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> Lightning was what Apple standardized on when the world was still using dock connectors with completely incompatible pinouts and wire protocols. What? Lighti

> Lightning was what Apple standardized on when the world was still using dock connectors with completely incompatible pinouts and wire protocols. What? Lighting is what Apple imposed (to themselves) when the world standardized on micro USB and Apple was still using dock connectors.

karlshea 4y ago
But the micro USB connector is trash, so it’s no surprise they didn’t use it.
- ginko 4y ago
  So they should have been active in defining the successor USB standard.
  - vineyardmike 4y ago
    ... like how they had an active role in USB C?
    - ginko 4y ago
      Did they? As far as I can tell USB-C was mainly invented by Intel and TI.
      - thiht 4y ago
        Isn't USB-C basically Thunderbolt? Which was made by Apple
        grishka 4y ago
        Wasn't Thunderbolt made by Intel?
        dmitriid 4y ago
        Original Thunderbolt was by Intel, then Apple came up with how to use it with MiniDP connector. There definitely was more collaboration, but as a simple overview this works. In 2019 Intel donated the spec royalty free to USB-IF
        thiht 4y ago
        Didn't know that, thanks for the info!
      - madeofpalk 4y ago
        Yes. Apple engineers played a significant role in developing USB-C. Of the 79 engineers who worked on the original spec, 18 of them were from Apple. Intel had 24, JAE had 21, TI had 12 https://www.docdroid.net/uf3z/typec-pdf https://www.docdroid.net/uf3z/typec-pdf
  - dmitriid 4y ago
    They did. It's called Thunderbolt. Then they were literally the first to go all in on USB-C in their laptops. And the world (well, HN) loudly complained every single time.
    - ginko 4y ago
      Thunderbolt isn't an open standard.
      - dmitriid 4y ago
        Define "open". Thunderbolt 3 spec was released to USB-IF in 2019 as a royalty-free standard.
sockaddr 4y ago
I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt that you simply are unaware of the physical realities (re: limitations) of micro USB and not actively trying to mislead but here’s a real anecdote from someone who routinely repaired micro USB and lightning devices: Micro USB ports failed considerably faster and more often than lightning. Easily by a margin of 100:1. the design of the “cage” that held the male connector would wear out, the thin center plastic would break, etc. Micro USB was and still is complete garbage. Apple engineers knew this and thankfully put in the effort to make something better. The rest of the industry was still trying to pull their head out of their ass and apple had this awesome durable new connector. That’s what really happened. Now, years later people like you have either forgotten or I guess maybe never saw the comparison up close for prolonged periods but it tires me to see this careless and ignorant argument brought up time and time again.
- sonofhans 4y ago
  Preach it. Even by the standards of the times, MicroUSB was hot garbage.
  - steve_adams_86 4y ago
    It’s the only connector I’ve had fail multiple times. I replaced the port on a friend’s camera as well. On the other hand, I have lightning ports and cables pushing 5 years of regular use. For some reason it never occurred to me that these connectors were so awful until very recently when I had one fail on a brand new micro controller. Unfortunately it’s still a super common connector in that space.
    - graphe 4y ago
      USB-C isn't making me very enthusiastic either. Both of them suck. It would rock to get lightning on there lol. I've been using magnetic ones to prevent my ports from wearing out and if anyone preaches about safety or standards I don't care. It's what I'm forced to do, and now my data rates are slow but at least my port will work next time.
- 4y ago

karlshea 4y ago

But the micro USB connector is trash, so it’s no surprise they didn’t use it.

ginko 4y ago
So they should have been active in defining the successor USB standard.
- vineyardmike 4y ago
  ... like how they had an active role in USB C?
  - ginko 4y ago
    Did they? As far as I can tell USB-C was mainly invented by Intel and TI.
    - thiht 4y ago
      Isn't USB-C basically Thunderbolt? Which was made by Apple
      - grishka 4y ago
        Wasn't Thunderbolt made by Intel?
        dmitriid 4y ago
        Original Thunderbolt was by Intel, then Apple came up with how to use it with MiniDP connector. There definitely was more collaboration, but as a simple overview this works. In 2019 Intel donated the spec royalty free to USB-IF
        thiht 4y ago
        Didn't know that, thanks for the info!
    - madeofpalk 4y ago
      Yes. Apple engineers played a significant role in developing USB-C. Of the 79 engineers who worked on the original spec, 18 of them were from Apple. Intel had 24, JAE had 21, TI had 12 https://www.docdroid.net/uf3z/typec-pdf https://www.docdroid.net/uf3z/typec-pdf
- dmitriid 4y ago
  They did. It's called Thunderbolt. Then they were literally the first to go all in on USB-C in their laptops. And the world (well, HN) loudly complained every single time.
  - ginko 4y ago
    Thunderbolt isn't an open standard.
    - dmitriid 4y ago
      Define "open". Thunderbolt 3 spec was released to USB-IF in 2019 as a royalty-free standard.

sockaddr 4y ago

I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt that you simply are unaware of the physical realities (re: limitations) of micro USB and not actively trying to mislead but here’s a real anecdote from someone who routinely repaired micro USB and lightning devices: Micro USB ports failed considerably faster and more often than lightning. Easily by a margin of 100:1. the design of the “cage” that held the male connector would wear out, the thin center plastic would break, etc. Micro USB was and still is complete garbage. Apple engineers knew this and thankfully put in the effort to make something better. The rest of the industry was still trying to pull their head out of their ass and apple had this awesome durable new connector. That’s what really happened. Now, years later people like you have either forgotten or I guess maybe never saw the comparison up close for prolonged periods but it tires me to see this careless and ignorant argument brought up time and time again.

sonofhans 4y ago
Preach it. Even by the standards of the times, MicroUSB was hot garbage.
- steve_adams_86 4y ago
  It’s the only connector I’ve had fail multiple times. I replaced the port on a friend’s camera as well. On the other hand, I have lightning ports and cables pushing 5 years of regular use. For some reason it never occurred to me that these connectors were so awful until very recently when I had one fail on a brand new micro controller. Unfortunately it’s still a super common connector in that space.
  - graphe 4y ago
    USB-C isn't making me very enthusiastic either. Both of them suck. It would rock to get lightning on there lol. I've been using magnetic ones to prevent my ports from wearing out and if anyone preaches about safety or standards I don't care. It's what I'm forced to do, and now my data rates are slow but at least my port will work next time.
4y ago