6 ms·

> It's probably fine--unless you care about self-improvement or taking pride in your work. I’m hired to solve business problems with technology, not to self-im

> It's probably fine--unless you care about self-improvement or taking pride in your work. I’m hired to solve business problems with technology, not to self-improve or get on my high horse because I hand-wrote a silly abstraction layer for the n-th time

deleted 9mo ago
[deleted]
darkwater 9mo ago
And you/we will be replaced by an AI that will solve the business problem (the day they get so good to actually do that, which might happen or not but... who knows?)
- rybosworld 9mo ago
  And the person that hand-writes the code won't be replaced?
  - darkwater 9mo ago
    Yes, as well. There aare probably 2 ways to see te future of LLMs / AI: they are either going to have the capabilities to replace all white collar work, or they are not. If you think they are going to replace us, then yo ucan either surrender or fight back, and personally I read all these anti-AI posts as fighting back, to help people realize we might be digging our own grave. If, OTOH, you see AI as a force-multiplier tool that's never going to completely replace a human developer then yes, probably the smartest thing to do is to learn how to master this new tool, but at the same time keep in mind the side effects it might bring, like atrophy.
    - shadowgovt 9mo ago
      My personal goal has been to dig that grave ever since I could hold a shovel. We've always been in the business of replacing humans in the 3-D's space (dirty, dangerous, dull... And to be clear. data manipulation for its own sake is dull). If we make AI that replaces 90% of what I do at my desk every day... We did it. We realized the dream from the old Tom Swift novels where he comes up with an idea for an invention and hands the idea off to his computer to extrapolate it, or the ship's computer in Star Trek acting like a perfect engineering and analytical assistant to take fuzzy asks from humans and turn them into useful output.
      - rybosworld 9mo ago
        The problem is that this time, we're creating a competing intelligence that in theory could replace all work, AND, that competing intelligence is ultimately owned/controlled by a few dozen very rich guys. They aren't going to willingly spread the wealth.
    - rybosworld 9mo ago
      Realistically I think the only way to fight back is unions.
- sallveburrpi 9mo ago
  I really really hope an AI will do this work and solve all the “business problems” so I can go and be a goat herder
  - noman-land 9mo ago
    Go herd goats. You don't need to wait for AI to destroy your livelihood.
    - defterGoose 9mo ago
      Yeah, but there's nothing like some sweet, sweet justification.
    - shadowgovt 9mo ago
      Herding goats doesn't solve the interesting technical problem I'm trying to solve. Point is: if that problem is solvable without me, that's the win condition for everyone. Then I go herd goats (and have this nifty tool that helps me spec out an optimal goat fence while I'm at it).
      - lelanthran 9mo ago
        > Point is: if that problem is solvable without me, that's the win condition for everyone. The problem is solvable without you. I don't even need to know what the problem actually is, because the odds of you being one of the handful of the people in the world who are so critical that the world notices their passing is so low, I have a better chance of winning a lottery jackpot than of you being some critical piece of some solution.
        sallveburrpi 9mo ago
        I completely disagree - I think it’s the other way around. Solving the problem - no matter what problem it is - is extremely dependent on you and every single human being (or animal for that matter) is a critical piece of their environment and circumstances.
tomjen3 9mo ago
For me AI is really powerful autocomplete. Like you said, I wrote the abstraction years ago. Writing the abstraction again now is not required. A time and place may come where the AI are so powerful I’m not needed. That time is not right now. I have used Rider for years at this point and it automatically handles most imports. It’s not AI, but its one of the things that is just not needed for me to even think about.
saubeidl 9mo ago
Maybe you become worse at solving business problems with technology once you let that muscle atrophy?
hudon 9mo ago
and a teacher is hired to teach, but some self-improve so they may become headmaster
shams93 9mo ago
I agree, I was always annoyed in projects where these kids thought they were still in school and spinning up incredible levels of over abstraction that led to some really horrible security problems.
wrs 9mo ago
Are you a consultant? Because otherwise there’s a thing called a “career ladder”, and you are very much being paid to self-improve. And if you don’t, that’s going to feature prominently in your next promotion review.
avgDev 9mo ago
I love to code, like fun code, solving a relatively small concrete problem with code feels rewarding to me....however, writing business code on the other hand? Not really. I do however, love solving business problems. This is what I am hired for. I speak to VP/managers to improve their day to day. I come up with feasible solution and translate them into code. If AI could actually code, like really code(not here is some code, it may or may not work go read documentation to figure out why it doesn't), I would just go and focus on creating affordable software solutions to medium/small businesses. This is kind of like gardening/farming, before industrial revolution most crops required a huge work force, these days with all the equipment and advancements a single farmer can do a lot on their own with small staff. People still "hand" garden for pleasure, but without using the new tech they wouldn't be able to compete on a big scale. I know many fear AI, but it is progress and it will never stop. I do think many devs are intelligent and will be able to evolve in the workplace.
lelanthran 9mo ago
> I’m hired to solve business problems with technology, not to self-improve or get on my high horse because I hand-wrote a silly abstraction layer for the n-th time So, this "solve business problems" is some temporary[1] gig for you?[2] ------------------------------ [1] I'm reminded of the anti-union people who are merely temporarily embarrassed millionaires. [2] Skills atrophy. Maybe you won't need the atrophied skill in the future, but how sure are you that this is the case? The eventual outcome?

deleted 9mo ago

[deleted]

darkwater 9mo ago

And you/we will be replaced by an AI that will solve the business problem (the day they get so good to actually do that, which might happen or not but... who knows?)

rybosworld 9mo ago
And the person that hand-writes the code won't be replaced?
- darkwater 9mo ago
  Yes, as well. There aare probably 2 ways to see te future of LLMs / AI: they are either going to have the capabilities to replace all white collar work, or they are not. If you think they are going to replace us, then yo ucan either surrender or fight back, and personally I read all these anti-AI posts as fighting back, to help people realize we might be digging our own grave. If, OTOH, you see AI as a force-multiplier tool that's never going to completely replace a human developer then yes, probably the smartest thing to do is to learn how to master this new tool, but at the same time keep in mind the side effects it might bring, like atrophy.
  - shadowgovt 9mo ago
    My personal goal has been to dig that grave ever since I could hold a shovel. We've always been in the business of replacing humans in the 3-D's space (dirty, dangerous, dull... And to be clear. data manipulation for its own sake is dull). If we make AI that replaces 90% of what I do at my desk every day... We did it. We realized the dream from the old Tom Swift novels where he comes up with an idea for an invention and hands the idea off to his computer to extrapolate it, or the ship's computer in Star Trek acting like a perfect engineering and analytical assistant to take fuzzy asks from humans and turn them into useful output.
    - rybosworld 9mo ago
      The problem is that this time, we're creating a competing intelligence that in theory could replace all work, AND, that competing intelligence is ultimately owned/controlled by a few dozen very rich guys. They aren't going to willingly spread the wealth.
  - rybosworld 9mo ago
    Realistically I think the only way to fight back is unions.
sallveburrpi 9mo ago
I really really hope an AI will do this work and solve all the “business problems” so I can go and be a goat herder
- noman-land 9mo ago
  Go herd goats. You don't need to wait for AI to destroy your livelihood.
  - defterGoose 9mo ago
    Yeah, but there's nothing like some sweet, sweet justification.
  - shadowgovt 9mo ago
    Herding goats doesn't solve the interesting technical problem I'm trying to solve. Point is: if that problem is solvable without me, that's the win condition for everyone. Then I go herd goats (and have this nifty tool that helps me spec out an optimal goat fence while I'm at it).
    - lelanthran 9mo ago
      > Point is: if that problem is solvable without me, that's the win condition for everyone. The problem is solvable without you. I don't even need to know what the problem actually is, because the odds of you being one of the handful of the people in the world who are so critical that the world notices their passing is so low, I have a better chance of winning a lottery jackpot than of you being some critical piece of some solution.
      - sallveburrpi 9mo ago
        I completely disagree - I think it’s the other way around. Solving the problem - no matter what problem it is - is extremely dependent on you and every single human being (or animal for that matter) is a critical piece of their environment and circumstances.

tomjen3 9mo ago

For me AI is really powerful autocomplete. Like you said, I wrote the abstraction years ago. Writing the abstraction again now is not required. A time and place may come where the AI are so powerful I’m not needed. That time is not right now. I have used Rider for years at this point and it automatically handles most imports. It’s not AI, but its one of the things that is just not needed for me to even think about.

saubeidl 9mo ago

Maybe you become worse at solving business problems with technology once you let that muscle atrophy?

hudon 9mo ago

and a teacher is hired to teach, but some self-improve so they may become headmaster

shams93 9mo ago

I agree, I was always annoyed in projects where these kids thought they were still in school and spinning up incredible levels of over abstraction that led to some really horrible security problems.

wrs 9mo ago

Are you a consultant? Because otherwise there’s a thing called a “career ladder”, and you are very much being paid to self-improve. And if you don’t, that’s going to feature prominently in your next promotion review.

avgDev 9mo ago

I love to code, like fun code, solving a relatively small concrete problem with code feels rewarding to me....however, writing business code on the other hand? Not really. I do however, love solving business problems. This is what I am hired for. I speak to VP/managers to improve their day to day. I come up with feasible solution and translate them into code. If AI could actually code, like really code(not here is some code, it may or may not work go read documentation to figure out why it doesn't), I would just go and focus on creating affordable software solutions to medium/small businesses. This is kind of like gardening/farming, before industrial revolution most crops required a huge work force, these days with all the equipment and advancements a single farmer can do a lot on their own with small staff. People still "hand" garden for pleasure, but without using the new tech they wouldn't be able to compete on a big scale. I know many fear AI, but it is progress and it will never stop. I do think many devs are intelligent and will be able to evolve in the workplace.

lelanthran 9mo ago

> I’m hired to solve business problems with technology, not to self-improve or get on my high horse because I hand-wrote a silly abstraction layer for the n-th time So, this "solve business problems" is some temporary[1] gig for you?[2] ------------------------------ [1] I'm reminded of the anti-union people who are merely temporarily embarrassed millionaires. [2] Skills atrophy. Maybe you won't need the atrophied skill in the future, but how sure are you that this is the case? The eventual outcome?