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Android FTW. I know this pops up constantly, but this is EXACTLY the reason I advocate for android. This sort of shit does not fly there. Apple has the ability

Android FTW. I know this pops up constantly, but this is EXACTLY the reason I advocate for android. This sort of shit does not fly there. Apple has the ability to censor which even the government can't and worse is that it's fully legal. I really wish people would take these stories as a sign that we need to focus on the android market. FWIW: I am not advocating for the baby & bathwater argument. I think we must focus on android because it will put market pressure on apple to have a more fair/just approval process.

stephengillie 14y ago
Even if both Google's and Amazon's app stores reject an app, there are still other markets. And you can just download APKs from websites/ftp/etc and install them to your android, no market required.
- nivla 14y ago
  That is until all the three (Apple, Google and Microsoft) decides to only allow installs from the maketplace, you know for "security" reasons. The problem is if one company gets away with it, others follow suit.
  - adambyrtek 14y ago
    I don't get your logic. Apple pretty much got away with it, Microsoft wasn't really in this space at that time, and still Google didn't follow.
  - stephengillie 14y ago
    If Google decides to only allow installs from their market, someone will just fork android and change that.
    - philwelch 14y ago
      And how will that fork get on any phones for customers to use? "People can just sideload the OS" is not a feasible answer here.
      - chimeracoder 14y ago
        > "People can just sideload the OS" is not a feasible answer here. Well, it's not feasible as long as bootloaders remain encrypted/non-unlockable. That's the problem with restricting the software that can run on hardware after the user has purchased the hardware and owns it.
      - fpgeek 14y ago
        People will just buy different Android phones from someone else. We've already been through this. AT&T (uniquely among US carriers, I believe) blocked non-Market applications on all of their devices. The success of the Amazon Appstore forced them to change that policy.
        mcpherrinm 14y ago
        Saying "the success" was what caused it isn't really accurate, though. If it hadn't been for a large, US corporation lobbying AT&T to allow their product on the handsets, would it have gone through? A future where AT&T allows the Amazon and Google app stores only is still one that could happen.
    - fulafel 14y ago
      Only a part of Android is open source.
  - untog 14y ago
    I doubt that very much- Android has the perfect middle ground right now. Only installs from approved sources, but has a checkbox in the settings that basically allows you to say "I know what I'm doing, let me do whatever I want". I doubt they'll change that.
  - cheald 14y ago
    How do you propose enforcing that on an open-source operating system?
    - nivla 14y ago
      The same way chromium has become obsolete with chrome becoming less and less open-source. The same goes with MySQL. In case of android, most consumers will deal with what the manufacturers decides to put on their phones and less than 1% will resort to installing another O/S. Keep in mind even with Android you are forced to register a Google account. What if you din't want to use Google or worst case, they ban you from their network? The point is, just because something is open-source now doesn't mean it will remain that way in the future.
      - nivla 14y ago
        What is with the downvotes and no comment? I would love to hear your side of the argument too.
        orangecat 14y ago
        It was a combination of FUD and objective falsehood. You presented no evidence that Google intends to close off Android source, and Android doesn't force users to create or use a Google account.
        nivla 14y ago
        > You presented no evidence that Google intends to close off Android source. You are right, but the statement was meant to be more of a what-if situation and not a it is. Either-ways we all can agree that based on the past events that it is not in Google's priority list to keep the open-source community updated: http://www.zdnet.com/blog/open-source/googles-decision-to-delay-android-3-0-code-is-unacceptable/8559 http://www.zdnet.com/blog/open-source/googles-decision-to-de... http://www.itworld.com/open-source/164153/how-google-can-delay-android-source-code-releases http://www.itworld.com/open-source/164153/how-google-can-del... >and Android doesn't force users to create or use a Google account. If so, could you tell me how I could use an android phone without setting up a Google account? The first screen to hit you when you switch on a brand new android phone is the Google Login/Signup screen.
  - kcbanner 14y ago
    From day one you could always install any .apk you wanted, I don't see that changing.
  - veidr 14y ago
    It's not a very effective defense of Apple to say, "Yeah, Google's phones and tablets don't currently have the same central, fundamental limitation that all Apple's iOS devices do, but someday they probably will."
  - fpgeek 14y ago
    Not really. The competition between Amazon and Google (and other app stores overseas) has made selling an Android device tied to a single app store untenable. For example, the volume of customer complaints about the Amazon Appstore even forced AT&T to give up on blocking non-Market applications.
enraged_camel 14y ago
While this is true, security is a massive concern. Just look at how many malicious apps were in the Android store just last year, vs. in the Apple store.
- hammersend 14y ago
  This has absolutely nothing to do with the issue being discussed. Google could clamp down hard on security if they wanted to and still not reject apps for political reasons like Apple appear to do.
- nutjob123 14y ago
  How many malicious apps were in the Android store? A few? A dozen? Thats a pretty good ratio out of the hundreds of thousands available.
  - ralfd 14y ago
    On a similar line of argument: "How many blocked apps were in the App Store? A few? A dozen? Thats a pretty good ratio out of the hundreds of thousands available."
    - dripton 14y ago
      How would you know how many apps were blocked, if they never showed up in the store?
    - mechnik 14y ago
      I Know Why The Caged Bird Sings The free bird leaps on the back of the win and floats downstream till the current ends and dips his wings in the orange sun rays and dares to claim the sky. But a bird that stalks down his narrow cage can seldom see through his bars of rage his wings are clipped and his feet are tied so he opens his throat to sing. The caged bird sings with fearful trill of the things unknown but longed for still and is tune is heard on the distant hillfor the caged bird sings of freedom The free bird thinks of another breeze an the trade winds soft through the sighing trees and the fat worms waiting on a dawn-bright lawn and he names the sky his own. But a caged bird stands on the grave of dreams his shadow shouts on a nightmare scream his wings are clipped and his feet are tied so he opens his throat to sing The caged bird sings with a fearful trill of things unknown but longed for still and his tune is heard on the distant hill for the caged bird sings of freedom. Maya Angelou
at-fates-hands 14y ago
I actually would've thought the MS Windows Phone App Store would be even more fertile ground. Not sure how stringent their policies are, but a quick Google search only turned up a rejected Twitter content scraping app which was rejected. Not to mention if anybody needs more apps, its the Windows Phone App store.
- vaultboy21 14y ago
  Yeah, as far as I know, the Windows Phone Store certification policies are pretty lax (not sure if that’s reflected in their official terms or their implementation of them; I’m guessing it’s the latter). The only times I hear of apps being rejected or pulled seem to in cases of trademark infringement; and, even-then, only if the infringed-upon company requests them to do so.. I saw this play-out with Vimeo apps not too long ago. Prior to the company launching their (really nice btw) official app there were a few a third-party clients which used the Vimeo name and logo; since then, they've all rebranded or disappeared (I’m guessing at the request of Vimeo to avoid confusion). Other than that, pretty much everything else seems to fly (I’m guessing security issues and serious bugs that come-up during review aside). This is all anecdotal (I don’t work at Microsoft or review apps for certification) but I’d be pretty shocked if they blocked an app like this. Anyways, it looks pretty cool, maybe if iOS certification doesn’t go over the dev can port it to WP. For simpler apps (no offense here) I’ve heard it’s fairly quick work and involves a lot less on the testing/optimizing for 1,000+ device SKUs (Android) front.
- mtgx 14y ago
  The WP store is a little more relaxed than the iOS app store - but - it still doesn't have any way to sideload any apps, which means it's still up to Microsoft, a single central entity, to decide what apps you can install on your device. The same is true for any Metro apps.
  - dnissley 14y ago
    Does the WP SDK give you the ability to sideload apps? At the very least, WP is different from iOS in that their SDK is provided for free (using the express edition of Visual Studio).

stephengillie 14y ago

Even if both Google's and Amazon's app stores reject an app, there are still other markets. And you can just download APKs from websites/ftp/etc and install them to your android, no market required.

nivla 14y ago
That is until all the three (Apple, Google and Microsoft) decides to only allow installs from the maketplace, you know for "security" reasons. The problem is if one company gets away with it, others follow suit.
- adambyrtek 14y ago
  I don't get your logic. Apple pretty much got away with it, Microsoft wasn't really in this space at that time, and still Google didn't follow.
- stephengillie 14y ago
  If Google decides to only allow installs from their market, someone will just fork android and change that.
  - philwelch 14y ago
    And how will that fork get on any phones for customers to use? "People can just sideload the OS" is not a feasible answer here.
    - chimeracoder 14y ago
      > "People can just sideload the OS" is not a feasible answer here. Well, it's not feasible as long as bootloaders remain encrypted/non-unlockable. That's the problem with restricting the software that can run on hardware after the user has purchased the hardware and owns it.
    - fpgeek 14y ago
      People will just buy different Android phones from someone else. We've already been through this. AT&T (uniquely among US carriers, I believe) blocked non-Market applications on all of their devices. The success of the Amazon Appstore forced them to change that policy.
      - mcpherrinm 14y ago
        Saying "the success" was what caused it isn't really accurate, though. If it hadn't been for a large, US corporation lobbying AT&T to allow their product on the handsets, would it have gone through? A future where AT&T allows the Amazon and Google app stores only is still one that could happen.
  - fulafel 14y ago
    Only a part of Android is open source.
- untog 14y ago
  I doubt that very much- Android has the perfect middle ground right now. Only installs from approved sources, but has a checkbox in the settings that basically allows you to say "I know what I'm doing, let me do whatever I want". I doubt they'll change that.
- cheald 14y ago
  How do you propose enforcing that on an open-source operating system?
  - nivla 14y ago
    The same way chromium has become obsolete with chrome becoming less and less open-source. The same goes with MySQL. In case of android, most consumers will deal with what the manufacturers decides to put on their phones and less than 1% will resort to installing another O/S. Keep in mind even with Android you are forced to register a Google account. What if you din't want to use Google or worst case, they ban you from their network? The point is, just because something is open-source now doesn't mean it will remain that way in the future.
    - nivla 14y ago
      What is with the downvotes and no comment? I would love to hear your side of the argument too.
      - orangecat 14y ago
        It was a combination of FUD and objective falsehood. You presented no evidence that Google intends to close off Android source, and Android doesn't force users to create or use a Google account.
        nivla 14y ago
        > You presented no evidence that Google intends to close off Android source. You are right, but the statement was meant to be more of a what-if situation and not a it is. Either-ways we all can agree that based on the past events that it is not in Google's priority list to keep the open-source community updated: http://www.zdnet.com/blog/open-source/googles-decision-to-delay-android-3-0-code-is-unacceptable/8559 http://www.zdnet.com/blog/open-source/googles-decision-to-de... http://www.itworld.com/open-source/164153/how-google-can-delay-android-source-code-releases http://www.itworld.com/open-source/164153/how-google-can-del... >and Android doesn't force users to create or use a Google account. If so, could you tell me how I could use an android phone without setting up a Google account? The first screen to hit you when you switch on a brand new android phone is the Google Login/Signup screen.
- kcbanner 14y ago
  From day one you could always install any .apk you wanted, I don't see that changing.
- veidr 14y ago
  It's not a very effective defense of Apple to say, "Yeah, Google's phones and tablets don't currently have the same central, fundamental limitation that all Apple's iOS devices do, but someday they probably will."
- fpgeek 14y ago
  Not really. The competition between Amazon and Google (and other app stores overseas) has made selling an Android device tied to a single app store untenable. For example, the volume of customer complaints about the Amazon Appstore even forced AT&T to give up on blocking non-Market applications.

enraged_camel 14y ago

While this is true, security is a massive concern. Just look at how many malicious apps were in the Android store just last year, vs. in the Apple store.

hammersend 14y ago
This has absolutely nothing to do with the issue being discussed. Google could clamp down hard on security if they wanted to and still not reject apps for political reasons like Apple appear to do.
nutjob123 14y ago
How many malicious apps were in the Android store? A few? A dozen? Thats a pretty good ratio out of the hundreds of thousands available.
- ralfd 14y ago
  On a similar line of argument: "How many blocked apps were in the App Store? A few? A dozen? Thats a pretty good ratio out of the hundreds of thousands available."
  - dripton 14y ago
    How would you know how many apps were blocked, if they never showed up in the store?
  - mechnik 14y ago
    I Know Why The Caged Bird Sings The free bird leaps on the back of the win and floats downstream till the current ends and dips his wings in the orange sun rays and dares to claim the sky. But a bird that stalks down his narrow cage can seldom see through his bars of rage his wings are clipped and his feet are tied so he opens his throat to sing. The caged bird sings with fearful trill of the things unknown but longed for still and is tune is heard on the distant hillfor the caged bird sings of freedom The free bird thinks of another breeze an the trade winds soft through the sighing trees and the fat worms waiting on a dawn-bright lawn and he names the sky his own. But a caged bird stands on the grave of dreams his shadow shouts on a nightmare scream his wings are clipped and his feet are tied so he opens his throat to sing The caged bird sings with a fearful trill of things unknown but longed for still and his tune is heard on the distant hill for the caged bird sings of freedom. Maya Angelou

at-fates-hands 14y ago

I actually would've thought the MS Windows Phone App Store would be even more fertile ground. Not sure how stringent their policies are, but a quick Google search only turned up a rejected Twitter content scraping app which was rejected. Not to mention if anybody needs more apps, its the Windows Phone App store.

vaultboy21 14y ago
Yeah, as far as I know, the Windows Phone Store certification policies are pretty lax (not sure if that’s reflected in their official terms or their implementation of them; I’m guessing it’s the latter). The only times I hear of apps being rejected or pulled seem to in cases of trademark infringement; and, even-then, only if the infringed-upon company requests them to do so.. I saw this play-out with Vimeo apps not too long ago. Prior to the company launching their (really nice btw) official app there were a few a third-party clients which used the Vimeo name and logo; since then, they've all rebranded or disappeared (I’m guessing at the request of Vimeo to avoid confusion). Other than that, pretty much everything else seems to fly (I’m guessing security issues and serious bugs that come-up during review aside). This is all anecdotal (I don’t work at Microsoft or review apps for certification) but I’d be pretty shocked if they blocked an app like this. Anyways, it looks pretty cool, maybe if iOS certification doesn’t go over the dev can port it to WP. For simpler apps (no offense here) I’ve heard it’s fairly quick work and involves a lot less on the testing/optimizing for 1,000+ device SKUs (Android) front.
mtgx 14y ago
The WP store is a little more relaxed than the iOS app store - but - it still doesn't have any way to sideload any apps, which means it's still up to Microsoft, a single central entity, to decide what apps you can install on your device. The same is true for any Metro apps.
- dnissley 14y ago
  Does the WP SDK give you the ability to sideload apps? At the very least, WP is different from iOS in that their SDK is provided for free (using the express edition of Visual Studio).