20 ms·

Carl Icahn Says Apple Is Massively Undervalued

15 points by cyphersanctus 12y ago

chollida1 12y ago
I think this is a much better url as it has the actual letter that the article is based on. http://www.businessinsider.com/carl-icahn-apple-letter-2014-10 http://www.businessinsider.com/carl-icahn-apple-letter-2014-... To be fair to him, he's not the only person who thinks apple should be doing more with their cash: http://appleinsider.com/articles/13/11/21/hedge-fund-manager-david-einhorn-still-thinks-apple-should-do-more-with-its-cash http://appleinsider.com/articles/13/11/21/hedge-fund-manager... I'm sure most people have heard about Icahn. But if not check out his Wikipedia page to see a list of investments he's gone activist on: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Icahn http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Icahn The guy is an interesting man. His most recent endeavor was to prop up the company herbalife. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-07-22/icahn-makes-234-million-as-ackman-fails-with-herbalife.html http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-07-22/icahn-makes-234-mil... He sure isn't the kind of hedge fund manager that sits behind a desk and stares at his Bloomberg terminal all day:) The man is 78, and worth 23 billion and he's still picking fights, I hope I have that kind of energy when I get that old, maybe not the fight picking part:) EDIT to be clear, I'm not making a judgement on his character or if he's a net positive to the market. You may see him as good or bad.
- pothibo 12y ago
  From what I read from him, I can only feel that he's one of the example of what's wrong with capitalism. He only serves himself (Pump & dump, Herbalife, etc.) He's been a cancer to any company that he's invested in. Check the Family Dollar history. Force owner to sell, then when a serious offer shows up, he sells his share before the deal is closed.
- JetSpiegel 12y ago
  > to be clear, I'm not making a judgement on his character or if he's a net positive to the market. I am. Herbalife is a Ponzi scheme.
sgnelson 12y ago
You should read this as "Carl Icahn wants to pump and dump Apple Stock."
- untothebreach 12y ago
  FWIW, he does claim that he won't do that. Depends on how trustworthy he is, though.
  - guyzero 12y ago
    He's going to pump now and will dump later at his leisure.
fleitz 12y ago
Carl: Hmm... I think I should sell my apple shares... but who would buy them all...? Carl: I know, I'll get apple to buy my shares!
andrewrice 12y ago
He's expressed this sentiment before, and has been pressing Apple to expand its stock buyback program since he first invested in the company. See this 2013 article from Bloomberg: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-08-13/carl-icahn-discloses-large-stake-in-apple-in-tweet.html http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-08-13/carl-icahn-disclose...
metaphorm 12y ago
he's so full of it. he wants a stock buyback program to boost his own shares valuation. that's all. this guy is a scam artist.
q2 12y ago
I wonder if Tim Cook really reads that lengthy letter or some legal expert will just summarize the content. TL;DR version might be helpful.
- cpwright 12y ago
  I would be surprised if Cook did not read it. Its not that lengthy, and Icahn does own just a bit under 1% of the company, if I did my math right(53M shares * 100.98 / 596B market cap).
  - JohnTHaller 12y ago
    Cook should read it and then do the opposite of whatever Icahn wants given Icahn's track record of wrecking companies.
lotsofmangos 12y ago
promising that if Apple heeds his advice, he won’t sell off any of his approximately 53 million shares. If he really thinks the stock is undervalued, why would he sell in the absence of a share buyback anyway? If he is right then surely he should be buying those shares himself and waiting as the buyback would only be bringing forward a rise, not creating it.
- nly 12y ago
  It's a good point, but investing more than a certain % of your assets (roughly proportional to your perceived edge) in any one thing, is a bad idea.
salimmadjd 12y ago
You should read how Icahn destroyed TWA [1] before believing a word he says. [1] http://blog.pmarca.com/2014/03/18/when-carl-icahn-ran-a-company-the-story-of-twa/ http://blog.pmarca.com/2014/03/18/when-carl-icahn-ran-a-comp...
wil421 12y ago
Maybe he can schedule a takeover then start selling off their assets. Then move to take the company private again.
npalli 12y ago
Michael Dell after his experience with Carl Icahn [1] and the bitter battle to take his company private. “It’s a big poker game to him [Carl Icahn],” says Dell. “It’s not about the customers. It’s not about the people. It’s not about changing the world. He doesn’t give a crap about any of that. He didn’t know whether we made nuclear power plants or French fries. He didn’t care.” http://www.forbes.com/sites/connieguglielmo/2013/10/30/you-wont-have-michael-dell-to-kick-around-anymore/ http://www.forbes.com/sites/connieguglielmo/2013/10/30/you-w...
anonbanker 12y ago
I might be in the minority here, but I want to see Icahn pump-and-dump Apple. Now that Jobs is gone, there is nobody running the ship that is competent enough to stop Icahn. He'll devalue the company, and bleed it dry if allowed, just like he's trying to do with eBay right now. And this makes me happy as a clam; Now that Microsoft is steadily marching toward irrelevance, it'd be peachy keen if we could take down the usurper to that throne (Apple), and give the GNU/Linux and BSD families the attention they rightfully deserve. Could you imagine? if Icahn bled Apple to death, Ubuntu would be the 800lb Gorilla.

15 points by cyphersanctus 12y ago

I think this is a much better url as it has the actual letter that the article is based on. http://www.businessinsider.com/carl-icahn-apple-letter-2014-10 http://www.businessinsider.com/carl-icahn-apple-letter-2014-... To be fair to him, he's not the only person who thinks apple should be doing more with their cash: http://appleinsider.com/articles/13/11/21/hedge-fund-manager-david-einhorn-still-thinks-apple-should-do-more-with-its-cash http://appleinsider.com/articles/13/11/21/hedge-fund-manager... I'm sure most people have heard about Icahn. But if not check out his Wikipedia page to see a list of investments he's gone activist on: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Icahn http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Icahn The guy is an interesting man. His most recent endeavor was to prop up the company herbalife. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-07-22/icahn-makes-234-million-as-ackman-fails-with-herbalife.html http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-07-22/icahn-makes-234-mil... He sure isn't the kind of hedge fund manager that sits behind a desk and stares at his Bloomberg terminal all day:) The man is 78, and worth 23 billion and he's still picking fights, I hope I have that kind of energy when I get that old, maybe not the fight picking part:) EDIT to be clear, I'm not making a judgement on his character or if he's a net positive to the market. You may see him as good or bad.

pothibo 12y ago
From what I read from him, I can only feel that he's one of the example of what's wrong with capitalism. He only serves himself (Pump & dump, Herbalife, etc.) He's been a cancer to any company that he's invested in. Check the Family Dollar history. Force owner to sell, then when a serious offer shows up, he sells his share before the deal is closed.
JetSpiegel 12y ago
> to be clear, I'm not making a judgement on his character or if he's a net positive to the market. I am. Herbalife is a Ponzi scheme.

sgnelson 12y ago

You should read this as "Carl Icahn wants to pump and dump Apple Stock."

untothebreach 12y ago
FWIW, he does claim that he won't do that. Depends on how trustworthy he is, though.
- guyzero 12y ago
  He's going to pump now and will dump later at his leisure.

fleitz 12y ago

Carl: Hmm... I think I should sell my apple shares... but who would buy them all...? Carl: I know, I'll get apple to buy my shares!

andrewrice 12y ago

He's expressed this sentiment before, and has been pressing Apple to expand its stock buyback program since he first invested in the company. See this 2013 article from Bloomberg: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-08-13/carl-icahn-discloses-large-stake-in-apple-in-tweet.html http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-08-13/carl-icahn-disclose...

metaphorm 12y ago

he's so full of it. he wants a stock buyback program to boost his own shares valuation. that's all. this guy is a scam artist.

q2 12y ago

I wonder if Tim Cook really reads that lengthy letter or some legal expert will just summarize the content. TL;DR version might be helpful.

cpwright 12y ago
I would be surprised if Cook did not read it. Its not that lengthy, and Icahn does own just a bit under 1% of the company, if I did my math right(53M shares * 100.98 / 596B market cap).
- JohnTHaller 12y ago
  Cook should read it and then do the opposite of whatever Icahn wants given Icahn's track record of wrecking companies.

lotsofmangos 12y ago

promising that if Apple heeds his advice, he won’t sell off any of his approximately 53 million shares. If he really thinks the stock is undervalued, why would he sell in the absence of a share buyback anyway? If he is right then surely he should be buying those shares himself and waiting as the buyback would only be bringing forward a rise, not creating it.

nly 12y ago
It's a good point, but investing more than a certain % of your assets (roughly proportional to your perceived edge) in any one thing, is a bad idea.

salimmadjd 12y ago

You should read how Icahn destroyed TWA [1] before believing a word he says. [1] http://blog.pmarca.com/2014/03/18/when-carl-icahn-ran-a-company-the-story-of-twa/ http://blog.pmarca.com/2014/03/18/when-carl-icahn-ran-a-comp...

wil421 12y ago

Maybe he can schedule a takeover then start selling off their assets. Then move to take the company private again.

npalli 12y ago

Michael Dell after his experience with Carl Icahn [1] and the bitter battle to take his company private. “It’s a big poker game to him [Carl Icahn],” says Dell. “It’s not about the customers. It’s not about the people. It’s not about changing the world. He doesn’t give a crap about any of that. He didn’t know whether we made nuclear power plants or French fries. He didn’t care.” http://www.forbes.com/sites/connieguglielmo/2013/10/30/you-wont-have-michael-dell-to-kick-around-anymore/ http://www.forbes.com/sites/connieguglielmo/2013/10/30/you-w...

anonbanker 12y ago

I might be in the minority here, but I want to see Icahn pump-and-dump Apple. Now that Jobs is gone, there is nobody running the ship that is competent enough to stop Icahn. He'll devalue the company, and bleed it dry if allowed, just like he's trying to do with eBay right now. And this makes me happy as a clam; Now that Microsoft is steadily marching toward irrelevance, it'd be peachy keen if we could take down the usurper to that throne (Apple), and give the GNU/Linux and BSD families the attention they rightfully deserve. Could you imagine? if Icahn bled Apple to death, Ubuntu would be the 800lb Gorilla.