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Boring lineup, Lack of recent innovation, poor repairability and a CEO who has alienated people on both sides of the political isle. The 1 trillion dollar packa

Boring lineup, Lack of recent innovation, poor repairability and a CEO who has alienated people on both sides of the political isle. The 1 trillion dollar package the board is offering Musk is a joke. They need to find a new CEO.

randycupertino 1y ago
I low key have a conspiracy theory that the "1 trillion dollar pay package" is just Tesla PR fluff - smoke and mirrors to steal attention away from the poorly performing cybertruck sales and falling stock. If they spin news with dramatic flair highlighting Musk’s bonkers pay package it's a distraction from Tesla’s more immediate and tangible troubles, political alienation of their buyers and ongoing regulatory and manufacturing operational crises.
- aorloff 1y ago
  Hiding the cyberflop is much easier than explaining why they have monitors riding in robotaxis while Waymo works
- sethops1 1y ago
  I think it's a desperate attempt by the board to get Musk to focus on Tesla again. Tesla has a PE ratio of around 230 right now. If that comes back down to the reality of a declining-sales mid-sized car company, it's going to be an absolute blood bath.
- otterley 1y ago
  A pay package of that magnitude is a material business fact. If Tesla is lying about this, that would likely constitute securities fraud and risks imprisonment for the people involved in making it.
  - jjulius 1y ago
    The company that had to pay out $20 million (in addition to Musk paying another $20 million) to settle with the SEC after being accused of securities fraud in 2018, and whose owner has just been accused of another instance of securities fraud by the SEC this year may, in fact, be engaging in securities fraud here? Well, color me just absolutely shocked.
  - myvoiceismypass 1y ago
    I would imagine the current administration has little to no desire to enforce this. There was already an executive order early on to specifically stop enforcing crypto regulation.
- jjulius 1y ago
  Seems counterintuitive, no? The first thing I thought of when I saw that pay package being floated was the current state that Tesla is in. That's the primary reason such a package seems so fucking bonkers.
  - tim333 1y ago
    In fairness Musk only gets the payout if he hits various targets, more related to AI than cars.
ajross 1y ago
Nah, they're still the best cars you can buy[1]. It's all down to Musk's political antics. [1] Seriously, it's hard to be lacking in innovation when other brands still don't even have walk-up unlock or 360° cameras, much less drive themselves around or launch like rockets. And the repairability thing is a meme from back when they had part production lag due to crazy scaling. Getting a Tesla fixed now (and yes, I have) is like "click three buttons in your app and come in tomorrow".
- 01HNNWZ0MV43FF 1y ago
  Istg I had a ten year old Prius with walk up unlock They're terrible for privacy too. Just give me the finished product after the AC button is in and the telemetry is gone
- sleepyguy 1y ago
  I don't know why you're getting junked. A friend's Model Y was rear-ended, and he had it fixed in less than two weeks. Did have a sensor problem afterwards, but that was taken care of immediately. I think you're accurate that they are still ahead of the competition, but the race is getting closer.
- kube-system 1y ago
  Tesla was not first to market for keyless entry, 360 cameras, nor level 2 ADAS. In fact, they are behind. A couple of automakers are now shipping level 3 ADS systems.
  - ajross 1y ago
    > keyless entry, 360 cameras, nor level 2 ADAS It's the only non-luxury brand I'm aware of with all of those features. Who are you thinking about? Also you're misdirecting: "keyless entry" isn't remotely the same as "your phone is your key". And the "level 2 ADAS" business is a transparent attempt to troll an FSD argument to which won't engage except to say, again, that the user experience of letting your car drive a 200 mile leg of a long road trip is also not remotely the same as always bouncing around and stomping on brakes experience of the lanekeeping offered elsewhere. You know both of these truths, which is why you want to redefine the features to make them false.
jbm 1y ago
I've generally advocated ignoring Musk, but it's impossible to defend him in good faith as a reasonable figurehead for a multinational company. His X page in particular portrays a man who cares deeply about 4chan/pol politics and very little about his car company. If he cared at all, you'd see a better repair process with them. There is a Tesla repair hub in Calgary where I live, and I had to wait 5 weeks for them to see my car (including an un-explained situation where they bumped me, despite me being concerned about a safety issue). I eventually took it to an EV repair shop who did it for half of what Tesla quoted because, FFS, the world's most valuable auto company is "Resource Constrained" with mechanics. Seriously, how can they afford a trillion on a CEO when they are parking expensive Cybertrucks on the front lawn of their Calgary store? I still love driving my car (a 2019 Model 3), but I have no faith that Tesla will actually improve on it with their current leadership structure.
- nofriend 1y ago
  Tesla exists to make money. Every car company in the world charges more than independent mechanics for repairs, because that's how you make money.
  - AlotOfReading 1y ago
    Unlike Tesla, legacy OEMs are prohibited from owning dealerships in the US. They make the same (or more) money selling the parts to an independent shop. They only lose out on things like certification / training / diagnostic equipment with third party shops that don't buy everything the way a dealership is required to. The relationship between dealerships and OEMs is complicated, incestuous and fundamentally adversarial.
    - Gud 1y ago
      Tesla are also prohibited from running OEM dealerships by most states. That they went with online sales only was an incredibly smart move and they cut out an unwanted middleman. I’ve been following Tesla for a long time. I made a small fortune investing in them in 2012. The folks at Tesla Motor Club were very happy to buy directly from Tesla.
raldi 1y ago
They were coasting for a while on false promises of self-driving abilities by "the end of this year" every year and consumers have finally caught on that Tesla's not trustworthy about such claims.
- dawnerd 1y ago
  And their recent updates have made basic autopilot frustrating to use. Their reliance on only camera and map data is really showing how much Elon actually knows about self driving reliability. Heck, the backup cross traffic detection only alerts when a car or pedestrian is already crossed and out of view. It’s absurdly bad.
tim333 1y ago
The 1 trillion dollar package seems to me a bit like trying to pump a meme stock. Saying he'll get 1 T when the stock is 8 T will encourage people to buy in now when it's a bargain at a 1 T market cap.
praveenraja22 1y ago
[flagged]
aurareturn 1y ago
The 1 trillion dollar package the board is offering Musk is a joke. They need to find a new CEO. It's an attempt to rally the stock. It's tied to a $8.6 trillion valuation. It's basically a stunt for the public. Problem for Tesla is that Musk is the reason it has a 200 P/E ratio (and increasing at that). Without Musk, they are likely to go all the way down to a 15 P/E or less ratio in my opinion because they're decreasing in growth. That'd make them go from being worth $1 trillion today to just $75 billion instantly. I don't own TSLA but it could crash the market if it drops that low.
- thunky 1y ago
  > I don't own TSLA but it could crash the market if it drops that low. TSLA is about 2% of the s&p. If they crash I think the market will shrug that off easily. Tesla's (lack of) success is not tied to the health of the larger market, and everyone knows they are overvalued so there would be no surprise factor either.
  - aurareturn 1y ago
    It's not about how much of it is the S&P. It's about sentiment.
    - LeFantome 1y ago
      I agree with that but I also agree that everybody knows they are overvalued. A Tesla crash is unlikely to spook the market that much.
      - aurareturn 1y ago
        The mother of all meme stocks collapsing would trigger people to exit all very risky equities.
        hashstring 1y ago
        I doubt it.
pornel 1y ago
Value of TSLA has been disconnected from the actual car business for a while, and instead vaguely betting on Musk figuring out something with robots, taxis, or AI or whatever. Now I wonder if it's tied to any future of the company at all. It seems to be a Musk stock: if you want Musk have more power to do whatever he's doing, pump TSLA.
duxup 1y ago
Can they find a new CEO? Tesla's valuation has been crazy for a while and Musk an his magic has been a part of that ... Are they faced with picking someone else also admitting Musk's magic is at an end for them and thus at the same time triggering a return to reality?
api 1y ago
Letting go of Musk would let go of the Musk hype and cause the company to be valued like a car company, which would crash the stock.
Yeul 1y ago
There's a reason why in most companies the CEO isn't allowed to put up inane rants on social media.
m463 1y ago
the model y update to mimic the cybertruck made me groan. I think the old model y looks great. It was a success! But they messed with it and the new one looks like a duck. in comparison the model 3 update looked ok. But for me the relentless march to remove controls from the car is the worst. It started with no dashboard on the model 3, (crowded central display off to side). But then got worse and worse. No stalks makes it unbuyable to me. No drive select stalk (it will guess), no turn signal stalks. Critical controls on the touchscreen. Small targets that are hard to hit in a moving car. It looks minimal in the showroom, but day to day it makes you a worse driver. It is techno poverty.

randycupertino 1y ago

I low key have a conspiracy theory that the "1 trillion dollar pay package" is just Tesla PR fluff - smoke and mirrors to steal attention away from the poorly performing cybertruck sales and falling stock. If they spin news with dramatic flair highlighting Musk’s bonkers pay package it's a distraction from Tesla’s more immediate and tangible troubles, political alienation of their buyers and ongoing regulatory and manufacturing operational crises.

aorloff 1y ago
Hiding the cyberflop is much easier than explaining why they have monitors riding in robotaxis while Waymo works
sethops1 1y ago
I think it's a desperate attempt by the board to get Musk to focus on Tesla again. Tesla has a PE ratio of around 230 right now. If that comes back down to the reality of a declining-sales mid-sized car company, it's going to be an absolute blood bath.
otterley 1y ago
A pay package of that magnitude is a material business fact. If Tesla is lying about this, that would likely constitute securities fraud and risks imprisonment for the people involved in making it.
- jjulius 1y ago
  The company that had to pay out $20 million (in addition to Musk paying another $20 million) to settle with the SEC after being accused of securities fraud in 2018, and whose owner has just been accused of another instance of securities fraud by the SEC this year may, in fact, be engaging in securities fraud here? Well, color me just absolutely shocked.
- myvoiceismypass 1y ago
  I would imagine the current administration has little to no desire to enforce this. There was already an executive order early on to specifically stop enforcing crypto regulation.
jjulius 1y ago
Seems counterintuitive, no? The first thing I thought of when I saw that pay package being floated was the current state that Tesla is in. That's the primary reason such a package seems so fucking bonkers.
- tim333 1y ago
  In fairness Musk only gets the payout if he hits various targets, more related to AI than cars.

ajross 1y ago

Nah, they're still the best cars you can buy[1]. It's all down to Musk's political antics. [1] Seriously, it's hard to be lacking in innovation when other brands still don't even have walk-up unlock or 360° cameras, much less drive themselves around or launch like rockets. And the repairability thing is a meme from back when they had part production lag due to crazy scaling. Getting a Tesla fixed now (and yes, I have) is like "click three buttons in your app and come in tomorrow".

01HNNWZ0MV43FF 1y ago
Istg I had a ten year old Prius with walk up unlock They're terrible for privacy too. Just give me the finished product after the AC button is in and the telemetry is gone
sleepyguy 1y ago
I don't know why you're getting junked. A friend's Model Y was rear-ended, and he had it fixed in less than two weeks. Did have a sensor problem afterwards, but that was taken care of immediately. I think you're accurate that they are still ahead of the competition, but the race is getting closer.
kube-system 1y ago
Tesla was not first to market for keyless entry, 360 cameras, nor level 2 ADAS. In fact, they are behind. A couple of automakers are now shipping level 3 ADS systems.
- ajross 1y ago
  > keyless entry, 360 cameras, nor level 2 ADAS It's the only non-luxury brand I'm aware of with all of those features. Who are you thinking about? Also you're misdirecting: "keyless entry" isn't remotely the same as "your phone is your key". And the "level 2 ADAS" business is a transparent attempt to troll an FSD argument to which won't engage except to say, again, that the user experience of letting your car drive a 200 mile leg of a long road trip is also not remotely the same as always bouncing around and stomping on brakes experience of the lanekeeping offered elsewhere. You know both of these truths, which is why you want to redefine the features to make them false.

jbm 1y ago

I've generally advocated ignoring Musk, but it's impossible to defend him in good faith as a reasonable figurehead for a multinational company. His X page in particular portrays a man who cares deeply about 4chan/pol politics and very little about his car company. If he cared at all, you'd see a better repair process with them. There is a Tesla repair hub in Calgary where I live, and I had to wait 5 weeks for them to see my car (including an un-explained situation where they bumped me, despite me being concerned about a safety issue). I eventually took it to an EV repair shop who did it for half of what Tesla quoted because, FFS, the world's most valuable auto company is "Resource Constrained" with mechanics. Seriously, how can they afford a trillion on a CEO when they are parking expensive Cybertrucks on the front lawn of their Calgary store? I still love driving my car (a 2019 Model 3), but I have no faith that Tesla will actually improve on it with their current leadership structure.

nofriend 1y ago
Tesla exists to make money. Every car company in the world charges more than independent mechanics for repairs, because that's how you make money.
- AlotOfReading 1y ago
  Unlike Tesla, legacy OEMs are prohibited from owning dealerships in the US. They make the same (or more) money selling the parts to an independent shop. They only lose out on things like certification / training / diagnostic equipment with third party shops that don't buy everything the way a dealership is required to. The relationship between dealerships and OEMs is complicated, incestuous and fundamentally adversarial.
  - Gud 1y ago
    Tesla are also prohibited from running OEM dealerships by most states. That they went with online sales only was an incredibly smart move and they cut out an unwanted middleman. I’ve been following Tesla for a long time. I made a small fortune investing in them in 2012. The folks at Tesla Motor Club were very happy to buy directly from Tesla.

raldi 1y ago

They were coasting for a while on false promises of self-driving abilities by "the end of this year" every year and consumers have finally caught on that Tesla's not trustworthy about such claims.

dawnerd 1y ago
And their recent updates have made basic autopilot frustrating to use. Their reliance on only camera and map data is really showing how much Elon actually knows about self driving reliability. Heck, the backup cross traffic detection only alerts when a car or pedestrian is already crossed and out of view. It’s absurdly bad.

tim333 1y ago

The 1 trillion dollar package seems to me a bit like trying to pump a meme stock. Saying he'll get 1 T when the stock is 8 T will encourage people to buy in now when it's a bargain at a 1 T market cap.

praveenraja22 1y ago

[flagged]

aurareturn 1y ago

The 1 trillion dollar package the board is offering Musk is a joke. They need to find a new CEO. It's an attempt to rally the stock. It's tied to a $8.6 trillion valuation. It's basically a stunt for the public. Problem for Tesla is that Musk is the reason it has a 200 P/E ratio (and increasing at that). Without Musk, they are likely to go all the way down to a 15 P/E or less ratio in my opinion because they're decreasing in growth. That'd make them go from being worth $1 trillion today to just $75 billion instantly. I don't own TSLA but it could crash the market if it drops that low.

thunky 1y ago
> I don't own TSLA but it could crash the market if it drops that low. TSLA is about 2% of the s&p. If they crash I think the market will shrug that off easily. Tesla's (lack of) success is not tied to the health of the larger market, and everyone knows they are overvalued so there would be no surprise factor either.
- aurareturn 1y ago
  It's not about how much of it is the S&P. It's about sentiment.
  - LeFantome 1y ago
    I agree with that but I also agree that everybody knows they are overvalued. A Tesla crash is unlikely to spook the market that much.
    - aurareturn 1y ago
      The mother of all meme stocks collapsing would trigger people to exit all very risky equities.
      - hashstring 1y ago
        I doubt it.

pornel 1y ago

Value of TSLA has been disconnected from the actual car business for a while, and instead vaguely betting on Musk figuring out something with robots, taxis, or AI or whatever. Now I wonder if it's tied to any future of the company at all. It seems to be a Musk stock: if you want Musk have more power to do whatever he's doing, pump TSLA.

duxup 1y ago

Can they find a new CEO? Tesla's valuation has been crazy for a while and Musk an his magic has been a part of that ... Are they faced with picking someone else also admitting Musk's magic is at an end for them and thus at the same time triggering a return to reality?

api 1y ago

Letting go of Musk would let go of the Musk hype and cause the company to be valued like a car company, which would crash the stock.

Yeul 1y ago

There's a reason why in most companies the CEO isn't allowed to put up inane rants on social media.

m463 1y ago

the model y update to mimic the cybertruck made me groan. I think the old model y looks great. It was a success! But they messed with it and the new one looks like a duck. in comparison the model 3 update looked ok. But for me the relentless march to remove controls from the car is the worst. It started with no dashboard on the model 3, (crowded central display off to side). But then got worse and worse. No stalks makes it unbuyable to me. No drive select stalk (it will guess), no turn signal stalks. Critical controls on the touchscreen. Small targets that are hard to hit in a moving car. It looks minimal in the showroom, but day to day it makes you a worse driver. It is techno poverty.