6 ms·

Sounds more like people need to de-UK. It's going to be a problem with any company or technology.

by codexb 10mo ago

advisedwang 10mo ago
[flagged]
- jajuuka 10mo ago
  Granted it would be more impactful that to stop using Google and Apple services.
- cmsj 10mo ago
  The actual straightforward fix isn't available to us - namely, we aren't due a general election until 2029 and right now the "good guys" are in power, so it's not at all clear that anyone would even offer to reverse this TCN if they were elected instead, in 4 years time.
  - anonymousiam 10mo ago
    At least the US hasn't postponed the general elections to keep the unpopular party in power. https://www.local.gov.uk/our-support/devolution-and-lgr-hub/devolution-lgr-and-delays-local-elections https://www.local.gov.uk/our-support/devolution-and-lgr-hub/...
    - exe34 10mo ago
      I wish they would help get as many reform councils as possible. Given how incompetent they have been in the ones they did get elected, I think it would put a damper on the enthusiasm of their supporters.
      - rob_c 10mo ago
        yes, and they're totally not fighting on multiple fronts against central govt, those in the areas they're trying to run deciding that the civil service can now be a political arm of the left or from having to boot the actual racists in sheep's clothing from the party. I'm not defending any party here, I'm even highlighting some of reforms worse issues. But you have to admit it's not apples and oranges when comparing their performance so far with a cushy little on-the-Thames millionaires cul-de-sac.
        exe34 10mo ago
        > racists in sheep's clothing from the party. Could you name a few? I thought you had to be racist to join...
    - 4ndrewl 10mo ago
      Fact check - the UK hasn't postponed the general election. Your link points to _some_ local council elections (the people responsible for bin collections, parks and care homes) and the extension has been requested by the local councils themselves.
    - kcartlidge 10mo ago
      Neither has the UK government. * It wasn't the general election. * They offered local councils the chance to request it if they were going through a reorganisation or devolution process. * 18 councils requested and 9 were accepted as justified. * And even those are only delayed until May next year (one year after the rest of the UK). So to be clear the UK government not only didn't postpone the general elections but half the councils who requested the local elections were postponed were denied, with the other half having reasons and still doing it a year later anyway. And all that is actually covered in the page you link to.
  - dontlaugh 10mo ago
    If there was a general election today, who exactly could we vote for? Trade union organising with the threat of nationwide industrial action would work regardless of which flavour of Tory is in power, though.
  - fastball 10mo ago
    > and right now the "good guys" are in power, so So close and yet so far.
- aa-jv 10mo ago
  They need to stay and fix their country, and the means by which they do that is simple: start prosecuting our own war criminals.
benoau 10mo ago
It's more likely to be a problem with Apple (and Google) because they have put themselves in a position where they are a gateway to everybody. There are multitudes of online storage providers outside of the UK's reach and jurisdiction but 0% of iPhone users back up to them because of technical limitations that inhibit iCloud competitors or any compatible storage solution.
- stavros 10mo ago
  > 0% of iPhone users back up to them because of technical limitations that inhibit iCloud competitors or any compatible storage solution. To clarify, by "technical limitations" here you don't mean "it's not possible with our current technology", you mean "Apple purposely blocks this".
  - benoau 10mo ago
    Allegedly it's deliberate, according to a pair of legal actions they face in the UK (hearing in 9 days) and US (hearing in August 2026). > 13.1 a set of technical restrictions and practices that prevent users of iOS from storing certain key file types (known as “Restricted Files”) on any cloud storage service other than its own iCloud and thus ensuring that users have no choice but to use iCloud (a complete monopolist in respect of these Restricted Files) if they wish to meet all their cloud storage and/or back up needs, in particular in order to conduct a complete back-up of the device (“the Restricted File Conduct”); and/or > 13.2 an unfair choice architecture, which individually and cumulatively steer iOS Users towards using and purchasing iCloud rather than other cloud storage services, and/or limit their effective choice, and/or exclude or disadvantage rivals or would- be rivals ( “the Choice Architecture Conduct ”). See further paragraphs 6 to 9 and 97 to 132 of the CPCF. https://www.catribunal.org.uk/cases/16897724-consumers-association-which https://www.catribunal.org.uk/cases/16897724-consumers-assoc... (via summary of ruling of the chair) > 30. By sequestering Restricted Files, and denying all other cloud providers access to them, Apple prevents rival cloud platforms from offering a full-service cloud solution that can compete effectively against iCloud. The cloud products that rivals can offer are, by virtue of Apple’s restraints, fundamentally diminished because they can only host Accessible Files. Users who want to back up all of their files—including the basic Restricted Files needed to restore their device at replacement—have but one option in the marketplace: iCloud. > 31. There is no technological or security justification for Apple mandating the use of iCloud for Restricted Files. Apple draws this distinction only to curtail competition and advantage its iCloud product over rival cloud platforms. https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/68303306/felix-gamboa-v-apple-inc/ https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/68303306/felix-gamboa-v... (via document 1 the complaint)
amelius 10mo ago
It's an Apple problem, because with libre tools you can run your own software to circumvent this law.
- j45 10mo ago
  The majority of apple and android users can't run their own libre software, until libre software is as easy and seamless to use as the comparables.
  - Aachen 10mo ago
    My (grand)parents like their FOSS launcher, gallery, and chat client just fine. I've had zero questions about how Signal works, but a bunch about how to deal with the OS' pre-installed garbage spawning notifications about this or that update. They can't tell the difference between an advertisement pushed by some commercial app they want and a smartwatch firmware update notification From my POV, it's the commercial software that has fundamental usability issues due to misaligned incentives (not completely different either, but not as aligned as FOSS). They just have a better lobby and marketing budget. Chrome didn't become this ubiquitous on mobile by having to be downloaded from f-droid, but by making a deal that device manufacturers cannot refuse
    - rob_c 10mo ago
      tell me, did they install and set this up themselves or you?
      - catlikesshrimp 10mo ago
        Did you have to state that as a question? (I obviously install even FB and Watsapp in there) It's unthinkable to setup a phone with whatsapp and fb here. When meta had a BGP problem, they (the older ones) asked me why there was "no internet"
        rob_c 10mo ago
odiroot 10mo ago
There's more good reasons to de-Apple besides just residing in UK.
mistercheph 10mo ago
Thankfully my predecessors de-UK’ed for me!
- herewulf 10mo ago
  Legacy features!
aa-jv 10mo ago
People need to hold the UK government responsible for its crimes against humanity. Until the AUMF and similiar policies across the Wetsern hemisphere which resulted in the utterly reprehensible "War on Terror", are rescinded and the crimes committed under their enactment fully prosecuted, the authoritarianism will continue. Remember, people, these are WAR CRIMINALS driving these policies forward. To expect this class of individuals to adhere to democratic, western values, is naive in the extreme. The same people who have no problem with genociding a million people in the middle east enemy-state-de-jour are not going to give one fig of care to the local human rights violations that they are also getting away with. The West has a war criminal problem. Until we solve that we cannot do a damn thing about our human rights problem.

Sounds more like people need to de-UK. It's going to be a problem with any company or technology.

by codexb 10mo ago

Sounds more like people need to de-UK. It's going to be a problem with any company or technology.

advisedwang 10mo ago

[flagged]

jajuuka 10mo ago
Granted it would be more impactful that to stop using Google and Apple services.
cmsj 10mo ago
The actual straightforward fix isn't available to us - namely, we aren't due a general election until 2029 and right now the "good guys" are in power, so it's not at all clear that anyone would even offer to reverse this TCN if they were elected instead, in 4 years time.
- anonymousiam 10mo ago
  At least the US hasn't postponed the general elections to keep the unpopular party in power. https://www.local.gov.uk/our-support/devolution-and-lgr-hub/devolution-lgr-and-delays-local-elections https://www.local.gov.uk/our-support/devolution-and-lgr-hub/...
  - exe34 10mo ago
    I wish they would help get as many reform councils as possible. Given how incompetent they have been in the ones they did get elected, I think it would put a damper on the enthusiasm of their supporters.
    - rob_c 10mo ago
      yes, and they're totally not fighting on multiple fronts against central govt, those in the areas they're trying to run deciding that the civil service can now be a political arm of the left or from having to boot the actual racists in sheep's clothing from the party. I'm not defending any party here, I'm even highlighting some of reforms worse issues. But you have to admit it's not apples and oranges when comparing their performance so far with a cushy little on-the-Thames millionaires cul-de-sac.
      - exe34 10mo ago
        > racists in sheep's clothing from the party. Could you name a few? I thought you had to be racist to join...
  - 4ndrewl 10mo ago
    Fact check - the UK hasn't postponed the general election. Your link points to _some_ local council elections (the people responsible for bin collections, parks and care homes) and the extension has been requested by the local councils themselves.
  - kcartlidge 10mo ago
    Neither has the UK government. * It wasn't the general election. * They offered local councils the chance to request it if they were going through a reorganisation or devolution process. * 18 councils requested and 9 were accepted as justified. * And even those are only delayed until May next year (one year after the rest of the UK). So to be clear the UK government not only didn't postpone the general elections but half the councils who requested the local elections were postponed were denied, with the other half having reasons and still doing it a year later anyway. And all that is actually covered in the page you link to.
- dontlaugh 10mo ago
  If there was a general election today, who exactly could we vote for? Trade union organising with the threat of nationwide industrial action would work regardless of which flavour of Tory is in power, though.
- fastball 10mo ago
  > and right now the "good guys" are in power, so So close and yet so far.
aa-jv 10mo ago
They need to stay and fix their country, and the means by which they do that is simple: start prosecuting our own war criminals.

benoau 10mo ago

It's more likely to be a problem with Apple (and Google) because they have put themselves in a position where they are a gateway to everybody. There are multitudes of online storage providers outside of the UK's reach and jurisdiction but 0% of iPhone users back up to them because of technical limitations that inhibit iCloud competitors or any compatible storage solution.

stavros 10mo ago
> 0% of iPhone users back up to them because of technical limitations that inhibit iCloud competitors or any compatible storage solution. To clarify, by "technical limitations" here you don't mean "it's not possible with our current technology", you mean "Apple purposely blocks this".
- benoau 10mo ago
  Allegedly it's deliberate, according to a pair of legal actions they face in the UK (hearing in 9 days) and US (hearing in August 2026). > 13.1 a set of technical restrictions and practices that prevent users of iOS from storing certain key file types (known as “Restricted Files”) on any cloud storage service other than its own iCloud and thus ensuring that users have no choice but to use iCloud (a complete monopolist in respect of these Restricted Files) if they wish to meet all their cloud storage and/or back up needs, in particular in order to conduct a complete back-up of the device (“the Restricted File Conduct”); and/or > 13.2 an unfair choice architecture, which individually and cumulatively steer iOS Users towards using and purchasing iCloud rather than other cloud storage services, and/or limit their effective choice, and/or exclude or disadvantage rivals or would- be rivals ( “the Choice Architecture Conduct ”). See further paragraphs 6 to 9 and 97 to 132 of the CPCF. https://www.catribunal.org.uk/cases/16897724-consumers-association-which https://www.catribunal.org.uk/cases/16897724-consumers-assoc... (via summary of ruling of the chair) > 30. By sequestering Restricted Files, and denying all other cloud providers access to them, Apple prevents rival cloud platforms from offering a full-service cloud solution that can compete effectively against iCloud. The cloud products that rivals can offer are, by virtue of Apple’s restraints, fundamentally diminished because they can only host Accessible Files. Users who want to back up all of their files—including the basic Restricted Files needed to restore their device at replacement—have but one option in the marketplace: iCloud. > 31. There is no technological or security justification for Apple mandating the use of iCloud for Restricted Files. Apple draws this distinction only to curtail competition and advantage its iCloud product over rival cloud platforms. https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/68303306/felix-gamboa-v-apple-inc/ https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/68303306/felix-gamboa-v... (via document 1 the complaint)

amelius 10mo ago

It's an Apple problem, because with libre tools you can run your own software to circumvent this law.

j45 10mo ago
The majority of apple and android users can't run their own libre software, until libre software is as easy and seamless to use as the comparables.
- Aachen 10mo ago
  My (grand)parents like their FOSS launcher, gallery, and chat client just fine. I've had zero questions about how Signal works, but a bunch about how to deal with the OS' pre-installed garbage spawning notifications about this or that update. They can't tell the difference between an advertisement pushed by some commercial app they want and a smartwatch firmware update notification From my POV, it's the commercial software that has fundamental usability issues due to misaligned incentives (not completely different either, but not as aligned as FOSS). They just have a better lobby and marketing budget. Chrome didn't become this ubiquitous on mobile by having to be downloaded from f-droid, but by making a deal that device manufacturers cannot refuse
  - rob_c 10mo ago
    tell me, did they install and set this up themselves or you?
    - catlikesshrimp 10mo ago
      Did you have to state that as a question? (I obviously install even FB and Watsapp in there) It's unthinkable to setup a phone with whatsapp and fb here. When meta had a BGP problem, they (the older ones) asked me why there was "no internet"
      - rob_c 10mo ago

odiroot 10mo ago

There's more good reasons to de-Apple besides just residing in UK.

mistercheph 10mo ago

Thankfully my predecessors de-UK’ed for me!

herewulf 10mo ago
Legacy features!

aa-jv 10mo ago

People need to hold the UK government responsible for its crimes against humanity. Until the AUMF and similiar policies across the Wetsern hemisphere which resulted in the utterly reprehensible "War on Terror", are rescinded and the crimes committed under their enactment fully prosecuted, the authoritarianism will continue. Remember, people, these are WAR CRIMINALS driving these policies forward. To expect this class of individuals to adhere to democratic, western values, is naive in the extreme. The same people who have no problem with genociding a million people in the middle east enemy-state-de-jour are not going to give one fig of care to the local human rights violations that they are also getting away with. The West has a war criminal problem. Until we solve that we cannot do a damn thing about our human rights problem.