7 ms·

I wish other car makers were as reasonable as Honda here. No "evil valet" with half a brain cell would waste time hacking the head unit if they have physical a

I wish other car makers were as reasonable as Honda here. No "evil valet" with half a brain cell would waste time hacking the head unit if they have physical access to the car. They would simply hide a spying device somewhere in the car. Not to mention that people with Civics are never targets of three letter agencies.

saaaaaam 3mo ago
Not sure if you’re being sarcastic/satirical or not. If you are, fine. But if you’re not - why would someone driving a civic not be a target of an intelligence agency? It’s one of the most common cars about there, so if you want to fade into the background it’s a perfect car. Also, lots of otherwise “normal” people - scientists, engineers, journalists, lawyers - likely drive Honda civics. A spying device hidden in the car may be found. Something installed directly within the car’s firmware is somewhat less likely to be found.
- drew870mitchell 3mo ago
  Whenever we get to talking about three letter agencies, i wish people spent more time thinking about their threat model. Is the TLA surveilling me because they're broadly interested in everybody? OK then, the return on investment isn't there to pull an evil maid attack on public randos. If the TLA is interested in you because of who you specifically are, the average individual can't begin to plug all the possible holes in their lives. As a Honda owner (but the kind the company probably doesn't really really love since i'm still driving a 2006) i actually think it's better for the long haul that their cars are hackable given physical possession.
  - saaaaaam 3mo ago
    I wasn’t making any comment on whether cars should be hackable or not, simply that saying “people with Civics are never targets of three letter agencies” is a little silly.
  - rangestransform 3mo ago
    Everyone should have security robust against nation-state actors by default in the most popular consumer products, so that people who need it can hide in the masses. I hope LLM-assisted “offensive security research” makes insecure software fully unusable so that companies finally take security seriously.
newsclues 3mo ago
You think there isn’t some boring scientist or engineer with classified access who doesn’t drive a boring civic to work?
- nick__m 3mo ago
  [flagged]
  - newsclues 3mo ago
    Because he’s talking to himself about work.
    - qingcharles 3mo ago
      Or he's calling his mistress/lover from the safety of his car and now he's open to blackmail.
  - fireflash38 3mo ago
    Why not when it's so trivial?
bri3d 3mo ago
I'm hoping this comment is a joke? It's kind of nonsensical. > I wish other car makers were as reasonable as Honda here. I doubt they did this on purpose. > No "evil valet" with half a brain cell would waste time hacking the head unit if they have physical access to the car. Keep in mind that head units usually also contain historic data; stuff like left-over synced phone contacts in SQLite databases, historic location data collected either explicitly for telemetry or accidentally in log files etc. Additionally, head units usually have access to a lot of internal buses in a car; depending on manufacturer there's sometimes some level of firewalling effort, for example through a Gateway module, but these firewalls are usually quite weak when they are present at all (see: the famous thing with Honda unlock and starter release working with no cryptographic material through the same CAN bus as the headlights). This means that the infotainment can usually control some part of the car, and is much more powerful than a tracking device. Plus, implanting code (or just extracting the data that's already there) from a head unit leaves much less evidence than adding an additional tracker. > Not to mention that people with Civics are never targets of three letter agencies. ???
- SoftTalker 3mo ago
  > ??? People who drive Civics are boring, normal people with boring, normal lives. Not of any interest to the NSA.
  - cardiffspaceman 3mo ago
    The question marks are because it’s practically a trope that the most interesting subjects disguise their importance by driving Civics and such.
    - ErroneousBosh 3mo ago
      Literally a plot point in Breaking Bad.
  - bravetraveler 3mo ago
    That's what Civic-driving people who are of interest to The Agency would say :)

saaaaaam 3mo ago

Not sure if you’re being sarcastic/satirical or not. If you are, fine. But if you’re not - why would someone driving a civic not be a target of an intelligence agency? It’s one of the most common cars about there, so if you want to fade into the background it’s a perfect car. Also, lots of otherwise “normal” people - scientists, engineers, journalists, lawyers - likely drive Honda civics. A spying device hidden in the car may be found. Something installed directly within the car’s firmware is somewhat less likely to be found.

drew870mitchell 3mo ago
Whenever we get to talking about three letter agencies, i wish people spent more time thinking about their threat model. Is the TLA surveilling me because they're broadly interested in everybody? OK then, the return on investment isn't there to pull an evil maid attack on public randos. If the TLA is interested in you because of who you specifically are, the average individual can't begin to plug all the possible holes in their lives. As a Honda owner (but the kind the company probably doesn't really really love since i'm still driving a 2006) i actually think it's better for the long haul that their cars are hackable given physical possession.
- saaaaaam 3mo ago
  I wasn’t making any comment on whether cars should be hackable or not, simply that saying “people with Civics are never targets of three letter agencies” is a little silly.
- rangestransform 3mo ago
  Everyone should have security robust against nation-state actors by default in the most popular consumer products, so that people who need it can hide in the masses. I hope LLM-assisted “offensive security research” makes insecure software fully unusable so that companies finally take security seriously.

newsclues 3mo ago

You think there isn’t some boring scientist or engineer with classified access who doesn’t drive a boring civic to work?

nick__m 3mo ago
[flagged]
- newsclues 3mo ago
  Because he’s talking to himself about work.
  - qingcharles 3mo ago
    Or he's calling his mistress/lover from the safety of his car and now he's open to blackmail.
- fireflash38 3mo ago
  Why not when it's so trivial?

bri3d 3mo ago

I'm hoping this comment is a joke? It's kind of nonsensical. > I wish other car makers were as reasonable as Honda here. I doubt they did this on purpose. > No "evil valet" with half a brain cell would waste time hacking the head unit if they have physical access to the car. Keep in mind that head units usually also contain historic data; stuff like left-over synced phone contacts in SQLite databases, historic location data collected either explicitly for telemetry or accidentally in log files etc. Additionally, head units usually have access to a lot of internal buses in a car; depending on manufacturer there's sometimes some level of firewalling effort, for example through a Gateway module, but these firewalls are usually quite weak when they are present at all (see: the famous thing with Honda unlock and starter release working with no cryptographic material through the same CAN bus as the headlights). This means that the infotainment can usually control some part of the car, and is much more powerful than a tracking device. Plus, implanting code (or just extracting the data that's already there) from a head unit leaves much less evidence than adding an additional tracker. > Not to mention that people with Civics are never targets of three letter agencies. ???

SoftTalker 3mo ago
> ??? People who drive Civics are boring, normal people with boring, normal lives. Not of any interest to the NSA.
- cardiffspaceman 3mo ago
  The question marks are because it’s practically a trope that the most interesting subjects disguise their importance by driving Civics and such.
  - ErroneousBosh 3mo ago
    Literally a plot point in Breaking Bad.
- bravetraveler 3mo ago
  That's what Civic-driving people who are of interest to The Agency would say :)