7 ms·

Running a Docker Host under OpenBSD using vmd(8)

41 points by hucste 4y ago

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
gigatexal 4y ago
Having to prepare container specific folders on the Docker host to run stuff is a bit annoying. Surely you can map these from the local BSD machine?
- whalesalad 4y ago
  you'd probably need to either use a sidecar injection mechanism like mutagen, or you would have to pass thru the filesystem to the underlying vm at a high enough level such that docker could access all the directories.
- somat 4y ago
  nfs?
- nix23 4y ago
  9p? Namespaces..
waynesonfire 4y ago
This is awesome. I'm inspired to try it on freebsd. Docker is the killer app feature keeping me on Linux.
- normaler 4y ago
  I don't linke FreeBSD but love OpenBSD. If they would support something like zfs I would usw it AS my go to nas machine.
  - nix23 4y ago
    Why do you dont like freebsd?
    - normaler 4y ago
      I dont linke their wireguard Fiasko and the way they patch SSH. FreeBSD just doesnt offer enough benefits compared to Linux for me. OpenBSD in the other Hand is very special to me.
      - normaler 4y ago
        Also FreeBSD uses ZFSonLinux so license issues aside it doesnt even benefit me there.
        nix23 4y ago
        > Also FreeBSD uses ZFSonLinux so license issues aside it doesnt even benefit me there. You are misinformed here, Linux, BSD and Illumos all use OpenZFS they all work together, and there is no license issues, why do you think that? FreeBSD just changed the from Illumos to OpenZFS, whats the problem when everyone works on one project? https://openzfs.org/wiki/Main_Page https://openzfs.org/wiki/Main_Page >>The OpenZFS project brings together developers from the Linux, FreeBSD, illumos, MacOS, and Windows platforms. OpenZFS is supported by a wide range of companies. Well the rest of your points is like saying i don't like OpenBSD because it cuts my CPU in half, yes i know i could change that but i still don't like it, and i don't like Linux because of the Debian-Fiasko, and OpenSSL is terrible because of heartbleed ;)
- GekkePrutser 4y ago
  It'll be a bit different, FreeBSD doesn't have vmd but it does have bhyve.
- KronisLV 4y ago
  > Docker is the killer app feature keeping me on Linux. Agreed. Docker (or another OCI compatible solution) feels like one of the few good ways to run software with all of its dependencies consistently across different systems/OSes: you can generally develop things on macOS, Windows or Linux and run your containers with reasonable amounts of confidence in everything working as expected. No longer must you worry as much about what the host OS will be for your business webapp to run, nor are you tied down to an old OS version just because of some dependency not being present/working on the latest one, or even need to worry as much about updating the host with the potential to break something (at least something other than the container runtime). That said, it's always nice to have a decent amount of choice regarding the host OSes and see more support! Even other runtimes like Podman feel like a good sign. Note: some of the aspects of containers have drawbacks, of course (and certain things can break due to FS differences, for example), about which I wrote on my blog, "Containers are broken": https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/containers-are-broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/containers-...
jbirer 4y ago
There's a "yo dawg" joke in here somewhere.
jacooper 4y ago
I still dont understand why one would spend the time to switch to BSD.
- mburee 4y ago
  Is it really incomprehensible that people like a BSD better than Linux? Along the lines of "BSD is for people who love Unix, Linux is for people who hate Microsoft."
  - mekster 4y ago
    Actually it is, at least these days. I tried to use BSD for the past 20 years just to keep my knowledge up to date but only on hobby machines and never for work but frankly gave up using it within the past 5 years. I don't care about the philosophies as they don't seem to bring much benefit. What actual benefit do you see with being "more unified"? I never understood that part. "Better doc" isn't even practical when you google around, you get all the Linux gotchas solved already by someone else when you get far less info on BSD. And then lack of packages and environments like Docker and Homebrew and all I see is limitations. The only thing I miss is probably pf firewall but unless I'm running a router to utilize more rules than simple port allowances, ufw is fine enough. zfs on Ubuntu is darn easy to get started and I just lost much reason to stay with BSD. And considering that I want to setup monitoring, logging and backing up to a central server to be aligned with other servers, things get pretty tough too. There were several related topics. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32369189 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32369189 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31664952 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31664952 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30057549 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30057549 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22852316 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22852316 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22024881 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22024881
- lcall 4y ago
  I spent the time for OpenBSD because I want greater security and control over when to make changes that could have a security impact. In other words, "secure by default", and only 2 of the worst kind of security bugs since ~1996, are very impressive. Plus I find it a good learning system, as things are well ordered and the documentation is reliable, if one follows the docs and is willing to learn. Of course, there might be features or handholding missing that would make one prefer something else. (Features missing might include bluetooth, maybe some usb things, point-and-click printer setup, ZFS, but I haven't missed these much.) Also there is a somewhat recent change that makes the system use full CPU all the time (not ratcheting up/down with the load), until one configures it otherwise (as I understand, anyway--in the coming 7.2 release there is a package one can install, or build/install now from source, that I understand works around this). To quote another discussion thread: "They develop this software for themselves first. If you like it and it’s useful to you you are welcome to it. If not, look elsewhere. That’s been their working philosophy all along and if you ask me that’s what makes it so great to use. Every piece of the system is carefully thought out and organized so it doesn’t suffer from nearly as much feature creep as other systems." https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18250567 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18250567

41 points by hucste 4y ago

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

Having to prepare container specific folders on the Docker host to run stuff is a bit annoying. Surely you can map these from the local BSD machine?

whalesalad 4y ago
you'd probably need to either use a sidecar injection mechanism like mutagen, or you would have to pass thru the filesystem to the underlying vm at a high enough level such that docker could access all the directories.
somat 4y ago
nfs?
nix23 4y ago
9p? Namespaces..

waynesonfire 4y ago

This is awesome. I'm inspired to try it on freebsd. Docker is the killer app feature keeping me on Linux.

normaler 4y ago
I don't linke FreeBSD but love OpenBSD. If they would support something like zfs I would usw it AS my go to nas machine.
- nix23 4y ago
  Why do you dont like freebsd?
  - normaler 4y ago
    I dont linke their wireguard Fiasko and the way they patch SSH. FreeBSD just doesnt offer enough benefits compared to Linux for me. OpenBSD in the other Hand is very special to me.
    - normaler 4y ago
      Also FreeBSD uses ZFSonLinux so license issues aside it doesnt even benefit me there.
      - nix23 4y ago
        > Also FreeBSD uses ZFSonLinux so license issues aside it doesnt even benefit me there. You are misinformed here, Linux, BSD and Illumos all use OpenZFS they all work together, and there is no license issues, why do you think that? FreeBSD just changed the from Illumos to OpenZFS, whats the problem when everyone works on one project? https://openzfs.org/wiki/Main_Page https://openzfs.org/wiki/Main_Page >>The OpenZFS project brings together developers from the Linux, FreeBSD, illumos, MacOS, and Windows platforms. OpenZFS is supported by a wide range of companies. Well the rest of your points is like saying i don't like OpenBSD because it cuts my CPU in half, yes i know i could change that but i still don't like it, and i don't like Linux because of the Debian-Fiasko, and OpenSSL is terrible because of heartbleed ;)
GekkePrutser 4y ago
It'll be a bit different, FreeBSD doesn't have vmd but it does have bhyve.
KronisLV 4y ago
> Docker is the killer app feature keeping me on Linux. Agreed. Docker (or another OCI compatible solution) feels like one of the few good ways to run software with all of its dependencies consistently across different systems/OSes: you can generally develop things on macOS, Windows or Linux and run your containers with reasonable amounts of confidence in everything working as expected. No longer must you worry as much about what the host OS will be for your business webapp to run, nor are you tied down to an old OS version just because of some dependency not being present/working on the latest one, or even need to worry as much about updating the host with the potential to break something (at least something other than the container runtime). That said, it's always nice to have a decent amount of choice regarding the host OSes and see more support! Even other runtimes like Podman feel like a good sign. Note: some of the aspects of containers have drawbacks, of course (and certain things can break due to FS differences, for example), about which I wrote on my blog, "Containers are broken": https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/containers-are-broken https://blog.kronis.dev/everything%20is%20broken/containers-...

jbirer 4y ago

There's a "yo dawg" joke in here somewhere.

jacooper 4y ago

I still dont understand why one would spend the time to switch to BSD.

mburee 4y ago
Is it really incomprehensible that people like a BSD better than Linux? Along the lines of "BSD is for people who love Unix, Linux is for people who hate Microsoft."
- mekster 4y ago
  Actually it is, at least these days. I tried to use BSD for the past 20 years just to keep my knowledge up to date but only on hobby machines and never for work but frankly gave up using it within the past 5 years. I don't care about the philosophies as they don't seem to bring much benefit. What actual benefit do you see with being "more unified"? I never understood that part. "Better doc" isn't even practical when you google around, you get all the Linux gotchas solved already by someone else when you get far less info on BSD. And then lack of packages and environments like Docker and Homebrew and all I see is limitations. The only thing I miss is probably pf firewall but unless I'm running a router to utilize more rules than simple port allowances, ufw is fine enough. zfs on Ubuntu is darn easy to get started and I just lost much reason to stay with BSD. And considering that I want to setup monitoring, logging and backing up to a central server to be aligned with other servers, things get pretty tough too. There were several related topics. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32369189 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32369189 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31664952 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31664952 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30057549 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30057549 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22852316 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22852316 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22024881 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22024881
lcall 4y ago
I spent the time for OpenBSD because I want greater security and control over when to make changes that could have a security impact. In other words, "secure by default", and only 2 of the worst kind of security bugs since ~1996, are very impressive. Plus I find it a good learning system, as things are well ordered and the documentation is reliable, if one follows the docs and is willing to learn. Of course, there might be features or handholding missing that would make one prefer something else. (Features missing might include bluetooth, maybe some usb things, point-and-click printer setup, ZFS, but I haven't missed these much.) Also there is a somewhat recent change that makes the system use full CPU all the time (not ratcheting up/down with the load), until one configures it otherwise (as I understand, anyway--in the coming 7.2 release there is a package one can install, or build/install now from source, that I understand works around this). To quote another discussion thread: "They develop this software for themselves first. If you like it and it’s useful to you you are welcome to it. If not, look elsewhere. That’s been their working philosophy all along and if you ask me that’s what makes it so great to use. Every piece of the system is carefully thought out and organized so it doesn’t suffer from nearly as much feature creep as other systems." https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18250567 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18250567