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Over half of Amazon's third party sellers are Chinese companies who regularly false report to dodge tariffs on their products in ways that American competitors

Over half of Amazon's third party sellers are Chinese companies who regularly false report to dodge tariffs on their products in ways that American competitors can't. Amazon claims to police them but they're extremely reliant on them at this point and the Chinese sellers just start up new brands if penalized. https://x.com/zackkanter/status/1908343624464576666 https://x.com/zackkanter/status/1908343624464576666

scarface_74 1y ago
From your citations > What kind of idiot US seller hasn’t had their Chinese factory also write in a lower value on the import invoice? Why do people on X think Americans don’t cheat the system too?
ericmay 1y ago
The best way to avoid this kind of behavior is to avoid shopping at stores where you can’t trace the origin of their products. Stop buying “brands”, and looking for “deals” and acting like a consumer. Do research and find high quality products, pay more for those products, buy less disposable junk. This isn’t just a “China” thing it’s in general.
- trollbridge 1y ago
  I buy cheap things at Harbor Freight now instead of on Amazon because at least then I know I can return it if it breaks.
  - conductr 1y ago
    I find Amazon has the better return policy. HF has at times zero flexibility and I find I really have to pay attention to each item’s policy and weight the risk of failure (eg. A $5 hammer is low risk, $400 machine is too high risk). It’s not worth the mental math required while shopping. I only buy consumables there (HF) now, gloves, ropes, tarps, etc. Nothing with moving part, especially a motor. I’ve been left holding the bag on $400 items I I couldn’t even assemble because the bolt holes were out of alignment (obvious manufacturing defect) and they’ve refused to allow the return or force a boxing fee on me.
    - DrillShopper 1y ago
      This seems like the exact situation a credit card chargeback is designed to fix.
      - conductr 1y ago
        I think HF technically tells you no refunds or that there's a restocking fee policy when you buy it so I don't think it would work. As a consumer, I'm used to companies like that making an exception when something goes overly wrong like what happened to me. It's not like I used it and it failed, I couldn't even assemble it. I spoke to the manager and he insisted he didn't even have the authority to wave the fees. It would require some regional VP or greater and I'd have to wait for him to return a message, and he hinted that he never approves it and it would all be a waste of time. I just gave up as I was in the middle of my project and just needed to get back to it. I stopped shopping here after that though.
        bee_rider 1y ago
        Can a business just say “no refunds, even if the device is completely non-functional.” At least (maybe it varies state by state) Massachusetts has an “implied warranty of merchantability,” the thing has to basically work at least for a little bit. I mean, if the bolt-holes don’t line up, they didn’t just sell you a bad <thing>, they sold you a random sheet of metal that is not <thing>.
        conductr 1y ago
        This is kind of the argument I made to the manager in a Karenesque fashion. Why would I have even bought it if I knew it was defective? How would I have known without opening the box? Etc. I live in a state that is politically conservative and probably least likely to have similar protections but also ultimately I wasn’t going to have a legal battle over it. They lost me as a customer, well not even entirely, just for tools and bigger ticket stuff. I go through work gloves too quickly and they have them a third of the prices at Home Depot so I go for that
- sorcerer-mar 1y ago
  This is actually the exact reason for the existence of brands. You absolutely should buy brands, and stop buying random "RANDOMCAPITALLETTERS Product 1" But yeah, what people think of as good, high-quality brands often are not.
  - ericmay 1y ago
    It's a little difficult for me to make the point I want to make here because I don't disagree with you, but the usage of the word "brand" is not as descriptive as I'd like it to be. If you're buying good copper cookware the manufacturer "brand" matters, they build a reputation for having quality products, ideally continue to make those quality products at a fair price, etc. and life is good. But then there are brands and unfortunately when we use the term brand we wind up lumping together "high quality brands" with "cheap, useless dog shit products" and it can be difficult to differentiate. At least for me and my limited vocabulary.
    - sorcerer-mar 1y ago
      I get it - there are brands that are well-known for being brands (i.e. famous for being famous) and there are brands that are well-known for making legitimately good products. Avoid the former like the plague, but the latter is one of the best methods to find legitimately great stuff.
      - ericmay 1y ago
        Absolutely. I actually keep and maintain extensive lists of businesses that produce "real stuff" that we only buy from for those item categories.
        sorcerer-mar 1y ago
        Do you publish these anywhere? Very into good products and as you know they’re hard to find haha
        1y ago
- CamperBob2 1y ago
  No, the best way to avoid this kind of behavior is to refrain from incentivizing it with misguided, poorly-thought-out, and anticapitalistic trade policy. Smuggling is the world's second-oldest profession. Trade finds a way.
lvl155 1y ago
When are we going to realize this is a form of dumping by the Chinese? People love cheap goods but as QoL in China improves, they won’t be able to churn out cheap goods for long. That’s why CCP is hellbent on trying to monopolize global supply chain. In fact, I believe we are first slowly and then drastically headed toward global equilibrium in labor cost. We might be looking at significantly cheaper labor in the US and double or triple labor costs in China and India.
- ZeroTalent 1y ago
  There is no more "as QoL in China improves." The majority of parts of "Swiss Made" watches are made in China, utilizing a loophole that requires 60% of the watch's cost to be manufactured and assembled in Switzerland. So they make a rotor made out of gold in Switzerland, which accounts for 60% of the COGS of the watch, pop the rotor on the movement, and the sapphire glass on the watch, and it's "Swiss Made." Best source, a rabbit hole: https://monochrome-watches.com/h-moser-cie-launches-swiss-mad-watch-swiss-watch-ever-swiss-cheese-case-yes-venturer-swiss-mad/ https://monochrome-watches.com/h-moser-cie-launches-swiss-ma... Replicas are also manufactured in the same factories as "authentic" watches, but are fully assembled in China. (my personal insider anecdote) "Investigators who work for Rolex and others say high-end fakes are “made in the same industrial parks and on cloned CNC machines”": https://www.businessinsider.com/how-counterfeit-rolexes-work-fake-watches-2024-5 https://www.businessinsider.com/how-counterfeit-rolexes-work... "2025 “superfake” TAG Heuer Aquaracers used real Swiss Sellita movements inside Chinese-made cases—proof of parts leakage, if not identical factory floors": https://www.heddels.com/2025/03/spotting-a-superfake-4-real-counterfeit-watches-and-how-bezel-caught-them/ https://www.heddels.com/2025/03/spotting-a-superfake-4-real-...
  - rafram 1y ago
    > There is no more "as QoL in China improves." You start with this, but then the rest of your comment is totally unrelated. Could you elaborate?
    - phil21 1y ago

scarface_74 1y ago

From your citations > What kind of idiot US seller hasn’t had their Chinese factory also write in a lower value on the import invoice? Why do people on X think Americans don’t cheat the system too?

ericmay 1y ago

The best way to avoid this kind of behavior is to avoid shopping at stores where you can’t trace the origin of their products. Stop buying “brands”, and looking for “deals” and acting like a consumer. Do research and find high quality products, pay more for those products, buy less disposable junk. This isn’t just a “China” thing it’s in general.

trollbridge 1y ago
I buy cheap things at Harbor Freight now instead of on Amazon because at least then I know I can return it if it breaks.
- conductr 1y ago
  I find Amazon has the better return policy. HF has at times zero flexibility and I find I really have to pay attention to each item’s policy and weight the risk of failure (eg. A $5 hammer is low risk, $400 machine is too high risk). It’s not worth the mental math required while shopping. I only buy consumables there (HF) now, gloves, ropes, tarps, etc. Nothing with moving part, especially a motor. I’ve been left holding the bag on $400 items I I couldn’t even assemble because the bolt holes were out of alignment (obvious manufacturing defect) and they’ve refused to allow the return or force a boxing fee on me.
  - DrillShopper 1y ago
    This seems like the exact situation a credit card chargeback is designed to fix.
    - conductr 1y ago
      I think HF technically tells you no refunds or that there's a restocking fee policy when you buy it so I don't think it would work. As a consumer, I'm used to companies like that making an exception when something goes overly wrong like what happened to me. It's not like I used it and it failed, I couldn't even assemble it. I spoke to the manager and he insisted he didn't even have the authority to wave the fees. It would require some regional VP or greater and I'd have to wait for him to return a message, and he hinted that he never approves it and it would all be a waste of time. I just gave up as I was in the middle of my project and just needed to get back to it. I stopped shopping here after that though.
      - bee_rider 1y ago
        Can a business just say “no refunds, even if the device is completely non-functional.” At least (maybe it varies state by state) Massachusetts has an “implied warranty of merchantability,” the thing has to basically work at least for a little bit. I mean, if the bolt-holes don’t line up, they didn’t just sell you a bad <thing>, they sold you a random sheet of metal that is not <thing>.
        conductr 1y ago
        This is kind of the argument I made to the manager in a Karenesque fashion. Why would I have even bought it if I knew it was defective? How would I have known without opening the box? Etc. I live in a state that is politically conservative and probably least likely to have similar protections but also ultimately I wasn’t going to have a legal battle over it. They lost me as a customer, well not even entirely, just for tools and bigger ticket stuff. I go through work gloves too quickly and they have them a third of the prices at Home Depot so I go for that
sorcerer-mar 1y ago
This is actually the exact reason for the existence of brands. You absolutely should buy brands, and stop buying random "RANDOMCAPITALLETTERS Product 1" But yeah, what people think of as good, high-quality brands often are not.
- ericmay 1y ago
  It's a little difficult for me to make the point I want to make here because I don't disagree with you, but the usage of the word "brand" is not as descriptive as I'd like it to be. If you're buying good copper cookware the manufacturer "brand" matters, they build a reputation for having quality products, ideally continue to make those quality products at a fair price, etc. and life is good. But then there are brands and unfortunately when we use the term brand we wind up lumping together "high quality brands" with "cheap, useless dog shit products" and it can be difficult to differentiate. At least for me and my limited vocabulary.
  - sorcerer-mar 1y ago
    I get it - there are brands that are well-known for being brands (i.e. famous for being famous) and there are brands that are well-known for making legitimately good products. Avoid the former like the plague, but the latter is one of the best methods to find legitimately great stuff.
    - ericmay 1y ago
      Absolutely. I actually keep and maintain extensive lists of businesses that produce "real stuff" that we only buy from for those item categories.
      - sorcerer-mar 1y ago
        Do you publish these anywhere? Very into good products and as you know they’re hard to find haha
        1y ago
CamperBob2 1y ago
No, the best way to avoid this kind of behavior is to refrain from incentivizing it with misguided, poorly-thought-out, and anticapitalistic trade policy. Smuggling is the world's second-oldest profession. Trade finds a way.

lvl155 1y ago

When are we going to realize this is a form of dumping by the Chinese? People love cheap goods but as QoL in China improves, they won’t be able to churn out cheap goods for long. That’s why CCP is hellbent on trying to monopolize global supply chain. In fact, I believe we are first slowly and then drastically headed toward global equilibrium in labor cost. We might be looking at significantly cheaper labor in the US and double or triple labor costs in China and India.

ZeroTalent 1y ago
There is no more "as QoL in China improves." The majority of parts of "Swiss Made" watches are made in China, utilizing a loophole that requires 60% of the watch's cost to be manufactured and assembled in Switzerland. So they make a rotor made out of gold in Switzerland, which accounts for 60% of the COGS of the watch, pop the rotor on the movement, and the sapphire glass on the watch, and it's "Swiss Made." Best source, a rabbit hole: https://monochrome-watches.com/h-moser-cie-launches-swiss-mad-watch-swiss-watch-ever-swiss-cheese-case-yes-venturer-swiss-mad/ https://monochrome-watches.com/h-moser-cie-launches-swiss-ma... Replicas are also manufactured in the same factories as "authentic" watches, but are fully assembled in China. (my personal insider anecdote) "Investigators who work for Rolex and others say high-end fakes are “made in the same industrial parks and on cloned CNC machines”": https://www.businessinsider.com/how-counterfeit-rolexes-work-fake-watches-2024-5 https://www.businessinsider.com/how-counterfeit-rolexes-work... "2025 “superfake” TAG Heuer Aquaracers used real Swiss Sellita movements inside Chinese-made cases—proof of parts leakage, if not identical factory floors": https://www.heddels.com/2025/03/spotting-a-superfake-4-real-counterfeit-watches-and-how-bezel-caught-them/ https://www.heddels.com/2025/03/spotting-a-superfake-4-real-...
- rafram 1y ago
  > There is no more "as QoL in China improves." You start with this, but then the rest of your comment is totally unrelated. Could you elaborate?
  - phil21 1y ago