8 ms·

It's funny to think some of the world's largest trades are being done in something that resembles a game's tradechat. (WTS bonds)

globular-toast 1mo ago
I find it a bit less funny. There is this perception that what finance people do is super important and grown up but following a brief stint in the industry I realised it literally is just a game. We used to trade bits of stationery and trading cards for fun at school. They never stopped. The only difference is people who never consented to any of this are paying for it all, especially when it all goes wrong.
- allthetime 1mo ago
  That should have been obvious from the mere fact that the bottom rungs are almost completely populated by silver-spooned nepo-babies.
  - JumpCrisscross 1mo ago
    > the bottom rungs are almost completely populated by silver-spooned nepo-babies You’re thinking of investment banking, corporate finance. Trading has always been the place folks from less privileged backgrounds got into finance. In the old days, Jews. (Like, into the 50s.) In the 80s, poor schmucks.
    - allthetime 1mo ago
      I know a lot of traders from both university and growing up around rich kids. Their parents are invariably very wealthy. They were the ones who had the time and safety net to sit around on computers all the time (like me becoming a programmer) I’m not in the trading world though so I haven’t met the ones that don’t fit this description. But exactly zero of the people I know who were raised in either poverty or mediocrity are traders or involved in finance, aside from maybe accounting. Of course, this is all anecdotal - but I’ve only ever seen Bloomberg terminals outside of office settings in the apartments of wealthy children. Perhaps things were a bit different decades ago, in the scrappy past, but it feels like most higher earning spheres are closing in around pre-existing wealth.
      - JumpCrisscross 1mo ago
        > I’m not in the trading world I was. Algorithmic derivatives. The rich kids went into banking. Their connections bought deal flow. Those of us from public universities mostly went into trading. It’s why it’s been looked down on within Wall Street since basically ever. > I’ve only ever seen Bloomberg terminals outside of office settings in the apartments of wealthy children Parents buying their kids Bloomberg terminals aren’t looking for them to get into trading, they’re training them to start a hedge fund. (I’d also guess a minority of folks with a BB are traders. It’s really more of a vetted calling card.)
      - kasey_junk 1mo ago
        You know _traders_ who came from wealthy backgrounds? That's a completely incongruous outcome in my experience. At least in the markets I'm aware of from my career (commodities and fx) the trading component has effectively always been a middle class activity. Something that the kids of cops and plumbers did if they didn't want to go into the family business. That has changed in the last 20 years or so but only because those jobs have effectively gone away. They are the factory jobs of the finance world. They succumbed to the automation impulse that started in the 80s and reached its zenith in the early 2010s. Traders basically don't exist anymore, a computer can do the job much more effectively. So much so that I was shocked when I _encountered_ a real live trading desk as part of a recent job move.
- linkregister 1mo ago
  Why would a trader need your consent to make a trade with somebody else?
  - grigri907 1mo ago
    I assumed they were referring to market crashes caused by irresponsible levels of risks and deceptive practices like we saw in 2008, and/or government-funded bailouts
    - graemep 1mo ago
      That was not caused by trading. It was caused by irresponsible lending and deceptive securitisation of that debt. Trading can bring down a bank (e.g.Barings) but is not a big systemic risk.
      - wyre 1mo ago
        Is lending not a trade? Two parties exchange money for terms of repayment/debt.
        linkregister 1mo ago
        The trading occurring on the Bloomberg terminal is of bonds, equities, and commodities.
        wyre 1mo ago
        Sure, this subthread was about finance people in general, the big short in 2008, and other government-funded bailouts.
        graemep 1mo ago
        If you look at ancestors there are repeated references to trades and trading, not to finance or banking.
- sheeshkebab 1mo ago
  It’s pretty bad except that any other way is even worse.
lq9AJ8yrfs 1mo ago
For a long time fixed income trading took place over AOL Instant Messenger and later Yahoo chat rooms. I am not making this up. There were custom frontends that would enrich things like cusips.
ConcernedCoder 1mo ago
Unlocked a core memory for me! Anyone else old enough to remember scripting a tradebot in Asheron's Call?
ceasesurthinko 1mo ago
Slack (acquired by Salesforce in 2021 for $27 billion) started out as a chat app built for the devs of a failing online multiplayer video game called Glitch.
- IIsi50MHz 1mo ago
  I'd forgotten that. I miss Fog Creek Software. Used Trello a lot before it got sold to, and damaged by contact with, Atlassian. FogBugz looked cool…but I had to use an old version of Bugzilla. I didn't know Glitch existed until this site had a notice that it Glitch would be shutting down. Surprised me FCS had anything to do with a game, and seems it wasn't a good fit. I like the style though, and downloaded some of the art and variations on the Groddle theme before it died.

globular-toast 1mo ago

I find it a bit less funny. There is this perception that what finance people do is super important and grown up but following a brief stint in the industry I realised it literally is just a game. We used to trade bits of stationery and trading cards for fun at school. They never stopped. The only difference is people who never consented to any of this are paying for it all, especially when it all goes wrong.

allthetime 1mo ago
That should have been obvious from the mere fact that the bottom rungs are almost completely populated by silver-spooned nepo-babies.
- JumpCrisscross 1mo ago
  > the bottom rungs are almost completely populated by silver-spooned nepo-babies You’re thinking of investment banking, corporate finance. Trading has always been the place folks from less privileged backgrounds got into finance. In the old days, Jews. (Like, into the 50s.) In the 80s, poor schmucks.
  - allthetime 1mo ago
    I know a lot of traders from both university and growing up around rich kids. Their parents are invariably very wealthy. They were the ones who had the time and safety net to sit around on computers all the time (like me becoming a programmer) I’m not in the trading world though so I haven’t met the ones that don’t fit this description. But exactly zero of the people I know who were raised in either poverty or mediocrity are traders or involved in finance, aside from maybe accounting. Of course, this is all anecdotal - but I’ve only ever seen Bloomberg terminals outside of office settings in the apartments of wealthy children. Perhaps things were a bit different decades ago, in the scrappy past, but it feels like most higher earning spheres are closing in around pre-existing wealth.
    - JumpCrisscross 1mo ago
      > I’m not in the trading world I was. Algorithmic derivatives. The rich kids went into banking. Their connections bought deal flow. Those of us from public universities mostly went into trading. It’s why it’s been looked down on within Wall Street since basically ever. > I’ve only ever seen Bloomberg terminals outside of office settings in the apartments of wealthy children Parents buying their kids Bloomberg terminals aren’t looking for them to get into trading, they’re training them to start a hedge fund. (I’d also guess a minority of folks with a BB are traders. It’s really more of a vetted calling card.)
    - kasey_junk 1mo ago
      You know _traders_ who came from wealthy backgrounds? That's a completely incongruous outcome in my experience. At least in the markets I'm aware of from my career (commodities and fx) the trading component has effectively always been a middle class activity. Something that the kids of cops and plumbers did if they didn't want to go into the family business. That has changed in the last 20 years or so but only because those jobs have effectively gone away. They are the factory jobs of the finance world. They succumbed to the automation impulse that started in the 80s and reached its zenith in the early 2010s. Traders basically don't exist anymore, a computer can do the job much more effectively. So much so that I was shocked when I _encountered_ a real live trading desk as part of a recent job move.
linkregister 1mo ago
Why would a trader need your consent to make a trade with somebody else?
- grigri907 1mo ago
  I assumed they were referring to market crashes caused by irresponsible levels of risks and deceptive practices like we saw in 2008, and/or government-funded bailouts
  - graemep 1mo ago
    That was not caused by trading. It was caused by irresponsible lending and deceptive securitisation of that debt. Trading can bring down a bank (e.g.Barings) but is not a big systemic risk.
    - wyre 1mo ago
      Is lending not a trade? Two parties exchange money for terms of repayment/debt.
      - linkregister 1mo ago
        The trading occurring on the Bloomberg terminal is of bonds, equities, and commodities.
        wyre 1mo ago
        Sure, this subthread was about finance people in general, the big short in 2008, and other government-funded bailouts.
        graemep 1mo ago
        If you look at ancestors there are repeated references to trades and trading, not to finance or banking.
sheeshkebab 1mo ago
It’s pretty bad except that any other way is even worse.

lq9AJ8yrfs 1mo ago

For a long time fixed income trading took place over AOL Instant Messenger and later Yahoo chat rooms. I am not making this up. There were custom frontends that would enrich things like cusips.

ConcernedCoder 1mo ago

Unlocked a core memory for me! Anyone else old enough to remember scripting a tradebot in Asheron's Call?

ceasesurthinko 1mo ago

Slack (acquired by Salesforce in 2021 for $27 billion) started out as a chat app built for the devs of a failing online multiplayer video game called Glitch.

IIsi50MHz 1mo ago
I'd forgotten that. I miss Fog Creek Software. Used Trello a lot before it got sold to, and damaged by contact with, Atlassian. FogBugz looked cool…but I had to use an old version of Bugzilla. I didn't know Glitch existed until this site had a notice that it Glitch would be shutting down. Surprised me FCS had anything to do with a game, and seems it wasn't a good fit. I like the style though, and downloaded some of the art and variations on the Groddle theme before it died.