5 ms·

You can't use BigDecimal either. There are libraries whose whole purpose is just to exactly reproduce COBOL arithmetic, eg. the IBM Decimal Arithmetic Library.

ptx 1mo ago
Wow, their Java code example [0] makes COBOL look elegant and terse by comparison. [0] https://community.ibm.com/community/user/blogs/gregory-cernera/2026/04/07/ibm-decimal-arithmetic-library-for-java-v20-releas https://community.ibm.com/community/user/blogs/gregory-cerne...
- DarkUranium 1mo ago
  I know it's not the only problem (but it is IMO the main one), but this is why I'm a proponent of allowing operator overloading in languages. Yes, you can't tell at a glance if `+` really still does what it should, but I find that problem no different from a library mis-naming a function and/or said function having strange side-effects. `+` should do addition, period. No, not even concatenation if possible (I do find the lack of a separate concatenation operator to be a language flaw --- that said, I understand the use of `+` for concat in libraries targeting languages that offer no alternative). I think the abuse (especially in C++ ... seriously, allowing overloading of the comma operator? --- and <iostream> working via bit-shifting streams by ${some_string} bits) gave everyone a bad taste and they kind of threw out the baby with the bathwater.
  - Oxodao 1mo ago
    php has a separate `.` operator that concatenate and you get an error if you try to do it with a `+`. That's indeed better but most of the time you concatenate with `sprintf` anyway
    - DarkUranium 1mo ago
      Yes, and it's a surprising good part about PHP (a language that otherwise has an enormous collection of warts, to put it mildly). I feel like the more dynamic and/or weakly-typed the language is, the more important it is to have a separate concat operator. The worst ones being weakly-typed and dynamic. Consider `'5' + '10'` in JavaScript vs `'5' - '10'`. I also very much dislike Python's `+` for concat, but at least it's more strongly typed. PHP, Lua, and Erlang are three examples of dynamically-typed languages with separate concat operators (`.`, `..`, `++`; respectively), and they all are better for it. That said, even statically-typed languages benefit greatly from it. Maybe if C++ had a concat operator, it'd never end up abusing `<<` for writing to a stream (yes, there's no opposite for reading, but maybe they wouldn't end up doing that in this case). For example, D uses `~` in infix for concat. Even UnrealScript, a 1990s game-engine-specific language (which tend to be a mess in general) did this right (it uses `$` or `@` --- with `a @ b` being equivalent to `a $ " " $ b`, IIRC).
  - vips7L 1mo ago
    It seems like Java is thinking about it now that Valhalla is landing and they’re expecting more user defined mathematical types.

ptx 1mo ago

Wow, their Java code example [0] makes COBOL look elegant and terse by comparison. [0] https://community.ibm.com/community/user/blogs/gregory-cernera/2026/04/07/ibm-decimal-arithmetic-library-for-java-v20-releas https://community.ibm.com/community/user/blogs/gregory-cerne...

DarkUranium 1mo ago
I know it's not the only problem (but it is IMO the main one), but this is why I'm a proponent of allowing operator overloading in languages. Yes, you can't tell at a glance if `+` really still does what it should, but I find that problem no different from a library mis-naming a function and/or said function having strange side-effects. `+` should do addition, period. No, not even concatenation if possible (I do find the lack of a separate concatenation operator to be a language flaw --- that said, I understand the use of `+` for concat in libraries targeting languages that offer no alternative). I think the abuse (especially in C++ ... seriously, allowing overloading of the comma operator? --- and <iostream> working via bit-shifting streams by ${some_string} bits) gave everyone a bad taste and they kind of threw out the baby with the bathwater.
- Oxodao 1mo ago
  php has a separate `.` operator that concatenate and you get an error if you try to do it with a `+`. That's indeed better but most of the time you concatenate with `sprintf` anyway
  - DarkUranium 1mo ago
    Yes, and it's a surprising good part about PHP (a language that otherwise has an enormous collection of warts, to put it mildly). I feel like the more dynamic and/or weakly-typed the language is, the more important it is to have a separate concat operator. The worst ones being weakly-typed and dynamic. Consider `'5' + '10'` in JavaScript vs `'5' - '10'`. I also very much dislike Python's `+` for concat, but at least it's more strongly typed. PHP, Lua, and Erlang are three examples of dynamically-typed languages with separate concat operators (`.`, `..`, `++`; respectively), and they all are better for it. That said, even statically-typed languages benefit greatly from it. Maybe if C++ had a concat operator, it'd never end up abusing `<<` for writing to a stream (yes, there's no opposite for reading, but maybe they wouldn't end up doing that in this case). For example, D uses `~` in infix for concat. Even UnrealScript, a 1990s game-engine-specific language (which tend to be a mess in general) did this right (it uses `$` or `@` --- with `a @ b` being equivalent to `a $ " " $ b`, IIRC).
- vips7L 1mo ago
  It seems like Java is thinking about it now that Valhalla is landing and they’re expecting more user defined mathematical types.