6 ms·

What are the obvious reasons?

Cumpiler69 2y ago
I guess the expensive energy in Germany, lots of red tape and nimbyism, and not enough state subsidies which is what these companies were hoping for when they were fishing for places to open fabs.
- kuschkufan 2y ago
  Well, your guess is off the mark.
  - Cumpiler69 2y ago
    Care to explain why?
- PittleyDunkin 2y ago
  There's also the fact that every single fab opened outside of Taiwan reduces Taiwan's national security.
  - swarnie 2y ago
    Is Taiwan's national security the major concern here? I assumed everyone was just bluffing at that until they can get their own supply. Getting dragging in to an East China unification war because you can't squeeze lighting in to rocks on time is a tragedy.
    - whimsicalism 2y ago
      > East China unification war Are you from China? I find this phraseology very odd
      - PittleyDunkin 2y ago
        Who cares? the situation is the same regardless: china wants taiwan, taiwan doesn't want to be a part of china, and the single largest factor blocking china from taking taiwan is TSMC. Not the american navy, not sanctions, not anything else. If TSMC weren't a factor they could simply destroy the island and move in.
        whimsicalism 2y ago
        I care because I am interested in how language reflects and shapes beliefs and I have never seen that phrase before.
        mjh2539 2y ago
        This is too simplistic. The ROC has not had any formal military alliance with the United States since 1979. TSMC was not founded until 1987, didn't start producing chips until 1993. It was not even publicly traded until 1994 (and that was only on the Taiwanese stock exchange; it was listed on the NYSE in 1997). The reason the PRC hasn't done it is because it would make no sense politically or economically. They have a lot more to lose and a lot less to gain than Russia did in 2014 (Sevastopol was/is seen as integral to the Russian navy...there is no parallel with Taiwan as the PRC has plenty of excellent ports on the mainland). And the continued existence of Taiwan gives the PRC a convenient excuse to sabre-rattle.
        plaguuuuuu 2y ago
        No formal alliance, but in reality, if you look up the proportion of Taiwanese-made chips used by the US military in... everything - aircraft, missiles ,tanks, planes, everything - invading Taiwan would probably cripple the US military's production capabilities so it's probably kicking off a proper war with USA.
        mjh2539 2y ago
        It would be a headache but it wouldn't be the end of the world. At the end of the day there are other fabrication plants to manufacture microprocessors. And it's not as if China invading Taiwan would suddenly make all of the existing supply stop working.
    - markhahn 2y ago
      No, the world outside PRC don't believe Taiwan should be "unified" against its will. The fact that Tiawanese industry is quite important is more of a gain factor, not polarity.
      - swarnie 2y ago
        Do they believe enough to go fight a war over it? If we assume everyone can make their own hardware at home.
        rad_gruchalski 2y ago
        As long as TSMC is the major chip hub.
        corimaith 2y ago
        Taiwan forms the first Island chain that currently keeps China's navy constrained. Loosing Taiwan is tantamount to accepting Chinese military hegemony in SEA and East Asia. No need to export ideology, it's more like if I put up tariffs against Chinese goods to protect domestic business and then a few PLAN warships park up right next to my trade corridors.
        femto 2y ago
        Some background: https://www.defensepriorities.org/explainers/challenges-to-chinese-blue-water-operations/#chinas-maritime-geography https://www.defensepriorities.org/explainers/challenges-to-c...
    - rad_gruchalski 2y ago
      > Is Taiwan's national security the major concern here? Yes. It’s called “semiconductor shield”. As long as China cannot manufacture chips like those made in Taiwan, it will thread carefully.

I guess the expensive energy in Germany, lots of red tape and nimbyism, and not enough state subsidies which is what these companies were hoping for when they were fishing for places to open fabs.

kuschkufan 2y ago
Well, your guess is off the mark.
- Cumpiler69 2y ago
  Care to explain why?
PittleyDunkin 2y ago
There's also the fact that every single fab opened outside of Taiwan reduces Taiwan's national security.
- swarnie 2y ago
  Is Taiwan's national security the major concern here? I assumed everyone was just bluffing at that until they can get their own supply. Getting dragging in to an East China unification war because you can't squeeze lighting in to rocks on time is a tragedy.
  - whimsicalism 2y ago
    > East China unification war Are you from China? I find this phraseology very odd
    - PittleyDunkin 2y ago
      Who cares? the situation is the same regardless: china wants taiwan, taiwan doesn't want to be a part of china, and the single largest factor blocking china from taking taiwan is TSMC. Not the american navy, not sanctions, not anything else. If TSMC weren't a factor they could simply destroy the island and move in.
      - whimsicalism 2y ago
        I care because I am interested in how language reflects and shapes beliefs and I have never seen that phrase before.
      - mjh2539 2y ago
        This is too simplistic. The ROC has not had any formal military alliance with the United States since 1979. TSMC was not founded until 1987, didn't start producing chips until 1993. It was not even publicly traded until 1994 (and that was only on the Taiwanese stock exchange; it was listed on the NYSE in 1997). The reason the PRC hasn't done it is because it would make no sense politically or economically. They have a lot more to lose and a lot less to gain than Russia did in 2014 (Sevastopol was/is seen as integral to the Russian navy...there is no parallel with Taiwan as the PRC has plenty of excellent ports on the mainland). And the continued existence of Taiwan gives the PRC a convenient excuse to sabre-rattle.
        plaguuuuuu 2y ago
        No formal alliance, but in reality, if you look up the proportion of Taiwanese-made chips used by the US military in... everything - aircraft, missiles ,tanks, planes, everything - invading Taiwan would probably cripple the US military's production capabilities so it's probably kicking off a proper war with USA.
        mjh2539 2y ago
        It would be a headache but it wouldn't be the end of the world. At the end of the day there are other fabrication plants to manufacture microprocessors. And it's not as if China invading Taiwan would suddenly make all of the existing supply stop working.
  - markhahn 2y ago
    No, the world outside PRC don't believe Taiwan should be "unified" against its will. The fact that Tiawanese industry is quite important is more of a gain factor, not polarity.
    - swarnie 2y ago
      Do they believe enough to go fight a war over it? If we assume everyone can make their own hardware at home.
      - rad_gruchalski 2y ago
        As long as TSMC is the major chip hub.
      - corimaith 2y ago
        Taiwan forms the first Island chain that currently keeps China's navy constrained. Loosing Taiwan is tantamount to accepting Chinese military hegemony in SEA and East Asia. No need to export ideology, it's more like if I put up tariffs against Chinese goods to protect domestic business and then a few PLAN warships park up right next to my trade corridors.
        femto 2y ago
        Some background: https://www.defensepriorities.org/explainers/challenges-to-chinese-blue-water-operations/#chinas-maritime-geography https://www.defensepriorities.org/explainers/challenges-to-c...
  - rad_gruchalski 2y ago
    > Is Taiwan's national security the major concern here? Yes. It’s called “semiconductor shield”. As long as China cannot manufacture chips like those made in Taiwan, it will thread carefully.