6 ms·

I know absolutely nothing about Mexico in terms of geography or driving so I wonder how feasible an EV that you presumably constantly have to charge is going to

I know absolutely nothing about Mexico in terms of geography or driving so I wonder how feasible an EV that you presumably constantly have to charge is going to fare. In the US, a range of 77 miles is a complete non starter. You'd have to charge it every single day. If not multiple times a day in some peoples cases. It's interesting that info about the car is only half the article. The other half is a commentary on how US politicians are desperately trying to keep foreign EVs out of the country, lest it hurt corporate profits.

phildenhoff 3mo ago
If you have a charger at home, or at work, why does it matter if you have to charge it daily or weekly? Yes, for some lifestyles, range matters. For others, a 125 km range is perfectly acceptable
- HeyLaughingBoy 3mo ago
  For a significant segment of the US population, that thing wouldn't get them to work and back, so they'd have to charge it both at home and at work. And in many cases, forget running any errands, picking up kids from daycare, etc. And minimum speed on US interstates is typically 40mph, so that reduces its usability even more.
  - phildenhoff 3mo ago
    I don't think this car is designed for them, similar to how trucks are not designed for urban areas. Not every car has to cater to every demographic.
    - HeyLaughingBoy 3mo ago
      People move around: that's what cars are for. Trucks may not be "designed for urban areas" (whatever that means), but they certainly go into them on a daily basis.
  - applfanboysbgon 3mo ago
    I think you wildly overestimate how many Americans are white-collar workers commuting 100 miles to a 6-figure job. A <$10k EV was never even remotely aiming at that market to begin with.
    - HeyLaughingBoy 3mo ago
      With a range of 77 miles, I wouldn't make it to work and back. Everyone I know (yes, it's anecdotal, but a widely-shared one) has to commute on roads where the average speed is well above 30mph. This is a non-starter for the US.
      - deleted 3mo ago
        [deleted]
  - thelastgallon 3mo ago
    28% of trips are under a mile, 52% under three, 64% under five, 79% under ten, 93% under twenty-five, and 98% under 50 miles. Only 0.8% of the trips are over 100 miles! > For a significant segment of the US population, that thing wouldn't get them to work and back 0.8% is not significant.
  - rsynnott 3mo ago
    > For a significant segment of the US population, that thing wouldn't get them to work and back, so they'd have to charge it both at home and at work. What does 'significant' mean here? I find it hard to imagine that a _large_ number of people have a round-trip of like 100km to work; that would be horrendous.
    - HeyLaughingBoy 3mo ago
      Really? that's a bit over 30 miles each way. It doesn't sound at all unusual to me.
apparent 3mo ago
> In the US, a range of 77 miles is a complete non starter. You'd have to charge it every single day. If not multiple times a day in some peoples cases. It's true that some people drive more than 77 miles per day. But a pretty big chunk of people never do, except road trips/vacations. It could easily be worth it to buy a cheap EV for everyday use and then rent a vehicle for long trips.
- degenerate 3mo ago
  exactly - the rejection of short range EVs was when they cost as much as a normal car if the short range EV is now much cheaper, people will adapt to the restriction because it's an affordable option
  - SoftTalker 3mo ago
    Would have to be very affordable. Like well under $10K. Otherwise I'll just buy a used ICE vehicle and have a lot more flexibility in how I use it.
    - jbm 3mo ago
      Even Cargo Bicycles cost more than $10k. I think a 6 seater people mover is worth far more than those. I'd buy a 6 seater with this range but not with the speed limitations (I think it is like 50-60 kph which is a non starter)
      - BenjiWiebe 3mo ago
        You can buy used ICE cars for $10k easy. Like really really easy. Apologies if I missed your point.
  - apparent 3mo ago
    Yep, you can pick up used Leafs for super cheap (under $10k, sometimes substantially) and if they fit your use case, they're an amazing deal. Mostly helpful as a second car for a family, or as a city car for someone who never plans to road trip in it.
floxy 3mo ago
>charge it every single day. That's pretty much standard operating procedure for any EV. That's one of the perks of owning an EV. Plug it in when you get home from work, and have a full "tank" every morning. Plus you get the cabin preheating using the wall electricity.
loloquwowndueo 3mo ago
> I know absolutely nothing about Mexico in terms of geography or driving so I wonder how feasible an EV that you presumably constantly have to charge is going to fare. Hey at least you admitted that upfront. Average driving speed in Mexico City is 15 km/h so one would have to spend 8h driving to deplete the battery in a day. Typical commutes are perhaps 1h one-way but again, distance wise probably only about 40 km both ways. So this 125km range easily covers it for most people. I think energy cost is more of an issue for most. electricity is expensive in Mexico City especially compared to base salaries. And electrical infrastructure was never built to handle high power consumption. Most apartments have a single 30A breaker for the entire house. Most heating is done by gas and air conditioning is not widely used. For most people charging speed will likely be limited to about 10A at 120V.
thelastgallon 3mo ago
28% of trips are under a mile, 52% under three, 64% under five, 79% under ten, 93% under twenty-five, and 98% under 50 miles.
- gwbas1c 3mo ago
  This is the kind of misleading fact that motivated me to make my post. (Former 2014 Leaf leaseholder.) Americans buy the car for the 1% trips. In my case, most of my car trips are short, but most of my milage is from long-range trips. What's more informative is this post that explains Mexican driving behavior: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48634740 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48634740
  - rsynnott 3mo ago
    > Americans buy the car for the 1% trips. In my case, most of my car trips are short, but most of my milage is from long-range trips. How many of these long trips are you making? Depending on number might be more economical just to rent for that.
    - gwbas1c 3mo ago
      At least once a week. I commute 120 miles round trip one day a week, 180 miles 1-2 times a month, and 300+ miles 6-10 times a year. I also have 3 kids, a dog, and don't live near a city. If I lived in a city dogless and childless something like Zipcar would make much more sense. BTW: The "transaction cost" (time) of frequent car rentals is a non-starter. One of the things I hate about renting a car is that every time it's a different car, some I like, some I don't. I just want to pick out a car I like, have it ready when I need it, have it set up the way I like it, and have my "box of crap" in the trunk where I know where it is. I don't want to navigate through a young ambitious salesperson trying to sell insurance, or the AI car scanner charging me hallucinated wear and tear.
thelastgallon 3mo ago
> You'd have to charge it every single day. If not multiple times a day in some peoples cases. Charging is not a problem when a car is stationary. It is parked next to a building, building usually has electricity (unless you are Amish). I don't know why most people don't understand electricity is available everywhere, but petrol is only available at gas stations. You have to somewhere to pump gas, a major inconvenience.

phildenhoff 3mo ago

If you have a charger at home, or at work, why does it matter if you have to charge it daily or weekly? Yes, for some lifestyles, range matters. For others, a 125 km range is perfectly acceptable

HeyLaughingBoy 3mo ago
For a significant segment of the US population, that thing wouldn't get them to work and back, so they'd have to charge it both at home and at work. And in many cases, forget running any errands, picking up kids from daycare, etc. And minimum speed on US interstates is typically 40mph, so that reduces its usability even more.
- phildenhoff 3mo ago
  I don't think this car is designed for them, similar to how trucks are not designed for urban areas. Not every car has to cater to every demographic.
  - HeyLaughingBoy 3mo ago
    People move around: that's what cars are for. Trucks may not be "designed for urban areas" (whatever that means), but they certainly go into them on a daily basis.
- applfanboysbgon 3mo ago
  I think you wildly overestimate how many Americans are white-collar workers commuting 100 miles to a 6-figure job. A <$10k EV was never even remotely aiming at that market to begin with.
  - HeyLaughingBoy 3mo ago
    With a range of 77 miles, I wouldn't make it to work and back. Everyone I know (yes, it's anecdotal, but a widely-shared one) has to commute on roads where the average speed is well above 30mph. This is a non-starter for the US.
    - deleted 3mo ago
      [deleted]
- thelastgallon 3mo ago
  28% of trips are under a mile, 52% under three, 64% under five, 79% under ten, 93% under twenty-five, and 98% under 50 miles. Only 0.8% of the trips are over 100 miles! > For a significant segment of the US population, that thing wouldn't get them to work and back 0.8% is not significant.
- rsynnott 3mo ago
  > For a significant segment of the US population, that thing wouldn't get them to work and back, so they'd have to charge it both at home and at work. What does 'significant' mean here? I find it hard to imagine that a _large_ number of people have a round-trip of like 100km to work; that would be horrendous.
  - HeyLaughingBoy 3mo ago
    Really? that's a bit over 30 miles each way. It doesn't sound at all unusual to me.

apparent 3mo ago

> In the US, a range of 77 miles is a complete non starter. You'd have to charge it every single day. If not multiple times a day in some peoples cases. It's true that some people drive more than 77 miles per day. But a pretty big chunk of people never do, except road trips/vacations. It could easily be worth it to buy a cheap EV for everyday use and then rent a vehicle for long trips.

degenerate 3mo ago
exactly - the rejection of short range EVs was when they cost as much as a normal car if the short range EV is now much cheaper, people will adapt to the restriction because it's an affordable option
- SoftTalker 3mo ago
  Would have to be very affordable. Like well under $10K. Otherwise I'll just buy a used ICE vehicle and have a lot more flexibility in how I use it.
  - jbm 3mo ago
    Even Cargo Bicycles cost more than $10k. I think a 6 seater people mover is worth far more than those. I'd buy a 6 seater with this range but not with the speed limitations (I think it is like 50-60 kph which is a non starter)
    - BenjiWiebe 3mo ago
      You can buy used ICE cars for $10k easy. Like really really easy. Apologies if I missed your point.
- apparent 3mo ago
  Yep, you can pick up used Leafs for super cheap (under $10k, sometimes substantially) and if they fit your use case, they're an amazing deal. Mostly helpful as a second car for a family, or as a city car for someone who never plans to road trip in it.

floxy 3mo ago

>charge it every single day. That's pretty much standard operating procedure for any EV. That's one of the perks of owning an EV. Plug it in when you get home from work, and have a full "tank" every morning. Plus you get the cabin preheating using the wall electricity.

loloquwowndueo 3mo ago

> I know absolutely nothing about Mexico in terms of geography or driving so I wonder how feasible an EV that you presumably constantly have to charge is going to fare. Hey at least you admitted that upfront. Average driving speed in Mexico City is 15 km/h so one would have to spend 8h driving to deplete the battery in a day. Typical commutes are perhaps 1h one-way but again, distance wise probably only about 40 km both ways. So this 125km range easily covers it for most people. I think energy cost is more of an issue for most. electricity is expensive in Mexico City especially compared to base salaries. And electrical infrastructure was never built to handle high power consumption. Most apartments have a single 30A breaker for the entire house. Most heating is done by gas and air conditioning is not widely used. For most people charging speed will likely be limited to about 10A at 120V.

thelastgallon 3mo ago

28% of trips are under a mile, 52% under three, 64% under five, 79% under ten, 93% under twenty-five, and 98% under 50 miles.

gwbas1c 3mo ago
This is the kind of misleading fact that motivated me to make my post. (Former 2014 Leaf leaseholder.) Americans buy the car for the 1% trips. In my case, most of my car trips are short, but most of my milage is from long-range trips. What's more informative is this post that explains Mexican driving behavior: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48634740 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48634740
- rsynnott 3mo ago
  > Americans buy the car for the 1% trips. In my case, most of my car trips are short, but most of my milage is from long-range trips. How many of these long trips are you making? Depending on number might be more economical just to rent for that.
  - gwbas1c 3mo ago
    At least once a week. I commute 120 miles round trip one day a week, 180 miles 1-2 times a month, and 300+ miles 6-10 times a year. I also have 3 kids, a dog, and don't live near a city. If I lived in a city dogless and childless something like Zipcar would make much more sense. BTW: The "transaction cost" (time) of frequent car rentals is a non-starter. One of the things I hate about renting a car is that every time it's a different car, some I like, some I don't. I just want to pick out a car I like, have it ready when I need it, have it set up the way I like it, and have my "box of crap" in the trunk where I know where it is. I don't want to navigate through a young ambitious salesperson trying to sell insurance, or the AI car scanner charging me hallucinated wear and tear.

thelastgallon 3mo ago

> You'd have to charge it every single day. If not multiple times a day in some peoples cases. Charging is not a problem when a car is stationary. It is parked next to a building, building usually has electricity (unless you are Amish). I don't know why most people don't understand electricity is available everywhere, but petrol is only available at gas stations. You have to somewhere to pump gas, a major inconvenience.