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Why the quotemarks around "migrants"? You think these people aren’t actually migrating from one country to another?
by hamper653 2mo ago
Why the quotemarks around "migrants"? You think these people aren’t actually migrating from one country to another?
- grumple 2mo agoIf you watch the videos or interviews with the “migrants”, these are clearly just agitators and looters trying to have a good time by harassing the Spanish. None of them expect to suddenly become Spanish citizens. It’s like flash mobs or organized looting we see in the US organized by social media.
- hamper653 2mo agoAre they, or are they not, foreign-born people crossing a border to settle on the other side?
- debugnik 2mo agoSee my other reply to you, most are in fact not settling.
- hamper653 2mo agoThey are not staying at least one year in Europe?
- debugnik 2mo agoMost have already returned voluntarily!
- hamper653 2mo agoOk so they are aspiring migrants.
- readthenotes1 2mo agoMostly peaceful aspiring migrants, just trying to make a better life for their children
- hamper653 2mo agoWell… yeah.
- bertylicious 2mo agoBy your definition a migrant needs to cross borders and successfully settle on the other site. What do you call the people being forced back or stuck in holding facilities and internation camps then?
- debugnik 2mo agoI'm talking exclusively about this particular breach. 48000 out of 50000 have returned voluntarily. I don't think that counts as trying, so talking about success is a category error. This was a (deadly) flash mob.
- hamper653 2mo ago> I'm talking exclusively about this particular breach. Actually OP was talking about migrants crossing from Belarus.
- grumple 2mo agoThey were there for the fun of looting and harassing the Spanish at the direction of their government, not to actually settle. I might call them agitators, raiders or invaders, not migrants.
- hamper653 2mo agoYou believe these people to be Moroccans? Really?
- grumple 2mo agoWhat conspiracy theory is this that you’re pushing that these were not Moroccans? You think there’s some other large group of people who live in Morocco and were just ready to run into Ceuta within a day of this Spanish ruling?
- hamper653 2mo ago> You think there’s some other large group of people who live in Morocco and were just ready to run into Ceuta? Morocco, being close to Spain, is a well-known hub for migrants from all over Africa hoping to make it to Europe, yes. Do you also believe that all the migrants attempting to cross the Channel from Calais are… French?
- debugnik 2mo ago48000 out of 50000 in Ceuta's breach won't be migrating actually, since they've already returned voluntarily. Most either were agitators or have realised they weren't any better off on the other side.
- hamper653 2mo agoMost have already migrated actually, unless you believe they were born in Morocco. And their intention was obviously to settle in Europe through Spain.
- fcatalan 2mo agoStop sealioning, this is simply Morocco once again using its desperate young population as pawns in their underhanded "diplomacy". Those people had no way to stay in Ceuta or travel onwards in any way, so this was just a deadly flashmob performance. Of course the whole thing does double duty in arousing fascists and racists in Spain and the EU, for which the cui prodest list is quite ample.
- hamper653 2mo agoOh so you actually believe these people were Moroccans?
- dumberquestions 2mo agoThey're quite obviously Moroccan.
- hamper653 2mo agoObviously? Morocco is a well-known hub for migrants from all over Africa who try to reach Europe, but these ones are "quite obviously" Moroccan? What makes it this obvious then?
- 2mo ago
- Almondsetat 2mo agoUntil it's proven they want to actually move there, they cannot be called migrants. In fact, 90% of them have gone back to Morocco, so not much permanence to speak of
- hamper653 2mo agoUnless they were born in Morocco, they are migrants. And why else would they move into Ceuta like this?
- defrost 2mo agoA soccer match would be a good first guess for a large surging crowd.
- hamper653 2mo ago> soccer What is that?
- defrost 2mo agoOne of the common names for Association football. As you very well know.
- hamper653 2mo ago[flagged]
- readthenotes1 2mo agoThat word doesn't mean what you think it means
- hamper653 2mo ago[flagged]
- dtagames 2mo agoGeographically, they're not. Ceuta occupies a tiny corner of Africa. None of these people reached peninsular Spain and they are not migrants fleeing into Europe to live there.
- lukan 2mo agoThey migrated to a different, country, that is part of the EU. Once they are legal there, they can move to anywhere in europe without problems.
- dtagames 1mo agoCrossing a breakwater and going home 30 minutes later does not make them legal EU immigrants. It was an overblown news story that only have been believed by someone who has never been to the region, like so much news today!
- hamper653 2mo agoMost of these people aren’t from Morocco, so they already were migrants before even making into Ceuta, which is Spain, hence yet another country.
- dtagames 1mo agoWhere did you hear that? Ceuta is entirely surrounded by Morocco and all of the people who moved into Spanish territory in Africa for 30 minutes did so by coming from Morocco. The confusion surrounding the geography there is... confusing!
- rich_sasha 2mo agoI don't know about Ceuta, but it is true Belarus has been "importing" people and forcing them to storm the Polish border, in huge numbers. It is also true that many times the Polish state has behaved inhumanely towards these people. But for sure their presence on the forester Polish-Belarussian border was an engineered hybrid warfare act, not some act of collective desperation, and it continues to this day. The poor people taking part are, I understand, often recruited in poor places and told they will be smuggled into Europe. Then they arrive in Belarus and get sandwiched between Belarusian police (KGB?) and the border, told the only way out of, effectively, Belarusian captivity, is into Poland, through the barbed wire and border patrol/army.