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> The UK has people in prison for tweets and saying mean words. We do not have that; the first amendment is not a myth. US seems not to understand yet, how fas
by CLPadvocate 1y ago
> The UK has people in prison for tweets and saying mean words. We do not have that; the first amendment is not a myth.
US seems not to understand yet, how fast words become deeds. Every oppression starts with words.
> You called me a dilettante, I claim that is hate speech. It meets all the (current) criteria for hate speech.
He/She actually didn't. He/She called ALL Americans dilettantes, not you personally. In the latter case, you may TRY to sue, which would with nearly 100% probability be dismissed by any court, since it's not really an insult.
> Do you think that the government should be able to silence or punish you because I was offended by your insult? A world where that is true is a world where freedom and democracy die.
The government has absolutely nothing to do with it. And yes, absolutely and definitely, every single person should be able to defend himself against insults. Why should you have the right to insult other people? Are you somehow better than them? Not in a country where law is respected and where every person is equal.
> Language is context dependent and requires interpretation. I can easily take someone’s words out of context and they become hate speech, I can also easily misinterpret someone’s words and they become hate speech. What is fine one day can become hate speech the next under a different administration.
And this ist exactly where it gets wrong - you don't decide anything. You MAY think that something is hate speech, you MAY think that someone insulted you - so you are allowed to fill a complaint, but there is INDEPENDENT JUSTICE that decides if you have the point or not. And they would dismiss any claims that have no substance. So if someone was fined (most usually somewhere about 1000-2000 Euros) then it was really an insult, if someone was imprisoned (pretty uncommon) then it was someone who repeatedly insulted other people (and was convicted multiple times) or was so incredibly offensive that it crossed the boundaries of civilised behaviour by so far that he had to be isolated from the society. I actually have no examples where people were imprisoned for the first-time insult or even for the first-time hate speech.
There is absolutely no danger to democracy if the laws apply to all people equally and if people are forced to communicate in civilised ways.
- Dig1t 1y ago>how fast words become deeds. Every oppression starts with words. Well illegal deeds are already illegal. Oppression is already illegal. Just enforce the existing laws if words you disagree with become actions. The problem with this system where you say that “certain words lead to bad deeds, therefore we must silence bad words” is that it is so easily abused to silence anything that people in power don’t like. “Independent justice” is just a group of people with their own biases. The point is still true that they are a body which can decide which types of (words) are okay to say vs others, you can simply change one day what qualifies as “hate speech”. >Why should you have the right to insult other people? Because words are words, they are information, and violence is already illegal. There are many cases where something is both an insult and TRUE, and being able to speak the truth is important in a democracy. You can never speak truth to power or truly question anyone in authority because they will always have the power to lock you up (or fine you) for insults.