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Bad idea. I personally know a guy who was illegally kidnapped by the US government from Ecuador with the assistance of local police. Snowden will regret this de

Bad idea. I personally know a guy who was illegally kidnapped by the US government from Ecuador with the assistance of local police. Snowden will regret this decision.

werid 13y ago
Mossad kidnapped Vanunu from Italy. With or without local help, you can be kidnapped anywhere. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mordechai_Vanunu http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mordechai_Vanunu
- tzury 13y ago
  1986 is not 2013. The fact this is not going off the top news makes it much harder - in all aspects (the tactic operation is just one aspect to such act).
  - grey-area 13y ago
    Osama Nasr was abducted by the US from Milan, Italy in 2003 without permission or cooperation from the Italian government and tortured in Egypt. Illegal abduction can happen anywhere. I agree publicity would make it harder, but the US has shown willingness to act extra-legally and ignore the fallout even from allies (Pakistan, Italy etc), so Snowden is probably not safe anywhere, just a bit safer for longer in a country which opposes the US. In his words: You can't come forward against the world's most powerful intelligence agencies and be completely free from risk because they're such powerful adversaries. No one can meaningfully oppose them. If they want to get you, they'll get you in time. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hassan_Mustafa_Osama_Nasr https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hassan_Mustafa_Osama_Nasr
  - mike_esspe 13y ago
    http://www.richardsilverstein.com/2011/03/03/mossad-kidnaps-gazan-engineer-in-ukraine-now-held-incommunicado-in-israeli-prison/ http://www.richardsilverstein.com/2011/03/03/mossad-kidnaps-... This happened just two years ago. Palestinian engineer, traveling in Ukraine, was captured by unknown people, and was found in Israel prison week later.
  - threeseed 13y ago
    But it will go off the top news. The US government has all the time in the world and in months/years from now when nobody remembers his name there will be an opportunity for a extradition to be done quietly.
    - goldfeld 13y ago
      That's my thought . But I guess there's a way for him in working together with Assange from now on, thus keeping a high profile.
- MattDL 13y ago
  Didn't they have to lure him away from the UK to be in a position to abduct him in the first place though? So really it depends where you are and what you're willing to do.
pvnick 13y ago
I'd like to see them try, considering the high-profile nature of this specific case. It would severely harm their position diplomatically.
deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
kinghajj 13y ago
I'm not trusting any "sources" that claim to know his final destination, as various ones have claimed Venezuela, Norway, and now Ecuador. I guess we'll have to wait a couple days to know what'll really happen.
1337biz 13y ago
Just wondering: What would be the appeals process if he were actually kidnapped by the US government in a foreign country. Is there some court by the United Nations that is mediating such cases even if there is an extreme power imbalance between both nations?
- dragonwriter 13y ago
  > Just wondering: What would be the appeals process if he were actually kidnapped by the US government in a foreign country. The appeals process that would go through a system with the power to matter would be through the US courts and would almost certainly be unsuccessful, see U.S. v. Alvarez-Machain, 504 US 655 (1992) [1]. > Is there some court by the United Nations that is mediating such cases even if there is an extreme power imbalance between both nations? A case could be filed in the International Court of Justice by the offended country against the US alleging violation of a treaty or some other element of international law within the competence of the Court, but for consideration of how much that would be worth even if the offended country won the case, consider Nicaragua v. United States [1]. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicaragua_v._United_States http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicaragua_v._United_States
ngoel36 13y ago
One would think that he would have planned this shit out...
- aspensmonster 13y ago
  I'm sure he did. But plans are just that. They're dependent on the moves of other players that you typically have no control over and can only imperfectly guess at.
- fnordfnordfnord 13y ago
  The best laid plans and all that... Maybe this is the plan. It's not as though you get to practice at this.
lhnz 13y ago
Can you give us more information? This sounds like bullshit.
- throwawayyyz 13y ago
  Two weeks ago everything Snowden said would have sounded like bullshit. There are plenty of things we are not aware of. This kidnapping that I mentioned just happens to be something I was physically present to witness. However, I'm not going to provide further details. Feel free to move on with your day and ignore my comment.
  - lhnz 13y ago
    That was incredibly unconvincing. You were physically present for a kidnapping? Yep, I'm moving on with my day...
lawnchair_larry 13y ago
Sounds exactly like what Sweden did to Gottfrid Svartholm Warg in Cambodia a few months ago.

Bad idea. I personally know a guy who was illegally kidnapped by the US government from Ecuador with the assistance of local police. Snowden will regret this decision.

werid 13y ago

Mossad kidnapped Vanunu from Italy. With or without local help, you can be kidnapped anywhere. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mordechai_Vanunu http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mordechai_Vanunu

tzury 13y ago
1986 is not 2013. The fact this is not going off the top news makes it much harder - in all aspects (the tactic operation is just one aspect to such act).
- grey-area 13y ago
  Osama Nasr was abducted by the US from Milan, Italy in 2003 without permission or cooperation from the Italian government and tortured in Egypt. Illegal abduction can happen anywhere. I agree publicity would make it harder, but the US has shown willingness to act extra-legally and ignore the fallout even from allies (Pakistan, Italy etc), so Snowden is probably not safe anywhere, just a bit safer for longer in a country which opposes the US. In his words: You can't come forward against the world's most powerful intelligence agencies and be completely free from risk because they're such powerful adversaries. No one can meaningfully oppose them. If they want to get you, they'll get you in time. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hassan_Mustafa_Osama_Nasr https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hassan_Mustafa_Osama_Nasr
- mike_esspe 13y ago
  http://www.richardsilverstein.com/2011/03/03/mossad-kidnaps-gazan-engineer-in-ukraine-now-held-incommunicado-in-israeli-prison/ http://www.richardsilverstein.com/2011/03/03/mossad-kidnaps-... This happened just two years ago. Palestinian engineer, traveling in Ukraine, was captured by unknown people, and was found in Israel prison week later.
- threeseed 13y ago
  But it will go off the top news. The US government has all the time in the world and in months/years from now when nobody remembers his name there will be an opportunity for a extradition to be done quietly.
  - goldfeld 13y ago
    That's my thought . But I guess there's a way for him in working together with Assange from now on, thus keeping a high profile.
MattDL 13y ago
Didn't they have to lure him away from the UK to be in a position to abduct him in the first place though? So really it depends where you are and what you're willing to do.

pvnick 13y ago

I'd like to see them try, considering the high-profile nature of this specific case. It would severely harm their position diplomatically.

deleted 13y ago

[deleted]

kinghajj 13y ago

I'm not trusting any "sources" that claim to know his final destination, as various ones have claimed Venezuela, Norway, and now Ecuador. I guess we'll have to wait a couple days to know what'll really happen.

1337biz 13y ago

Just wondering: What would be the appeals process if he were actually kidnapped by the US government in a foreign country. Is there some court by the United Nations that is mediating such cases even if there is an extreme power imbalance between both nations?

dragonwriter 13y ago
> Just wondering: What would be the appeals process if he were actually kidnapped by the US government in a foreign country. The appeals process that would go through a system with the power to matter would be through the US courts and would almost certainly be unsuccessful, see U.S. v. Alvarez-Machain, 504 US 655 (1992) [1]. > Is there some court by the United Nations that is mediating such cases even if there is an extreme power imbalance between both nations? A case could be filed in the International Court of Justice by the offended country against the US alleging violation of a treaty or some other element of international law within the competence of the Court, but for consideration of how much that would be worth even if the offended country won the case, consider Nicaragua v. United States [1]. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicaragua_v._United_States http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicaragua_v._United_States

ngoel36 13y ago

One would think that he would have planned this shit out...

aspensmonster 13y ago
I'm sure he did. But plans are just that. They're dependent on the moves of other players that you typically have no control over and can only imperfectly guess at.
fnordfnordfnord 13y ago
The best laid plans and all that... Maybe this is the plan. It's not as though you get to practice at this.

lhnz 13y ago

Can you give us more information? This sounds like bullshit.

throwawayyyz 13y ago
Two weeks ago everything Snowden said would have sounded like bullshit. There are plenty of things we are not aware of. This kidnapping that I mentioned just happens to be something I was physically present to witness. However, I'm not going to provide further details. Feel free to move on with your day and ignore my comment.
- lhnz 13y ago
  That was incredibly unconvincing. You were physically present for a kidnapping? Yep, I'm moving on with my day...

lawnchair_larry 13y ago

Sounds exactly like what Sweden did to Gottfrid Svartholm Warg in Cambodia a few months ago.