7 ms·

> At the end, she told me she would review my exam and have the results ready in a few days. Yeah man I can go ahead and let you know early if you want.

by a2dam 17d ago

johnwalkr 16d ago
This comment is so funny to me, because I imagine you being distracted to make the comment before making it to the end where the psych did indeed review the new results. Well I only know that because I skipped to the end. Then, while scrolling up I realised I missed the whole side-quest about promising to not cheat the test again, taking the test again, but then "accidentally" finding an exploit the system, and then cheating the test again, but this time cheating even more to see the results. Then, scrolling up more I see that this whole thing started with seeing stars and then buying a telescope on amazon (probably at 3am). And here I am commenting on HN instead of replying to an email...
- jaggederest 16d ago
  Brother the test is quick, easy, and painless, and the results can be lifechanging. The other thing is, ADHD in my mind is really a syndrome that starts with a symptom - inattention - that can be caused by so, so many things. I have both, because of course I do, I had a medical problem that exacerbated my ADHD to a significant, significant degree (it's amazing I was able to be a software engineer for so long without treatment). So don't just tunnel vision in... as we tend to be prone to do. Get the whole workup with an experienced clinician, it's so lifechanging it's hard to describe.
  - johnwalkr 16d ago
    I want to add that the comment is also funny to me because it and the blog post are very relatable to me. I don't mean to dismiss it at all. It's really important to get a good diagnosis for anything like this and not dismiss it or lock into the wrong diagnosis because of your own tunnel vision. You wrote "the test is quick, easy, and painless" but I also want to note that it's not always. Depending on your country, parents, specific doctor, etc it can be very difficult to get a proper diagnosis and help. In some places a big criteria is diagnosis during childhood so if you're 30 or 40 you might have no chance. Or a chance but it depends on your parents retroactively answering a questionnaire, or finding an old report card with the right words. As you said it's life changing to get the right help and I encourage everyone to pursue this.
    - jaggederest 16d ago
      The thing is, the test is super quick and easy. And then they throw 50 procedurally complex and tedious tasks at someone who can definitionally not do that, and they know that. Kafkaesque. Btw no criticism implied on my end, I'm just now constitutionally incapable of not telling people they should get screened. Hmmm I wonder why I have difficulty resisting that urge...
      - johnwalkr 16d ago
        I think I get your point. It's cruel to require Kafkaesque testing and that just makes it not worth it try. But too simple of a test can also misdiagnose. The chance to be diagnosed with an appropriate gate varies greatly based on where you live and which doctor you can see and more. It can be anything from a 5 minute conversation, to 6 months of inconvenience, to no chance of even existing in your lifetime, to suck it up and don't ask because your career will end.
        jaggederest 16d ago
        Right let me be very explicit: TOVA or equivalent are basically "play video games for 10 minutes as a part of your diagnosis" like the OP, the kafkaesque part is getting the appointment, and getting them administered, getting the diagnosis confirmed, going through the records and getting the prescriptions, everything around it :) they're actually pretty sophisticated tests, despite their palatability - I think if they had better ones they'd obviously use them.
        tacticus 16d ago
        "Sorry the psych is no longer available today. your appointment has been moved to the next available booking in 9 months time"
        jaggederest 16d ago
        Or even better, "We have one available psychologist and they kinda don't believe in ADHD, so they'll see you but not actually grade the test correctly, so you'll have to try again, and as a bonus get labeled medication seeking". Not my experience, but...
hungryhobbit 16d ago
I know this is a joke, but I'd be careful about assuming: I had a trained therapist diagnose me with ADHD ... incorrectly. It turns out, there are other conditions out there that can appear to be be ADHD. If a trained therapist can confuse them, outside observers certainly can too, so it is possible that "very ADHD-acting" person you know might not have it. (Or, especially for females, the reverse can be true, as not everyone with ADHD manifests with the same trademark hyperactivity.)
- pstuart 16d ago
  I understand this is your personal medical info, but could you drop any hints as to the nature of the misdiagnosis? I've learned late in life that I am neurospicy and learning from other's experiences in this domain has been quite helpful.
  - annzabelle 16d ago
    I listen to a lot of psychiatry podcasts, and they generally think that ADHD is being seriously overdiagnosed at this point. Executive dysfunction, especially that which was not impairing as a child, has a lot of potential causes. Anxiety, depression (yes, ADHD can cause these, but these can also cause executive dysfunction in people without ADHD), OCD, Bipolar (manic people in particular often attribute worsening of hyperactivity and distractability to ADHD instead of mania), Schizophrenia pretty much universally is related to cognitive symptoms and lowered motivation even when not psychotic, and borderline personality disorder can cause changes in interests and identity. For many of these conditions, stimulants can act as a band aid on something else. It can superficially make people feel better (of course, it's speed), but it can distract from other symptoms that are impairing functioning, and prevent people from seeking long term solutions.
    - pstuart 16d ago
      I can roll with that. I do have executive dysfunction and other "fun" facets of a funky neurobiology. I also recognize that every body and mind is different and it's a personal journey to find the right tools. I recognize that non-medical options should always be front line approaches but there can be a chicken and egg effect as to making that happen. In my youth I adhered to a "better living through chemistry (wink wink)", I do now too (rip Mitch Hedburg) but the wink wink part is very rare and disciplined and now it's all about pharma and supplements to wring what I can out of what I've got left.

> At the end, she told me she would review my exam and have the results ready in a few days. Yeah man I can go ahead and let you know early if you want.

by a2dam 17d ago

> At the end, she told me she would review my exam and have the results ready in a few days. Yeah man I can go ahead and let you know early if you want.

johnwalkr 16d ago

This comment is so funny to me, because I imagine you being distracted to make the comment before making it to the end where the psych did indeed review the new results. Well I only know that because I skipped to the end. Then, while scrolling up I realised I missed the whole side-quest about promising to not cheat the test again, taking the test again, but then "accidentally" finding an exploit the system, and then cheating the test again, but this time cheating even more to see the results. Then, scrolling up more I see that this whole thing started with seeing stars and then buying a telescope on amazon (probably at 3am). And here I am commenting on HN instead of replying to an email...

jaggederest 16d ago
Brother the test is quick, easy, and painless, and the results can be lifechanging. The other thing is, ADHD in my mind is really a syndrome that starts with a symptom - inattention - that can be caused by so, so many things. I have both, because of course I do, I had a medical problem that exacerbated my ADHD to a significant, significant degree (it's amazing I was able to be a software engineer for so long without treatment). So don't just tunnel vision in... as we tend to be prone to do. Get the whole workup with an experienced clinician, it's so lifechanging it's hard to describe.
- johnwalkr 16d ago
  I want to add that the comment is also funny to me because it and the blog post are very relatable to me. I don't mean to dismiss it at all. It's really important to get a good diagnosis for anything like this and not dismiss it or lock into the wrong diagnosis because of your own tunnel vision. You wrote "the test is quick, easy, and painless" but I also want to note that it's not always. Depending on your country, parents, specific doctor, etc it can be very difficult to get a proper diagnosis and help. In some places a big criteria is diagnosis during childhood so if you're 30 or 40 you might have no chance. Or a chance but it depends on your parents retroactively answering a questionnaire, or finding an old report card with the right words. As you said it's life changing to get the right help and I encourage everyone to pursue this.
  - jaggederest 16d ago
    The thing is, the test is super quick and easy. And then they throw 50 procedurally complex and tedious tasks at someone who can definitionally not do that, and they know that. Kafkaesque. Btw no criticism implied on my end, I'm just now constitutionally incapable of not telling people they should get screened. Hmmm I wonder why I have difficulty resisting that urge...
    - johnwalkr 16d ago
      I think I get your point. It's cruel to require Kafkaesque testing and that just makes it not worth it try. But too simple of a test can also misdiagnose. The chance to be diagnosed with an appropriate gate varies greatly based on where you live and which doctor you can see and more. It can be anything from a 5 minute conversation, to 6 months of inconvenience, to no chance of even existing in your lifetime, to suck it up and don't ask because your career will end.
      - jaggederest 16d ago
        Right let me be very explicit: TOVA or equivalent are basically "play video games for 10 minutes as a part of your diagnosis" like the OP, the kafkaesque part is getting the appointment, and getting them administered, getting the diagnosis confirmed, going through the records and getting the prescriptions, everything around it :) they're actually pretty sophisticated tests, despite their palatability - I think if they had better ones they'd obviously use them.
        tacticus 16d ago
        "Sorry the psych is no longer available today. your appointment has been moved to the next available booking in 9 months time"
        jaggederest 16d ago
        Or even better, "We have one available psychologist and they kinda don't believe in ADHD, so they'll see you but not actually grade the test correctly, so you'll have to try again, and as a bonus get labeled medication seeking". Not my experience, but...

hungryhobbit 16d ago

I know this is a joke, but I'd be careful about assuming: I had a trained therapist diagnose me with ADHD ... incorrectly. It turns out, there are other conditions out there that can appear to be be ADHD. If a trained therapist can confuse them, outside observers certainly can too, so it is possible that "very ADHD-acting" person you know might not have it. (Or, especially for females, the reverse can be true, as not everyone with ADHD manifests with the same trademark hyperactivity.)

pstuart 16d ago
I understand this is your personal medical info, but could you drop any hints as to the nature of the misdiagnosis? I've learned late in life that I am neurospicy and learning from other's experiences in this domain has been quite helpful.
- annzabelle 16d ago
  I listen to a lot of psychiatry podcasts, and they generally think that ADHD is being seriously overdiagnosed at this point. Executive dysfunction, especially that which was not impairing as a child, has a lot of potential causes. Anxiety, depression (yes, ADHD can cause these, but these can also cause executive dysfunction in people without ADHD), OCD, Bipolar (manic people in particular often attribute worsening of hyperactivity and distractability to ADHD instead of mania), Schizophrenia pretty much universally is related to cognitive symptoms and lowered motivation even when not psychotic, and borderline personality disorder can cause changes in interests and identity. For many of these conditions, stimulants can act as a band aid on something else. It can superficially make people feel better (of course, it's speed), but it can distract from other symptoms that are impairing functioning, and prevent people from seeking long term solutions.
  - pstuart 16d ago
    I can roll with that. I do have executive dysfunction and other "fun" facets of a funky neurobiology. I also recognize that every body and mind is different and it's a personal journey to find the right tools. I recognize that non-medical options should always be front line approaches but there can be a chicken and egg effect as to making that happen. In my youth I adhered to a "better living through chemistry (wink wink)", I do now too (rip Mitch Hedburg) but the wink wink part is very rare and disciplined and now it's all about pharma and supplements to wring what I can out of what I've got left.