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"Beginning Oct. 1, motorists with a Clean Air Vehicle decal will no longer be able to drive solo in carpool lanes because the program was not extended by the fe

"Beginning Oct. 1, motorists with a Clean Air Vehicle decal will no longer be able to drive solo in carpool lanes because the program was not extended by the federal government..." So it's a special EV privilege that is going away (because of the Feds). Now they'll be treated like other vehicles. Not as bad as the headline could be interpreted.

altairprime 1y ago
Well, no, they still won’t be taxed for miles driven per year like gas vehicles are. Not yet, anyways! Probably two or three years left on that watt-o-mobile owner loophole (that Priuses have been exploiting for years, but with far less road damage per mile traveled due to being hybrids). Or maybe less if the feds starve California of transportation funding in petulance at whatever.
- burnerthrow008 1y ago
  EVs pay a registration surcharge in lieu of gas taxes. And it works out to something crazy like 20k equivalent miles per year.
  - altairprime 1y ago
    Here in California, 20k miles of driving at 30mpg (so, highway only, which is of course unrealistically high) is $600 in gasoline taxes per year, with California state and local taxes at $0.612/gal; meanwhile, the EV registration gas tax makeup fee is $118/yr, which is equivalent to 192 gallons per year of tax, which at 30mpg is merely 6k miles, not 20k. California average miles driven is estimated at 11k. So: the EV loophole is costing the state half of the road maintenance tax budgeted for road wear in subsidies paid to EV drivers, assuming that all gas vehicles get 30mpg at all times. I don’t expect that gap to last much longer now the Federal government is openly hostile to the state. Hooray for silver linings, I guess.
    - thorncorona 1y ago
      If anything drivers are subsidizing trucks
      - altairprime 1y ago
        That is also happening, yes! Lots of problems coexisting to our general detriment in that regard.
- triceratops 1y ago
  > they still won’t be taxed for miles driven per year like gas vehicles are If you're referring to gasoline taxes, California taxes electricity too. > with far less road damage per mile I agree, let's tax all vehicles by weight. I'd love to see all those pickup trucks and full-size SUVs pay.
  - jaredhallen 1y ago
    Pickups are taxed by weight.
    - Braxton1980 1y ago
      I believe they mean the gasoline tax not the registration cost which isn't a huge increase between size
  - altairprime 1y ago
    Solar charged vehicles, such as with a Tesla powerwall, would pay zero dollars of tax per mile driven if you depended on an electricity tax. Doesn’t really work out in road repair costs to leave a massive tax loophole open. By weight and by tire count! Have to made sure to deal with four-tire axles and such, not to mention electric semi trucks. I believe the California pilot determined that odometer reporting and occasional DMV drive-thru checks will be the solution. I’d post the newsletter to HN the next time it comes out but this isn’t really the sort of group that appreciates taxation.
    - triceratops 1y ago
      > Solar charged vehicles, such as with a Tesla powerwall Paying tens of thousands to avoid a few cents per gallon doesn't immediately strike me as a great deal. "According to Caltrans, Californians with gas-powered vehicles pay about $300 a year in state gas taxes."[1] This is a tiny minority of EV drivers. > Doesn’t really work out in road repair costs For that matter did the gasoline tax ever fully cover repair costs when EVs weren't around? I always had the impression that funds were needed from other sources too. It's interesting to see so many people get religion about "making drivers pay their fair share" after EVs became popular. > By weight and by tire count Even better! 1. https://abc7.com/post/california-looks-eliminate-gas-tax-replace-road-charge-program/16063939/ https://abc7.com/post/california-looks-eliminate-gas-tax-rep...

altairprime 1y ago

Well, no, they still won’t be taxed for miles driven per year like gas vehicles are. Not yet, anyways! Probably two or three years left on that watt-o-mobile owner loophole (that Priuses have been exploiting for years, but with far less road damage per mile traveled due to being hybrids). Or maybe less if the feds starve California of transportation funding in petulance at whatever.

burnerthrow008 1y ago
EVs pay a registration surcharge in lieu of gas taxes. And it works out to something crazy like 20k equivalent miles per year.
- altairprime 1y ago
  Here in California, 20k miles of driving at 30mpg (so, highway only, which is of course unrealistically high) is $600 in gasoline taxes per year, with California state and local taxes at $0.612/gal; meanwhile, the EV registration gas tax makeup fee is $118/yr, which is equivalent to 192 gallons per year of tax, which at 30mpg is merely 6k miles, not 20k. California average miles driven is estimated at 11k. So: the EV loophole is costing the state half of the road maintenance tax budgeted for road wear in subsidies paid to EV drivers, assuming that all gas vehicles get 30mpg at all times. I don’t expect that gap to last much longer now the Federal government is openly hostile to the state. Hooray for silver linings, I guess.
  - thorncorona 1y ago
    If anything drivers are subsidizing trucks
    - altairprime 1y ago
      That is also happening, yes! Lots of problems coexisting to our general detriment in that regard.
triceratops 1y ago
> they still won’t be taxed for miles driven per year like gas vehicles are If you're referring to gasoline taxes, California taxes electricity too. > with far less road damage per mile I agree, let's tax all vehicles by weight. I'd love to see all those pickup trucks and full-size SUVs pay.
- jaredhallen 1y ago
  Pickups are taxed by weight.
  - Braxton1980 1y ago
    I believe they mean the gasoline tax not the registration cost which isn't a huge increase between size
- altairprime 1y ago
  Solar charged vehicles, such as with a Tesla powerwall, would pay zero dollars of tax per mile driven if you depended on an electricity tax. Doesn’t really work out in road repair costs to leave a massive tax loophole open. By weight and by tire count! Have to made sure to deal with four-tire axles and such, not to mention electric semi trucks. I believe the California pilot determined that odometer reporting and occasional DMV drive-thru checks will be the solution. I’d post the newsletter to HN the next time it comes out but this isn’t really the sort of group that appreciates taxation.
  - triceratops 1y ago
    > Solar charged vehicles, such as with a Tesla powerwall Paying tens of thousands to avoid a few cents per gallon doesn't immediately strike me as a great deal. "According to Caltrans, Californians with gas-powered vehicles pay about $300 a year in state gas taxes."[1] This is a tiny minority of EV drivers. > Doesn’t really work out in road repair costs For that matter did the gasoline tax ever fully cover repair costs when EVs weren't around? I always had the impression that funds were needed from other sources too. It's interesting to see so many people get religion about "making drivers pay their fair share" after EVs became popular. > By weight and by tire count Even better! 1. https://abc7.com/post/california-looks-eliminate-gas-tax-replace-road-charge-program/16063939/ https://abc7.com/post/california-looks-eliminate-gas-tax-rep...