8 ms·

I still dont get it. If someone else's software is running the hardware, what difference does it make if its on-prem or offsite?

transpute 1y ago
Is the software open-source with reproducible builds of any runtime binaries? Oxide has been remarkably transparent about the development and architecture of critical system components. We can only hope they succeed and inspire others to follow their transparency lead.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
- gtirloni 1y ago
  Open source is a requirement but not the only one. There are countless examples of companies building integrated solutions based off of open source projects that, when they went bankrupt, there was nobody to pick up the available pieces and continue moving the stack forward. Just pointing out that open source is not this magical escape hatch that some people think (at least not in corporate environments).
  - yencabulator 1y ago
    Especially so for Oxide's decidedly non-Linux setup. They are in a niche software ecosystem with practically no one else. Apparently mostly because they're practically all ex-Solaris staff. https://www.illumos.org/docs/about/who/ https://www.illumos.org/docs/about/who/ (Listing all projects using ZFS or DTrace as "who uses Illumos" is cheating.)
    - sunshowers 1y ago
      > Apparently mostly because they're practically all ex-Solaris staff. I absolutely do not have a Solaris/illumos background! The first time I ever sshed into an illumos machine was my first day on the job.
      - jiveturkey 1y ago
        The exception proves the rule. You can't deny the deep Solaris heritage.
        sunshowers 1y ago
        I wouldn't deny that, no.
    - ryao 1y ago
      I remember many Linux fans saying that monocultures were bad until Linux became so popular that Linux was the one benefiting from a monoculture. Despite that, the rationale against monocultures still applies. That said, Illumos is influential as an organ donor to many others. There are a number of awesome technologies in it.
      - yencabulator 1y ago
        Oh I would love to have some healthy competition to Linux, but I am not rooting for Solaris to do that, I'd rather have one of the Rust-based microkernel actually git gud. Time to shake the foundations of the age-old security and isolation models, not resuscitate a dusty old thing built on piles of C and shell on top of a large monolithic kernel and pretend everything's fine.
        bcantrill 1y ago
        Well, good news: we have one of those too![0] [0] https://oxide.computer/blog/hubris-and-humility https://oxide.computer/blog/hubris-and-humility
        yencabulator 1y ago
        Oh I am well aware. But I am hoping to run dynamic workloads, including virtual Linux machines, on a PC. It's a bit of a different world. Latest one still in my to-read pile: https://lwn.net/Articles/1022920/ https://lwn.net/Articles/1022920/
        freeopinion 1y ago
        You want to run dynamic workloads on a PC? As in a desktop PC? That is clearly a completely different market than Oxide serves. Or do you mean PC as in rackmounted servers? If that's what you meant, PC is a very poor word for it. That's kind of the point Oxide made from the beginning. Why are you running server workloads on a PC with a funny shape? Why do you need 84 power supplies (2/shelf) in your rack? Why do you need any keyboard or graphics controllers? Why don't you design for purpose a rack-sized server? Or did you mean exactly what you wrote: "a PC"? You only need one server, not a whole rack's worth? Again, that is not the market Oxide is targeting. Or you need to be able to run "dynamic workloads" that could require 40-4000 CPUs? You need hypervisors and orchestration, etc.? And you don't want them to be Solaris, or to run on Solaris? And you know all about Hubris and you don't want that either? But you think it would be nice if they weren't Linux? Maybe if they were modern microkernels written in something like Rust? But not the Hubris microkernel written in Rust? I'm going to have to take you at your word. Your needs are "a bit of a different world" than Oxide fits. But it's pretty cool that you still got some friendly personal attention from two big-name Oxide employees who seem willing to try to help you if they can. If you ever do find yourself in a world that aligns with theirs it appears that they are willing to try to accommodate you.
steveklabnik 1y ago
> If someone else's software is running the hardware Our stack is open source. > what difference does it make if its on-prem or offsite? The difference is not where it runs, it's that you own our racks, rather than rent them. In the traditional cloud, you're renting. Other vendors who sell you hardware will still have you paying software licensing fees, so it never feels like you truly own it. We don't have any licensing fees.
- stavros 1y ago
  I like you. Are you guys hiring?
  - steveklabnik 1y ago
    We are! https://oxide.computer/careers https://oxide.computer/careers
    - stavros 1y ago
      Thanks! Not much for my skillset, but I'll keep an eye out!
    - archon810 1y ago
      I just have to say this is an incredible page. Everything is well thought out and there's no BS. The salary is upfront too and everything is remote. A gold standard for hiring pages?
      - cj 1y ago
        Paying everyone at the company a flat rate of $207k, no matter their role or location, is quite the concept.
    - mbjorling 1y ago
      Are there any storage-related roles? Will Oxide redefine storage as well?
bpt3 1y ago
Cloud computing is significantly more expensive than self-hosting for most large organizations. People are slowly figuring that out, and Oxide was a bet on the timing of that realization.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
- Aperocky 1y ago
  That's almost always been true but servers are more like commodities at this point. iphone is nice and upgrade from commodities phone and I have one, but I wouldn't care much if my fridge has sleek UI because I just need it to be a fridge.
  - bpt3 1y ago
    Servers are commodities, a on-prem cloud is not.
vatican_banker 1y ago
Banks care _a lot_ where the data is store, hence most banks are inclined to keep customer data on-prem. Because data must be on-prem, banks are stuck in legacy infra paradigms. The whole org suffers, innovation is stiffled, yada yada… An on-prem cloud product (hardware+software) is a game changer for these companies, IMO. My question to oxide: how easy is to integrate external hardware into the cloud? For example: bunch of GPUs or a bunch of next-gen hardware like SambaNova.

transpute 1y ago

Is the software open-source with reproducible builds of any runtime binaries? Oxide has been remarkably transparent about the development and architecture of critical system components. We can only hope they succeed and inspire others to follow their transparency lead.

deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
gtirloni 1y ago
Open source is a requirement but not the only one. There are countless examples of companies building integrated solutions based off of open source projects that, when they went bankrupt, there was nobody to pick up the available pieces and continue moving the stack forward. Just pointing out that open source is not this magical escape hatch that some people think (at least not in corporate environments).
- yencabulator 1y ago
  Especially so for Oxide's decidedly non-Linux setup. They are in a niche software ecosystem with practically no one else. Apparently mostly because they're practically all ex-Solaris staff. https://www.illumos.org/docs/about/who/ https://www.illumos.org/docs/about/who/ (Listing all projects using ZFS or DTrace as "who uses Illumos" is cheating.)
  - sunshowers 1y ago
    > Apparently mostly because they're practically all ex-Solaris staff. I absolutely do not have a Solaris/illumos background! The first time I ever sshed into an illumos machine was my first day on the job.
    - jiveturkey 1y ago
      The exception proves the rule. You can't deny the deep Solaris heritage.
      - sunshowers 1y ago
        I wouldn't deny that, no.
  - ryao 1y ago
    I remember many Linux fans saying that monocultures were bad until Linux became so popular that Linux was the one benefiting from a monoculture. Despite that, the rationale against monocultures still applies. That said, Illumos is influential as an organ donor to many others. There are a number of awesome technologies in it.
    - yencabulator 1y ago
      Oh I would love to have some healthy competition to Linux, but I am not rooting for Solaris to do that, I'd rather have one of the Rust-based microkernel actually git gud. Time to shake the foundations of the age-old security and isolation models, not resuscitate a dusty old thing built on piles of C and shell on top of a large monolithic kernel and pretend everything's fine.
      - bcantrill 1y ago
        Well, good news: we have one of those too![0] [0] https://oxide.computer/blog/hubris-and-humility https://oxide.computer/blog/hubris-and-humility
        yencabulator 1y ago
        Oh I am well aware. But I am hoping to run dynamic workloads, including virtual Linux machines, on a PC. It's a bit of a different world. Latest one still in my to-read pile: https://lwn.net/Articles/1022920/ https://lwn.net/Articles/1022920/
        freeopinion 1y ago
        You want to run dynamic workloads on a PC? As in a desktop PC? That is clearly a completely different market than Oxide serves. Or do you mean PC as in rackmounted servers? If that's what you meant, PC is a very poor word for it. That's kind of the point Oxide made from the beginning. Why are you running server workloads on a PC with a funny shape? Why do you need 84 power supplies (2/shelf) in your rack? Why do you need any keyboard or graphics controllers? Why don't you design for purpose a rack-sized server? Or did you mean exactly what you wrote: "a PC"? You only need one server, not a whole rack's worth? Again, that is not the market Oxide is targeting. Or you need to be able to run "dynamic workloads" that could require 40-4000 CPUs? You need hypervisors and orchestration, etc.? And you don't want them to be Solaris, or to run on Solaris? And you know all about Hubris and you don't want that either? But you think it would be nice if they weren't Linux? Maybe if they were modern microkernels written in something like Rust? But not the Hubris microkernel written in Rust? I'm going to have to take you at your word. Your needs are "a bit of a different world" than Oxide fits. But it's pretty cool that you still got some friendly personal attention from two big-name Oxide employees who seem willing to try to help you if they can. If you ever do find yourself in a world that aligns with theirs it appears that they are willing to try to accommodate you.

steveklabnik 1y ago

> If someone else's software is running the hardware Our stack is open source. > what difference does it make if its on-prem or offsite? The difference is not where it runs, it's that you own our racks, rather than rent them. In the traditional cloud, you're renting. Other vendors who sell you hardware will still have you paying software licensing fees, so it never feels like you truly own it. We don't have any licensing fees.

stavros 1y ago
I like you. Are you guys hiring?
- steveklabnik 1y ago
  We are! https://oxide.computer/careers https://oxide.computer/careers
  - stavros 1y ago
    Thanks! Not much for my skillset, but I'll keep an eye out!
  - archon810 1y ago
    I just have to say this is an incredible page. Everything is well thought out and there's no BS. The salary is upfront too and everything is remote. A gold standard for hiring pages?
    - cj 1y ago
      Paying everyone at the company a flat rate of $207k, no matter their role or location, is quite the concept.
  - mbjorling 1y ago
    Are there any storage-related roles? Will Oxide redefine storage as well?

bpt3 1y ago

Cloud computing is significantly more expensive than self-hosting for most large organizations. People are slowly figuring that out, and Oxide was a bet on the timing of that realization.

deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
Aperocky 1y ago
That's almost always been true but servers are more like commodities at this point. iphone is nice and upgrade from commodities phone and I have one, but I wouldn't care much if my fridge has sleek UI because I just need it to be a fridge.
- bpt3 1y ago
  Servers are commodities, a on-prem cloud is not.

vatican_banker 1y ago

Banks care _a lot_ where the data is store, hence most banks are inclined to keep customer data on-prem. Because data must be on-prem, banks are stuck in legacy infra paradigms. The whole org suffers, innovation is stiffled, yada yada… An on-prem cloud product (hardware+software) is a game changer for these companies, IMO. My question to oxide: how easy is to integrate external hardware into the cloud? For example: bunch of GPUs or a bunch of next-gen hardware like SambaNova.