6 ms·

The World's Lightest Electric Vehicle

279 points by zachallia 14y ago

Robby2012 14y ago
I love it but isn't it freaking expensive?
- stephengillie 14y ago
  Putting a skateboard on top of a $100 RC car would be less elegant.
typicalrunt 14y ago
Great idea. I'm surprised nobody has done this before (but they probably have, I'm no longer a skateboarder). But I'm wondering about the prices. $10 stickers and $40 t-shirts are still advertising, so people are paying to advertise for your company? That doesn't seem right. In reality, they are really trying to push people to spend $1200 for a board. Even the $1099 pledge is a complete rip-off since you spend $100 less than the pledge that gets you a board, and they only give you a $100 coupon when you buy your first board for full price. That doesn't make sense. A suggestion: create a small batch (5) of $500 or $700 pledges that provide a board. That kicks everyone into gear to get that pledge as soon as possible and fight over the $500 pledge spot.
- Scene_Cast2 14y ago
  The stickers and t-shirts are meant as a way to help the project while still getting something in return - think of it as a donation with a perk. As for 1.2k / board - that's quite steep, their BOM (Bill of Materials) should be at most 1/2 of that. A very substantial off-the-shelf 4x (motor + ESC + LiPo) combo will run at the very most for $400.
  - malvim 14y ago
    "The stickers and t-shirts are meant as a way to help the project while still getting something in return - think of it as a donation with a perk." I feel that's how we should think of most stuff we back on Kickstarter. Since at some levels the "reward" is the product itself, though, it gets harder to think like that. That's why when you pledge to donate on Kickstarter you're called a "backer" instead of a "customer", I think. You're a customer AFTER you get the product, but till then you're a someone that believes in that project and wants to help.
- darklajid 14y ago
  Uhm.. I read it the way you did it for a couple of times and then decided that it's really just a bad way of saying 'back early (25 max) and get a board for $100 less than the next 25 people on the first batch'. In other words: No, I really don't think they give you a $100 rebate for ~$1100 and a full board for $100 more.. Not my native language though..?
  - cocoflunchy 14y ago
    Well of course it's this. If not you'd be buying 100$ at 1100$ ! Not much of a bargain... ;)
  - deleted 14y ago
    [deleted]
- avree 14y ago
  The pricing seems like a complete rip-off, to be honest. $10 for a sticker? $40 for a t-shirt? $1000 for a skateboard? For comparison, you can buy a top-of-the-line longboard for $200, full kit. An essentially equivalent product [1] is selling for $500 a pop, half the price. That's more in line with what I'd pay for a luxury product like this. Also, I'm not sure how comfortable this would actually be to carry around. Most longboards are around 7 pounds... this says "12 to 15" in the description. So, basically, this is going to feel like I'm carrying two skateboards around, not one. [1] - http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1645804961/the-zboard-the-weight-sensing-electric-skateboard?ref=live http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1645804961/the-zboard-th...
  - brasmasus 14y ago
    the lightest zboard weighs 30 lbs vs 12 lbs for this. Big difference in tote-ability there.
  - markerdmann 14y ago
    I think describing that linked product as "essentially equivalent" is a bit misleading. It takes 5 hours instead of 2 hours to charge, the top speed is 15mph instead of 20mph, and it weighs 37 lbs. instead of 12-15 lbs.
  - cjlars 14y ago
    I think you hit it on the head with the weight issue. 15 pounds isn't light, but it's manageable for most people -- about the same as an 18 pack of canned soda/beer. The $500 board listed above is a whopping 37 pounds... much heavier than an ordinary person can carry comfortably.
  - sequoia 14y ago
    $10 for a sticker? $40 for a t-shirt? $1000 for a skateboard? You are not "buying a sticker" or a t-shirt. The offer is "donate to this project and receive a 'thank you gift'." This is referred to as a "premium" and can be seen in the USA in Public Radio fund drives: "Give $60 and get an NPR mug" they are not "selling really expensive mugs," they are soliciting donations and giving gifts or "premiums" in exchange. A premium is, basically by definition, worth much less than your donation. Giving a premium with a $100 cash value for a $100 donation would not be a good way to raise money. ;)
- zzzmarcus 14y ago
  There have been plenty of electric longboards before, but none even close to this size. Someone else linked to this: http://www.zboardshop.com/ http://www.zboardshop.com/ which is basically the same idea but the difference in implementation is night and day. This board weighs 12lbs, the Z board weighs 37lbs, and it's one of the lighter competitors.
- njoubert 14y ago
  There's actually a bunch of companies already making these - definitely not an original idea or even an original implementation. Back in 2007 we used to ride electric boards around UC Berkeley, and they only cost $600.
massarog 14y ago
Isn't this the same thing? Was launched on kickstarter months ago: http://www.zboardshop.com/ http://www.zboardshop.com/
- MartinCron 14y ago
  The zboard is a different design in that you don't have a hand-held remote, you press on footpads to accelerate/brake. I would have to try them both out to see which is a better solution to the control problem. edit: another key difference is that this is 12 pounds vs the 30 to 37 pounds for the zboard. That difference is HUGE.
  - zzzmarcus 14y ago
    Absolutely. The weight difference is definitely the biggest difference. I've ridden longboards with both foot and hand brakes. All the hand braking boards I've tried had a cable from the board to the controls and even with that hassle, I much prefer them to the foot brakes. Moving your foot around and trying to get even pressure at 20mph is a lot more tricky than squeezing a lever.
    - MartinCron 14y ago
      I'm interested in getting into longboarding. Would you be willing to share the name of the hand braking board you've used?
      - zzzmarcus 14y ago
        Looks like it's evolved some since I used it, but this is the company: http://www.skatebrake.com/products.html http://www.skatebrake.com/products.html
- tonylemesmer 14y ago
  (I'm not critising you massarog just using your post as a hopping on point :) Kind of a big difference in battery size from the Zboard to the Boosted Board. Quoted mileage is not that different either. Given that the board has to move a human at 20Mph I would wager that the smaller of the two batteries is not big enough. Its barely larger than a couple of mobile phone batteries. They say the motor is rated at 2kw. Something that size using that much power is going to get pretty hot and the wires and battery are also going to get hot. I'm pretty sure that brushless motors don't like working at low RPM (anything less than about 10,000rpm) Looking at the transmission and wheel size, at 20mph those wheels are going at 1,100rpm. Which means the motors are probably doing about 2-3 times that. Under high load (like this) brushed and brushless motors are comparable efficiency. I'd love to see a prototype of this but the motors and batteries don't seem powerful enough (having been a model car enthusiast for many years) - I'd love to be proved wrong. I wanted to put some brushless motors on my bike but after doing the calcs never got any further than the drawing board. ZBoard seems more realistic to me.
thomas-st 14y ago
Seems like it's illegal to use in California: http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc21968.htm http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc21968.htm
- ck2 14y ago
  1977 - was probably gas powered but must have been impressive tech for the time to warrant a ban!
  - stan_rogers 14y ago
    If by "impressive tech" you mean "unmuffled, high-pitched, blue-smoke-spewing, 10cc-ish two-stroke chainsaw engine controlled by a deadman/lever throttle", then you're right. There wasn't much about them that wasn't offensive to everybody except the rider (and the few riders of those contraptions that I knew seemed to take particular delight in the offensiveness of their machines).
- anemitz 14y ago
  Thanks for point that out -- I probably would have just assumed it was legal. Would be helpful to see a breakdown of all states it's illegal in under the Legality section of the Kickstarter. Seems like a great way to get around while traveling so I'd want to make sure it's useable in most states (or at least the ones you frequent most).
- skdoo 14y ago
  We're still researching all the legal issues that vary from state to state. So far, we've never heard of a ticket being issued, and all the cops who have seen it think it's a fantastic idea. I think the biggest factor will be how responsible our new users are.
  - jonnycowboy 14y ago
    You might have luck in voluntarily limiting the power output to 1,000W and trying to follow the California guidelines for electric bicycles. Then gradually petition the government to delete the current motorized skateboard law. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_bicycle_laws#California http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_bicycle_laws#Californi...
moreati 14y ago
I was surprised by 2 kW. I have an electric moped that's 2 kW - and in that class 1.5 kW is more typical. Maybe a burst vs steady state spec
noonespecial 14y ago
I've been building that project over and over since I was 14. My first try was a "Vision Gator" skateboard with a 35watt brushed dc motor and vacuum cleaner belts for drive. It is astonishing (and more than a little awesome) that you can pack 2kw of motor power and so much range into so small a space now. Oh how I wish parts like this had been available in 1989.
ck2 14y ago
I think I've actually seen these on DIY electric bike boards? I would recommend a direct drive motor though, less parts to break, direct torque.
IanDrake 14y ago
This sounds cool, but (IMO) it's actually a bad idea. When I was in my late teens / early twenties, I essentially had a 180HP version of this. It was a lot more expensive back then: $4,000 for the 1984 Chevy Blazer and $0 dollars for an extension cord we found in the garage, but going going fast on a skateboard, no matter what the method, is dangerous. The worst part of this idea is "braking". I can assure you the only good way to brake a skate board at speed is a power slide, which you need to be an expert to do. I've hit sand at speed and, even knowing it was coming, the slight braking power of the sand was enough to throw me. It's difficult to explain, but between knowing how far to lean against the braking force AND managing your balance side to side on the trucks, it ends up being harder to pull off than a good ole power slide. That said, a roller blade version of this would be cool.
- Adirael 14y ago
  Disclosure: I have never "ridden" a skateboard. Wouldn't it be very different braking by yourself than being slowed down by anything on the road? You control exactly the speed and brake force you apply to the board so you can balance/react. I see the guys in the video doing pretty well. Physics of a table attached to a car using a rope are very different from this.
- zzzmarcus 14y ago
  I agree that yes, you should definitely be experienced if you're going to be going 20mph on a longboard. It's fast. But, if you've got brakes, and I've ridden both electric skateboards with brakes and non-electric skateboards with brakes before and both are easy to use, you'll probably never end up going that fast in the first place unless you're being reckless. A power slide is one way to stop, but brakes work just fine. The reason the sand throws people isn't because they're slowing down, it's that they don't expect it and can't predict how quickly it will slow them down. Decent brakes have neither of those problems.
  - IanDrake 14y ago
    Maybe I'm thinking about it wrong. Slowing down vs. braking, I mean. If I'm going 20mph, "braking" to me means coming to a stop in an equivalent distance as a car or bike going the same speed. Are the brakes that you've used stable at that rate of deceleration?
marquis 14y ago
I have zero balance. If this were a scooter I'd be in.
ChuckMcM 14y ago
Sounds cool, but even a 95% efficient 2kW brushless motor would be dissipating 100W of heat. Not easy to dump in a small package. I've never tried building a skateboard but I've built quite a few mobile robots (and a few battlebots). Wish they had a bit more detail on the tech.
- skdoo 14y ago
  Part of our tech is very efficient, compact, and (relatively) cheap brushless motor controllers. It's not easy.
  - jonnycowboy 14y ago
    How are you cooling the motors?
    - indiecore 14y ago
      I'd assume that you'd have a rad over the bottom of the board and the motor housing that uses the air going by as it moves to dump the heat. At least that's my first idea, since I'm not a skateboard engineer it's probably not even close.
      - sbierwagen 14y ago
        They'll just be air-cooled: 2KW motors in a skateboard are going spend very little of their time running at max load. I of course have no idea what the average load is, but a reasonable wild ass guess is ~100W.
        ChuckMcM 14y ago
        My experience with DC motors was that they got hottest when starting and stopping, that was the result of a high current demand for torque and relatively low operating speed with meant minimal airflow. If you're going up a hill you're easily burning 1 - 1.5 HP or a .75 - 1kW of power. They look very cool, can't wait to see one 'in the flesh' as it were.
HyprMusic 14y ago
I can't help but think if you're willing to carry around a long board for your journey, the extra effort in pushing it manually is not much and probably more fun (I can't really judge, having not used the product). If you were really against walking or pushing, then a foldable bike would be a lot more useful, safer and cheaper.
- uvtc 14y ago
  Regarding folding bikes, even the smaller ones are still somewhat of a pain to take on the train. But a really tiny one like the "CarryMe" from Pacific Cycles might fit the bill if your "last mile" commute is in the city.
- muraiki 14y ago
  Where I live, there are many urban areas but also many hills / roads with long inclines. Longboarding isn't that popular here because: 1) You can't longboard up a hill, or even much of an incline. 2) More importantly, when you go _down_ a hill, it's pretty difficult to stop quickly (this is why I personally stopped longboarding) This device would help with both problems!
  - wwweston 14y ago
    > More importantly, when you go _down_ a hill, it's pretty difficult to stop quickly (this is why I personally stopped longboarding) This might help you stop the longboard quickly, but will it help you stop quickly (but not too quickly)?
    - muraiki 14y ago
      Good point! The stop will never be instant... and you'd better have good grip on your shoes, too. While I think this product will be pretty neat, I can't see it revolutionizing transportation simply because longboarding requires a good amount of mental energy in comparison to a scooter or bike. But I have to admit, it is seriously fun, and the sensation of gliding is awesome.
ricardobeat 14y ago
Looks like a great technologic improvement, but not revolutionary at all. A search for "electric skateboard" returns a dozen manufacturers, some with similar specs, most much cheaper - yes, they have that bulge going on but it doesn't change much in terms of feasibility. A skateboard is still not a viable means of daily transportation unless your route consists solely of smooth, untrafficked asphalt and you're a lucky person. Why not sell it by what it is (a very cool electric longboard), instead of making surreal claims about changing the world?
arikrak 14y ago
It sounds like it could be dangerous enough to lead to lawsuits. I think there's a reason why electric scooters are much more common than electric skateboards: people can stay on them.
liamondrop 14y ago
`The last mile of transportation is this huge problem that hasn't been solved yet` Really? I think we've had it solved for at least several million years. Anyone that isn't capable of walking or skating a mile is certainly not going to be served by this. It looks like a cool toy, but I don't think it's going to revolutionize transportation.
- natrius 14y ago
  "Last mile" is a transportation (and telecommunications) term that doesn't mean a literal mile. It's the last leg of your trip. Solutions to the last mile problem will revolutionize transportation, though this probably isn't that solution. I'd bet on bike sharing systems. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Last_mile_(transportation) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Last_mile_(transportation)
pg 14y ago
This is one of those things that's like Google in the sense that it seems to be just an improvement on existing technology, but in fact is enough of an improvement that it's qualitatively different. In all the startups we've funded I don't think I've seen one whose product was so enthusiastically embraced by YC partners. Three bought one of these boards. One says it "changed his life."
- Datonomics 14y ago
  I wonder if applying this technology to something like this: http://www.diytrade.com/china/pd/2572648/Kick_Scooter.html http://www.diytrade.com/china/pd/2572648/Kick_Scooter.html would lower the perceived learning curve and greatly expand their potential market?
- twoodfin 14y ago
  Are they street-legal in Cambridge?
- dhugiaskmak 14y ago
  One says it "changed his life." I would genuinely like to hear more about this.
  - agscala 14y ago
    Ditto. This is the kind of claim that, if explained appropriately, may convince me (and others) to buy one despite the price point.
  - deleted 14y ago
    [deleted]
  - aaroniba 14y ago
    I said that. I realized my world was divided into: places I could walk to, places I could bike to, and places I could drive to. Where I live (downtown Palo Alto), driving is a hassle because of traffic and parking. Driving is annoying, boring, frustrating, life-wasting... basically I hate driving and use it only as a last resort. Walking is great, but it's slow. It's really time-consuming to walk anywhere beyond a few blocks. Biking is pretty fast, but still a bit of a hassle because I have to bring a heavy U-lock and worry about my bike. "Where is my bike and is it OK?" is always in the back of my head, which makes it harder to enjoy whatever I'm doing. Also biking doesn't leave any hands free to carry things. Now I have a Boosted Board with a 6-mile range. For any trip under 3 miles, it is: * Faster than walking, biking, or driving. * More fun. * No extra hassle, nothing to worry about. * Leaves 2 hands free to carry stuff like groceries. So it's opened up this whole 3 mile radius of things around me that I previously wouldn't go to. Now these places feel like they're at my fingertips. It feels like my world got smaller.
Datonomics 14y ago
Maybe the following title would attract more people willing to invest: Electric longboard: 12 lbs, 6 mi range, $1,099
skdoo 14y ago
Co-founder here. Feel free to ask questions!
- duked 14y ago
  Why the price is so expensive, it would help people to understand and eventually invest?
  - skdoo 14y ago
    Two reasons. 1. We're starting with a great longboard - one that would cost over $300 if you bought it alone. 2. We're using advanced and expensive motor and battery technology. The kind seen in electric motorcycles and cars, but never in bikes or scooters. The reason the price is so high is because we built the first ones for ourselves, not for customers, and we only used the best ingredients. We have no intention of compromising that, even if it means less volume, because the end result is worth it.
- vanhowen 14y ago
  (Ignore the horrible website) What are your thoughts on this? http://www.metro-board.com/ http://www.metro-board.com/ How does your board compare to the metro board? What makes it special?
  - skdoo 14y ago
    The weight, power, hill capability, deck flex, handling, design, aesthetic, and interface are very very different. More to come on this topic later.
- polshaw 14y ago
  2KW sounds a hell of a lot, when a 250W motor on a bike can get up to 20mph? Do you actually use the full 2KW of power? it seems like it would throw the rider to me. I'm willing to bet from ebike knowledge that the regenerative braking is more of a marketing feature, and may not even break even with the added weight. Have you done tests on this? Others have touched upon price so i'll ask if you had any concerns about liabilities? and are you hoping to grow organically post-kickstarter, or a funding round?
wheelerwj 14y ago
As I scrolled up to kickstart it myself, I saw the price. Thanks but I can walk.
duked 14y ago
I went saw the descriptions the pictures and it looks awesome until I saw the price, I'm not saying it's not worth it: I have no idea how much they have invested in R&D/prototyping etc.. but it's too much for me $1000 for an electric board :/ too bad.
asdfs 14y ago
How many Ah is the battery? It seems extremely small for the quoted 6 mile (@ 20mph?) range.
BasDirks 14y ago
Love the disclaimer, love the realism ++ the idealism. F* the danger, let's board.
ph0rque 14y ago
Does it do regenerative braking?
- ph0rque 14y ago
  Also, it would be really cool if a few years from now, the board became the battery.
- FrojoS 14y ago
  Yes. And on top of that, we've added regenerative braking, accomplished using the motors.
Permit 14y ago
Looks pretty awesome, but the price tag instantly puts it out of range for a student like myself. Hopefully they attain some level of success such that they can mass manufacture them and bring the price down. I'd love to have one.
brianstorms 14y ago
Great, empowering more idiots to set out on public thoroughfares and ignore every basic traffic law (stop signs, red lights, for starters; look 'em up if you're not familiar with the concepts) not to mention common sense. Ought to produce a few Darwin Award winners.
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
TomatoTomato 14y ago
Are batteries quickly replaceable? i.e. If I had a spare battery in my pack, I could change it out and continue on?
- JoeAltmaier 14y ago
  Or can it come with a larger pack to begin with? Avoid changing it at all.
  - TomatoTomato 14y ago
    If they don't do it, I'm sure someone will hack multiple batteries together and post a how to.
- skdoo 14y ago
  We are looking into what the final product will do. In our prototypes, we can swap in about 15 seconds with no tools.
cpeterso 14y ago
Why is the only woman in the Kickstarter video little more than a prop watching the boys play with their toys?
abecedarius 14y ago
This looks like a fantastic product. But how about a video with at least a minute of uninterrupted actual use? The video is very slick but only a small fraction of its 3 minutes goes to people using it, with no clip longer than 2 or 3 seconds (as far as I can remember).
dredmorbius 14y ago
Chiseled spam.
ulyssesgrant 14y ago
What exactly will/could change between the 1st, 2nd, and final production runs? The board is compelling, and it does fill a spot that I and many students likely have, but unless the price comes down I don't see how this will take off. edit: Also, after these boards do reach final production, do you plan on expanding your tech to other loaded longboards? Never loved the vanguard, but the tan tien is great.
Poiesis 14y ago
Ok, I have a 5.6 mile commute each way, with 300 feet ascent worst case (just under 100 ft descent). Charging at work is no problem. Is this going to be a good fit?
will_work4tears 14y ago
This would be really cool if it was rechargeable by use rather than merely plugging it in.
orangethirty 14y ago
My only concern is the belt driven drivetrain. I used to race R/C cars who used the same time of layout (belts and plastic/aluminum gears), and the belts did not last that long. Given that this board would be pushing a fair amount of weight around, I don't see how it would last over a reasonable time frame. Though I'm just speculating. If anyone can chime in with more data, I'd love to know about it. Maybe the belts are kevlar reinforced? I know there are suppliers making those and they are readily available.
Toenex 14y ago
In the UK all such novel forms of transport have to first shake off the C5 effect http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinclair_C5 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinclair_C5
jazzdev 14y ago
I got to ride one of these at Disrupt today. Inside, in a crowd, but still impressive tech. Smooth acceleration. I do ride boards, so I'm not a newbie. Loved it. I want one.

279 points by zachallia 14y ago

Robby2012 14y ago

I love it but isn't it freaking expensive?

stephengillie 14y ago
Putting a skateboard on top of a $100 RC car would be less elegant.

typicalrunt 14y ago

Great idea. I'm surprised nobody has done this before (but they probably have, I'm no longer a skateboarder). But I'm wondering about the prices. $10 stickers and $40 t-shirts are still advertising, so people are paying to advertise for your company? That doesn't seem right. In reality, they are really trying to push people to spend $1200 for a board. Even the $1099 pledge is a complete rip-off since you spend $100 less than the pledge that gets you a board, and they only give you a $100 coupon when you buy your first board for full price. That doesn't make sense. A suggestion: create a small batch (5) of $500 or $700 pledges that provide a board. That kicks everyone into gear to get that pledge as soon as possible and fight over the $500 pledge spot.

Scene_Cast2 14y ago
The stickers and t-shirts are meant as a way to help the project while still getting something in return - think of it as a donation with a perk. As for 1.2k / board - that's quite steep, their BOM (Bill of Materials) should be at most 1/2 of that. A very substantial off-the-shelf 4x (motor + ESC + LiPo) combo will run at the very most for $400.
- malvim 14y ago
  "The stickers and t-shirts are meant as a way to help the project while still getting something in return - think of it as a donation with a perk." I feel that's how we should think of most stuff we back on Kickstarter. Since at some levels the "reward" is the product itself, though, it gets harder to think like that. That's why when you pledge to donate on Kickstarter you're called a "backer" instead of a "customer", I think. You're a customer AFTER you get the product, but till then you're a someone that believes in that project and wants to help.
darklajid 14y ago
Uhm.. I read it the way you did it for a couple of times and then decided that it's really just a bad way of saying 'back early (25 max) and get a board for $100 less than the next 25 people on the first batch'. In other words: No, I really don't think they give you a $100 rebate for ~$1100 and a full board for $100 more.. Not my native language though..?
- cocoflunchy 14y ago
  Well of course it's this. If not you'd be buying 100$ at 1100$ ! Not much of a bargain... ;)
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
avree 14y ago
The pricing seems like a complete rip-off, to be honest. $10 for a sticker? $40 for a t-shirt? $1000 for a skateboard? For comparison, you can buy a top-of-the-line longboard for $200, full kit. An essentially equivalent product [1] is selling for $500 a pop, half the price. That's more in line with what I'd pay for a luxury product like this. Also, I'm not sure how comfortable this would actually be to carry around. Most longboards are around 7 pounds... this says "12 to 15" in the description. So, basically, this is going to feel like I'm carrying two skateboards around, not one. [1] - http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1645804961/the-zboard-the-weight-sensing-electric-skateboard?ref=live http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1645804961/the-zboard-th...
- brasmasus 14y ago
  the lightest zboard weighs 30 lbs vs 12 lbs for this. Big difference in tote-ability there.
- markerdmann 14y ago
  I think describing that linked product as "essentially equivalent" is a bit misleading. It takes 5 hours instead of 2 hours to charge, the top speed is 15mph instead of 20mph, and it weighs 37 lbs. instead of 12-15 lbs.
- cjlars 14y ago
  I think you hit it on the head with the weight issue. 15 pounds isn't light, but it's manageable for most people -- about the same as an 18 pack of canned soda/beer. The $500 board listed above is a whopping 37 pounds... much heavier than an ordinary person can carry comfortably.
- sequoia 14y ago
  $10 for a sticker? $40 for a t-shirt? $1000 for a skateboard? You are not "buying a sticker" or a t-shirt. The offer is "donate to this project and receive a 'thank you gift'." This is referred to as a "premium" and can be seen in the USA in Public Radio fund drives: "Give $60 and get an NPR mug" they are not "selling really expensive mugs," they are soliciting donations and giving gifts or "premiums" in exchange. A premium is, basically by definition, worth much less than your donation. Giving a premium with a $100 cash value for a $100 donation would not be a good way to raise money. ;)
zzzmarcus 14y ago
There have been plenty of electric longboards before, but none even close to this size. Someone else linked to this: http://www.zboardshop.com/ http://www.zboardshop.com/ which is basically the same idea but the difference in implementation is night and day. This board weighs 12lbs, the Z board weighs 37lbs, and it's one of the lighter competitors.
njoubert 14y ago
There's actually a bunch of companies already making these - definitely not an original idea or even an original implementation. Back in 2007 we used to ride electric boards around UC Berkeley, and they only cost $600.

massarog 14y ago

Isn't this the same thing? Was launched on kickstarter months ago: http://www.zboardshop.com/ http://www.zboardshop.com/

MartinCron 14y ago
The zboard is a different design in that you don't have a hand-held remote, you press on footpads to accelerate/brake. I would have to try them both out to see which is a better solution to the control problem. edit: another key difference is that this is 12 pounds vs the 30 to 37 pounds for the zboard. That difference is HUGE.
- zzzmarcus 14y ago
  Absolutely. The weight difference is definitely the biggest difference. I've ridden longboards with both foot and hand brakes. All the hand braking boards I've tried had a cable from the board to the controls and even with that hassle, I much prefer them to the foot brakes. Moving your foot around and trying to get even pressure at 20mph is a lot more tricky than squeezing a lever.
  - MartinCron 14y ago
    I'm interested in getting into longboarding. Would you be willing to share the name of the hand braking board you've used?
    - zzzmarcus 14y ago
      Looks like it's evolved some since I used it, but this is the company: http://www.skatebrake.com/products.html http://www.skatebrake.com/products.html
tonylemesmer 14y ago
(I'm not critising you massarog just using your post as a hopping on point :) Kind of a big difference in battery size from the Zboard to the Boosted Board. Quoted mileage is not that different either. Given that the board has to move a human at 20Mph I would wager that the smaller of the two batteries is not big enough. Its barely larger than a couple of mobile phone batteries. They say the motor is rated at 2kw. Something that size using that much power is going to get pretty hot and the wires and battery are also going to get hot. I'm pretty sure that brushless motors don't like working at low RPM (anything less than about 10,000rpm) Looking at the transmission and wheel size, at 20mph those wheels are going at 1,100rpm. Which means the motors are probably doing about 2-3 times that. Under high load (like this) brushed and brushless motors are comparable efficiency. I'd love to see a prototype of this but the motors and batteries don't seem powerful enough (having been a model car enthusiast for many years) - I'd love to be proved wrong. I wanted to put some brushless motors on my bike but after doing the calcs never got any further than the drawing board. ZBoard seems more realistic to me.

thomas-st 14y ago

Seems like it's illegal to use in California: http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc21968.htm http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc21968.htm

ck2 14y ago
1977 - was probably gas powered but must have been impressive tech for the time to warrant a ban!
- stan_rogers 14y ago
  If by "impressive tech" you mean "unmuffled, high-pitched, blue-smoke-spewing, 10cc-ish two-stroke chainsaw engine controlled by a deadman/lever throttle", then you're right. There wasn't much about them that wasn't offensive to everybody except the rider (and the few riders of those contraptions that I knew seemed to take particular delight in the offensiveness of their machines).
anemitz 14y ago
Thanks for point that out -- I probably would have just assumed it was legal. Would be helpful to see a breakdown of all states it's illegal in under the Legality section of the Kickstarter. Seems like a great way to get around while traveling so I'd want to make sure it's useable in most states (or at least the ones you frequent most).
skdoo 14y ago
We're still researching all the legal issues that vary from state to state. So far, we've never heard of a ticket being issued, and all the cops who have seen it think it's a fantastic idea. I think the biggest factor will be how responsible our new users are.
- jonnycowboy 14y ago
  You might have luck in voluntarily limiting the power output to 1,000W and trying to follow the California guidelines for electric bicycles. Then gradually petition the government to delete the current motorized skateboard law. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_bicycle_laws#California http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_bicycle_laws#Californi...

moreati 14y ago

I was surprised by 2 kW. I have an electric moped that's 2 kW - and in that class 1.5 kW is more typical. Maybe a burst vs steady state spec

noonespecial 14y ago

I've been building that project over and over since I was 14. My first try was a "Vision Gator" skateboard with a 35watt brushed dc motor and vacuum cleaner belts for drive. It is astonishing (and more than a little awesome) that you can pack 2kw of motor power and so much range into so small a space now. Oh how I wish parts like this had been available in 1989.

ck2 14y ago

I think I've actually seen these on DIY electric bike boards? I would recommend a direct drive motor though, less parts to break, direct torque.

IanDrake 14y ago

This sounds cool, but (IMO) it's actually a bad idea. When I was in my late teens / early twenties, I essentially had a 180HP version of this. It was a lot more expensive back then: $4,000 for the 1984 Chevy Blazer and $0 dollars for an extension cord we found in the garage, but going going fast on a skateboard, no matter what the method, is dangerous. The worst part of this idea is "braking". I can assure you the only good way to brake a skate board at speed is a power slide, which you need to be an expert to do. I've hit sand at speed and, even knowing it was coming, the slight braking power of the sand was enough to throw me. It's difficult to explain, but between knowing how far to lean against the braking force AND managing your balance side to side on the trucks, it ends up being harder to pull off than a good ole power slide. That said, a roller blade version of this would be cool.

Adirael 14y ago
Disclosure: I have never "ridden" a skateboard. Wouldn't it be very different braking by yourself than being slowed down by anything on the road? You control exactly the speed and brake force you apply to the board so you can balance/react. I see the guys in the video doing pretty well. Physics of a table attached to a car using a rope are very different from this.
zzzmarcus 14y ago
I agree that yes, you should definitely be experienced if you're going to be going 20mph on a longboard. It's fast. But, if you've got brakes, and I've ridden both electric skateboards with brakes and non-electric skateboards with brakes before and both are easy to use, you'll probably never end up going that fast in the first place unless you're being reckless. A power slide is one way to stop, but brakes work just fine. The reason the sand throws people isn't because they're slowing down, it's that they don't expect it and can't predict how quickly it will slow them down. Decent brakes have neither of those problems.
- IanDrake 14y ago
  Maybe I'm thinking about it wrong. Slowing down vs. braking, I mean. If I'm going 20mph, "braking" to me means coming to a stop in an equivalent distance as a car or bike going the same speed. Are the brakes that you've used stable at that rate of deceleration?

marquis 14y ago

I have zero balance. If this were a scooter I'd be in.

ChuckMcM 14y ago

Sounds cool, but even a 95% efficient 2kW brushless motor would be dissipating 100W of heat. Not easy to dump in a small package. I've never tried building a skateboard but I've built quite a few mobile robots (and a few battlebots). Wish they had a bit more detail on the tech.

skdoo 14y ago
Part of our tech is very efficient, compact, and (relatively) cheap brushless motor controllers. It's not easy.
- jonnycowboy 14y ago
  How are you cooling the motors?
  - indiecore 14y ago
    I'd assume that you'd have a rad over the bottom of the board and the motor housing that uses the air going by as it moves to dump the heat. At least that's my first idea, since I'm not a skateboard engineer it's probably not even close.
    - sbierwagen 14y ago
      They'll just be air-cooled: 2KW motors in a skateboard are going spend very little of their time running at max load. I of course have no idea what the average load is, but a reasonable wild ass guess is ~100W.
      - ChuckMcM 14y ago
        My experience with DC motors was that they got hottest when starting and stopping, that was the result of a high current demand for torque and relatively low operating speed with meant minimal airflow. If you're going up a hill you're easily burning 1 - 1.5 HP or a .75 - 1kW of power. They look very cool, can't wait to see one 'in the flesh' as it were.

HyprMusic 14y ago

I can't help but think if you're willing to carry around a long board for your journey, the extra effort in pushing it manually is not much and probably more fun (I can't really judge, having not used the product). If you were really against walking or pushing, then a foldable bike would be a lot more useful, safer and cheaper.

uvtc 14y ago
Regarding folding bikes, even the smaller ones are still somewhat of a pain to take on the train. But a really tiny one like the "CarryMe" from Pacific Cycles might fit the bill if your "last mile" commute is in the city.
muraiki 14y ago
Where I live, there are many urban areas but also many hills / roads with long inclines. Longboarding isn't that popular here because: 1) You can't longboard up a hill, or even much of an incline. 2) More importantly, when you go _down_ a hill, it's pretty difficult to stop quickly (this is why I personally stopped longboarding) This device would help with both problems!
- wwweston 14y ago
  > More importantly, when you go _down_ a hill, it's pretty difficult to stop quickly (this is why I personally stopped longboarding) This might help you stop the longboard quickly, but will it help you stop quickly (but not too quickly)?
  - muraiki 14y ago
    Good point! The stop will never be instant... and you'd better have good grip on your shoes, too. While I think this product will be pretty neat, I can't see it revolutionizing transportation simply because longboarding requires a good amount of mental energy in comparison to a scooter or bike. But I have to admit, it is seriously fun, and the sensation of gliding is awesome.

ricardobeat 14y ago

Looks like a great technologic improvement, but not revolutionary at all. A search for "electric skateboard" returns a dozen manufacturers, some with similar specs, most much cheaper - yes, they have that bulge going on but it doesn't change much in terms of feasibility. A skateboard is still not a viable means of daily transportation unless your route consists solely of smooth, untrafficked asphalt and you're a lucky person. Why not sell it by what it is (a very cool electric longboard), instead of making surreal claims about changing the world?

arikrak 14y ago

It sounds like it could be dangerous enough to lead to lawsuits. I think there's a reason why electric scooters are much more common than electric skateboards: people can stay on them.

liamondrop 14y ago

`The last mile of transportation is this huge problem that hasn't been solved yet` Really? I think we've had it solved for at least several million years. Anyone that isn't capable of walking or skating a mile is certainly not going to be served by this. It looks like a cool toy, but I don't think it's going to revolutionize transportation.

natrius 14y ago
"Last mile" is a transportation (and telecommunications) term that doesn't mean a literal mile. It's the last leg of your trip. Solutions to the last mile problem will revolutionize transportation, though this probably isn't that solution. I'd bet on bike sharing systems. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Last_mile_(transportation) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Last_mile_(transportation)

pg 14y ago

This is one of those things that's like Google in the sense that it seems to be just an improvement on existing technology, but in fact is enough of an improvement that it's qualitatively different. In all the startups we've funded I don't think I've seen one whose product was so enthusiastically embraced by YC partners. Three bought one of these boards. One says it "changed his life."

Datonomics 14y ago
I wonder if applying this technology to something like this: http://www.diytrade.com/china/pd/2572648/Kick_Scooter.html http://www.diytrade.com/china/pd/2572648/Kick_Scooter.html would lower the perceived learning curve and greatly expand their potential market?
twoodfin 14y ago
Are they street-legal in Cambridge?
dhugiaskmak 14y ago
One says it "changed his life." I would genuinely like to hear more about this.
- agscala 14y ago
  Ditto. This is the kind of claim that, if explained appropriately, may convince me (and others) to buy one despite the price point.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
- aaroniba 14y ago
  I said that. I realized my world was divided into: places I could walk to, places I could bike to, and places I could drive to. Where I live (downtown Palo Alto), driving is a hassle because of traffic and parking. Driving is annoying, boring, frustrating, life-wasting... basically I hate driving and use it only as a last resort. Walking is great, but it's slow. It's really time-consuming to walk anywhere beyond a few blocks. Biking is pretty fast, but still a bit of a hassle because I have to bring a heavy U-lock and worry about my bike. "Where is my bike and is it OK?" is always in the back of my head, which makes it harder to enjoy whatever I'm doing. Also biking doesn't leave any hands free to carry things. Now I have a Boosted Board with a 6-mile range. For any trip under 3 miles, it is: * Faster than walking, biking, or driving. * More fun. * No extra hassle, nothing to worry about. * Leaves 2 hands free to carry stuff like groceries. So it's opened up this whole 3 mile radius of things around me that I previously wouldn't go to. Now these places feel like they're at my fingertips. It feels like my world got smaller.

Datonomics 14y ago

Maybe the following title would attract more people willing to invest: Electric longboard: 12 lbs, 6 mi range, $1,099

skdoo 14y ago

Co-founder here. Feel free to ask questions!

duked 14y ago
Why the price is so expensive, it would help people to understand and eventually invest?
- skdoo 14y ago
  Two reasons. 1. We're starting with a great longboard - one that would cost over $300 if you bought it alone. 2. We're using advanced and expensive motor and battery technology. The kind seen in electric motorcycles and cars, but never in bikes or scooters. The reason the price is so high is because we built the first ones for ourselves, not for customers, and we only used the best ingredients. We have no intention of compromising that, even if it means less volume, because the end result is worth it.
vanhowen 14y ago
(Ignore the horrible website) What are your thoughts on this? http://www.metro-board.com/ http://www.metro-board.com/ How does your board compare to the metro board? What makes it special?
- skdoo 14y ago
  The weight, power, hill capability, deck flex, handling, design, aesthetic, and interface are very very different. More to come on this topic later.
polshaw 14y ago
2KW sounds a hell of a lot, when a 250W motor on a bike can get up to 20mph? Do you actually use the full 2KW of power? it seems like it would throw the rider to me. I'm willing to bet from ebike knowledge that the regenerative braking is more of a marketing feature, and may not even break even with the added weight. Have you done tests on this? Others have touched upon price so i'll ask if you had any concerns about liabilities? and are you hoping to grow organically post-kickstarter, or a funding round?

wheelerwj 14y ago

As I scrolled up to kickstart it myself, I saw the price. Thanks but I can walk.

duked 14y ago

I went saw the descriptions the pictures and it looks awesome until I saw the price, I'm not saying it's not worth it: I have no idea how much they have invested in R&D/prototyping etc.. but it's too much for me $1000 for an electric board :/ too bad.

asdfs 14y ago

How many Ah is the battery? It seems extremely small for the quoted 6 mile (@ 20mph?) range.

BasDirks 14y ago

Love the disclaimer, love the realism ++ the idealism. F* the danger, let's board.

ph0rque 14y ago

Does it do regenerative braking?

ph0rque 14y ago
Also, it would be really cool if a few years from now, the board became the battery.
FrojoS 14y ago
Yes. And on top of that, we've added regenerative braking, accomplished using the motors.

Permit 14y ago

Looks pretty awesome, but the price tag instantly puts it out of range for a student like myself. Hopefully they attain some level of success such that they can mass manufacture them and bring the price down. I'd love to have one.

brianstorms 14y ago

Great, empowering more idiots to set out on public thoroughfares and ignore every basic traffic law (stop signs, red lights, for starters; look 'em up if you're not familiar with the concepts) not to mention common sense. Ought to produce a few Darwin Award winners.

deleted 14y ago

[deleted]

TomatoTomato 14y ago

Are batteries quickly replaceable? i.e. If I had a spare battery in my pack, I could change it out and continue on?

JoeAltmaier 14y ago
Or can it come with a larger pack to begin with? Avoid changing it at all.
- TomatoTomato 14y ago
  If they don't do it, I'm sure someone will hack multiple batteries together and post a how to.
skdoo 14y ago
We are looking into what the final product will do. In our prototypes, we can swap in about 15 seconds with no tools.

cpeterso 14y ago

Why is the only woman in the Kickstarter video little more than a prop watching the boys play with their toys?

abecedarius 14y ago

This looks like a fantastic product. But how about a video with at least a minute of uninterrupted actual use? The video is very slick but only a small fraction of its 3 minutes goes to people using it, with no clip longer than 2 or 3 seconds (as far as I can remember).

dredmorbius 14y ago

Chiseled spam.

ulyssesgrant 14y ago

What exactly will/could change between the 1st, 2nd, and final production runs? The board is compelling, and it does fill a spot that I and many students likely have, but unless the price comes down I don't see how this will take off. edit: Also, after these boards do reach final production, do you plan on expanding your tech to other loaded longboards? Never loved the vanguard, but the tan tien is great.

Poiesis 14y ago

Ok, I have a 5.6 mile commute each way, with 300 feet ascent worst case (just under 100 ft descent). Charging at work is no problem. Is this going to be a good fit?

will_work4tears 14y ago

This would be really cool if it was rechargeable by use rather than merely plugging it in.

orangethirty 14y ago

My only concern is the belt driven drivetrain. I used to race R/C cars who used the same time of layout (belts and plastic/aluminum gears), and the belts did not last that long. Given that this board would be pushing a fair amount of weight around, I don't see how it would last over a reasonable time frame. Though I'm just speculating. If anyone can chime in with more data, I'd love to know about it. Maybe the belts are kevlar reinforced? I know there are suppliers making those and they are readily available.

Toenex 14y ago

In the UK all such novel forms of transport have to first shake off the C5 effect http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinclair_C5 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinclair_C5

jazzdev 14y ago

I got to ride one of these at Disrupt today. Inside, in a crowd, but still impressive tech. Smooth acceleration. I do ride boards, so I'm not a newbie. Loved it. I want one.