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I'd rather my country not follow the US off yet another cliff. We still remember the US lying about weapons of mass destruction to justify yet another unnecess

I'd rather my country not follow the US off yet another cliff. We still remember the US lying about weapons of mass destruction to justify yet another unnecessary war (only necessary to feed the American war machine)

cenal 4y ago
Yes, because China is a bastion of good information...
- unity1001 4y ago
  Compared to the US, yes, everyone is.
  - HyperSane 4y ago
    Seriously?
    - unity1001 4y ago
      Seriously. Many countries' establishments have a fear of lying, due to the repercussions of what happens if they were caught. That is the very reason why Soviet establishment chose not to lie, as we see from the period's records. Which made their propaganda much less effective compared to the emotional manipulation - especially atrocity propaganda - that Angloamerica uses. Lying is an establishment practice in Angloamerica only because Angloamerican public uses ignoring their own lot's offenses and directing their ire at external enemies as a way to create and protect group cohesion. They are not dumb. They believe the lies that they are told willingly for that purpose and ignore the offenses of those who perpetuate them for the above reason. That's why the entire administrations who lied about things like Iraqi WMDs, Vietnam etc and murdered tens of millions of people over 30-40 years are still on top of the establishment instead of getting persecuted. The history of the atrocity propaganda as a policy tool in Angloamerica goes back to Elizabethan England, which used a lot of smears against its Spanish enemies and it worked. In the following centuries, we see the English establishment using lies about external enemies and atrocity propaganda as a means to scare the English to support the aristocratic regime and justify wars. From the war of Jenkins' Ear to whatever example one may pick. "Evildoers are about to beat our fleet and invade our islands" is the constant propaganda in between 1560-1760. In World War I, atrocity propaganda was institutionalized - there was no other way to justify a millions of commoners dying for aristocratic monarchies whose monarchs were cousins among themselves. So was invented the "Germans murdered and raped babies in Belgium" lie, which STILL goes on today with many people believing that Germans actuall did that. It worked very well for Britain in Ww I. From that point on, Britain never let go of atrocity propaganda and lies, and the US copied a lot of their practices. Iraqi WMD case is just a trifle compared to the constant lying, smearing and 'wag the dog' cases over ~100 years of recent history.
      - HyperSane 4y ago
        " That is the very reason why Soviet establishment chose not to lie" I love the things insane tankies say.
        unity1001 4y ago
        I have no problem with being labeled a tankie. So save that for the American discourse. It has absolutely no effect in my country. ... Its only insane because you have no knowledge of actual history, less, the actual declassified documents of the USSR and instead 'know' things based on the cold war propaganda that you sucked up over the years. Like how 'propaganda' was something that only 'others' did, and there was 'free press' in 'the West.
        _kbh_ 4y ago
        > Its only insane because you have no knowledge of actual history You realise that Russia and the USSR lied nearly constantly right? And you can hear about it from like hundreds of millions of post soviet citizens?. I mean it’s gotta be beyond clear to anyone that Russia lies to its own citizens there soldiers dug defences in one of the most radioactive parts of the world.
        unity1001 4y ago
        > You realise that Russia and the USSR lied nearly constantly right? No. We dont. That's what the American propaganda tells us. Not the circumstances and actual declassified documents. Character assassination, nothing else. > hundreds of millions of post soviet citizens?. Hundreds of millions of post soviet citizens do not say anything like that. https://www.thetrumpet.com/18312-poll-two-thirds-of-russians-miss-the-soviet-union https://www.thetrumpet.com/18312-poll-two-thirds-of-russians... > I mean it’s gotta be beyond clear to anyone that Russia lies That's a religious statement. Nothing else. The US lied about nonexistent WMDs for EIGHT years. And yet, its propaganda is the one that's being trusted to determine the trustworthiness of others. That's just crazy.
- pessimizer 4y ago
  Even when we lie, it's somehow China's fault.
HyperSane 4y ago
And China is just so trustworthy /s

cenal 4y ago

Yes, because China is a bastion of good information...

unity1001 4y ago
Compared to the US, yes, everyone is.
- HyperSane 4y ago
  Seriously?
  - unity1001 4y ago
    Seriously. Many countries' establishments have a fear of lying, due to the repercussions of what happens if they were caught. That is the very reason why Soviet establishment chose not to lie, as we see from the period's records. Which made their propaganda much less effective compared to the emotional manipulation - especially atrocity propaganda - that Angloamerica uses. Lying is an establishment practice in Angloamerica only because Angloamerican public uses ignoring their own lot's offenses and directing their ire at external enemies as a way to create and protect group cohesion. They are not dumb. They believe the lies that they are told willingly for that purpose and ignore the offenses of those who perpetuate them for the above reason. That's why the entire administrations who lied about things like Iraqi WMDs, Vietnam etc and murdered tens of millions of people over 30-40 years are still on top of the establishment instead of getting persecuted. The history of the atrocity propaganda as a policy tool in Angloamerica goes back to Elizabethan England, which used a lot of smears against its Spanish enemies and it worked. In the following centuries, we see the English establishment using lies about external enemies and atrocity propaganda as a means to scare the English to support the aristocratic regime and justify wars. From the war of Jenkins' Ear to whatever example one may pick. "Evildoers are about to beat our fleet and invade our islands" is the constant propaganda in between 1560-1760. In World War I, atrocity propaganda was institutionalized - there was no other way to justify a millions of commoners dying for aristocratic monarchies whose monarchs were cousins among themselves. So was invented the "Germans murdered and raped babies in Belgium" lie, which STILL goes on today with many people believing that Germans actuall did that. It worked very well for Britain in Ww I. From that point on, Britain never let go of atrocity propaganda and lies, and the US copied a lot of their practices. Iraqi WMD case is just a trifle compared to the constant lying, smearing and 'wag the dog' cases over ~100 years of recent history.
    - HyperSane 4y ago
      " That is the very reason why Soviet establishment chose not to lie" I love the things insane tankies say.
      - unity1001 4y ago
        I have no problem with being labeled a tankie. So save that for the American discourse. It has absolutely no effect in my country. ... Its only insane because you have no knowledge of actual history, less, the actual declassified documents of the USSR and instead 'know' things based on the cold war propaganda that you sucked up over the years. Like how 'propaganda' was something that only 'others' did, and there was 'free press' in 'the West.
        _kbh_ 4y ago
        > Its only insane because you have no knowledge of actual history You realise that Russia and the USSR lied nearly constantly right? And you can hear about it from like hundreds of millions of post soviet citizens?. I mean it’s gotta be beyond clear to anyone that Russia lies to its own citizens there soldiers dug defences in one of the most radioactive parts of the world.
        unity1001 4y ago
        > You realise that Russia and the USSR lied nearly constantly right? No. We dont. That's what the American propaganda tells us. Not the circumstances and actual declassified documents. Character assassination, nothing else. > hundreds of millions of post soviet citizens?. Hundreds of millions of post soviet citizens do not say anything like that. https://www.thetrumpet.com/18312-poll-two-thirds-of-russians-miss-the-soviet-union https://www.thetrumpet.com/18312-poll-two-thirds-of-russians... > I mean it’s gotta be beyond clear to anyone that Russia lies That's a religious statement. Nothing else. The US lied about nonexistent WMDs for EIGHT years. And yet, its propaganda is the one that's being trusted to determine the trustworthiness of others. That's just crazy.
pessimizer 4y ago
Even when we lie, it's somehow China's fault.

HyperSane 4y ago

And China is just so trustworthy /s