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Not that I want my kids looking at porn or violent content, but I’m far more concerned about man-o-sphere influencers than that other stuff.
by kentm 3mo ago
Not that I want my kids looking at porn or violent content, but I’m far more concerned about man-o-sphere influencers than that other stuff.
- pphysch 3mo agoManosphere content is toxic and harmful but the hyperviolence and desensitisation of the former should not be downplayed. That's where the mass shooters evidently come from.
- nearlyepic 3mo ago> That's where the mass shooters evidently come from. I mean, quite a few have come from proto-manosphere circles, too. Elliot Rodger comes to mind.
- scotty79 3mo agoGiven how large it is, I don't think it's a high stat. Especially compared with other subcultures. And we don't blame feminism for every instance where a man is killed by a man hating woman.
- tsimionescu 3mo ago> And we don't blame feminism for every instance where a man is killed by a man hating woman. The fact that this is basically unheard of, while incels shooting up schools is somewhat common, may explain why blame is often thrown at one movement and not the other.
- scotty79 3mo ago[flagged]
- tsimionescu 3mo agoSo can you give an example of a crazed man-hating feminist woman engaging in a mass shooting? Or just of a woman engaging in a mass shooting (alone, not with a man) in the last, say, 10 years? 20 years? 50 years? Because I can definitely give you examples of incels doing this. Not a huge amount, mind you, but at least some.
- acdha 3mo agoThe asymmetry is striking: when feminists talk about incels, it’s about how to improve their lives and help them out of the cognitive trap they’ve fallen or been lured into. I’ve never seen the equivalent of the pervasive casual, often gleeful, calls for violence and degradation which characterize the “manosphere”.
- scotty79 3mo agoI think men hating women don't usually do mass killings. They mostly kill specific men they hate the most.
- tsimionescu 3mo agoOK, the a female serial killer, killing the men she hates the most, one after the other. Or do you just mean that some women kill a man because they hate that particular man? Because that's not what "man-hating" means. I might hate Adolf Hitler, who was a man, but that doesn't make me "a man hating man".
- mrguyorama 3mo agoHalf the country talks about feminism like it is an existential threat, including the millions upon millions of people who consume manosphere content.
- pphysch 3mo agoI wouldn't equate incel with manosphere. Manosphere is often hypersexual and about greed/consumption and being insecure and getting scammed, whereas inceldom is more hate-based.
- Balinares 3mo agoA hundred thousand furries consuming unfathomable amounts of porn without shooting up anyone kind of cast doubt about that point.
- sciencejerk 3mo agoWho is talking about furries? But Tyler James Robinson and Benjamin Jeffrey Smith. I guess that's only 2/100k to your point?
- vharish 3mo agoAnd 99 out of hundred get tired of porn at some point. We all have watched it and moved on. If only one can shoot and move on.
- Zababa 3mo ago>That's where the mass shooters evidently come from. Citation needed?
- mschuster91 3mo ago> That's where the mass shooters evidently come from. Bollocks. European teenagers watch just as much porn and play GTA at age 10 and yet we don't end up having 12 children a day die from gun violence [1]. Note, I'm not an anti-gun nut, I think German and British anti-gun laws are ridiculously strict. But the American way of dealing with guns is equally bad. [1] https://www.sandyhookpromise.org/resources/gun-violence-facts/ https://www.sandyhookpromise.org/resources/gun-violence-fact...
- technothrasher 3mo ago> we don't end up having 12 children a day die from gun violence Note that this definition of "children" includes ages up 24 years old. Not that the US doesn't have a gun violence problem, but pretending 24 year olds are "children" in order to gain a better sound bite doesn't help anybody.
- imtringued 3mo agoIf you look at the actual statistics there are 1300 annual homicides killing children which amounts to 3.5 children + teenagers a day. Then there are gun suicides which I would not count as gun violence, amounting to another 3.5 children + teenagers a day.
- sciencejerk 3mo agoI had to Google "man-o-sphere". Is it particularly more dangerous or toxic than other identity-based activist communities? Genuinely curious to know
- grey-area 3mo agoYes, a lot of it involves denigrating women and an entitled and very rigid attitude towards the male place in society (alphas etc). This is incredibly toxic for young men growing up and the women they interact with. Some of the more prominent proponents are actual pimps (the Tate brothers).
- elcritch 3mo agoHow is that different than pervasive pornography though? Many young boys now think it’s normal to ask girls for sexual acts before having ever kissed a girl.
- khalic 3mo agoSeems like they could use some sex ed courses
- squidbeak 3mo ago> Many young boys now think it’s normal to ask girls for sexual acts before having ever kissed a girl. This is a common media talking point, but are there any hard figures for this 'many'? The type you're describing existed when I was young, long before the internet. My impression of boys and young men today is that they are generally just as decent, cautious, respectful and idealistic as they ever were - but that a small crude and unpleasant minority taints the reputation of the whole generation.
- elcritch 3mo agoI don't think it's a "reputation" issue, more of a what they're being exposed to and what it's normalizing. From studies I've seen it's a significant percentage (from a random Google search [1]): The review talked to young people aged 13 to 19 and surveyed 1,000 young people aged 16 to 21. Over 6 in 10 (64%) said they had seen online pornography. Of these: 1 in 10 (10%) of nine-year-olds had seen pornography 3 in 10 (27%) of children had seen pornography by age 11 Half (50%) of children had seen it by age 13 4 in 5 (79%) had seen violent pornography before the age of 18, with the report stating “young people are frequently exposed to violent pornography, depicting coercive, degrading or pain-inducing sex acts”. 1: https://www.fpa.org.uk/rshe-for-teachers/uk-online-child-sex-abuse-and-sexual-harassment-statistics/ https://www.fpa.org.uk/rshe-for-teachers/uk-online-child-sex...
- lo_zamoyski 3mo agoThe "man-o-sphere" is pornographic. Look at the porn-brained Tate brothers for an example. That is their whole ethos and their souls are rotted out by it. Both are based in dehumanization and contempt for women and draws from the well of insecurity, viciousness, and psychological disorder. Both entrench and deepen psychological disorder and immorality. I think the basic error is that we're making a concession to obscene content and the sophists in our midst who have spent decades deploying the garbage of moral relativism and fallacious appeals to "freedom" to defend evil. The argument for age verification here is weakened if, instead, the production and distribution of pornography is outlawed. That you cannot perfectly enforce the law doesn't mean the law has no value or function. The purpose of the law is not undermined by imperfect enforcement, and it isn't exhausted by enforceability. Law is a teacher. Anti-porn laws would still carry psychological and social weight. They are a declaration of what is not tolerated and what is not good and contributes to the stigmatization of bad things. That creates a higher hurdle in people's minds to seek out and engage in such activity and creates shame around such activities that itself dissuades. I would also add that pornography and drugs have a history of being used in psychological warfare. Oligarchs ruining society? Allow pornography and it will absorb people's attention and cripple them emotionally and rationally to neutralize them. Or consider the recent loosening of drug laws or debate about loosing them - which I do not accept is coincidental - to give people another dulling and numbing agent and an escape. It is in the corrupt interests of an oligarchic elite to corral the herd. The police baton is painful and creates a dangerous indignation and resentment, but pornography and drugs do not.
- nerdsniper 3mo agoSo, re-instate the Hays Code, essentially? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hays_Code https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hays_Code