7 ms·

This is a great smoke screen for the ACLU to blow. While the real problem of MASSIVE illegal alien voter fraud continues in California. How does a state go from

This is a great smoke screen for the ACLU to blow. While the real problem of MASSIVE illegal alien voter fraud continues in California. How does a state go from voting for proposition 187 to halt illegal immigration and having a conservative governor like Pete Wilson to the far leftist government presently in place? Massive voter fraud is the answer. I'm so glad the Trump administration is investigating :)

Fej 9y ago
That's a quite serious accusation. Do you have some evidence (from a reputable source) that confirms this?
- boneheadmed 9y ago
  One actually investigated: http://www.heritage.org/election-integrity/report/election-fraud-the-2008-indiana-presidential-campaign-case-study http://www.heritage.org/election-integrity/report/election-f... In CA they will fight like hell to prevent it from ever being investigated. And why would they block an "open" voting process from being investigated? A scandal in its own right.
  - Fej 9y ago
    The Heritage Foundation is a think tank, not a primary source. Do you know of any primary sources? The article you linked to talks about election fraud (i.e. the rigging of an election), not voter fraud (i.e. a ballot voted by one who is ineligible to vote).
    - boneheadmed 9y ago
      Sure. Study the history of leftists like Lenin and Stalin and see how they got their "votes". Works the same way in California. And just like in the Soviet Union, you'll never be able to see the voter data to prove it, because communist governments will not allow that. You have to actually think outside the ballot box to figure it out.
      - Fej 9y ago
        That is an argument, not a source. I have seen no evidence to believe that the Californian government is actively suppressing access to voter data for the purposes of covering up a scandal. If you have some, I'm all ears. (Or eyes, as it may be.)
    - boneheadmed 9y ago
      More analysis. (Not part of a left wing "primary" source poly-sci journal, just people who actually think for themselves): http://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/jun/19/noncitizen-illegal-vote-number-higher-than-estimat/ http://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/jun/19/noncitizen-ill...
      - adjkant 9y ago
        http://www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2017/jun/22/ainsley-earhardt/following-trump-voter-fraud-allegations-claim-57-m/ http://www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2017/jun/22/ain... http://www.snopes.com/illegal-immigrants-2008-election/ http://www.snopes.com/illegal-immigrants-2008-election/
kevinh 9y ago
If there was massive voter fraud, surely there would be more evidence that a few conspiracy theorists saying as such.
- boneheadmed 9y ago
  The evidence is inferred from the incredible 180 degree shift in California state politics from conservative to far left in such a short period of time. The data would also be available, however leftist governments like California refuse to turn it over. Think a little bit before you reply.
  - kevinh 9y ago
    That's what happens when conservatives (in California) used identity politics and racism to target a growing minority population. Public consensus turned against them. Try reading this if you have the time and wish to understand: http://faculty2.ucmerced.edu/snicholson/nicholson.earthquakes.pdf http://faculty2.ucmerced.edu/snicholson/nicholson.earthquake...
sweep4r 9y ago
I am not American so I don't understand this so please somebody explain. Is this guy being downvoted because it's thought to be racist to complain about illegals voting without them being citizens, or is this guy being downvoted because this fraud is thought to not happen?
- kevinh 9y ago
  He's being downvoted because voter fraud, if on the scale that Trump believes it is (millions of people), would be readily visible and provable. Instead it's a mechanism for enabling voter ID laws, which prevent demographics that trend Democrat from voting.
  - sweep4r 9y ago
    How do voter ID laws prevent democrats from voting? We have to be fully identified in Europe to vote and parties from the left win elections just fine.
    - schwabacher 9y ago
      ID laws are most likely to exclude young, black, low income and (legal) immigrant voters who are less likely to have drivers licenses than others and are more likely to vote for democrats. (here is one study https://apnews.com/1dba56c5f8f7430f859748aff4405b10/study-voter-id-laws-cut-turnout-blacks-young https://apnews.com/1dba56c5f8f7430f859748aff4405b10/study-vo...) Some of the laws are explicitly designed to favor demographics that skew conservative and exclude others - for example Texas accepts gun licenses as valid IDs but excludes student IDs.
      - sweep4r 9y ago
        There are two things I don't understand. 1) How come there isn't a standard, mandatory, country-wide ID card system in place? 2) If you can vote without an ID card, what prevents illegals from voting as somebody else?

Fej 9y ago

That's a quite serious accusation. Do you have some evidence (from a reputable source) that confirms this?

boneheadmed 9y ago
One actually investigated: http://www.heritage.org/election-integrity/report/election-fraud-the-2008-indiana-presidential-campaign-case-study http://www.heritage.org/election-integrity/report/election-f... In CA they will fight like hell to prevent it from ever being investigated. And why would they block an "open" voting process from being investigated? A scandal in its own right.
- Fej 9y ago
  The Heritage Foundation is a think tank, not a primary source. Do you know of any primary sources? The article you linked to talks about election fraud (i.e. the rigging of an election), not voter fraud (i.e. a ballot voted by one who is ineligible to vote).
  - boneheadmed 9y ago
    Sure. Study the history of leftists like Lenin and Stalin and see how they got their "votes". Works the same way in California. And just like in the Soviet Union, you'll never be able to see the voter data to prove it, because communist governments will not allow that. You have to actually think outside the ballot box to figure it out.
    - Fej 9y ago
      That is an argument, not a source. I have seen no evidence to believe that the Californian government is actively suppressing access to voter data for the purposes of covering up a scandal. If you have some, I'm all ears. (Or eyes, as it may be.)
  - boneheadmed 9y ago
    More analysis. (Not part of a left wing "primary" source poly-sci journal, just people who actually think for themselves): http://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/jun/19/noncitizen-illegal-vote-number-higher-than-estimat/ http://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/jun/19/noncitizen-ill...
    - adjkant 9y ago
      http://www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2017/jun/22/ainsley-earhardt/following-trump-voter-fraud-allegations-claim-57-m/ http://www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2017/jun/22/ain... http://www.snopes.com/illegal-immigrants-2008-election/ http://www.snopes.com/illegal-immigrants-2008-election/

kevinh 9y ago

If there was massive voter fraud, surely there would be more evidence that a few conspiracy theorists saying as such.

boneheadmed 9y ago
The evidence is inferred from the incredible 180 degree shift in California state politics from conservative to far left in such a short period of time. The data would also be available, however leftist governments like California refuse to turn it over. Think a little bit before you reply.
- kevinh 9y ago
  That's what happens when conservatives (in California) used identity politics and racism to target a growing minority population. Public consensus turned against them. Try reading this if you have the time and wish to understand: http://faculty2.ucmerced.edu/snicholson/nicholson.earthquakes.pdf http://faculty2.ucmerced.edu/snicholson/nicholson.earthquake...

sweep4r 9y ago

I am not American so I don't understand this so please somebody explain. Is this guy being downvoted because it's thought to be racist to complain about illegals voting without them being citizens, or is this guy being downvoted because this fraud is thought to not happen?

kevinh 9y ago
He's being downvoted because voter fraud, if on the scale that Trump believes it is (millions of people), would be readily visible and provable. Instead it's a mechanism for enabling voter ID laws, which prevent demographics that trend Democrat from voting.
- sweep4r 9y ago
  How do voter ID laws prevent democrats from voting? We have to be fully identified in Europe to vote and parties from the left win elections just fine.
  - schwabacher 9y ago
    ID laws are most likely to exclude young, black, low income and (legal) immigrant voters who are less likely to have drivers licenses than others and are more likely to vote for democrats. (here is one study https://apnews.com/1dba56c5f8f7430f859748aff4405b10/study-voter-id-laws-cut-turnout-blacks-young https://apnews.com/1dba56c5f8f7430f859748aff4405b10/study-vo...) Some of the laws are explicitly designed to favor demographics that skew conservative and exclude others - for example Texas accepts gun licenses as valid IDs but excludes student IDs.
    - sweep4r 9y ago
      There are two things I don't understand. 1) How come there isn't a standard, mandatory, country-wide ID card system in place? 2) If you can vote without an ID card, what prevents illegals from voting as somebody else?