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DeepSeek's documentation has a different problem, which is that there are spelling errors and weird grammatical constructions everywhere: "DeepSeek API does NO

DeepSeek's documentation has a different problem, which is that there are spelling errors and weird grammatical constructions everywhere: "DeepSeek API does NOT constrain user's rate limit. We will try out best to serve every request. However, please note that when our servers are under high traffic pressure, your requests may take some time to receive a response from the server. During this period, your HTTP request will remain connected, and you may continuously receive contents in the following formats..." The documentation is still mostly easy to read, so it doesn't *really" matter, but I always thought this was bizarre. I mean, I get the language barrier reading manuals from Chinese products off of Amazon or whatever, but this is a company that does nothing but work with language all day long, and even at one point had the world's leading English-speaking language model. Shouldn't they be able to produce professional-looking documentation without spelling and grammatical errors?

comradesmith 1y ago
What’s the problem? Can you point out a specific thing you would change from that quote?
- albert_e 1y ago
  Maybe the first sentence? I am guessing they meant "DeepSeek API does not enforce any rate limit on users." would be more appropriate. _Constraining the rate 'limit'_ seems like incorrect usage - but it is an a easy mistake to make in a first draft. Review should have caught it.
- lolinder 1y ago
  Are you a native English speaker? "does NOT constrain user's rate limit" should be "does NOT rate limit incoming requests" or similar. "We will try out best" should be "our best". "when our servers are under high traffic pressure" is at least grammatical, but it's awkward. Normally you'd say "when our servers are dealing with high load" or something similar. "your requests may take some time to receive a response from the server" is again grammatical but also awkward. "Our response times may be slower" would be more natural. The last sentence is also awkward but the whole thing would need to be restructured, which is too much for an HN comment. Basically: everything about this screams English as a second language. Which does mean that it's unlikely to have been LLM generated, because from what I've seen DeepSeek itself does a pretty good job with English!
  - reliabilityguy 1y ago
    > "Our response times may be slower" would be more natural. How can the time be slower? Response times may be longer, but not slower
    - lolinder 1y ago
      In colloquial English my construction is just fine, but sure, you'd be welcome to pick longer too. Some examples of my usage in the wild ("response times may be slower" is present verbatim on each page): https://github.com/aquasecurity/trivy/discussions/8133 https://github.com/aquasecurity/trivy/discussions/8133 https://www.ameristarstaffingny.com/the-negative-effects-of-understaffing https://www.ameristarstaffingny.com/the-negative-effects-of-... https://oci.wi.gov/Pages/Regulation/Bulletin20200320RegulatoryRequirements.aspx https://oci.wi.gov/Pages/Regulation/Bulletin20200320Regulato... https://playrix.helpshift.com/hc/en/27-questbound/faq/13930-no-response-from-support-1718116700/ https://playrix.helpshift.com/hc/en/27-questbound/faq/13930-...
      - brabel 1y ago
        This sentence is a good example where the native speaker's version is worse (in this case because it's just non-sense, as the parent commenter already pointed out).
        lolinder 1y ago
        Sounds like you're the kind of person who will insist to Spanish speakers that a double negative is logically incoherent. Good luck with that approach to language!
        fivestones 1y ago
        This is normal and accepted English, at least in the USA. And in English, the word “worse” requires a comparative compliment . Worse than what? Maybe you meant worse than a non-native speaker, but because you didn’t say it, your sentence sounds off. In English time can have lots of lengths. Any number of English novels have the phrase “a long minute”. People talk about time passing slowly or quickly. We say things like “The last 15 minutes took hours!” Or “Today went by so fast.” Just because the word “sunrise” is nonsense scientifically doesn’t mean it’s not understood and correct to use in English.
- rrr_oh_man 1y ago
  I'd just shorten it: DeepSeek API does NOT have rate limits. However, when our servers are under high traffic, your requests may take some time. During this period, you will continuously receive the following responses:
fakedang 1y ago
I've seen documents that were applications by CCP-affiliated provincial government bodies, things like detailed studies for loan applications to international banks, etc. and trust me, the Deepseek documentation is miles ahead of that. These are official government documents from one government agency to some international agency.
- ComplexSystems 1y ago
  This has fascinated me for years. I'll just re-link this comment of mine from a few years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37544019#37548278 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37544019#37548278. This was about Amazon products rather than government documentation, but the point is the same. I'll just quote the relevant part: > The people who make these products have to spend millions and millions of dollars setting up factories, hiring people, putting things into production, etc. But somehow they don't have a budget for a bilingual college student intern to translate a bunch of copy to English better than "using this product will bring a great joy." Why? > I will make a super strong claim: ChatGPT can now do nearly perfect mass translations of this stuff for free, in theory simultaneously increasing translation quality and reducing costs. Despite this, for whatever reason, I predict that the average translation quality on Amazon won't improve within the next few years. My super strong claim has so far been correct. Just go on Amazon.com and click just about anything. For instance, here's a random blanket: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07MR4FSPT https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07MR4FSPT "OPTIMUM GIFT: All people can use this flannel fleece blanket in Coach、Office、Bed、Study, etc. Reversible softness offers all seasons warmth. INTIMATE SERVICE: If you have any questions, please contact us. it is our pleasure to serve you." How does a human being in this situation somehow invent the phrase "OPTIMUM GIFT?" "Optimum" is a fairly advanced English word. Maybe you'd expect, I dunno, "GREAT GIFT" or "BEST GIFT"? And "INTIMATE SERVICE?" And once again, we now have magic English-speaking computers that can do this all for us - for free - and China has unanimously decided "nah, screw that. We'd rather go with INTIMATE SERVICE."
  - delian66 1y ago
    It may have been A/B tested, and people do prefer the "INTIMATE SERVICE" version more...
k__ 1y ago
That text would be cut to at least half its length by an editor.
meindnoch 1y ago
That's just standard Chinglish.
827a 1y ago
Similarly strange and incorrect grammatical constructions are found in the English translations for Game Science’s hit game Black Myth Wukong. My expectations for, for example, the construction manual for a bookshelf is pretty different than a game or AI model & service costing tens of millions of dollars in development (or more). Heck, they could literally pay any native English speaker to take their English-ish translations and regionalize them; you don’t even need to know Chinese to fix those paragraphs. Why is this such a common problem with the English China exports? Is it cultural? Are they so disconnected from the west that they don’t realize? A great counter-example is NetEase’s Marvel Rivals; their English translations are fantastic, and even their dev interviews with their Chinese development team is fantastically regionalized. They make a real effort to appeal to English audiences.

comradesmith 1y ago

What’s the problem? Can you point out a specific thing you would change from that quote?

albert_e 1y ago
Maybe the first sentence? I am guessing they meant "DeepSeek API does not enforce any rate limit on users." would be more appropriate. _Constraining the rate 'limit'_ seems like incorrect usage - but it is an a easy mistake to make in a first draft. Review should have caught it.
lolinder 1y ago
Are you a native English speaker? "does NOT constrain user's rate limit" should be "does NOT rate limit incoming requests" or similar. "We will try out best" should be "our best". "when our servers are under high traffic pressure" is at least grammatical, but it's awkward. Normally you'd say "when our servers are dealing with high load" or something similar. "your requests may take some time to receive a response from the server" is again grammatical but also awkward. "Our response times may be slower" would be more natural. The last sentence is also awkward but the whole thing would need to be restructured, which is too much for an HN comment. Basically: everything about this screams English as a second language. Which does mean that it's unlikely to have been LLM generated, because from what I've seen DeepSeek itself does a pretty good job with English!
- reliabilityguy 1y ago
  > "Our response times may be slower" would be more natural. How can the time be slower? Response times may be longer, but not slower
  - lolinder 1y ago
    In colloquial English my construction is just fine, but sure, you'd be welcome to pick longer too. Some examples of my usage in the wild ("response times may be slower" is present verbatim on each page): https://github.com/aquasecurity/trivy/discussions/8133 https://github.com/aquasecurity/trivy/discussions/8133 https://www.ameristarstaffingny.com/the-negative-effects-of-understaffing https://www.ameristarstaffingny.com/the-negative-effects-of-... https://oci.wi.gov/Pages/Regulation/Bulletin20200320RegulatoryRequirements.aspx https://oci.wi.gov/Pages/Regulation/Bulletin20200320Regulato... https://playrix.helpshift.com/hc/en/27-questbound/faq/13930-no-response-from-support-1718116700/ https://playrix.helpshift.com/hc/en/27-questbound/faq/13930-...
    - brabel 1y ago
      This sentence is a good example where the native speaker's version is worse (in this case because it's just non-sense, as the parent commenter already pointed out).
      - lolinder 1y ago
        Sounds like you're the kind of person who will insist to Spanish speakers that a double negative is logically incoherent. Good luck with that approach to language!
      - fivestones 1y ago
        This is normal and accepted English, at least in the USA. And in English, the word “worse” requires a comparative compliment . Worse than what? Maybe you meant worse than a non-native speaker, but because you didn’t say it, your sentence sounds off. In English time can have lots of lengths. Any number of English novels have the phrase “a long minute”. People talk about time passing slowly or quickly. We say things like “The last 15 minutes took hours!” Or “Today went by so fast.” Just because the word “sunrise” is nonsense scientifically doesn’t mean it’s not understood and correct to use in English.
rrr_oh_man 1y ago
I'd just shorten it: DeepSeek API does NOT have rate limits. However, when our servers are under high traffic, your requests may take some time. During this period, you will continuously receive the following responses:

fakedang 1y ago

I've seen documents that were applications by CCP-affiliated provincial government bodies, things like detailed studies for loan applications to international banks, etc. and trust me, the Deepseek documentation is miles ahead of that. These are official government documents from one government agency to some international agency.

ComplexSystems 1y ago
This has fascinated me for years. I'll just re-link this comment of mine from a few years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37544019#37548278 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37544019#37548278. This was about Amazon products rather than government documentation, but the point is the same. I'll just quote the relevant part: > The people who make these products have to spend millions and millions of dollars setting up factories, hiring people, putting things into production, etc. But somehow they don't have a budget for a bilingual college student intern to translate a bunch of copy to English better than "using this product will bring a great joy." Why? > I will make a super strong claim: ChatGPT can now do nearly perfect mass translations of this stuff for free, in theory simultaneously increasing translation quality and reducing costs. Despite this, for whatever reason, I predict that the average translation quality on Amazon won't improve within the next few years. My super strong claim has so far been correct. Just go on Amazon.com and click just about anything. For instance, here's a random blanket: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07MR4FSPT https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07MR4FSPT "OPTIMUM GIFT: All people can use this flannel fleece blanket in Coach、Office、Bed、Study, etc. Reversible softness offers all seasons warmth. INTIMATE SERVICE: If you have any questions, please contact us. it is our pleasure to serve you." How does a human being in this situation somehow invent the phrase "OPTIMUM GIFT?" "Optimum" is a fairly advanced English word. Maybe you'd expect, I dunno, "GREAT GIFT" or "BEST GIFT"? And "INTIMATE SERVICE?" And once again, we now have magic English-speaking computers that can do this all for us - for free - and China has unanimously decided "nah, screw that. We'd rather go with INTIMATE SERVICE."
- delian66 1y ago
  It may have been A/B tested, and people do prefer the "INTIMATE SERVICE" version more...

k__ 1y ago

That text would be cut to at least half its length by an editor.

meindnoch 1y ago

That's just standard Chinglish.

827a 1y ago

Similarly strange and incorrect grammatical constructions are found in the English translations for Game Science’s hit game Black Myth Wukong. My expectations for, for example, the construction manual for a bookshelf is pretty different than a game or AI model & service costing tens of millions of dollars in development (or more). Heck, they could literally pay any native English speaker to take their English-ish translations and regionalize them; you don’t even need to know Chinese to fix those paragraphs. Why is this such a common problem with the English China exports? Is it cultural? Are they so disconnected from the west that they don’t realize? A great counter-example is NetEase’s Marvel Rivals; their English translations are fantastic, and even their dev interviews with their Chinese development team is fantastically regionalized. They make a real effort to appeal to English audiences.