for decades and act surprised when they act like enemies. You won't catch me defending Russia or Iran but get the fuck out of here with the "the US are the good guys and we're doing god's work by wiping out evil regimes" rhetoric lmao > Nobody else succeeded. Yes because that's the only thing they know and understand, bombs, if the problem cannot be solved with bombs they're useless

Jensson 6mo ago
> even if they had nukes they would not have used them for anything other than extinction level threats I'd agree for just about any other country, but Iran have a terrorist regime that is funding terrorists everywhere. They are not like Pakistan or North Korea etc, Iran is crazy and doesn't follow normal international norms. Even Russia and Ukraine doesn't bomb third party countries in war just for supporting the other side, that is a crazy stupid thing to do and any country behaving like that should never ever have nukes.
- ImPostingOnHN 6mo ago
  > Even Russia and Ukraine doesn't bomb third party countries in war just for supporting the other side, that is a crazy stupid thing to do and any country behaving like that should never ever have nukes. To the extent this might be true, it seems like it would be even more true of the two countries that unprovokedly bombed a third party country to start the war in the first place.
  - Jensson 6mo ago
    > two countries that unprovokedly It isn't unprovoked, Iran current regime has chanted "Death to America" since its founding. USA has plenty of reasons to attack here which is why you don't see more international outcry or support for Iran. Iran are on their own.
    - lm28469 6mo ago
      > USA has plenty of reasons to attack Yet none have been provided, remember the anthrax scam at the united nations? At least they put some efforts into it
      - Jensson 6mo ago
        They don't need to provide a reason, its probably related to greed etc, but greed is still a rational reason. Iran attacking their neighbors is not rational here, it just makes the middle east hate them more. I am not talking about international laws here, just the norms everyone follows in wars. Everyone breaks the international laws, but the norms of not attacking third parties etc are there for rational reasons, since you don't gain anything for doing so its just stupid and causes damage and strife and hurts you for doing it.

ImPostingOnHN 6mo ago

Generally, the one who causes the problem should fix it. Especially when the problem they caused is hurting their friends. It takes a really good friend to not only accept and forgive the hurt caused, but to help fix the problem, too. Usually an apology from the problem-causer must come first. I think what we're seeing is that the USA has un-good-friended so many countries that it has no good friends left with the military capabilities to help. It has allies maybe, but nobody who would do such a favor after being victimized by the asker and the problems they caused, without even so much as an apology. It certainly doesn't help that the USA is asking for help, but probably wants to boss around anybody who volunteers, and it is doing none of the work itself. Sounds like a toxic team. > Iran is everyones problem Iran is not everyone's problem. The effects of israel and the USA's war of choice on Iran are everyone's problem. What we're seeing now is not a result of anything Iran did, but rather something the USA and israel did. The worse the effects get, the more blame will be heaped upon the USA and israel. To that end, most countries are likely of the attitude that they have already incurred enough costs from the USA and israel's war, and that the USA and israel had better fix the problem they caused ASAP.

chasd00 6mo ago
there are no friends at the global scale just alliances. If Europe doesn't want to help then there's no forcing them to. Conversely, if the US manages to get the strait open and oil flowing there's no stopping them from requiring Europe to pay a little extra for the trouble. Fair or not, who's going to stop the other side? You can't exactly ask to speak to the manager.
- ImPostingOnHN 6mo ago
  If the USA manages to get the strait open and oil flowing, then allies might be satisfied with the harms the USA caused, even if there is no apology, much less restitution. At that point, we will be back to the status quo. If, at that point, the USA perpetrates any sort of further economic attacks on allies, then of course they will respond appropriately.
- rcxdude 6mo ago

detaro 6mo ago

Again, how should the UK use the Navy here?

cwillu 6mo ago

The pan of oil on the stove is everyone's problem, but when the dumbass decides the way to deal with it is to pour water on it, it is now in everyone's interest to leave the area.

mrguyorama 6mo ago

>Ukraine isn't part of NATO, and the US has been carrying 90% of NATO since forever. This has always been the stupidest take. Do you know how Europe always planned to pay their part of NATO? Blood. Go look at war plans if things ever got hot with the soviets. Germany would be gone. The plan was always hundreds of thousands of dead Europeans while the US geared up to come save the day. America's plan for NATO was the same as it's contribution to the first two world wars: Sell all the guns, ammo, fuel, and food required to keep Europe alive while their territory was wiped clean by war. Compare US casualties in either World War with European casualties. That was always the plan. Europe's contribution was the graveyards they would have to plow after the war. Complaining about some budgeting is insane. That was always just a bonus kickback. So, exactly how things go with Ukraine. They die, we profit, maybe their country survives after, US remains basically untouched, though that part is no longer reality.