8 ms·

Because increasing prices by that percentage is too hard?

LordAtlas 2mo ago
They're trying their best to make it seem that government policies and regulation compliance costs are responsible, hence the names of these charges.
- ryandrake 2mo ago
  Yea, it's basically restaurant owners trying to get their customers involved in their political whining. Notice how you never see things like "Business License Fee" or "Restaurant Electricity Bill Surcharge" listed out as separate line items on customers' bills. Those are things restaurant owners have to pay, too, so why don't they get their own charges to customers? Why does only "Living Wage" get a line item on the customer's bill?
  - baq 2mo ago
    The elephant in the room would be an ‘employee salary surcharge’
  - xp84 2mo ago
    Hey now, let's not get carried away, these jackass restaurant owners want to make it clear, the "Living Wage" guilt trip is the tip part, and the fees THEY put on are to pay for "benefits like healthcare" and you're not allowed to consider it part of the tip. Nevermind that California doesn't even have a lower "tipped" min wage like some states do, so by supporting tipping, we're just saying that servers simply "deserve" more money for some reason than people who stock shelves or pick orders at Amazon or Walmart.
    - expedition32 2mo ago
      If it is hard to find staff the wages go up. At least that's how it works in my country. Although I will admit service is notoriously bad over here but in honesty that's secretly how we all want it.
    - AnthonyMouse 2mo ago
      > Nevermind that California doesn't even have a lower "tipped" min wage like some states do, so by supporting tipping, we're just saying that servers simply "deserve" more money for some reason than people who stock shelves or pick orders at Amazon or Walmart. Isn't this the thing the government is saying in California? They passed a law requiring restaurants to pay the same minimum wage as jobs where workers don't get tips, on top of the tips, essentially making it the law that people in tipped occupations have to be paid more than what can be paid to people doing any other kind of work. Unless the point is to get customers to stop tipping because a) the workers are now guaranteed the same minimum wage as anyone else even if they don't and b) they can't afford the tip on top of the prices that now have the higher minimum wage priced into them anyway.
  - robocat 2mo ago
    > Electricity Bill Surcharge "Fuel surcharge" on flights. Which should be illegal: the cost of hedging fuel cost risk should be included in any ticket price. A friend said that Uber was charging a fuel surcharge here in New Zealand, but that it wasn't passed on to the driver (who pays for the fuel). If true I would find that interesting.
    - lostlogin 2mo ago
      > A friend said that Uber was charging a fuel surcharge here in New Zealand, but that it wasn't passed on to the driver I did a bit of a dive on this and I think it’s not correct. I have a low threshold for hating them, after the reports of how females staffers were treated a few years back, but this new thing seems to be untrue. https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/128042303/uber-introduces-fuel-surcharge-citing-the-sting-of-recordhigh-prices-at-the-pump https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/128042303/uber-introduces-f...
      - robocat 2mo ago
        Great link. Sounded suss to me. Could easily have been a bullshit taxi driver, or a social outrage story. I should have tried to validate before repeating, sorry.
  - phil21 2mo ago
    > "Restaurant Electricity Bill Surcharge" Unfortunately you’ve spoken too soon on this one. I recently had an energy surcharge added due to the “Iran war” (as explained by the server) added to every check.
- SoftTalker 2mo ago
  Well, they are responsible.
fhdkweig 2mo ago
If you want to claim "we have the lowest prices in town" in advertising, you can't increase the "price".
- efreak 2mo ago
  That's why you don't say _in town_. That's verifiable and specific. You just say _lowest prices_ (nobody cares if you aren't specific), or add fine print that specifies a time/location (Amazon renewed: comparison price is the brand new version of same item on Amazon itself) or _only at $store_ (your competitors aren't participating in your branded sale).
arnarbi 2mo ago
Restaurant owners interviewed in the media here in SF are directly quoted saying they can’t do that because “customers would notice”, or think “oh that’s expensive, I can’t eat out twice a week”. These are arguments for including the fees that make the customer __still pay the same higher price__, implying that the whole point is that they won’t notice. And reporters don’t seem to even register the absurdity of those remarks or question them in any way. https://www.sfgate.com/food/article/sf-restaurants-junk-fees-law-19436419.php#:~:text=People%20will%20notice%20that. https://www.sfgate.com/food/article/sf-restaurants-junk-fees... https://www.kqed.org/news/11992412/californias-junk-fee-ban-begins-but-restaurants-get-a-pass#:~:text=You%20can%20raise%20the%20prices.%20But%20then%20we%20anticipate%20consumers%20will%20do%20what%20my%20husband%20and%20I%20do https://www.kqed.org/news/11992412/californias-junk-fee-ban-...
- sieabahlpark 2mo ago
  [dead]
- phil21 2mo ago
  It’s the same thing with any “menu” vs actual price. Airline baggage fees are probably the prototypical case for this. Airlines that did not display the lowest price during flight searches got outcompeted by those that did. This led the entire industry to change since it took an entire decade long marketing campaign centered around it (Southwest) to try to stay even. Consumers make irrational choices all the time, and this is one of them. They absolutely notice the final bill and complain while continuing to patronize businesses that engage in such behavior. Consumers would need to reward honest pricing if they wanted this to change. Or vote for regulation.
  - dzhiurgis 2mo ago
    More akin comparison would be charging for carryon vs condiments. I just did trip with family where our allowance was 8 suitcases of 184 kg total weight. Buying same on a budget carrier we used on our leg would cost more than flights itself.
  - arnarbi 2mo ago

They're trying their best to make it seem that government policies and regulation compliance costs are responsible, hence the names of these charges.

ryandrake 2mo ago
Yea, it's basically restaurant owners trying to get their customers involved in their political whining. Notice how you never see things like "Business License Fee" or "Restaurant Electricity Bill Surcharge" listed out as separate line items on customers' bills. Those are things restaurant owners have to pay, too, so why don't they get their own charges to customers? Why does only "Living Wage" get a line item on the customer's bill?
- baq 2mo ago
  The elephant in the room would be an ‘employee salary surcharge’
- xp84 2mo ago
  Hey now, let's not get carried away, these jackass restaurant owners want to make it clear, the "Living Wage" guilt trip is the tip part, and the fees THEY put on are to pay for "benefits like healthcare" and you're not allowed to consider it part of the tip. Nevermind that California doesn't even have a lower "tipped" min wage like some states do, so by supporting tipping, we're just saying that servers simply "deserve" more money for some reason than people who stock shelves or pick orders at Amazon or Walmart.
  - expedition32 2mo ago
    If it is hard to find staff the wages go up. At least that's how it works in my country. Although I will admit service is notoriously bad over here but in honesty that's secretly how we all want it.
  - AnthonyMouse 2mo ago
    > Nevermind that California doesn't even have a lower "tipped" min wage like some states do, so by supporting tipping, we're just saying that servers simply "deserve" more money for some reason than people who stock shelves or pick orders at Amazon or Walmart. Isn't this the thing the government is saying in California? They passed a law requiring restaurants to pay the same minimum wage as jobs where workers don't get tips, on top of the tips, essentially making it the law that people in tipped occupations have to be paid more than what can be paid to people doing any other kind of work. Unless the point is to get customers to stop tipping because a) the workers are now guaranteed the same minimum wage as anyone else even if they don't and b) they can't afford the tip on top of the prices that now have the higher minimum wage priced into them anyway.
- robocat 2mo ago
  > Electricity Bill Surcharge "Fuel surcharge" on flights. Which should be illegal: the cost of hedging fuel cost risk should be included in any ticket price. A friend said that Uber was charging a fuel surcharge here in New Zealand, but that it wasn't passed on to the driver (who pays for the fuel). If true I would find that interesting.
  - lostlogin 2mo ago
    > A friend said that Uber was charging a fuel surcharge here in New Zealand, but that it wasn't passed on to the driver I did a bit of a dive on this and I think it’s not correct. I have a low threshold for hating them, after the reports of how females staffers were treated a few years back, but this new thing seems to be untrue. https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/128042303/uber-introduces-fuel-surcharge-citing-the-sting-of-recordhigh-prices-at-the-pump https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/128042303/uber-introduces-f...
    - robocat 2mo ago
      Great link. Sounded suss to me. Could easily have been a bullshit taxi driver, or a social outrage story. I should have tried to validate before repeating, sorry.
- phil21 2mo ago
  > "Restaurant Electricity Bill Surcharge" Unfortunately you’ve spoken too soon on this one. I recently had an energy surcharge added due to the “Iran war” (as explained by the server) added to every check.
SoftTalker 2mo ago
Well, they are responsible.

fhdkweig 2mo ago

If you want to claim "we have the lowest prices in town" in advertising, you can't increase the "price".

efreak 2mo ago
That's why you don't say _in town_. That's verifiable and specific. You just say _lowest prices_ (nobody cares if you aren't specific), or add fine print that specifies a time/location (Amazon renewed: comparison price is the brand new version of same item on Amazon itself) or _only at $store_ (your competitors aren't participating in your branded sale).

arnarbi 2mo ago

Restaurant owners interviewed in the media here in SF are directly quoted saying they can’t do that because “customers would notice”, or think “oh that’s expensive, I can’t eat out twice a week”. These are arguments for including the fees that make the customer __still pay the same higher price__, implying that the whole point is that they won’t notice. And reporters don’t seem to even register the absurdity of those remarks or question them in any way. https://www.sfgate.com/food/article/sf-restaurants-junk-fees-law-19436419.php#:~:text=People%20will%20notice%20that. https://www.sfgate.com/food/article/sf-restaurants-junk-fees... https://www.kqed.org/news/11992412/californias-junk-fee-ban-begins-but-restaurants-get-a-pass#:~:text=You%20can%20raise%20the%20prices.%20But%20then%20we%20anticipate%20consumers%20will%20do%20what%20my%20husband%20and%20I%20do https://www.kqed.org/news/11992412/californias-junk-fee-ban-...

sieabahlpark 2mo ago
[dead]
phil21 2mo ago
It’s the same thing with any “menu” vs actual price. Airline baggage fees are probably the prototypical case for this. Airlines that did not display the lowest price during flight searches got outcompeted by those that did. This led the entire industry to change since it took an entire decade long marketing campaign centered around it (Southwest) to try to stay even. Consumers make irrational choices all the time, and this is one of them. They absolutely notice the final bill and complain while continuing to patronize businesses that engage in such behavior. Consumers would need to reward honest pricing if they wanted this to change. Or vote for regulation.
- dzhiurgis 2mo ago
  More akin comparison would be charging for carryon vs condiments. I just did trip with family where our allowance was 8 suitcases of 184 kg total weight. Buying same on a budget carrier we used on our leg would cost more than flights itself.
- arnarbi 2mo ago