8 ms·

I'm pretty sure there is way less regulations in the US in respect to France where going over the legal 35h/week requires additional capital and legal paperwork

by gwervc 1y ago

I'm pretty sure there is way less regulations in the US in respect to France where going over the legal 35h/week requires additional capital and legal paperwork.

retinaros 1y ago
No one works 35hours in software jobs in france except maybe government. Overtime is also not compensated (they give some days off that is it.)
- psalaun 1y ago
  Even in government; I've worked 50+ hours weeks working for the healthcare branch of the providence state, with a classic 39h/w contract. No compensation of any sort, despite having timesheets. There are a lot of myths about French worker. Our lifelong worked hours is not exceptional; our productivity is also not exceptional.
  - greenavocado 1y ago
    Pointless suffering. Report violations to the CSE, Médecin du Travail, and Inspection du Travail.
    - psalaun 1y ago
      It was a choice, I loved my job there. I had more exciting projects than most of my friends in the private sector!
    - Saline9515 1y ago
      Excellent way to get blacklisted and never work for the State again if you're a contractor, or end up in a low impact, boring job if you're a career worker.
algoghostf 1y ago
This is not true. Government workers or factory workers can limit to 35h (with some salary loss or days off loss), but else than that (especially in tech) it is very competitive and working 50 hours+/week is not exceptionl.
- kgwgk 1y ago
  > 50 hours+/week is not exceptionl. https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/codes/article_lc/LEGIARTI000033020414 https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/codes/article_lc/LEGIARTI0000... Au cours d'une même semaine, la durée maximale hebdomadaire de travail est de quarante-huit heures. https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/codes/article_lc/LEGIARTI000033020402 https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/codes/article_lc/LEGIARTI0000... La durée hebdomadaire de travail calculée sur une période quelconque de douze semaines consécutives ne peut dépasser quarante-quatre heures, sauf dans les cas prévus aux articles L. 3121-23 à L. 3121-25.
  - Saline9515 1y ago
    Everyone is "forfait cadre", which allow them to work with no practical time limit since they don't log their time spent at work. https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F19261 https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F19261
    - kgwgk 1y ago
      It seems that 20% of employees in the private sector are "cadres" and half of them are on "forfait jours". That makes around 10% of the private sector employees working 218 days per year without the 48/44 weekly hour limits. It's more than I thought but I doubt that many of them work more than 10 hours per day. Whether that's "exceptional" or not is a matter of definition, of course.
      - psychoslave 1y ago
        What do you mean with work more than 10h/day for intellectual work? You don't stop to think the moment you are away from the production machine. And the exact opposite can often happen: you go away from the computer/board/paper/office, make a walk trying to wander at something else as far as you can stear consciousness, and then the solutions/ideas land in your mind.
Saline9515 1y ago
In France most white collar jobs are categorized as "management" ("cadre"), and they have no time limit. It is very common for workers to clock 12h days in consultancies (10am-10pm) and in state administrations, for instance.

by gwervc 1y ago

I'm pretty sure there is way less regulations in the US in respect to France where going over the legal 35h/week requires additional capital and legal paperwork.

retinaros 1y ago

No one works 35hours in software jobs in france except maybe government. Overtime is also not compensated (they give some days off that is it.)

psalaun 1y ago
Even in government; I've worked 50+ hours weeks working for the healthcare branch of the providence state, with a classic 39h/w contract. No compensation of any sort, despite having timesheets. There are a lot of myths about French worker. Our lifelong worked hours is not exceptional; our productivity is also not exceptional.
- greenavocado 1y ago
  Pointless suffering. Report violations to the CSE, Médecin du Travail, and Inspection du Travail.
  - psalaun 1y ago
    It was a choice, I loved my job there. I had more exciting projects than most of my friends in the private sector!
  - Saline9515 1y ago
    Excellent way to get blacklisted and never work for the State again if you're a contractor, or end up in a low impact, boring job if you're a career worker.

algoghostf 1y ago

This is not true. Government workers or factory workers can limit to 35h (with some salary loss or days off loss), but else than that (especially in tech) it is very competitive and working 50 hours+/week is not exceptionl.

kgwgk 1y ago
> 50 hours+/week is not exceptionl. https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/codes/article_lc/LEGIARTI000033020414 https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/codes/article_lc/LEGIARTI0000... Au cours d'une même semaine, la durée maximale hebdomadaire de travail est de quarante-huit heures. https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/codes/article_lc/LEGIARTI000033020402 https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/codes/article_lc/LEGIARTI0000... La durée hebdomadaire de travail calculée sur une période quelconque de douze semaines consécutives ne peut dépasser quarante-quatre heures, sauf dans les cas prévus aux articles L. 3121-23 à L. 3121-25.
- Saline9515 1y ago
  Everyone is "forfait cadre", which allow them to work with no practical time limit since they don't log their time spent at work. https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F19261 https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F19261
  - kgwgk 1y ago
    It seems that 20% of employees in the private sector are "cadres" and half of them are on "forfait jours". That makes around 10% of the private sector employees working 218 days per year without the 48/44 weekly hour limits. It's more than I thought but I doubt that many of them work more than 10 hours per day. Whether that's "exceptional" or not is a matter of definition, of course.
    - psychoslave 1y ago
      What do you mean with work more than 10h/day for intellectual work? You don't stop to think the moment you are away from the production machine. And the exact opposite can often happen: you go away from the computer/board/paper/office, make a walk trying to wander at something else as far as you can stear consciousness, and then the solutions/ideas land in your mind.

Saline9515 1y ago

In France most white collar jobs are categorized as "management" ("cadre"), and they have no time limit. It is very common for workers to clock 12h days in consultancies (10am-10pm) and in state administrations, for instance.