23 ms·

I am waiting for someone to build this for Neovim. Come on, you unknown hero! (and thanks to the Zed team and Google for building the spec)

by mg74 11mo ago

xenodium 11mo ago
Swing by the Emacs side ;) We got vim bindings too!
- tjpnz 11mo ago
  You can learn Emacs in one day. Every day!
  - theflyinghorse 11mo ago
    I've spent 2 month trying out emacs and I feel like I sort of scratched the surface. It's like the deeper you look the more you realize how much more there is
    - mimischi 11mo ago
      My biggest revelation was when I realized how to use Emacs to learn about Emacs. Knowing where to look up function, variable definitions etc was an eye opener in my understanding of how things work and are piped together
      - hbogert 11mo ago
        There was a time when this was the obvious thing to do when making systems. Sadly that's forgotten. Manpages to read on cli tooling is the same thing of course. Yet people rather go to another window, the browser, and go to a ad-driven website and get the same output as the manpage would give.
        koiueo 11mo ago
        These days people rather switch to a browser window, open an LLM of their choice in a new tab and in verbose English ask "how do I do X in this popular program Y?". Then get a hallucinated answer and come to you to complain about a missing cli option, while it's literally there, in their terminal, just one -h away. True story (had to vent out, thanks for listening).
        neutronicus 11mo ago
        Hey, now. When I want to ask an LLM how to do something in emacs I `SPC $ g g` and ask it in a gptel buffer.
        iLemming 11mo ago
        The only 2¢ I can add here is that LLMs are surprisingly good for solving tasks that involve Elisp. There's large corpus of Emacs Lisp in the wild - the amount of it on GitHub alone is shocking. For comparison - whenever I try using a model to write some Neovim config stuff, LLMs hallucinate badly. Using Emacs these days is so much fun - you just ask a model and you can immediately try things - not only without restarting - you don't even have to save anything, anywhere. You can even make Emacs do things that involve tools and languages that have nothing to do with elisp, e.g., "write elisp that would open all nested dirs in a given folder, and then run magit-log for each project, searching for specific pattern... and if found, issue npm or uv pip install with arguments...", etc.
        neutronicus 11mo ago
        This matches my experience as well. I'm a Spacemacs user, and Claude knows the difference between Spacemacs and stock emacs. It basically wrote tools for itself to hook into the emacs LSP package and look up C++ code (in our codebase, which is, uh, challenging for FOSS language servers) from gptel. I was completely fucking unable to do this via publicly-available MCP servers in the VSCode agent mode. In general I have been able to resolve a bunch of niggling config issues that I had just been ignoring in favor of doing Actual Work. As you said, I can evaluate the elisp Claude wrote right there in the gptel buffer, try it out, and iterate before actually pasting it into .spacemacs. It it doesn't work, Claude knows a ton of debugging tricks I can try. trace-function, advice to dump a backtrace, etc. It knows how to do everything in org-mode. Super helpful. Way better than the AI Assistant that my employer bundles with our product (which is outperformed by the Google AI Overview).
    - iLemming 11mo ago
      I think the problem that most beginners try to explore the editor features, instead of focusing on main fundamental truth about Emacs - it's not just an editor, it's a Lisp system with a built-in editor. I think focusing on understanding how Lisp drives Emacs can remarkably speed up the pace of learning it. Every key press and button click hooks up to a Lisp function. Even complex keyboard macros translate to Lisp command sequences. 1. Figure out structural editing commands to move s-expressions freely - those parens only feel annoying initially, later they become friendly. 2. Understand REPL-driven development - any expression can be evaled in-place. 3. Try the build-in profiler. 4. Learn the debugger. 5. Use the describe- commands. Emacs can "describe" to you every key, function, command, symbol, input methods, themes, fonts, characters, etc. Emacs is really not about "what it can or cannot do" in general sense. It's all about "what you can do with it". Learn some basic elisp - and you will be able to achieve a lot.
      - BeetleB 11mo ago
        I'm going to give a counterpoint to this (common) take. I was an Emacs power user for almost a decade before I learned Emacs Lisp. I knew just the bare minimum to populate my .emacs file, and occasionally copied others' config snippets. No need to rush into learning Elisp.
        iLemming 11mo ago
        You just unironically proved my point. Who's got a decade to spare, when they can wield the power in just a couple of months?
        BeetleB 11mo ago
        > Who's got a decade to spare, when they can wield the power in just a couple of months? I was a power user within months - a year tops. I didn't say it took me 10 years to become a power user. Ever since I learned Elisp (it's been many years), I wouldn't say my expertise and abilities has grown exponentially. It is merely an incremental improvement. It definitely is nice that I can now code away annoyances, but it's not the game changer people make it out to be.
    - mijoharas 11mo ago
      Im going on a decade now, and there's always still more (in a good way)!
  - xenodium 11mo ago
    Hey I know where that’s from! As an Emacs user, his video was very funny https://youtu.be/urcL86UpqZc?si=Jhqiy1yCXDGHoIoS https://youtu.be/urcL86UpqZc?si=Jhqiy1yCXDGHoIoS
bengillies 11mo ago
Code Companion for neovim has supported ACP for a while now See https://agentclientprotocol.com/overview/clients https://agentclientprotocol.com/overview/clients

I am waiting for someone to build this for Neovim. Come on, you unknown hero! (and thanks to the Zed team and Google for building the spec)

by mg74 11mo ago

I am waiting for someone to build this for Neovim. Come on, you unknown hero! (and thanks to the Zed team and Google for building the spec)

xenodium 11mo ago

Swing by the Emacs side ;) We got vim bindings too!

tjpnz 11mo ago
You can learn Emacs in one day. Every day!
- theflyinghorse 11mo ago
  I've spent 2 month trying out emacs and I feel like I sort of scratched the surface. It's like the deeper you look the more you realize how much more there is
  - mimischi 11mo ago
    My biggest revelation was when I realized how to use Emacs to learn about Emacs. Knowing where to look up function, variable definitions etc was an eye opener in my understanding of how things work and are piped together
    - hbogert 11mo ago
      There was a time when this was the obvious thing to do when making systems. Sadly that's forgotten. Manpages to read on cli tooling is the same thing of course. Yet people rather go to another window, the browser, and go to a ad-driven website and get the same output as the manpage would give.
      - koiueo 11mo ago
        These days people rather switch to a browser window, open an LLM of their choice in a new tab and in verbose English ask "how do I do X in this popular program Y?". Then get a hallucinated answer and come to you to complain about a missing cli option, while it's literally there, in their terminal, just one -h away. True story (had to vent out, thanks for listening).
        neutronicus 11mo ago
        Hey, now. When I want to ask an LLM how to do something in emacs I `SPC $ g g` and ask it in a gptel buffer.
        iLemming 11mo ago
        The only 2¢ I can add here is that LLMs are surprisingly good for solving tasks that involve Elisp. There's large corpus of Emacs Lisp in the wild - the amount of it on GitHub alone is shocking. For comparison - whenever I try using a model to write some Neovim config stuff, LLMs hallucinate badly. Using Emacs these days is so much fun - you just ask a model and you can immediately try things - not only without restarting - you don't even have to save anything, anywhere. You can even make Emacs do things that involve tools and languages that have nothing to do with elisp, e.g., "write elisp that would open all nested dirs in a given folder, and then run magit-log for each project, searching for specific pattern... and if found, issue npm or uv pip install with arguments...", etc.
        neutronicus 11mo ago
        This matches my experience as well. I'm a Spacemacs user, and Claude knows the difference between Spacemacs and stock emacs. It basically wrote tools for itself to hook into the emacs LSP package and look up C++ code (in our codebase, which is, uh, challenging for FOSS language servers) from gptel. I was completely fucking unable to do this via publicly-available MCP servers in the VSCode agent mode. In general I have been able to resolve a bunch of niggling config issues that I had just been ignoring in favor of doing Actual Work. As you said, I can evaluate the elisp Claude wrote right there in the gptel buffer, try it out, and iterate before actually pasting it into .spacemacs. It it doesn't work, Claude knows a ton of debugging tricks I can try. trace-function, advice to dump a backtrace, etc. It knows how to do everything in org-mode. Super helpful. Way better than the AI Assistant that my employer bundles with our product (which is outperformed by the Google AI Overview).
  - iLemming 11mo ago
    I think the problem that most beginners try to explore the editor features, instead of focusing on main fundamental truth about Emacs - it's not just an editor, it's a Lisp system with a built-in editor. I think focusing on understanding how Lisp drives Emacs can remarkably speed up the pace of learning it. Every key press and button click hooks up to a Lisp function. Even complex keyboard macros translate to Lisp command sequences. 1. Figure out structural editing commands to move s-expressions freely - those parens only feel annoying initially, later they become friendly. 2. Understand REPL-driven development - any expression can be evaled in-place. 3. Try the build-in profiler. 4. Learn the debugger. 5. Use the describe- commands. Emacs can "describe" to you every key, function, command, symbol, input methods, themes, fonts, characters, etc. Emacs is really not about "what it can or cannot do" in general sense. It's all about "what you can do with it". Learn some basic elisp - and you will be able to achieve a lot.
    - BeetleB 11mo ago
      I'm going to give a counterpoint to this (common) take. I was an Emacs power user for almost a decade before I learned Emacs Lisp. I knew just the bare minimum to populate my .emacs file, and occasionally copied others' config snippets. No need to rush into learning Elisp.
      - iLemming 11mo ago
        You just unironically proved my point. Who's got a decade to spare, when they can wield the power in just a couple of months?
        BeetleB 11mo ago
        > Who's got a decade to spare, when they can wield the power in just a couple of months? I was a power user within months - a year tops. I didn't say it took me 10 years to become a power user. Ever since I learned Elisp (it's been many years), I wouldn't say my expertise and abilities has grown exponentially. It is merely an incremental improvement. It definitely is nice that I can now code away annoyances, but it's not the game changer people make it out to be.
  - mijoharas 11mo ago
    Im going on a decade now, and there's always still more (in a good way)!
- xenodium 11mo ago
  Hey I know where that’s from! As an Emacs user, his video was very funny https://youtu.be/urcL86UpqZc?si=Jhqiy1yCXDGHoIoS https://youtu.be/urcL86UpqZc?si=Jhqiy1yCXDGHoIoS

bengillies 11mo ago

Code Companion for neovim has supported ACP for a while now See https://agentclientprotocol.com/overview/clients https://agentclientprotocol.com/overview/clients