14 ms·

This is simply not correct. Very few "cops" in the US can go to any kind of secret courts. Also, what you're describing is still infinitely better than the Eur

by _osud 6mo ago

This is simply not correct. Very few "cops" in the US can go to any kind of secret courts. Also, what you're describing is still infinitely better than the European system! The cops get to issue the warrants themselves.

generic92034 6mo ago
With any number of intelligence services in the USA I would not really be calmed by the prospect that an ordinary cop cannot do that. What you are claiming about European cops is also not uniformly true. A German police officer cannot "just" self-issue a search warrant.
- _osud 6mo ago
  >What you are claiming about European cops is also not uniformly true. A German police officer cannot "just" self-issue a search warrant. Yes. The more worrying situation is that Hungary can just decide that their police officers can self-issue search warrants, and then send those around the EU in the form of EIOs.
  - generic92034 6mo ago
    This is more of a theoretical concern, though.
    - _osud 6mo ago
      [dead]
      - generic92034 6mo ago
        That delay is concerning, obviously. But how should we judge that, without any further insights? However, usually it works more like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carles_Puigdemont#Arrest_in_Germany https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carles_Puigdemont#Arrest_in_Ge... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carles_Puigdemont#Arrest_in_Italy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carles_Puigdemont#Arrest_in_It... Usually LE in European countries will not respect warrants from another country if it does not make sense in the local jurisdiction as well.
        _osud 6mo ago
        Germany agreed to extradite Puigdemont, Spain did not want him. Perhaps because they wouldn't have been able to prosecute him for rebellion? Rebellion is not one of the EAW listed offenses, so it would require German approval. Same is not true for most crimes. Italy? I assume the prosecutor there told the Spanish there's no way the Rebellion will stick, and the Spanish told the Italians to just drop it. I assume they'll keep him listed on the SIS in case they get a hit in some friendlier jurisdiction. >Usually LE in European countries will not respect warrants from another country if it does not make sense in the local jurisdiction as well. This is incorrect and goes explicitly against the intent of the relevant frameworks.
        generic92034 6mo ago
        Sorry, but you should really read the links: "On 5 April 2018, the Oberlandesgericht (Higher State Court) in the German state of Schleswig-Holstein ruled that Puigdemont would not be extradited on charges of rebellion, and released him on bail while deliberating about the extradition on charges of misuse of public funds." So, exactly as I wrote: The rebellion charge did not make sense to the court, so no extradition due to that. On the other hand they found that they could do something with the charges of misusing public funds (and thus needed longer to decide about it). If Spain had not dropped the EAW, Puigdemont's legal team would have had an opportunity to challenge any decisions of the court. In general it is no fun if another EU country issues an EAW against you, but anything making no sense will be thrown out by the local EU country's courts and you have every chance to go against the decisions of the court.
        _osud 6mo ago
        >Sorry, but you should really read the links: That's rather rude of you, I did in fact read the entire text of the link. I hate citing wikipedia, but if you'll skip forward a few lines, you'll find this nugget: "On 12 July 2018 the higher court in Schleswig-Holstein confirmed that Puigdemont could not be extradited by the crime of rebellion, but may still be extradited based on charges of misuse of public funds" Puigdemont would have almost certainly ended up extradited, but he would enjoy the EAW protections which would presumably not be desirable for the Spanish government.

by _osud 6mo ago

generic92034 6mo ago

With any number of intelligence services in the USA I would not really be calmed by the prospect that an ordinary cop cannot do that. What you are claiming about European cops is also not uniformly true. A German police officer cannot "just" self-issue a search warrant.

_osud 6mo ago
>What you are claiming about European cops is also not uniformly true. A German police officer cannot "just" self-issue a search warrant. Yes. The more worrying situation is that Hungary can just decide that their police officers can self-issue search warrants, and then send those around the EU in the form of EIOs.
- generic92034 6mo ago
  This is more of a theoretical concern, though.
  - _osud 6mo ago
    [dead]
    - generic92034 6mo ago
      That delay is concerning, obviously. But how should we judge that, without any further insights? However, usually it works more like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carles_Puigdemont#Arrest_in_Germany https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carles_Puigdemont#Arrest_in_Ge... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carles_Puigdemont#Arrest_in_Italy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carles_Puigdemont#Arrest_in_It... Usually LE in European countries will not respect warrants from another country if it does not make sense in the local jurisdiction as well.
      - _osud 6mo ago
        Germany agreed to extradite Puigdemont, Spain did not want him. Perhaps because they wouldn't have been able to prosecute him for rebellion? Rebellion is not one of the EAW listed offenses, so it would require German approval. Same is not true for most crimes. Italy? I assume the prosecutor there told the Spanish there's no way the Rebellion will stick, and the Spanish told the Italians to just drop it. I assume they'll keep him listed on the SIS in case they get a hit in some friendlier jurisdiction. >Usually LE in European countries will not respect warrants from another country if it does not make sense in the local jurisdiction as well. This is incorrect and goes explicitly against the intent of the relevant frameworks.
        generic92034 6mo ago
        Sorry, but you should really read the links: "On 5 April 2018, the Oberlandesgericht (Higher State Court) in the German state of Schleswig-Holstein ruled that Puigdemont would not be extradited on charges of rebellion, and released him on bail while deliberating about the extradition on charges of misuse of public funds." So, exactly as I wrote: The rebellion charge did not make sense to the court, so no extradition due to that. On the other hand they found that they could do something with the charges of misusing public funds (and thus needed longer to decide about it). If Spain had not dropped the EAW, Puigdemont's legal team would have had an opportunity to challenge any decisions of the court. In general it is no fun if another EU country issues an EAW against you, but anything making no sense will be thrown out by the local EU country's courts and you have every chance to go against the decisions of the court.
        _osud 6mo ago
        >Sorry, but you should really read the links: That's rather rude of you, I did in fact read the entire text of the link. I hate citing wikipedia, but if you'll skip forward a few lines, you'll find this nugget: "On 12 July 2018 the higher court in Schleswig-Holstein confirmed that Puigdemont could not be extradited by the crime of rebellion, but may still be extradited based on charges of misuse of public funds" Puigdemont would have almost certainly ended up extradited, but he would enjoy the EAW protections which would presumably not be desirable for the Spanish government.